Quirin figures program

[bill evans]

I am looking to purchase or have someone write a program for me that imports the PP's from a vendor like BRISNET or PTS and computes the Quirin pace and speed figures from the paceline(s) selected by the user. I would like to integrate Cynthia Publishing or Gordon Pine pars into the program. Anyone out there who can help? Thanks.

[Partsnut]

Bill Evans:

I am looking to purchase or have someone write a program for me that imports the PP's from a vendor like BRISNET or PTS and computes the Quirin pace and speed figures from the paceline(s) selected by the user. I would like to integrate Cynthia Publishing or Gordon Pine pars into the program. Anyone out there who can help? Thanks.


Hi Bill,

I used to subscribe to Dr.Quirins par times and his Track to Track adjustments
until he gave up horse racing for golf. He was and possibly still is a Math professor at Hofstra university (Long Island, NY).
Quirins strength was computer generated impact numbers and track par times.

Years ago, there were no speed numbers in the past performances and they had to be calculated by the handicapper.

To make a long story short all speed figures and/or par times that are provided today by Gordon Pine, Dave Schwartz, C.J. and Randy Giles use the basic elements (impact values) that Quirin set forth.
The providers I mentioned are all talented and excellent providers and talking to them might be a good place to start. They are all participants of this forum.

[proximity]

handicapper jeebus1083 started a thread last year where i gave some information about converting bris figures to quirin figures.

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=58801


personally, i'd use the dave schwartz horsestreet pars instead of cynthia's as the horsestreet pars are actually pure quirin style pars (10,000 clm=100 and +/- 1/5 sec= 1 point at all distances).

[Big Bill]

proximity,

Going back to your post on June 13, 2009, on the Conversion of BRIS to Quirin thread, you offered the following formula:

(bris+(beaten lengths*(10/furlongs in race))-88)*(furlongs*0.10)+100-beaten lengths

Here's my question: Is the 0.10 in the formula a constant? If it is not a constant, does it change with the BRIS value of a length of the Speed Rating?

Big Bill

[JimG]

I am looking to purchase or have someone write a program for me that imports the PP's from a vendor like BRISNET or PTS and computes the Quirin pace and speed figures from the paceline(s) selected by the user. I would like to integrate Cynthia Publishing or Gordon Pine pars into the program. Anyone out there who can help? Thanks.

Hi Bill,

I think what you want has been created already. It is a dos program called Modern Pace Handicapping. It has an add on module that created the Quirin pace/speed figs. You can print all the pacelines or pick pacelines. You will need an old version of the program (1.2 or 1.4) that uses Bris files as well as the add-on module.

As I said it is in dos so be sure you can run dos programs. You can perform a search on "Modern pace Handicapping" and/or "brohamer" and find more information.

Jim

[proximity]

Going back to your post on June 13, 2009, on the Conversion of BRIS to Quirin thread, you offered the following formula:

(bris+(beaten lengths*(10/furlongs in race))-88)*(furlongs*0.10)+100-beaten lengths

Here's my question: Is the 0.10 in the formula a constant?

yes, the 0.10 is a constant.

the (furlongs*0.10) part tells us how many quirin points equals one bris point at that distance. (approximately)

[llegend39]

Hi Bill,

I think what you want has been created already. It is a dos program called Modern Pace Handicapping. It has an add on module that created the Quirin pace/speed figs. You can print all the pacelines or pick pacelines. You will need an old version of the program (1.2 or 1.4) that uses Bris files as well as the add-on module.

As I said it is in dos so be sure you can run dos programs. You can perform a search on "Modern pace Handicapping" and/or "brohamer" and find more information.

Jim

Its sold by trackmaster

[Jingle]

LLEGEND39

I don't think when Ken Massa turned the MPH Program over to Trackmaster it included the Quirin Pace & Speed Module. I know it didn't include the automatic paceline(s) feature. Jim G is correct but it is ver 1.3, Massa's last version. Ver 1.4 is Trackmasters.

The DOS program should run on your computer as Massa included some Windows features. If it doesn't, there is a program called TAME that will allow you to run the program in Windows. I don't know about Vista. Hope this helps.

[STABLEMATE]

I have Tame, and went (reluctantly) from Windows to Vista, and it still works fine with my DOS programs.

[socantra]

LLEGEND39

I don't think when Ken Massa turned the MPH Program over to Trackmaster it included the Quirin Pace & Speed Module. I know it didn't include the automatic paceline(s) feature. Jim G is correct but it is ver 1.3, Massa's last version. Ver 1.4 is Trackmasters.

.
The Trackmaster version 1.4 DOES have the Quirin Pace & Speed module. It DOES NOT have any auto paceline selection method. You pick the paceline(s).

I use it with the BRIS *.drf files or with Trackmaster *.exe files that have been processed by their Axlate utility, which Trackmaster tells me is obsolete. I have never tried it with the Trackmaster comma delimited files.

[JimG]

The Trackmaster version 1.4 DOES have the Quirin Pace & Speed module. It DOES NOT have any auto paceline selection method. You pick the paceline(s).

I use it with the BRIS *.drf files or with Trackmaster *.exe files that have been processed by their Axlate utility, which Trackmaster tells me is obsolete. I have never tried it with the Trackmaster comma delimited files.

Hi socantra,

Must be a lot of versions of this program floating out there. Mine says version 1.4 (1996) on the opening screen with a program (mph.exe) date in the file directory of 7/11/1995 and I also use with bris files and it DOES have the auto paceline feature and the Quirin fig module. Maybe I have a version Massa did just prior to Tom going full time with Trackmaster?

Jim

[socantra]

You're right Jim, there do seem to be a few. I went back and looked at mine and found it is actually version 1.2, from 1994. I did purchase it from Trackmaster 5 or 6 years ago and most of the files on the original floppy are from the early 90's. Trackmaster was advertising ver 1.4 at the time. I don't know if they sent me the wrong version or what. I do remember I had a hard time finding anyone there who knew anything about it.

Anyway, It handled either BRIS *.DRF files, computer Sports World files, or Today's Racing Digest *.TRD files. Ican't find any sort of auto paceline selection, but it has model, profile, Beyer input and odds line along with fps, Quirin ratings and fractional times. Nice program.

[Tom]

I think I have your version - I love it.
I like putting in several lines for each horse and looking at them individually.
I hate averaging lines.

The Quirin numbers are very good, IMHO. They work very nice using the fulcrum idea and the PBS idea.

[Pcon04]

Is that program still available to purchase??And where??

thanks

pcon

[llegend39]

Tom Brohamer's Modern Pace Handicapper (MPH)

The MPH Handicapping Program is based on Tom Brohamer's best selling book Modern Pace Handicapping, published in 1991 by William Morrow & Company and thought by many to be the premier book on pace handicapping. This program automates many tedious manual calculations and reports for evaluating pace that advanced players previously undertook by hand. Combining the ability of manual input or direct download from TrackMaster using the free converter progam with TrackMaster PPs or TrackMaster Plus files, Modern Pace Handicapping is one of the friendliest, most forgiving, and most accurate velocity pace handicapping programs you'll ever use.

[Tom]

The cost is $149.95 for TrackMaster PPs customers. For more information, call TrackMaster Sales at 800-334-3800.

Operators on duty - call now!

[Ted Craven]

For the record, TrackMaster asked me if I was interested in updating MPH to a Windows platform, and I committed to including the readouts from MPH in a new set of screens in the next version of RDSS. Using TrackMaster supplied data.

Ted

[46zilzal]

Bill Evans:


Hi Bill,

I used to subscribe to Dr.Quirins par times and his Track to Track adjustments
until he gave up horse racing for golf. He was and possibly still is a Math professor at Hofstra university (Long Island, NY).
Quirins strength was computer generated impact numbers and track par times.
.
nope, ADELPHI University New York

[xtb]

For the record, TrackMaster asked me if I was interested in updating MPH to a Windows platform, and I committed to including the readouts from MPH in a new set of screens in the next version of RDSS. Using TrackMaster supplied data.

Ted

Ted, will the capability to export the figures for all running lines into a .csv file exist?

[ldiatone]

i had one hell of a time trying to load MPH to my Vista puter. mr. stone spent a long time on the phone helping me. axalate didn't work on the vista. so..... had to buy a new power pack for my old "Traveler" '98 lp.so i can use MPH. so i down load a card from TM, and find out now i have to use "Trans B or C page to get the card. same price and it works. just like the old days ........dial up :faint: i do have the quirn #'s V 1.4 1996.
i still can not use the Turbo which is installed on this version. talked to people abut this and can not figure it out. What data does it use???

[Ted Craven]

Ted, will the capability to export the figures for all running lines into a .csv file exist?

Yes, CSV, XLS, XML, RAC.

Ted

[JimG]

i still can not use the Turbo which is installed on this version. talked to people abut this and can not figure it out. What data does it use???

From some reading of the documentation, I surmise Turbo was a program to be used when downloading special files that Ken Massa must have sold on his own prior to going with HDW and creating his current program HTR.

Jim

[shoelessjoe]

I knew RDSS would work its way somehow into this discussion.

[Tom]

Why wouldn't it if it is going to offer what is being talked about?

[gm10]

The pace numbers on my site are similar to Quirin's speed points if that's what you're after.
I can give you the SQL query for it if you have a database with past performances.

[socantra]

The pace numbers on my site are similar to Quirin's speed points if that's what you're after.
I can give you the SQL query for it if you have a database with past performances.
Sorry. Quirin speed points are not the same thing as Quirin pace and speed figures. Free ad probably wasted.

[shoelessjoe]

Is there much of a difference between using Quirin's pace and speed figures and TPR numbers?

[gm10]

Sorry. Quirin speed points are not the same thing as Quirin pace and speed figures. Free ad probably wasted.

That offer for free SQL code which took days to write isn't available to you, obviously.

[socantra]

:confused: :confused: :confused:

You mean, even after I helped you weasel out another free ad? ;) ;) ;)

[llegend39]

I think I have your version - I love it.
I like putting in several lines for each horse and looking at them individually.
I hate averaging lines.

The Quirin numbers are very good, IMHO. They work very nice using the fulcrum idea and the PBS idea.

Tom,I sent u a email but your box is full thnx

[Longshot]

In which one of his books does William Quirin explain the process he uses to arrive at his Pace and Speed figs? I'm trying to write an Equisim FV that will
reproduce the numbers, especially the Quirin Pace and Speed, that I get from the DOS MPH program. The Bris conversion formula that was posted a while back does not match the MPH numbers, especially the Pace numbers.

[PhantomOnTour]

In which one of his books does William Quirin explain the process he uses to arrive at his Pace and Speed figs? I'm trying to write an Equisim FV that will
reproduce the numbers, especially the Quirin Pace and Speed, that I get from the DOS MPH program. The Bris conversion formula that was posted a while back does not match the MPH numbers, especially the Pace numbers.
It's in a book titled 'Thoroughbred Handicapping: State Of The Art' and it is a great read. It was the first handicapping book I ever bought and I still have it around. Some DRF past performance stuff is outdated as the book came out around 1985, but the other content is great. Amazon has it for about $5 or less I bet.

[Longshot]

Thanks Phantom. I'll see if I can find a copy.

[Longshot]

I found a copy at Abe Books for $2.75

Thanks again

[bill evans]

I bought the MPH program after starting this thread. The Quirin figures it produces do not match those done by hand calculation. I believe this is because the program is no longer supported by updated pars which is the essential element of the methodology. We need an updated and supported version of MPH or another program, hopefully the new RDSS, which includes the figures and offers annual par updates similar to what Cynthia Publishing offers with its programs.

[Partsnut]

Quirin figures software
Bill Evans

I bought the MPH program after starting this thread. The Quirin figures it produces do not match those done by hand calculation. I believe this is because the program is no longer supported by updated pars which is the essential element of the methodology. We need an updated and supported version of MPH or another program, hopefully the new RDSS, which includes the figures and offers annual par updates similar to what Cynthia Publishing offers with its programs.


You can always add the updated Par times manually to MPH and use
either Gordon Pine's or Dave Schwartz's par times with a high level of confidence and accuracy. For my money, I personally would not chance anything else.

If you decide to go with something new, I suggest you try it before you buy it and see if it works for you.

To my knowledge and I'm always open for correction, there is only one source that can accurately identify The running style of a horse in conjuntion with Quirin speed points. It seems as though this has been an issue with most software products and programmers.

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/images/statusicon/user_online.gif

[tryto]

Bill,
Would you mind saying where you purchased the MPH Program ??

Thanks ER

[Tom]

I bought the MPH program after starting this thread. The Quirin figures it produces do not match those done by hand calculation. I believe this is because the program is no longer supported by updated pars which is the essential element of the methodology. We need an updated and supported version of MPH or another program, hopefully the new RDSS, which includes the figures and offers annual par updates similar to what Cynthia Publishing offers with its programs.

You can put in your own pars in the set up screen.

[Partsnut]

trytoBill,
Would you mind saying where you purchased the MPH Program ??

Thanks ER

Actually, I don't use or have a need for any software. I use PaceAppraiser and have been using it successfully for years. MPH is not an option for me. I don't own a copy.
If you want to buy MPH, Trackmaster sells it.

[PaceAdvantage]

Actually, I don't use or have a need for any software. I use PaceAppraiser and have been using it successfully for years.Pace Appraiser is software.

[Partsnut]

PaceAdvantageQuote:
Originally Posted by Partsnut
Actually, I don't use or have a need for any software. I use PaceAppraiser and have been using it successfully for years.

Pace Appraiser is software.


Being that PaceAppraiser is an internet subscription based service which is driven by software, I stand corrected. Realistically, I am not buying the software, I am buying the service. This is not a service or software that I am stuck with.
I can discontinue it at any time. I don't have to own it or make any sort of monetary, up front committments, I use it as I need it and when I choose to without committing to any protracted data plans. It works for me.

[speed]

Being that PaceAppraiser is an internet subscription based service which is driven by software, I stand corrected. Realistically, I am not buying the software, I am buying the service. This is not a service or software that I am stuck with.
I can discontinue it at any time. I don't have to own it or make any sort of monetary, up front committments, I use it as I need it and when I choose to without committing to any protracted data plans. It works for me.

Please, you are buying the software. Only it is monthly.If you use it for a year it costs you $240.00. Most vendors charge by the year, Randy chooses to charge by the month is all. You are right if you want to use it for a month it is $19.95 plus your data charges.

Continued success with it. Randy like most vendors on here are good for the business.

[bill evans]

This is an update to my original inquiry. I am still looking for someone who can write a program for my personal use which imports the past performances from PTS or similar monthly rate provider and computes the Quirin pace and speed figures using commercially available par times like Cynthia Publishing sells and updates annually. I don't need or want anything else and will pay a fair price for the program. As noted in my earlier post, Trackmaster MPH had it but does not support the old program via updated pars. Please let me know if there is a person out there who has a program or can write one for me. Thanks, Bill.

[proximity]

This is an update to my original inquiry. I am still looking for someone who can write a program for my personal use which imports the past performances from PTS or similar monthly rate provider and computes the Quirin pace and speed figures using commercially available par times like Cynthia Publishing sells and updates annually. I don't need or want anything else and will pay a fair price for the program. As noted in my earlier post, Trackmaster MPH had it but does not support the old program via updated pars. Please let me know if there is a person out there who has a program or can write one for me. Thanks, Bill.


i could easily do this with my program, but computers are not my bailiwick and it was so long ago that my i.t. consultant helped me set up my system that i would most assuredly forget something if i tried to help you.

i don't know where you are located, but if you are ever by pen on a friday i'd be able to look at your system and could easily call my computer expert with any questions and probably set you up with the program in an hour or two. btw, i use bris.

back online here for starters: you have ms access, yes??