View Full Version : Another pocket PC question
penguinfan
07-18-2003, 10:09 PM
I know the issue of betting via a pocket PC came up and it didn't look good, at least not yet, but what about handicapping software? Could one of those pocket PC's that runs on windows be capeable of running a program as big as some of the handicapping programs we use? It would be useful to have some of the information available at the track and lets face it, you can't print out EVERYTHING.
Thansk for any help.
Penguinfan
VetScratch
07-19-2003, 08:59 AM
The next logical step will be to tightly integrate wireless handicapping, data, and toteboard/wagering. We should see this for wireless laptops in the near future, and a palm/pocket PC implementation is sure to follow.
I think this business model is likely to emerge:
(1) A free stable of handicapping software will be part of the service.
(2) Data downloads will have a conditional fee schedule, and perhaps volume discounts.
(3) Toteboard access and wagering will have a conditional base monthly subscription fee.
(4) Wagering activity and volume will qualify users to have fees waived/discounted for both data downloads and toteboard/wagering subscription fees.
(5) Data download specifications and data extraction software will be open-sourced to enable non-affiliated software products or individual users to effectively use the data.
One nice feature would be automatic program changes updates throughout the course of the day. After logons, on demand, and also at periodic intervals thereafter, the software could update your previously downloaded racecards.
modred
07-19-2003, 11:34 PM
Has anyone programmed them for use at the track ....doesn't necessarily mean the whole handicapping program, but useful things to help one .. ie money management , data lists , etc.
VetScratch
07-20-2003, 01:23 AM
I can't see much appeal to a palm/pocket device that only maintains lists/reports loaded after handicapping on your desktop/laptop.
Manually entering toteboard data to compare with odds-lines or entering bankroll/wagers/results for money management won't appeal to many players (versus paper reports, pens, and solar calculators).
Until I can get wireless odds updates and conveniently place wireless wagers, I will prefer to stay with a bulky handicapping platform and carry my cell phone.
penguinfan
07-20-2003, 10:11 AM
The piece of software I use connects to a database and allows me to view all kinds of angles and such, that is what I want to take to the track with me and want to know if a pocket PC will do that or if it just too small yet. My guess is they are still not capeable of doing it, plus they run a different version of Windows, but nobody at the retail outlets seem to be able to answer these questions.
Penguinfan
VetScratch
07-20-2003, 11:24 AM
Penguinfan,
I assume "connects to a database" means via the Internet, such that database size is not an issue. In such cases, most Windows applications have to be adapted to run under Windows CE and present data in a way that best suits the palm/pocket display.
Since this kind of software is the bread and butter of wireless applications, it is a likely candidate for some wireless palm/pocket PC's. However, Intel/Microsoft platforms do not "monopolize" the palm/pocket marketplace, so that may inhibit your software supplier from adapting a standard Windows application for use on palm/pocket devices.
VetScratch
07-20-2003, 11:43 AM
Penguinfan,
You might want to post your question in the PA Off-Topic Forum where members might know more. For example, one conspiracy rumor asserts that internal memos smuggled out of Microsoft indicate that China has met with Intel/Microsoft to discuss plans to merge the three and enslave the rest of the world.
If this happens, I will join Larry Ellison's resistence fighters and hide out in Australia!
:) :) :)
ranchwest
07-22-2003, 01:13 AM
Originally posted by VetScratch
I assume "connects to a database" means via the Internet, such that database size is not an issue.
I don't know how this would be legally possible. Data providers expect you to download the data and then use it. I am not aware of any who allow using the data online. If you make the data available online, you've violated the license for the data.
I find having my laptop at the track is a big advantage for me because I can arrange the data views in a manner that is not suited to paper. Plus, lugging paper that is blowing in the wind and trying to figure out how to flip to the correct page is a pain, especially if you're trying to play multiple tracks.
While processing data might be nice, merely having a good view of the data is an advantage.
GameTheory
07-22-2003, 06:01 PM
Originally posted by ranchwest
I don't know how this would be legally possible. Data providers expect you to download the data and then use it. I am not aware of any who allow using the data online. If you make the data available online, you've violated the license for the data.
I find having my laptop at the track is a big advantage for me because I can arrange the data views in a manner that is not suited to paper. Plus, lugging paper that is blowing in the wind and trying to figure out how to flip to the correct page is a pain, especially if you're trying to play multiple tracks.
While processing data might be nice, merely having a good view of the data is an advantage.
It ought to be possible using a wireless connection to connect to your (password-protected) home machine via the internet, which acts as a server for your home database. So the data would not be available to anyone but you. But of course, no one's database is THAT big, and a few gig's can easily be accomodated on any modern laptop. The problem is when you want to connect via the internet to a real-time toteboard -- definitely you'll need the wireless connection for that. As long as the connection is reliable, I don't see any big problem with having your whole arsenal available to you at the track.
VetScratch
07-22-2003, 06:28 PM
Game and Ranch,
Penguinfan:
The piece of software I use connects to a database and allows me to view all kinds of angles and such...
I took Penguin's post to mean he connects to a web-based application which queries/extracts/reports from a database that he does not need to download, not unlike a lot of other web applications suitable for PCs and small wireless devices. I have been a mouse treading the BRIS wheel for so long that I made a mental leap to a service that may not exist! You guys undoubtedly know better what is available!
God, this black coffee is nauseous!:D :D :D
penguinfan
07-22-2003, 07:47 PM
The database is on my hard drive.
After looking further it appears a pocket PC is not a viable option, am looking into a tablet PC now, will let you know what I find out.
Penguinfan
ranchwest
07-22-2003, 10:49 PM
Even with a fast connection, I would not want to try to query a large database online while trying to handicap.
Each night I build summary tables that provide me with the totals that I want. I integrate these with my daily downloads and utilize screens that display the daily and summary data.
My primary database is on my desktop machine. I only bring the daily files enhanced with summary data on my laptop to the track (on the rare days when I go to the track).
I've currently got over 175,000 entries in my database, not huge, but not trivial, either.
azmike
05-27-2005, 11:18 PM
Thought I would try to bump this up for discussion.
There have been a lot of new PDA's and Smartphones since this thread stopped in '03.
Does anyone have any experience with Pocket PC or Palm based devices either handicapping or placing bets?
Thanks.
azmike
05-28-2005, 12:48 AM
I just noticed that youbet has a service called "youbet anywhere" designed for pocketpc devices. It is $19.95 per month but does not include video or audio.
My question, not being a techie, is--if you can access the internet using the pocketpc, why can't you just sign into youbet.com and use the features without subscribing to this extra service?
BillW
05-28-2005, 01:00 AM
Possibly screen size. Brisbet provides a "mobile" website that is formatted well for my cell phone. There is no charge.
Jeff P
05-28-2005, 01:32 AM
posted by penguinfan-I know the issue of betting via a pocket PC came up and it didn't look good, at least not yet, but what about handicapping software? Could one of those pocket PC's that runs on windows be capeable of running a program as big as some of the handicapping programs we use? It would be useful to have some of the information available at the track and lets face it, you can't print out EVERYTHING.
Back when I was working as a contract programmer, one of the more interesting projects I worked on was a database enabled pocket PC app we did for the Marine Corps. In a nutshell, the app gave the pocket PC user the ability to walk around a base or battlefield and tap a series of buttons and/or drop downs to do an inventory and order supplies. Supplies could mean anything from hum-vee parts to food and water to replacing live ammo. The pocket PC part was written in CE basic. At the end of the shift, the user would just insert the pocket PC into a cradle connected to a PC with a standard USB cable and it would auto-sync up with the server. The pocket PC would simply write its database file onto the server. The server app - which was my end of it - was web ennabled - ASP Pages written in VBScript connected to an Oracle database. Because it was web enabled, marine supply presonnel anywhere in the world could log onto the server, visit the web page(s) I designed and coded, and at the click of a button, see exactly what was being requested, when it was requested, why it was requested, and by whom. Very cool app. Not cheap but it worked pretty flawlessly. Your defense dollars at work.
So yes. I can see where an app could be written so that handicapping info could be transferred from a PC to a pocket PC and vice versa.
-jp
mcikey01
05-28-2005, 08:18 AM
The site called netcapper.com offers a Palm version of its Fig Line software that sets fair odds lines and overlays odds using any set of figures you choose to.
I use the desktop version and like it.
Its the only Palm version of handicapping utility software I am aware of.
However, You must purchase the software pre-loaded into a new Palm. You can't purchase the Palm software and upload it.
The Palm is obviously more limited in its computing capability than the desktop version, and, therefore its odds line may not be as accurate.
Hope that helps.
bobbyb
05-28-2005, 10:04 AM
AZMIKE, I use my PPC whenever I'm on Track - I use it to compute the following:
Starting Bankroll ~ Preceived % edge on my wager = Bet Amount (1/2 Kelly) using Tote odds vs My Odds - this little application has saved me a ton of $$. 3 taps and I know if I'm betting or not.
Pick 3/4/ Ticket structure and cost.
AND THE BONUS - CJ's Figs :) - NO printing needed (I edit (Condensed Version) into MS Word, re format the output and use Active Sync to transfer). :jump:
I use a Cassio E-125 - mainly because most of my applications are CE based, + it has a huge screen almost 2 1/2" x 3 1/2". IMHO this is/was an excellent PPC - now going on 5 yrs of age.
bobbyb
Storm Cadet
05-28-2005, 10:39 AM
nt :confused:
BillW
05-28-2005, 11:23 AM
http://mobile.brisbet.com
Storm Cadet
05-28-2005, 12:08 PM
Always go to Yoder...I mean BILLW for answers....may the force be with your selections today! ;)
BillW
05-28-2005, 12:10 PM
It's my homepage on my cell phone - don't go anywhere without it. :jump:
BTW - for you non-Brisbet subscribers, the results are open to the public via this URL
kingfin66
05-28-2005, 12:18 PM
What I would like to know is why there isn't software that enables you to load software - any software of suitable size - on your PDA. I too would like to have my horse racing info on my PDA for quick reference. TMM and my exotic calc program are all I would need. Okay maybe one or two small Excel spreadsheets as well, but that's it.
JustRalph
05-28-2005, 01:13 PM
http://mobile.brisbet.com (http://mobile.brisbet.com/)
I have used it. works pretty well. Pulled up outside a Panera bread shop with WiFi. Sat in my truck and placed a bet. Wouldn't our forefathers like to have seen that? God Bless the Internet..............
azmike
05-28-2005, 04:47 PM
So yes. I can see where an app could be written so that handicapping info could be transferred from a PC to a pocket PC and vice versa.
-jp
Jeff: I have been very impressed with your posts and your new software. Any plans/possibility of your jcapper working on a pocket pc?
azmike
05-28-2005, 04:49 PM
AZMIKE, I use my PPC whenever I'm on Track - I use it to compute the following:
Starting Bankroll ~ Preceived % edge on my wager = Bet Amount (1/2 Kelly) using Tote odds vs My Odds - this little application has saved me a ton of $$. 3 taps and I know if I'm betting or not.
Pick 3/4/ Ticket structure and cost.
AND THE BONUS - CJ's Figs :) - NO printing needed (I edit (Condensed Version) into MS Word, re format the output and use Active Sync to transfer). :jump:
I use a Cassio E-125 - mainly because most of my applications are CE based, + it has a huge screen almost 2 1/2" x 3 1/2". IMHO this is/was an excellent PPC - now going on 5 yrs of age.
bobbyb
Thanks for the helpful post. A couple of questions:
Is there a PPC application you use for structuring and tracking your bets?
Can you walk me through how you use "CJ's figs" on the PPC?
Thanks again.
azmike
05-28-2005, 04:52 PM
Possibly screen size. Brisbet provides a "mobile" website that is formatted well for my cell phone. There is no charge.
I have Brisbet account. Is there any extra charge for the mobile/wireless service. Is there a separate sign-up/log-on?
Thanks for your response.
azmike
05-28-2005, 05:14 PM
BTW, here is the website for the "Youbet Anywhere" service I posted above. Although it has a nice interface, it seems a little pricey at $19.99 per month with no video or audio:
http://products.digitalorchid.com/youbet/
BillW
05-28-2005, 05:51 PM
I have Brisbet account. Is there any extra charge for the mobile/wireless service. Is there a separate sign-up/log-on?
Thanks for your response.
No - standard login and password
azmike
05-30-2005, 06:12 PM
I have used it. works pretty well. Pulled up outside a Panera bread shop with WiFi. Sat in my truck and placed a bet. Wouldn't our forefathers like to have seen that? God Bless the Internet..............
Would you mind sharing with us what type of mobile device you were using that permitted you to access the internet via wi-fi. I understand that not all pocket pc's or palms have this ability.
As you can tell by my basic questions, I am just starting to look at this type of mobile devices for using with horse racing. Thanks.
JustRalph
05-30-2005, 07:15 PM
Would you mind sharing with us what type of mobile device you were using that permitted you to access the internet via wi-fi. I understand that not all pocket pc's or palms have this ability.
As you can tell by my basic questions, I am just starting to look at this type of mobile devices for using with horse racing. Thanks.
http://www1.us.dell.com/content/products/features.aspx/dotw_axim1?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs
see the link above
Storm Cadet
05-30-2005, 08:25 PM
Palm Treo 650...with Unlimited web air time from Sprint
Blackgold
05-30-2005, 09:23 PM
I currently use the Sprint Pocket PC/ Phone, model 6600. WiFi, cellular net access, Blue Tooth. . . I'm wired with no wires man!
azmike
05-30-2005, 10:18 PM
Palm Treo 650...with Unlimited web air time from Sprint
Could you share with us "how" you use it in connection with horse racing? Thanks.
BTW, I heard that is a great phone/pda.
azmike
05-30-2005, 10:19 PM
I currently use the Sprint Pocket PC/ Phone, model 6600. WiFi, cellular net access, Blue Tooth. . . I'm wired with no wires man!
Are you able to use any handicapping software programs and/or bet using your PC Phone? Thanks
azmike
05-31-2005, 11:41 PM
I just discovered that the NYRA has a free wireless service for PDA's, smartphones, Palm OS and Pocket PC--
http://www.nyra.com/Aqueduct/wireless.asp?track=A
azmike
05-31-2005, 11:44 PM
Brief story at--
http://www.pcworld.com/news/article/0,aid,120714,00.asp
Jeff P
06-01-2005, 04:56 AM
posted by azmike- Jeff: I have been very impressed with your posts and your new software. Any plans/possibility of your jcapper working on a pocket pc?
JCapper's reports are portable. The HTML Report is an html file with a little javascript thrown in. It should be viewable in just about any web browser, including those found on pocket PCs. Any current users who happen to have pocket PCs should be able to transfer the file (filename: Report_1.html) from their PC to their pocket PC and then simply open the file using the pocket PC's default browser to view it.
Getting the entire program up and running on a pocket PC would be quite an undertaking. Right now I have no plans to go that route.
-jp
azmike
06-01-2005, 12:23 PM
posted by azmike-
JCapper's reports are portable. The HTML Report is an html file with a little javascript thrown in. It should be viewable in just about any web browser, including those found on pocket PCs. Any current users who happen to have pocket PCs should be able to transfer the file (filename: Report_1.html) from their PC to their pocket PC and then simply open the file using the pocket PC's default browser to view it.
-jp
Thanks Jeff. So do I understand that because the format, HTML, is web browser friendly I could view it intact on a pocket pc. In other words will the pocket pc version be reduced in size so the full report is visible in smaller scale? As to transferring the report to the pocket pc--how would I do that? Sounds interesting.
Jeff P
06-01-2005, 05:46 PM
posted by azmike- As to transferring the report to the pocket pc--how would I do that? Here's a link to a page with a tutorial for using Windows Explorer to copy files from a PC to a pocket PC:
http://www.pqdvd.com/support/transfer2ppc.html
posted by azmike- So do I understand that because the format, HTML, is web browser friendly I could view it intact on a pocket pc. In other words will the pocket pc version be reduced in size so the full report is visible in smaller scale? The pocket PC version wouldn't be reduced in any way. You'd be copying the souce file for the HTML Report from your PC to your pocket PC. But because the file is simple html, the browser on a pocket PC should be capable of rendering it. Because the height and width of the HTML Report will exceed the screen area of a pocket PC, the browser should provide scroll bars. So the report would be viewable on a pocket PC, but the user would have to scroll around a bit to view the complete page content.
I need to make it clear that I don't have a pocket PC to unit test how a pocket PC browser will render JCapper's HTML Report. But based on my experience with the aforementioned pocket PC app we did for Uncle Sam, it should work - at least in theory. If there are any JCapper users out there with pocket PCs, by all means - give it a try and PLEASE let me know if I'm barking up the wrong tree.
-jp
.
azmike
06-01-2005, 05:57 PM
Thanks very much for taking the time to answer my questions!
Blackgold
06-02-2005, 09:11 PM
I use it to get the tote board from Bris, the scratches, exacta probables, etc.
Then I call in the wager.
I will have a race targeted for consideration before hand and have the printouts on hand for reference.
Good luck!
Storm Cadet
06-03-2005, 11:29 AM
I use it each day...1st I go on the NYRA wireless site to get changes and scratches...BetAmerica wireless site to place wagers and get quick results.
Don't get caught in a Vegas casino with one...they :mad: at you with any cell phone...but they have not caught on about the Palm 650 because if they come by, I change the screen to the Palm date book screen... :p
azmike
06-03-2005, 04:24 PM
I use it each day...1st I go on the NYRA wireless site to get changes and scratches...BetAmerica wireless site to place wagers and get quick results.
Thanks for the info. Could you give me the betamerica website address. I am not familar with that one.
Storm Cadet
06-03-2005, 04:58 PM
bet america site
http://mobile.brisbet.com
BillW
06-05-2005, 03:17 AM
This is pretty cool -
http://www.3g.co.uk/PR/December2004/8839.htm
azmike
06-05-2005, 01:04 PM
This is pretty cool -
http://www.3g.co.uk/PR/December2004/8839.htm
Very cool. Now that is something I would want for USA racing.
azmike
06-08-2005, 12:25 AM
Equibase also has a free wireless service for entries, scratches and results:
http://www.equibase.com/about/faq.cfm#wire
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