sartin, database or both

[masterpeg]

currently doing quarterhorses, but years ago had read many book and tried my hand in the Sartin method (just took more time than I had at that point in my life). Both using pace handicapping and data queries seem logical to me. I have been building a database fore Los alamitos and have enjoyed its value.

Because thoroughbreds are more fun the prices are better, I'm going to give it another shot (a real shot.) I am going to use RDSS as I enjoy the Sartin method and am somewhat familiar with it (brohammers version). I also would like to have a database to help with eliminators and my betting line.

I don't see anyone using both methods in conjunction here (yet, I'm sure many are), but I do often see both users touting one way or the other. Is there anything wrong with finding a use for both?

Is there a program out there that will allow me to take the same data files used by RDSS (trackmaster I think) and create a database I can run queries on without having to create my own (not capable of that), and that doesn't cost 1100.00 (I think that's what I saw HSH costs now). I was going to go the HSH route, but It has more than I need.

[ranchwest]

currently doing quarterhorses, but years ago had read many book and tried my hand in the Sartin method (just took more time than I had at that point in my life). Both using pace handicapping and data queries seem logical to me. I have been building a database fore Los alamitos and have enjoyed its value.

Because thoroughbreds are more fun the prices are better, I'm going to give it another shot (a real shot.) I am going to use RDSS as I enjoy the Sartin method and am somewhat familiar with it (brohammers version). I also would like to have a database to help with eliminators and my betting line.

I don't see anyone using both methods in conjunction here (yet, I'm sure many are), but I do often see both users touting one way or the other. Is there anything wrong with finding a use for both?

Is there a program out there that will allow me to take the same data files used by RDSS (trackmaster I think) and create a database I can run queries on without having to create my own (not capable of that), and that doesn't cost 1100.00 (I think that's what I saw HSH costs now). I was going to go the HSH route, but It has more than I need.

I'm just learning Sartin, but here's my thoughts...

I think you have to be careful how you mix Sartin and databases.

Using Brohamer numbers and some of the Sartin Methodology has greatly improved the consistency of my profits.

So, I'd suggest that you get a grasp of the Sartin Methodology first and then see what you can mesh with it. I'd be concerned that it would be difficult to blend your database strategies into Sartin, which you might not yet understand adequately to know what to mix with it.

[acorn54]

as far as i know hsh software uses hdw data files, subscription on a monthly basis is 140 dollars, last i looked
as far as using trackmaster datafiles with a database software commercially available, i don't think there is one.

[Tom]

The Sartin methodology was using databases decades ago - the track model and profile are databases.

[Ted Craven]

masterpeg,

Just so you know, the TrackMaster data file used by RDSS is a customized, encrypted file not usable by other software (same as HDW files are encrypted to their target software), but you can buy them one-by-one. RDSS stores the data in a SQL relational database (Sybase SQLAnywhere) which you could open and query if you wanted to via any other front end using ODBC if you knew how.

RDSS performs database queries to assemble cards of races, Past Performances and retrieve the various calculated factors. Producing decision models, track profiles, tote progressions/relationships and wager records is in the near future, but that all is just different SQL queries from the same database. I'm guessing any query you could make on a normalized relational database is just another query against the data, if you have it or want to buy back data from TrackMaster.

I do plan eventually to make some kinds of reasonably detailed queries accessible from within the RDSS user interface, as I have a good front-end tool which can be grafted onto that database (or others). However, aside from the above described everyday info needed to do the work, I guess I am leery of going overboard making any and all kinds of queries available just because it can be done, when the built-in and time tested readouts perform so well. For example, there's a fairly standardized method of identifying prime contenders, calculating an odds line then formulating wager decisions from the primary actors which is central to the Methodology. You could (and should) attempt to come up with your own research and database queries to improve on that, but just so you know, what's built-in has been working rather well for some time now. What's still missing is the aforementioned integrated record keeping, which I'm working on.

I know you're in the process of signing on over at PaceandCap, so feel free to continue this discussion there, as well as here.

All the best,

Ted