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alytim
04-24-2010, 05:17 PM
Verry careless ride on a horse that was clearly best.

PaceAdvantage
04-24-2010, 05:33 PM
Others in different parts of the country with access to race replays are supposed to use their powers of ESP to discover which race/track/horse you are talking about?

slew101
04-24-2010, 05:42 PM
No way that checking incident cost him the race. Horse was empty, IMO.

RXB
04-24-2010, 05:43 PM
D'Funnybone in the Withers. Checked on the backstretch while trying to move through on the rail. Wouldn't have won, anyway. Anyone betting/singling D'Wildcat progeny at a mile or more, especially at 1/2, hasn't been paying attention.

JustRalph
04-24-2010, 05:46 PM
He has got to be talking about DFunny Bone in the feature at AQU today 9th

Prado and Chavez should both be horsewhipped

I didnt' play the race......... thought there was no money in it........ :lol:

Little did I know that two riders were going to lose their Freaking minds on the best two horses

That track was a parking lot today, although I didn't see all the races. The ones I did......were fast.........

Mike_412
04-24-2010, 05:47 PM
D'Funnybone in the Withers. Checked on the backstretch while trying to move through on the rail. Wouldn't have won, anyway. Anyone betting/singling D'Wildcat progeny at a mile or more, especially at 1/2, hasn't been paying attention.

My apologies if you put this up before the race, but is this a clever new way of redboarding? Just curious. Regardless, I hope you bet the winner or at least dutched out a profit if that's the case.

For the record, I didn't bet the race so this is not sour grapes.

PaceAdvantage
04-24-2010, 05:51 PM
He has got to be talking about DFunny Bone in the feature at AQU today 9thYup...just thought it would be nice for people reading this thread a day or two down the road to know that....

jognlope
04-24-2010, 05:56 PM
Yeah that was sad to watch, Funnybone being stopped in traffic.

RXB
04-24-2010, 05:59 PM
[/b]

My apologies if you put this up before the race, but is this a clever new way of redboarding? Just curious. Regardless, I hope you bet the winner or at least dutched out a profit if that's the case.

For the record, I didn't bet the race so this is not sour grapes.

No, not clever at all. Merely based on the facts about D'Wildcat, who is a pure sprint sire.

alytim
04-24-2010, 06:00 PM
Others in different parts of the country with access to race replays are supposed to use their powers of ESP to discover which race
/track/horse you are talking about?

Sorry for that careless post boss. I was referring to the ninth race at Aqueduct, where Edgar Prado(born June 12, 1967 in Lima, Peru)rode the 2-5 favorite D'Funnybone.

PaceAdvantage
04-24-2010, 06:01 PM
Sorry for that careless post boss. I was referring to the ninth race at Aqueduct, where Edgar Prado(born June 12, 1967 in Lima, Peru)rode the 2-5 favorite D'Funnybone.Glad you included his birthday. Let's me know a thing or two more...

cj
04-24-2010, 06:05 PM
Today's ride aside, Prado is a shell of his former self.

Spalding No!
04-24-2010, 06:05 PM
I didn't see the whole race, but certainly being that close to those fractions (:43+ and 1:07+) had to have killed the horse who was already stretching himself beyond his best distance.

garyoz
04-24-2010, 06:31 PM
Today's ride aside, Prado is a shell of his former self.

Agreed. Reminds me of Jorge Velasquez at the end of his career. The degree of the check was much more then what seemed to be necessary (IMHO). Seemed like a panicked ride. And he used to sit so chilly. I bet the Dutrow colt (but not to show--LOL).

joanied
04-24-2010, 06:50 PM
http://www.nyra.com/aqueduct/stories/Withers.shtml

Prado says..."he just didn't have the finish...the mile got him"


here's the video...
http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/56642/afleet-again-upsets-withers-d-funnybone-4th

Don't know why Prado checked like he did...hard to tell, but looked like he had more than enough room to go through...then he rushes him up to catch a horse that was literally flying...the fractions were killer.
IMO, had Prado not checked, d'Funnybone would have at least got a check...glad I wasn't around Dutrow after this one:eek:

ghostyapper
04-24-2010, 06:57 PM
It was a terrible move but what would the fractions had been if he let the horse run? Given the pace scenario I don't think he would have won today if he didn't check.

RXB
04-24-2010, 07:07 PM
I didn't see the whole race, but certainly being that close to those fractions (:43+ and 1:07+) had to have killed the horse who was already stretching himself beyond his best distance.

I'm not buying that 21.60 opening quarter. The other quarter-mile splits seem okay but not the first one. I was shocked when I watched the race and they posted that time.

westny
04-24-2010, 07:55 PM
I'm not buying that 21.60 opening quarter. The other quarter-mile splits seem okay but not the first one. I was shocked when I watched the race and they posted that time.

Right, :faint: Nyra made up the fractions. They came home in 26.6...hardly flying.

These were sprinters running a mile in a race with a classic example of a pace melt down after scorching fractions 21.4 44.4

RXB
04-24-2010, 08:06 PM
Instead of mocking me, try timing the Withers a few times, then do same with the 2nd race yesterday and the 2nd and 8th races from Thursday. Compare the results, and let's see if you're still mocking me afterwards.

the little guy
04-24-2010, 08:09 PM
Can I redboard that I didn't like D'Funnybone today?

RXB
04-24-2010, 08:10 PM
Go ahead, I did.

RXB
04-24-2010, 08:20 PM
BTW, in the interests of accuracy, I merely pointed out that his sire's runners are really bent hard toward sprinting and thus he would not be a good horse to key or single at such miserly odds in a mile race. I didn't say that I would've been shocked if he had won.

the little guy
04-24-2010, 08:21 PM
I wouldn't have been shocked either but I didn't like him today.

onefast99
04-24-2010, 08:37 PM
D'Funnybone in the Withers. Checked on the backstretch while trying to move through on the rail. Wouldn't have won, anyway. Anyone betting/singling D'Wildcat progeny at a mile or more, especially at 1/2, hasn't been paying attention.
I have a dwildcat and the horses limit is 7/8ths and that is it. Like the jock said he is better at 3/4 and 7/8ths.

onefast99
04-24-2010, 08:39 PM
Can I redboard that I didn't like D'Funnybone today?
I imagine it was the distance that had you going against this one. Unless you saw something else you didn't like.

RXB
04-24-2010, 08:58 PM
I have a dwildcat and the horses limit is 7/8ths and that is it. Like the jock said he is better at 3/4 and 7/8ths.

Wildcat Heir, another son of Forest Wildcat, is a very similar sire. I've done great with his 1st-time starters. They are total win-early sprint types.

To save effort for anyone who thought about taking up my challenge regarding the Withers timing: the first quarter times and also the final times, for those other three recent Aqu mile races all had a differential of around 2.1 seconds between the posted times and my hand-times from the gate (versus "the beam.) For the Withers, the differential was more like 3.8 seconds for both the first quarter-mile and the finish.

Tee
04-24-2010, 09:22 PM
What final time do you get from gate opening to nose on the wire? I'm guessing somewhere in the 1:38 range.


To save effort for anyone who thought about taking up my challenge regarding the Withers timing: the first quarter times and also the final times, for those other three recent Aqu mile races all had a differential of around 2.1 seconds between the posted times and my hand-times from the gate (versus "the beam.) For the Withers, the differential was more like 3.8 seconds for both the first quarter-mile and the finish.

RXB
04-24-2010, 09:26 PM
1:37.8.

westny
04-24-2010, 09:35 PM
What final time do you get from gate opening to nose on the wire? I'm guessing somewhere in the 1:38 range.

I always understood there is a run-up time BEFORE the race is timed.
You have to know the length of THAT distance before you can time the race.
From the gate is erronous unless there is no run-up time.

Maybe the little guy knows.

Tee
04-24-2010, 09:39 PM
The run up was 40 feet, go from there.



I always understood there is a run-up time BEFORE the race is timed.
You have to know the length of THAT distance before you can time the race.
From the gate is erronous unless there is no run-up time.

Maybe the little guy knows.

RXB
04-24-2010, 09:43 PM
I always understood there is a run-up time BEFORE the race is timed.
You have to know the length of THAT distance before you can time the race.
From the gate is erronous unless there is no run-up time.

Maybe the little guy knows.

It's not erroneous if the gate is in the same place for each race. So unless the starters' crew misplaced the gate by about 25 feet, there was a timer malfunction.

RXB
04-24-2010, 10:04 PM
Shouldn't have edited that post; I got it right the first time! About 25 yards, not 25 feet worth of gate misplacement to account for a timing differential of about 1.7 seconds. (Time to shut it down for the day. :sleeping: )

InTheRiver68
04-24-2010, 10:15 PM
I'm not crushed that he blew it here. $500 in, $3,765 out!

- InTheRiver68

Robert Goren
04-24-2010, 10:29 PM
It was an interesting ride to say the least. I don't think he would have won anyway. He was giving it up in his last race at 7F at GP. The fractions today at Aqu were very fast for most of the dirt races. JMO

toussaud
04-24-2010, 10:29 PM
Can I redboard that I didn't like D'Funnybone today?
i saw you pre race say you really wren't crazy about him so it's not really redboarding i don't think

Linny
04-24-2010, 10:31 PM
I have not timed the race but there was a very strong tailwind on the backstretch and as the field was mostly sprinters, I guess the time is possible. At AQU they run a mile out of a chute, so they have a long straightaway in front of them out of the gate.

I'm not sure why Prado even attempted to hustle D'Funnybone up from 4th into that pace. The colt has shown that he can rate.

onefast99
04-25-2010, 10:11 AM
I have not timed the race but there was a very strong tailwind on the backstretch and as the field was mostly sprinters, I guess the time is possible. At AQU they run a mile out of a chute, so they have a long straightaway in front of them out of the gate.

I'm not sure why Prado even attempted to hustle D'Funnybone up from 4th into that pace. The colt has shown that he can rate.
Now the connections know he can't go 1m he will win a lot of sprint races at 3/4 and 7/8ths.

joanied
04-25-2010, 11:10 AM
before the race, Dutrow said he was not at all worried about the distance...ooppsss!!

RXB
04-25-2010, 11:19 AM
I have not timed the race but there was a very strong tailwind on the backstretch and as the field was mostly sprinters, I guess the time is possible. At AQU they run a mile out of a chute, so they have a long straightaway in front of them out of the gate.


The posted 6f fraction of 1:07.45 is faster than Kelly Kip's 6f track record (1:07.54). There's no way. To my eye, they weren't going very fast at all for the first 2f; my immediate thought when they posted 21.60 was that it was way off the mark. D'Funnybone actually checked when Casteneda sped up noticeably just before the 3/4 pole.

The 1:34.05 posted final time is also completely out of whack with what those horses could run. I gave the winner a 93 Beyer. If I go with the posted times, he gets a 110. (His previous best is 83.) Iboyyee gets a 91 from me, which is in line with his two other recent starts.

The true splits are closer to: 23.3 45.5 1:09.2 1:35.7

JustRalph
04-25-2010, 12:12 PM
they sure stopped like they ran those fast times..........

Like dogs they stopped ......

Wickel
04-25-2010, 01:53 PM
Verry careless ride on a horse that was clearly best.

Definitely Prado's fault. DF's poor effort had nothing to do with the distance. Not only was he blatantly check midbackstretch for no reason, but after watching the replay, you can see that Prado wasn't ready for the break, either. DF broke slugglishly and toward the rail. He was last in the first couple hundred yards and had to be rushed. If you don't think all this took a toll late, then I don't know what to say. CJ pegged it in an earlier post: Prado is a shell of his former self.

onefast99
04-25-2010, 06:47 PM
Definitely Prado's fault. DF's poor effort had nothing to do with the distance. Not only was he blatantly check midbackstretch for no reason, but after watching the replay, you can see that Prado wasn't ready for the break, either. DF broke slugglishly and toward the rail. He was last in the first couple hundred yards and had to be rushed. If you don't think all this took a toll late, then I don't know what to say. CJ pegged it in an earlier post: Prado is a shell of his former self.
The distance worked against this horse. He will rebound with a win in a 7f or 6f sprint in three to four weeks.

the little guy
04-25-2010, 09:58 PM
The distance worked against this horse. He will rebound with a win in a 7f or 6f sprint in three to four weeks.


Your down.

RXB
04-25-2010, 10:50 PM
They usually run a G2 3YO stakes at 7f on Belmont day, don't they? Maybe that will be D'Funnybone's next appearance.

Regarding his finish position, I think that the backstretch steady cost him nothing more than 3rd money. There wasn't anything in the horse's recent running lines to indicate that he wanted more distance and his sire's progeny are hugely skewed toward sprinting.

onefast99
04-26-2010, 08:47 AM
Your down.
Ok.

Wickel
04-26-2010, 01:30 PM
The distance worked against this horse. He will rebound with a win in a 7f or 6f sprint in three to four weeks.

You might be right on, but I'm inclined to throw out the race completely and give him another shot. With Castaneda going 43 and change, a boatload of trouble and Prado in the irons, DF didn't have a prayer.

RXB
04-26-2010, 01:57 PM
I agree that it's possible for D'Funnybone to rebound in his next start.

Casteneda didn't go 43-and-change, though. Add 1.7 seconds to all calls and the final time and you'll get a clearer picture of the real pace.

eastie
04-27-2010, 10:16 AM
Your down.

rare grammatical mistake from TLG.
who do you like in the derby Andy ?



also as far as the fractions of the race. I can remember watching Mr. Greely run the same type of fractions and look like he was welll within himself doing it. Almost like he could have run 7 flat or 6 and change.

RXB
04-27-2010, 06:38 PM
Mr. Greeley ran 44.7 1:08.6 in the Jerome, opening up a good lead before tiring and being swamped by French Deputy.

In the Withers, a nondescript NY-bred 3YO is currently listed as having ran a second faster to both calls. Anyone with a stopwatch who's willing to invest a modest amount of time reviewing a few recent mile races at Aqu can corroborate what I reported earlier in the thread.

Bobzilla
05-10-2010, 06:39 PM
The posted 6f fraction of 1:07.45 is faster than Kelly Kip's 6f track record (1:07.54). There's no way. To my eye, they weren't going very fast at all for the first 2f; my immediate thought when they posted 21.60 was that it was way off the mark. D'Funnybone actually checked when Casteneda sped up noticeably just before the 3/4 pole.

The 1:34.05 posted final time is also completely out of whack with what those horses could run. I gave the winner a 93 Beyer. If I go with the posted times, he gets a 110. (His previous best is 83.) Iboyyee gets a 91 from me, which is in line with his two other recent starts.

The true splits are closer to: 23.3 45.5 1:09.2 1:35.7


Randy Moss wrote about the apparent timing malfunction for this race in his latest blog entry. Your splits look to be in line with the revised ones used by Andy Beyer and Mark Hopkins.

http://mossblog.typepad.com/randy-moss-blog/

RXB
05-10-2010, 07:44 PM
Bob, thanks for posting this. The timing is great (pun not intended initially, but intended upon review).

I'm in an ongoing e-mail exchange with a NYRA official regarding this matter. The first response, received exactly a week after the race, said: "No one else had questioned this matter up to now." The latest response, received earlier today, said: "The teletimer is correct..."

However, I have reason to suspect that a correction might be forthcoming on Wed or Thu, especially now that it's not just a nobody like me who has written that the times are way off, but also mighty DRF.

RXB
05-12-2010, 02:02 PM
Just got a follow-up e-mail from NYRA and they will be using these as their official times:

23.42
45.64
109.27
135.87

Stillriledup
05-12-2010, 07:18 PM
http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=67963&highlight=edgar+prado :(