Should NYRA Rewards account be emptied???

[SansuiSC]

Obviously the money is not insured. If they close the plants, although it says nothing about operations (online simulcasting), who knows how long your money would be tied up if they cease operations.

I know it's a chess game with the state and being discussed generally but this is the ADW part of the equation that needs to be looked at.

Should NYRA Rewards account be emptied? Or just keep a low balance that you are willing to part with if they freeze accounts.

:bang:

http://www.nyra.com/belmont/stories/May212010.shtml


Contact: Dan Silver | May 21, 2010




"The New York Racing Association, Inc. (NYRA) announced today that it has provided notice to its employees that it expects to cease racing operations and begin the implementation of plant closures on Wednesday, June 9 at Belmont Park, Saratoga Race Course, and Aqueduct Racetrack. The notices, pursuant to the requirements of the Federal and New York State Workers Adjustment and Retraining Notification Acts (jointly referred to as the WARN Acts), were sent to more than 1,400 NYRA employees on Thursday, May 20 and indicated that layoffs can be expected to begin as early as June 9. Meanwhile, NYRA continues to pursue solutions with the State of New York that may avert the cessation of operations.

Founded in 1955, and franchised to run thoroughbred racing at New York’s three major tracks through 2033, NYRA boasts a lineage that actually stretches back almost 150 years. NYRA tracks are the cornerstone of the state’s thoroughbred business which contributes more than $2 billion annually to New York State’s urban, suburban and rural economy. In 2009, more than 1.6 million people attended the live races at NYRA tracks. Factoring nationwide off-track wagering, the average daily betting handle on NYRA races alone totals more than $9.3 million every race day. NYRA has a vast network of websites, including www.nyra.com, www.belmontstakes.com, and www.nyragroupsales.com."

[Robert Goren]

Get out while you can. As a loser in the JC Whitney bankruptcy a number of years ago, I can tell you don't want to be anywhere near a company going under. JMO

[OTM Al]

I won't tell you what to do with your money, but my understanding is that they do not mingle account holders funds with operating funds.

[Jeff P]

If you have a large balance in your account... and by "large" I mean an amout large enough that it is meaningful to you... or would cause you hardship if you were denied access to it... then NOW is the time to make a withdrawal.

Q. Do I know if NYRA will actually shut down?
A. No.

Q. If NYRA shuts down, do I know whether or not money in NYRA accounts will be held up?
A. Again, no.

However, if I am not mistaken NYRA (and MEC) both have track records that are not good when it comes to pool distribution money.

NYRA has in the past filed for bankruptcy protection from its creditors AND classified pool distribution money the same as if it were owed to unsecured creditors - effectively tying that money up as part of its bankruptcy case - causing players (If I am not mistaken some of those players post here at PA.) significant delays in getting paid.

MEC recently did the same thing (according to CHRB meeting transcripts) with pool money owed tracks and wagering outlets in California.

If you have a large balance, and you are going to err... NOW would be the time to err on the side of caution.


-jp

.

[Jeff P]

Related Thoroughbred Times story to my above post...

Off-track outlet sues NYRA over settlement payout dispute
http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/national-news/2007/February/20/Off-track-outlet-sues-NYRA-over-settlement-payout-dispute.aspx


Related CHRB Meeting agenda item to my above post...

http://chrb.ca.gov/board_meeting_agendas/2010_04_apr_agenda.pdf13. Discussion and action by the Board regarding an update from Magna Entertainment Corporation concerning its bankruptcy filing, racing operation and the status of statutory funds that may still be owed money for pre and post bankruptcy petition debts.


-jp

.

[DJofSD]

NYRA has in the past filed for bankruptcy protection from its creditors AND classified pool distribution money the same as if it were owed to unsecured creditors - effectively tying that money up as part of its bankruptcy case - causing players (If I am not mistaken some of those players post here at PA.) significant delays in getting paid.

I would take that to mean, as an unsecured creditor, a person would be at the end of the line for any consideration when it came time to be paid off.

I would also wonder if all of those funds wouldn't be frozen until the determination is made how the business is to operate going forward, if at all.

[SansuiSC]

I won't tell you what to do with your money, but my understanding is that they do not mingle account holders funds with operating funds.

If you have a large balance in your account... and by "large" I mean an amout large enough that it is meaningful to you... or would cause you hardship if you were denied access to it... then NOW is the time to make a withdrawal.

Q. Do I know if NYRA will actually shut down?
A. No.

Q. If NYRA shuts down, do I know whether or not money in NYRA accounts will be held up?
A. Again, no.

With the uncertainties here, I'll keep a balance that I'm willing to part with if they freeze accounts which means taking a chunk out now and as the days draw closer empty it daily on track unless something earth shattering happens between now and D-day.

Even if they do not mingle account holders funds with operating funds, I'm not going to put myself in a compromising position.

[Rutgers]

Keep in mind, this is not a bankrupcty.

NYRA has just announce a plan to cease racing operations and then to close down the plants. Which I'm guessing are the greatest costs to NYRA.

The notice as posted on this thread did not say whether or not the NYRA One account wagering will continue or not.

[Indulto]

... NYRA has in the past filed for bankruptcy protection from its creditors AND classified pool distribution money the same as if it were owed to unsecured creditors - effectively tying that money up as part of its bankruptcy case - causing players (If I am not mistaken some of those players post here at PA.) significant delays in getting paid.

MEC recently did the same thing (according to CHRB meeting transcripts) with pool money owed tracks and wagering outlets in California.

If you have a large balance, and you are going to err... NOW would be the time to err on the side of caution. ...Sounds like good advice although NYRA did eventually pay up in the case to which you referred.

Maybe if enough NYRA and OTB account holders withdrew all but a skeleton balance, it would prompt the state racing and wagering board and the legislature to guarantee those funds. What guarantees do TS, Ubet, Xbet, and TVG provide?

[OTM Al]

I brought this thread to the attention of some people I know who know the situation, shall we say, very well, and they have responded to me to confirm that all funds in NYRA One accounts are guaranteed.

[Indulto]

I brought this thread to the attention of some people I know who know the situation, shall we say, very well, and they have responded to me to confirm that all funds in NYRA One accounts are guaranteed.OA,
Did they mean "guaranteed" the way the state guaranteed NYRA's income from vlt's? ;)

I think most would be happier with published documents from appropriate authorities clearly defining how funds are protected and when and how they would be returned in all foreseeable circumstances. I'd be surprised if anyone at NYRA has sufficient authority for that, but it wouldn't surprise me if your contacts went beyond the Ha-Ha team.

Don't the current economic climate and political/legislative efforts to rein in Wall Street suggest a need for greater protection for wagering account customers?

[Stillriledup]

Good idea to be safe rather than sorry. You can always re-deposit the money when the smoke clears.

[Dave Schwartz]

This is really a devastating state of affairs.

My sincere condolences to all of our New York players, especially those who live in Saratoga.

Aside from the obvious, this shows that the end really can come.

[Jeff P]

This state of affairs really IS a shame.

But I'm not at all surprised.

Last October Equibase released their Scratches and Changes Today system. The purpose of the new system was to create a single place on the web where players could go to get accurate scratches and changes in real time. The "real time" element comes from having Equibase's chart callers key in new scratches and changes as they are announced by the track announcer over the track's public address system.

With two notable exceptions, this program has been a success - scratches and changes have been consistently delivered in accordance with system design.

Anyone care to guess the name of the most recognizeable racing association that decided not to participate in the program?

NYRA.

One of the requirements for making the system work is having somebody at the track level perform 10 minutes of data entry each day to key the early scratches and changes into the system so that they can appear at Equibase.com. Use of the system is free. To participate, the only thing a track has to do is provide somebody at the track level to do 10 minutes of data entry each day. Equibase will even train the track employee... again, at no cost to the track.

Since the system's inception last October NYRA has steadfastly refused to have somebody at the track level key early scratches and changes into the system.

NYRA's decision to be the only racing association to purposely NOT participate in the Equibase program speaks volumes.

Sadly I'm not at all surprised NYRA finds itself mired in the middle of this mess.


-jp

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[DJofSD]

Jeff,

In my industry, that activity (or lack thereof) is commonly referred to as the mushroom theory -- keep them in the dark and feed them s***.

[Light]

They'll probably get bailed out like the NY OTB's did.

[Tom]

Frankly, NYRA holds no interest for at all, any of the meets, including Toga.
There are FAR better betting tracks out there. While I agree, a lot of NYRAs problems are not their own doing, enough are to make me say ta ta NYRA. Like Jeff says, the simple idea of not participating in the scratch program tells me NYRA doesn't care about bettors or no one there can read. You decide! :rolleyes:

[Robert Goren]

Today you can add Monmouth park to that list. Equibase had Belmonts changes a full 45 minutes before Mth. Belmont also had a first post time 10 minutes later.

[Dahoss9698]

Frankly, NYRA holds no interest for at all, any of the meets, including Toga.
There are FAR better betting tracks out there. While I agree, a lot of NYRAs problems are not their own doing, enough are to make me say ta ta NYRA. Like Jeff says, the simple idea of not participating in the scratch program tells me NYRA doesn't care about bettors or no one there can read. You decide! :rolleyes:

More rubbish.

[Tom]

What?
They have the scratches up on time?
When?

[Dahoss9698]

What?
They have the scratches up on time?
When?

Post time is 1pm. Scratches were up at 11:22 am today on their website. How much earlier would you like them?

Their website is always updated, even with late scratches. There is a section on their website for track and turf updates. Free replays of their races. The best on air handicapping team in horse racing. When a race comes off turf in the process of a multirace wager, you recieve "all" instead of keeping the same horses you used on turf like other tracks.

Yeah, they don't care about bettors. :rolleyes:

[Jeff P]

Post time is 1pm. Scratches were up at 11:22 am today on their website. How much earlier would you like them?

Their website is always updated, even with late scratches. There is a section on their website for track and turf updates.
You're kidding, right?

Last October Equibase rolled out a new program called Scratches and Changes Today. The concept behind the program was a radical departure from the staus quo. The new program was based on simplicity and player convenience.

Instead of having to go to 100 plus different track and adw websites to get scratches and changes - or pick them up by waiting for them to show up on track video - now the player wanting to play multiple tracks on the same day could go to ONE PLACE on the internet to get scratches and changes for EVERY track... with scrathces and changes for every track updated throughout the race day in something pretty close to real time.

To make things even better, Equibase threw in a free XML feed so that developers so inclined could import changes into their own software. Further, Equibase included an RSS feed so that players can receive scratches and changes right on their cell phones.

Like I said, the new program represents a very nice addition for players everywhere - compliments of Equibase.

Every track and racing association in North America is voluntarily participating in making this a reality...

Except NYRA and EVD.

The only thing being asked of NYRA in the way of participation is a few minutes a day of data entry into the Equibase system of early scratches and changes only. That's it. Once early scratches and changes are in, Equibase's chart caller will take things from there.

The decision NOT to participate in this is a slap in the face to players everywhere.

So yes - I'm calling NYRA out on this. The decision not to participate comes from the top and in my opinion speaks volumes about NYRA.



Jeff Platt

President, HANA

.

[Dahoss9698]

I read your post the first time. I get it, HANA doesn't like NYRA. That's fine. But their scratches were up, today, on THEIR website at 11:22 am. Which is what I was responding to.

I think in the grand scheme of things, they are a lot more player friendly than other circuits. You disagree. Life will go on for both of us I'm sure.

Since I have your attention, did you guys get a chance to look into the situation at Mountaineer the other night? I can only imagine the backlash of that happened at a NYRA track.

[Jeff P]

Are you referring to the rider change (to Parker) during an ongoing pick3 sequence?

If so, I agree with other players here in that it shouldn't be allowed. Sadly, short of a rule change in WVA it's going to happen again.

Don't get me wrong. NYRA isn't all bad. IMHO they do a lot of things right.

But willfully deciding not to participate in Equibase's Scratches and Changes Today Program isn't one of them.

And yes. You're right. Life will go on for both of us I'm sure. <G>


-jp

.

[the little guy]

I don't understand, the NYRA scratches are on the Equibase site.

[Jeff P]

The system (launched back in Oct, 2009) was designed to work in the following manner:

* As soon as a change is submitted into the Equibase system it propagates out onto the Equibase site.

* Well before post time for R1, someone at the track level is asked to key early scratches and changes into the Equibase system. The track's part of things ends there.

* The Equibase chart caller shows up for work and keys all subsequent scratches and changes into the system as they are announced - the idea is that new changes propagate out onto the Equibase site in something approaching real time.


ALL of the tracks currently running (except NYRA and EVD) are voluntarily participating in this program by keying their own early scratches and changes into the Equibase system.

Equibase has been asking NYRA management to have someone at the track level do about 10 minutes of data entry per day to key early scratches and changes for NYRA into the Equibase system.

So far management at NYRA has refused to do this.


NYRA scratches and changes are available at Equibase.com for one reason only: Someone from Equibase (not NYRA) has been keying them in.

Hope I explained that in a way that makes sense.



-jp

.

[the little guy]

Sorry, Jeff, but with all due respect, your initial post suggested something that is at best debatable. The fact is that NYRA's scratches are available on the site, an Equibase site, which seems to me to be the most important issue and based on your initial post that did not seem to be the case. I honestly don't see how your version of how they get on the EQUIBASE site changes that.

I don't want to get into a pissing match comparing NYRA to others in the industry, as we must do everything we can at NYRA to meet our customer's needs, regardless of what others are or are not doing. However, to bash NYRA as you did because someone at Equibase is updating their site, and not us, does not seem either fair or constructive to me. Surely their are better ways for all of us to move forward, and together, in this industry.

[PaceAdvantage]

They'll probably get bailed out like the NY OTB's did.It has nothing to do with bailing out, and everything to do with money owed.

An agreement is in place for NY State to pay NYRA should NY State fail to get the VLTs up and running by a certain date. They are not paying NYRA, and neither is NYCOTB...

Has nothing to do with a bailout.

[Indulto]

... The fact is that NYRA's scratches are available on the site, an Equibase site, which seems to me to be the most important issue and based on your initial post that did not seem to be the case. I honestly don't see how your version of how they get on the EQUIBASE site changes that.

I don't want to get into a pissing match comparing NYRA to others in the industry, as we must do everything we can at NYRA to meet our customer's needs, regardless of what others are or are not doing. However, to bash NYRA as you did because someone at Equibase is updating their site, and not us, does not seem either fair or constructive to me. Surely their are better ways for all of us to move forward, and together, in this industry.Spin from the spokesperson? ;)

It would very likely be worth NYRA's efforts in terms of increased handle from serious bettors if they created a path to automatically transfer a machine-readable copy of their already entered changes to Equibase. Not doing this makes NYRA look petty and uncooperative; not a good combination for an outfit that wants and needs respect.

[Jeff P]

Sorry, Jeff, but with all due respect, your initial post suggested something that is at best debatable. The fact is that NYRA's scratches are available on the site, an Equibase site, which seems to me to be the most important issue and based on your initial post that did not seem to be the case. I honestly don't see how your version of how they get on the EQUIBASE site changes that.

I don't want to get into a pissing match comparing NYRA to others in the industry, as we must do everything we can at NYRA to meet our customer's needs, regardless of what others are or are not doing. However, to bash NYRA as you did because someone at Equibase is updating their site, and not us, does not seem either fair or constructive to me. Surely their are better ways for all of us to move forward, and together, in this industry.
With all due respect Andy, this isn't about MY version of how the changes make it to the Equibase site.

The truth is Equibase has been asking NYRA management to participate in the program (meaning data entry for early scratches only) since last October... and yet NYRA management keeps refusing.

Ideas and input from players and HANA members were considered during the design phase of the project and many of our ideas now appear in the finished product. We're pretty damn proud of the Equibase scratches and changes system because it represents an improvement for players everywhere over what was. Equibase really went to bat for the player here.

NYRA's refusal to participate is just one example (among many) of why this industry finds itself in the shape it's in.

Racing is no different from any other business in that it's driven by customer dollars.

If a racing association like NYRA isn't willing to provide 10 minutes of data entry a day to key early scratches and changes into a system designed by its own customers, a system designed to facilitate customer dollars being wagered on the racing association's own product... then by its own actions... or lack of action...

What is the racing association really telling the customer?


-jp

.

[Light]

Has nothing to do with a bailout.

Nyra is running out of funds to continue operations. Yes its partially due to not getting paid money owed them but that doesn't help their predicament right now. That's why gov. Patterson introduced a bill for the state to lend Nyra around $20 million. In my language and the NY state bill, it's called a bailout.

[slewis]

It has nothing to do with bailing out, and everything to do with money owed.

An agreement is in place for NY State to pay NYRA should NY State fail to get the VLTs up and running by a certain date. They are not paying NYRA, and neither is NYCOTB...

Has nothing to do with a bailout.

This is just the line of thinking that Haywood and Handel use. Dumb.

Where's the money coming from PA?? Should we lay off 1000 state troopers?

How's about we stop fixing roads so we can have $80,000 maiden races.

The sooner NYRA understands what's at stake here, and that they are NOT the bosses of Albany..the better we'll all be.


Have you (or others) wondered why NYRA and their high priced attorneys haven't filed suit to get the money they are "owed" yet?
(You know they're very good at threats and using the legal system to get their way).
I would LOVE to see them file suit in State court over the wording in the Franchise agreement....and demanding the NYCOTB money since the state took over the operation.

Dont worry...it wont happen.

Know what's funny though? I haven't seen ANY change in the day to day operational success at the track since NYRA laid off all those employees recently. Actually, things are pretty good at the track each day.

Know what that means PA? All those people that were let go were really not necessary. Now if the Bd of Directors bother to look a little higher up the ladder, they can find the REAL dead wood and clean house.:lol:

[Tom]

As a taxpayer, I say let NYRA and Governor Davey find the money somewhere else. Not a penny to of tax money.
Go milk OTB, not me.

Stupid idea. :ThmbDown::ThmbDown:

[Tom]

I f a racing association like NYRA isn't willing to provide 10 minutes of data entry a day to key early scratches and changes into a system designed by its own customers, a system designed to facilitate customer dollars being wagered on the racing association's own product... then by its own actions... or lack of action...

What is the racing association really telling the customer?

It is telling me to go play tacks that participate and show some respect for us. I refuse to have to go looking for scratches. Too many other tracks out there to bother playing hide and seek with one of them.

The times they are a changing. ;)

[the little guy]

With all due respect Andy, this isn't about MY version of how the changes make it to the Equibase site.

The truth is Equibase has been asking NYRA management to participate in the program (meaning data entry for early scratches only) since last October... and yet NYRA management keeps refusing.

Ideas and input from players and HANA members were considered during the design phase of the project and many of our ideas now appear in the finished product. We're pretty damn proud of the Equibase scratches and changes system because it represents an improvement for players everywhere over what was. Equibase really went to bat for the player here.

NYRA's refusal to participate is just one example (among many) of why this industry finds itself in the shape it's in.

Racing is no different from any other business in that it's driven by customer dollars.

If a racing association like NYRA isn't willing to provide 10 minutes of data entry a day to key early scratches and changes into a system designed by its own customers, a system designed to facilitate customer dollars being wagered on the racing association's own product... then by its own actions... or lack of action...

What is the racing association really telling the customer?


-jp

.


Jeff, it appears to me that you are allowing your personal involvement in this situation to obfuscate the fact that you misrepresented the fact that NYRA's scratches are on the Equibase site despite your initial claims to the contrary.

[Jeff P]

Jeff, it appears to me that you are allowing your personal involvement in this situation to obfuscate the fact that you misrepresented the fact that NYRA's scratches are on the Equibase site despite your initial claims to the contrary.Excuse me?

Please tell me in plain English... as if I were a three year old... exactly what you think I have misrepresented in this thread.



-jp

.

[the little guy]

Excuse me?

Please tell me in plain English... as if I were a three year old... exactly what you think I have misrepresented in this thread.



-jp

.


With this post.....

This state of affairs really IS a shame.

But I'm not at all surprised.

Last October Equibase released their Scratches and Changes Today system. The purpose of the new system was to create a single place on the web where players could go to get accurate scratches and changes in real time. The "real time" element comes from having Equibase's chart callers key in new scratches and changes as they are announced by the track announcer over the track's public address system.

With two notable exceptions, this program has been a success - scratches and changes have been consistently delivered in accordance with system design.

Anyone care to guess the name of the most recognizeable racing association that decided not to participate in the program?

NYRA.

One of the requirements for making the system work is having somebody at the track level perform 10 minutes of data entry each day to key the early scratches and changes into the system so that they can appear at Equibase.com. Use of the system is free. To participate, the only thing a track has to do is provide somebody at the track level to do 10 minutes of data entry each day. Equibase will even train the track employee... again, at no cost to the track.

Since the system's inception last October NYRA has steadfastly refused to have somebody at the track level key early scratches and changes into the system.

NYRA's decision to be the only racing association to purposely NOT participate in the Equibase program speaks volumes.

Sadly I'm not at all surprised NYRA finds itself mired in the middle of this mess.


-jp

.


I guess I misunderstood, but after reading this I was surprised to find NYRA's scratches on the Equibase site. Isn't having racetrack's scratches on the site the desired result?

[Jeff P]

I can see where you are coming from. Please know that it wasn't my intention to mislead anyone.

You wrote: I guess I misunderstood, but after reading this I was surprised to find NYRA's scratches on the Equibase site. Isn't having racetrack's scratches on the site the desired result?

My reply: Sure we want the changes to appear on the Equibase site - and as early each day as (humanely) possible.

But the core issue goes much deeper than that. NYRA's refusal to do data entry isn't the problem. It's a symptom indicating real problems that are prevelant throughout the industry.

I've said this before and I'll say it again.

Every successful Fortune 500 company is successful for a reason. The successful companies are successful because they do market research to determine who their target customer is. They discover what their target customer's needs and wants are. Then they make it their mission to satisfy those needs and wants. Every failed company that you can name failed to do that to some degree along the line.

Racing is no different than any other business in that its dollars come from customers.

What we really want (the desired result) is for racing as an industry to wake up and start behaving like Fortune 500 companies when it comes to customer needs and wants.

If that were to happen I really believe racing's ship would manage it right itself and in short order.



-jp

.

[PaceAdvantage]

Back to the original thread...I believe I called it when I said there was no way in hell NYCOTB was going to close its doors when they threatened to go out of business...and I was right. I said they wouldn't close their doors whether or NOT they got any money from the state, and I was right.

Same thing goes for NYRA. Although, I'm fairly certain the NYRA doesn't have as many potential cost-cutting measures in their favor as NYCOTB has, despite what slewis would like to have us believe.

Thus I believe the NYRA will be getting enough money to keep them going, whether it be from NY State or NYCOTB or a combination of the two...

Some folks like to talk about how politically unpopular it would be for the state of NY to give the money to the NYRA that is OWED to the NYRA. slewis would have you believe that by doing so, 1000 state troopers might have to be put out of a job....utter nonsense...

The simple fact remains that the state of New York stands to continue making a steady stream of money in the form of TAKEOUT and FEES from every dollar you and I put through the windows. Does anyone honestly believe a mere $17M is enough to stop this cash cow? You're telling me nobody can come up with enough money to keep that gravy train a rollin'?

Please...spare me...

Does any of us honestly believe NY State is going to cut off its nose to spite its face? Has everyone forgotten all the money sent to Albany by way of the pari-mutuel windows downstate? This is a no-brainer if you ask me. How it's gotten this far is laughable.

I looked at the numbers. In 2008 (the last year figs are available), NYRA ITSELF paid over $8M to NY State in the form of pari-mutuel taxes and fees just on the money wagered ON TRACK. New York State then received FORTY ONE MILLION DOLLARS from the money wagered on just NYRA races at all of the OTBs in the state combined (from a total NYRA-only OTB handle of around $557M).

It will take the state a mere four months (approx) to make back the 17M it owes the NYRA going by the above figures...it would be political suicide NOT to give the NYRA the money it needs and is in fact OWED. Let the politicians explain how they flushed almost FIFTY MILLION DOLLARS in tax revenue DOWN THE DRAIN. Yeah right. As if they EVER have any intention of doing such a thing. Tax revenue is what they live for.

Bottom line?

Your money is safe in a NYRA Rewards account, if only because of the simple fact that they will not be shutting down...they're worth way too much to the State of New York.

[Dahoss9698]

Back to the original thread...I believe I called it when I said there was no way in hell NYCOTB was going to close its doors when they threatened to go out of business...and I was right. I said they wouldn't close their doors whether or NOT they got any money from the state, and I was right.

Same thing goes for NYRA. Although, I'm fairly certain the NYRA doesn't have as many potential cost-cutting measures in their favor as NYCOTB has, despite what slewis would like to have us believe.

Thus I believe the NYRA will be getting enough money to keep them going, whether it be from NY State or NYCOTB or a combination of the two...

Some folks like to talk about how politically unpopular it would be for the state of NY to give the money to the NYRA that is OWED to the NYRA. slewis would have you believe that by doing so, 1000 state troopers might have to be put out of a job....utter nonsense...

The simple fact remains that the state of New York stands to continue making a steady stream of money in the form of TAKEOUT and FEES from every dollar you and I put through the windows. Does anyone honestly believe a mere $17M is enough to stop this cash cow? You're telling me nobody can come up with enough money to keep that gravy train a rollin'?

Please...spare me...

Does any of us honestly believe NY State is going to cut off its nose to spite its face? Has everyone forgotten all the money sent to Albany by way of the pari-mutuel windows downstate? This is a no-brainer if you ask me. How it's gotten this far is laughable.

I looked at the numbers. In 2008 (the last year figs are available), NYRA ITSELF paid over $8M to NY State in the form of pari-mutuel taxes and fees just on the money wagered ON TRACK. New York State then received FORTY ONE MILLION DOLLARS from the money wagered on just NYRA races at all of the OTBs in the state combined (from a total NYRA-only OTB handle of around $557M).

It will take the state a mere four months (approx) to make back the 17M it owes the NYRA going by the above figures...it would be political suicide NOT to give the NYRA the money it needs and is in fact OWED. Let the politicians explain how they flushed almost FIFTY MILLION DOLLARS in tax revenue DOWN THE DRAIN. Yeah right. As if they EVER have any intention of doing such a thing. Tax revenue is what they live for.

Bottom line?

Your money is safe in a NYRA Rewards account, if only because of the simple fact that they will not be shutting down...they're worth way too much to the State of New York.

Great post....

[slewis]

Back to the original thread...I believe I called it when I said there was no way in hell NYCOTB was going to close its doors when they threatened to go out of business...and I was right. I said they wouldn't close their doors whether or NOT they got any money from the state, and I was right.

Same thing goes for NYRA. Although, I'm fairly certain the NYRA doesn't have as many potential cost-cutting measures in their favor as NYCOTB has, despite what slewis would like to have us believe.

Thus I believe the NYRA will be getting enough money to keep them going, whether it be from NY State or NYCOTB or a combination of the two...

Some folks like to talk about how politically unpopular it would be for the state of NY to give the money to the NYRA that is OWED to the NYRA. slewis would have you believe that by doing so, 1000 state troopers might have to be put out of a job....utter nonsense...

The simple fact remains that the state of New York stands to continue making a steady stream of money in the form of TAKEOUT and FEES from every dollar you and I put through the windows. Does anyone honestly believe a mere $17M is enough to stop this cash cow? You're telling me nobody can come up with enough money to keep that gravy train a rollin'?

Please...spare me...

Does any of us honestly believe NY State is going to cut off its nose to spite its face? Has everyone forgotten all the money sent to Albany by way of the pari-mutuel windows downstate? This is a no-brainer if you ask me. How it's gotten this far is laughable.

I looked at the numbers. In 2008 (the last year figs are available), NYRA ITSELF paid over $8M to NY State in the form of pari-mutuel taxes and fees just on the money wagered ON TRACK. New York State then received FORTY ONE MILLION DOLLARS from the money wagered on just NYRA races at all of the OTBs in the state combined (from a total NYRA-only OTB handle of around $557M).

It will take the state a mere four months (approx) to make back the 17M it owes the NYRA going by the above figures...it would be political suicide NOT to give the NYRA the money it needs and is in fact OWED. Let the politicians explain how they flushed almost FIFTY MILLION DOLLARS in tax revenue DOWN THE DRAIN. Yeah right. As if they EVER have any intention of doing such a thing. Tax revenue is what they live for.

Bottom line?

Your money is safe in a NYRA Rewards account, if only because of the simple fact that they will not be shutting down...they're worth way too much to the State of New York.


PA,

I specifically stated in my post "Dont worry, it's not going to happen". in the context of :

A) NYRA's lawyers are not going to court for "owed" money (they would have already filed).

B) the short term issue would be resolved.

I should have made my point more precise. The point you make is precisely what I was suggesting. I could be wrong because I'm not privy to any kind of negotiations or discussions between NYRA and the state, but my bet is that the state warned NYRA that any legal action this time will piss so many politicos off that it WILL be the end. Im sure they told them to sit tight until details are worked out.

[SansuiSC]

Bottom line?

Your money is safe in a NYRA Rewards account, if only because of the simple fact that they will not be shutting down...they're worth way too much to the State of New York.

PA,

Thanks for bringing this back on topic. :ThmbUp: That said the money is probably safe in the NYRA One/Rewards account however to the customer it's a CYA situation.

This is a bad chess game between state and NYRA. Yes it is a cash cow for the state and would be foolish to let NYRA close the doors and it's unfortunate that these press releases and employee notices are moves in this chess game. I believe you live here in NY so you know what a shambles the politics are and the current state of the State.

Even if NYRA shuts the doors after the Belmont Stakes and doesn't open until tha Spa meet just to make a statement, why leave thousands of my dollars tied up with them with no definitive statement as to access to said funds. I'd rather leave a couple of hundred and have the cash to use with another ADW. It's just a matter of CYA at this point because we really have no idea what goes on behind doors on both sides.

This is why I started this topic. It's about the customer and their funds in the hands of NYRA who threatens to close.

[Tom]

OTB owes NYRA money.
No-brainer...FORCE them to pay up.

[rrbauer]

OTB owes NYRA money.
No-brainer...FORCE them to pay up.

They no got!

[Stillriledup]

PA,

Thanks for bringing this back on topic. :ThmbUp: That said the money is probably safe in the NYRA One/Rewards account however to the customer it's a CYA situation.

This is a bad chess game between state and NYRA. Yes it is a cash cow for the state and would be foolish to let NYRA close the doors and it's unfortunate that these press releases and employee notices are moves in this chess game. I believe you live here in NY so you know what a shambles the politics are and the current state of the State.

Even if NYRA shuts the doors after the Belmont Stakes and doesn't open until tha Spa meet just to make a statement, why leave thousands of my dollars tied up with them with no definitive statement as to access to said funds. I'd rather leave a couple of hundred and have the cash to use with another ADW. It's just a matter of CYA at this point because we really have no idea what goes on behind doors on both sides.

This is why I started this topic. It's about the customer and their funds in the hands of NYRA who threatens to close.


Nothing good can come out of leaving a large amount of funds in their account. Its not like its a money market fund getting 5% interest. The money is better off under the mattress until the smoke clears. I wouldnt trust these people as far as i can throw them.

[PaceAdvantage]

Nothing good can come out of leaving a large amount of funds in their account. Its not like its a money market fund getting 5% interest. The money is better off under the mattress until the smoke clears. I wouldnt trust these people as far as i can throw them.You could probably say this about every single ADW operation in existence. Although TVG advertises their accounts as insured...by whom, I'm not quite sure...

[OTM Al]

As we know from the commercials though, that means we don't have to worry and can concentrate on "pickin winners"....something about that guy's accent bugs me.....oh well, maybe that's why I haven't been able to pick many winners lately on my NYRA account.

[Stillriledup]

You could probably say this about every single ADW operation in existence. Although TVG advertises their accounts as insured...by whom, I'm not quite sure...


This is a good point, although here is the difference. If you have an account with XYZ ADW shop and they just go out of business for no patricular reason with no warning, that's part of life and once in a while you get horrible luck. But, if NYRA's place goes belly up, you had ample warning....so, if you leave your money in there, the regret will last you for eternity.....with the other situation, there won't be as much regret because it was sudden with no warning.

I mean, either way you're balance is zero, but i think you can live with yourself better if you went belly up with XYZ.

TVG is owned by Betfair....they seem pretty safe at the moment to be able to pay you...i think they gotta buncha money.

[Trotman]

IMO take your money and run, where there's smoke there usually a fire.

[DJofSD]

If the NY agency that holds the money wanted a good idea, they'd do what online brokers do: offer you a way to park your money in a safe place that'll earn some interest when it's not in the market.