Most Americans Wary of U.S. Government

[boxcar]

And I suppose it's these same Americans who are foaming at the mouth to get ObamaCare passed. :rolleyes:

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2010/02/26/cnn-poll-majority-says-government-a-threat-to-citizens-rights/?fbid=kjaBVJTen7q

Boxcar

[acorn54]

knocking the government is a favorite pasttime with people.
i do taxes part time and i get kick out of the people who i file for that pay no federal and state income taxes and get a pretty hefty sum in tax refunds. they complain about all the taxes the government levies.

[46zilzal]

Hardly a suprise given the track record.

[boxcar]

Hardly a suprise given the track record.

Yes, you're right -- no "suprise" at all due to the government's track record! Consider this poll with the rather dismal 10% approval rating of the Democrat-controlled congress, and it all makes sense -- to those who can connect the dots.

Boxcar

[boxcar]

knocking the government is a favorite pasttime with people.
i do taxes part time and i get kick out of the people who i file for that pay no federal and state income taxes and get a pretty hefty sum in tax refunds. they complain about all the taxes the government levies.

You should tell such ungrateful ingrates they should be thankful that the government has turned the tax system into a welfare system -- for their benefit and at the expense of all the productive taxpayers in this country.

Boxcar

[DRIVEWAY]

knocking the government is a favorite pasttime with people.
i do taxes part time and i get kick out of the people who i file for that pay no federal and state income taxes and get a pretty hefty sum in tax refunds. they complain about all the taxes the government levies.

There are a lot of games being played with childcare tax credits. Married people with two children will claim that they are living apart. One will change address to a closeby neighbor or relative. Each will claim one child and file as married but separated. The trick here is that one or both earn the right amount to qualify for the childcare tax credit. If they filed a joint return they would get little or no childcare tax credit.

However, by filing separate returns with one child each they hit the jackpot. The community organizers of the world are expert in explaining this hustle.

Now to be fair they still pay sales taxes and real estate taxes and gas taxes and tolls and cigarette taxes and liquor taxes etc.

Now the poor rich folk who pay all the federal taxes are stuck with the alternative minimum tax and living trusts and bonus income and cadillac healthcare and enormous pensions etc.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[sonnyp]

knocking the government is a favorite pasttime with people.
i do taxes part time and i get kick out of the people who i file for that pay no federal and state income taxes and get a pretty hefty sum in tax refunds. they complain about all the taxes the government levies.


do you also get a kick out of guys like dodd & co. who have made their living out of mis-appropriating, shamelessly, these tax revenues in return for sweetheart deals and personal enhancement ???

[boxcar]

There are a lot of games being played with childcare tax credits. Married people with two children will claim that they are living apart. One will change address to a closeby neighbor or relative. Each will claim one child and file as married but separated. The trick here is that one or both earn the right amount to qualify for the childcare tax credit. If they filed a joint return they would get little or no childcare tax credit.

However, by filing separate returns with one child each they hit the jackpot. The community organizers of the world are expert in explaining this hustle.

Now to be fair they still pay sales taxes and real estate taxes and gas taxes and tolls and cigarette taxes and liquor taxes etc.

Now the poor rich folk who pay all the federal taxes are stuck with the alternative minimum tax and living trusts and bonus income and cadillac healthcare and enormous pensions etc.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Those "poor rich folk" EARNED those "living trusts and bonus income and cadillac healthcare and enormous pensions". What about you?

And are you as envious of public employees' enormous pensions as you are of the those in the private sector?

Boxcar

[ArlJim78]

do you also get a kick out of guys like dodd & co. who have made their living out of mis-appropriating, shamelessly, these tax revenues in return for sweetheart deals and personal enhancement ???
or how about all the wealthy democrats who for years have been decrying the Bush tax cuts? how many of them do you think have refused to accept those tax cuts on the grounds that it was unfair and undeserved, and that they should have to pay their fair share to help the poor. like Biden said, because it's patriotic.

no instead what you find out is most of them are tax cheats, they don't even pay what they're supposed to even with Bush's tax cuts.

[sonnyp]

or how about all the wealthy democrats who for years have been decrying the Bush tax cuts? how many of them do you think have refused to accept those tax cuts on the grounds that it was unfair and undeserved, and that they should have to pay their fair share to help the poor. like Biden said, because it's patriotic.

no instead what you find out is most of them are tax cheats, they don't even pay what they're supposed to even with Bush's tax cuts.




it seems the wonderful justice department launches investigations into many, many areas these days. steroids, the B C S, and the amount of time, effort and resources spent on busting "gamblers" is mind boggling.

you know where and what they should launch an investigation into ?

CONGRESS. that would keep them employed for an awfully long time. if it weren't so pitiful, it would be laughable !

[DRIVEWAY]

Those "poor rich folk" EARNED those "living trusts and bonus income and cadillac healthcare and enormous pensions". What about you?

And are you as envious of public employees' enormous pensions as you are of the those in the private sector?

Boxcar

Grow up. Everyone is gaming the tax system.

[boxcar]

Grow up. Everyone is gaming the tax system.

Yeah, but isn't it interesting that you didn't express your disdain for unionized workers' pension windfalls in the public sector even though they are making out much better, on average, than most folks in the private one? (I just want to keep you fair and balanced.) Plus, I have to think you have enough of that stench-filled class envy in you to be able to spread it around some beyond the private sector.

Boxcar

[DRIVEWAY]

Yeah, but isn't it interesting that you didn't express your disdain for unionized workers' pension windfalls in the public sector even though they are making out much better, on average, than most folks in the private one? (I just want to keep you fair and balanced.) Plus, I have to think you have enough of that stench-filled class envy in you to be able to spread it around some beyond the private sector.

Boxcar

Now you are arguing about statements I didn't make. It seems that you have a penchant for putting words in other people's mouth and then arguing against those words.

And then there's the stench-filled class envy characterization. Wow.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[boxcar]

Now you are arguing about statements I didn't make. It seems that you have a penchant for putting words in other people's mouth and then arguing against those words.

And then there's the stench-filled class envy characterization. Wow.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I'm not putting words in your mouth. But you're so dense, you don't see that I'm criticizing you for your hypocrisy. You come down on the wealthy in the private sector with a sledge hammer, and one of the reasons were due to their fat pensions. But you conveniently forget that public sector union workers' pensions are generally much fatter than the average Joe's in the private sector. In fact, in many cases those pensions would rival those of wealthy folks in the private sector. So, why don't you spread around your class envy to the folks in the public sector, too?

Boxcar

[DRIVEWAY]

I'm not putting words in your mouth. But you're so dense, you don't see that I'm criticizing you for your hypocrisy. You come down on the wealthy in the private sector with a sledge hammer, and one of the reasons were due to their fat pensions. But you conveniently forget that public sector union workers' pensions are generally much fatter than the average Joe's in the private sector. In fact, in many cases those pensions would rival those of wealthy folks in the private sector. So, why don't you spread around your class envy to the folks in the public sector, too?

Boxcar

Are you on medication?

[46zilzal]

The vast majority of rich people would give up a body organ before they let go of their money

[johnhannibalsmith]

The vast majority of rich people would give up a body organ before they let go of their money

Yet they pay for "Cadillac plans"... huh...

[boxcar]

The vast majority of rich people would give up a body organ before they let go of their money

And why do you care? It's their money. It's their life. What is it to you? Why do you want to dictate or have the state dictate to other people how to live their lives?

Boxcar

[boxcar]

Are you on medication?

No, but you need to OD on anti-jealousy meds. Even then...I'm not sure it would help cure your hatred for the wealthy.

Boxcar

[46zilzal]

And why do you care? It's their money. It's their life. What is it to you? Why do you want to dictate or have the state dictate to other people how to live their lives?

Boxcar
I care because I see how they sequester income in legal tricks to defray or outright NEVER pay their share of the taxes.

I once had a deviously good accountant as well, for years, and have been privy to many tricks. It always bothered me as to the legitimacy of what was done as compared to say, my parents were able to do in their income bracket. Not fair at all.

[DRIVEWAY]

No, but you need to OD on anti-jealousy meds. Even then...I'm not sure it would help cure your hatred for the wealthy.

Boxcar

Drink a class of warm milk and take your afternoon nap. Hopefully, that will help you feel better and get over your dillussions.

Now fluff your pillow and zoom off into never-never land.

[boxcar]

Drink a class of warm milk and take your afternoon nap. Hopefully, that will help you feel better and get over your dillussions.

Now fluff your pillow and zoom off into never-never land.

Yeah, maybe I will once you learn how to spell. But I don't know what "dillussions" are. :rolleyes:

If you spent your time more constructively (perhaps learning grammar and spelling, for example), rather than cultivating your hate for the wealthy, you might acquire some credibility and ditch your shadow of hypocrisy.

Boxcar

[DRIVEWAY]

Yeah, maybe I will once you learn how to spell. But I don't know what "dillussions" are. :rolleyes:

If you spent your time more constructively (perhaps learning grammar and spelling, for example), rather than cultivating your hate for the wealthy, you might acquire some credibility and ditch your shadow of hypocrisy.

Boxcar

Now it's spelling bee time. You didn't nap long enough. :sleeping:

[boxcar]

Now it's spelling bee time. You didn't nap long enough. :sleeping:

It's encouraging to see that you get those one syllable words right. Keep up the good work. :rolleyes:

Boxcar

[newtothegame]

I care because I see how they sequester income in legal tricks to defray or outright NEVER pay their share of the taxes.

I once had a deviously good accountant as well, for years, and have been privy to many tricks. It always bothered me as to the legitimacy of what was done as compared to say, my parents were able to do in their income bracket. Not fair at all.

Amazing how you say you had a good accountant for "YEARS"...then you turn around and say how it "bothered" you as to the legitimacy of what was done.....

Didnt bother you enough to get rid of them when they tried to give ya those legal tricks their zilly???? :lol:

[46zilzal]

Amazing how you say you had a good accountant for "YEARS"...then you turn around and say how it "bothered" you as to the legitimacy of what was done.....

Didnt bother you enough to get rid of them when they tried to give ya those legal tricks their zilly???? :lol:
I grew up with nothing, and NO one in my family was able to secure the income or education I attained. When I saw all the gross imbalances I was accorded just by having a socially accepted title, knowing what a great fellow my dad and others in my family were, and were yet denied that same access, it bothered me no less today than it did then.

I have great disdain for many in my classes who are NOW in the position of "my shit doesn't stink" just because they were fortunate and forgot where they came from. I never will.

[johnhannibalsmith]

I grew up with nothing, and NO one in my family was able to secure the income or education I attained. When I saw all the gross imbalances I was accorded just by having a socially accepted title, knowing what a great fellow my dad and others in my family were, and were yet denied that same access, it bothered me no less today than it did then.

I have great disdain for many in my classes who are NOW in the position of "my shit doesn't stink" just because they were fortunate and forgot where they came from. I never will.

I'd argue that you have since you seem to assume that other success stories that you condemn didn't face the same struggles and benefit from the opportunities that our country offers to those willing to effort towards success.

[boxcar]

I care because I see how they sequester income in legal tricks to defray or outright NEVER pay their share of the taxes.

Errr...you referrin' to those often little known loopholes? And who put them there? The People or the Politicians? And aren't they there so that advantage of them can be taken? Methinks your hatred for the wealthy is misplaced. :rolleyes:

Boxcar

[46zilzal]

Errr...you referrin' to those often little known loopholes? And who put them there? The People or the Politicians? And aren't they there so that advantage of them can be taken? Methinks your hatred for the wealthy is misplaced.

Boxcar
Don't hate anyone or any thing, just gross inequality gets me.

[boxcar]

I grew up with nothing, and NO one in my family was able to secure the income or education I attained. When I saw all the gross imbalances I was accorded just by having a socially accepted title, knowing what a great fellow my dad and others in my family were, and were yet denied that same access, it bothered me no less today than it did then.

Since opportunities were denied to virtually everyone under the sun (save for yourself, of course), perhaps you'd tell us how you managed to escape the same fate as your family members. How did you manage to gain access to those great education and income opportunities that only the "privileged" few supposedly do?

And then I want to ask you this: Do you really believe that everyone has some kind of guaranteed right to success, good health, happiness and general good fortune? If so, where is this right "written"? Who bestows this right?

Boxcar

[boxcar]

Don't hate anyone or any thing, just gross inequality gets me.

Fine. Just answer my question about loopholes, then. Are these the "legal tricks" to which you were alluding earlier?

Boxcar

[jonnielu]

Errr...you referrin' to those often little known loopholes? And who put them there? The People or the Politicians? And aren't they there so that advantage of them can be taken? Methinks your hatred for the wealthy is misplaced. :rolleyes:

Boxcar

If you want to call them loopholes (as if one is obliged to donate to another) go ahead, but there are no "loopholes" in the income tax code that Congress can't close at their whimsy. The entire tax code is completely under the control of Congress.

And, of course people are wary of government, no one would pay the income tax if they weren't afraid not to. That's how you work extortion.

jdl

[boxcar]

If you want to call them loopholes (as if one is obliged to donate to another) go ahead, but there are no "loopholes" in the income tax code that Congress can't close at their whimsy. The entire tax code is completely under the control of Congress.

Did I not imply as much to Zilly earlier when I said his anger or hatred is misplaced!? Of course, those "loopholes" are there by design! And they're in the tax code so that politicians and the wealthy alike (at the risk of being redundant) can take advantage of them.

And, of course people are wary of government, no one would pay the income tax if they weren't afraid not to. That's how you work extortion.

Not if you listen to libs. According to their interpretation of reality, virtually everyone in the land wants a bigger and more controlling government.

Boxcar

[newtothegame]

I grew up with nothing, and NO one in my family was able to secure the income or education I attained. When I saw all the gross imbalances I was accorded just by having a socially accepted title, knowing what a great fellow my dad and others in my family were, and were yet denied that same access, it bothered me no less today than it did then.

I have great disdain for many in my classes who are NOW in the position of "my shit doesn't stink" just because they were fortunate and forgot where they came from. I never will.

Well obviously it didntbother you enough to do the right thing and show your true disdain. You could of easily got rid of the guy who was taking liberties with your taxes. Yet, not once have you mentioned getting rid of him/her in the name of doing the right thing....:bang:

[jonnielu]

Did I not imply as much to Zilly earlier when I said his anger or hatred is misplaced!? Of course, those "loopholes" are there by design! And they're in the tax code so that politicians and the wealthy alike (at the risk of being redundant) can take advantage of them.



Not if you listen to libs. According to their interpretation of reality, virtually everyone in the land wants a bigger and more controlling government.

Boxcar

Well the libs only recite from those living on the government tit, the middle class could take advantage of as many loopholes as anyone else, hell they don't even have to participate. But, to put an end to the burden they carry (which is all of it), they would have to stand up for themselves. Few are so motivated.

I believe that Thomas Jefferson put the truest words ever to paper when he wrote:

and accordingly all Experience hath shewn, that Mankind are more disposed to suffer, while Evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the Forms to which they are accustomed.

I just hope the evils can get all the way to unsufferable soon, because then maybe people will do something about it. Like, revolt - recall - repeal.

jdl

[boxcar]

Well the libs only recite from those living on the government tit, the middle class could take advantage of as many loopholes as anyone else, hell they don't even have to participate. But, to put an end to the burden they carry (which is all of it), they would have to stand up for themselves. Few are so motivated.

I believe that Thomas Jefferson put the truest words ever to paper when he wrote:

and accordingly all Experience hath shewn, that Mankind are more disposed to suffer, while Evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the Forms to which they are accustomed.

I just hope the evils can get all the way to unsufferable soon, because then maybe people will do something about it. Like, revolt - recall - repeal.

jdl

That's a very interesting quote. And it brings to mind a passage in the OT that, when understood in its larger context, is essentially saying the same thing as Jefferson concluded! Who knows? Jefferson might have had this or some similar passage in mind when he penned that. Here is the text:

Num 14:11-12
11 And the LORD said to Moses, "How long will this people spurn Me? And how long will they not believe in Me, despite all the signs which I have performed in their midst? 12 "I will smite them with pestilence and dispossess them, and I will make you into a nation greater and mightier than they."
NASB

God delivered the Jews from their oppressive slave masters in Egypt and brought them into the wilderness to teach them his laws and statutes before bringing them into the Promised Land. And in their sight, the Lord performed numerous signs and wonders during this sojourn in the wilderness. Yet, time and time again the Jews rebelled against God. They whined about this, complained about that, bellyached about something else. They weren't happy because they thought they were going to die of thirst. Then they were unhappy because they thought they'd die of starvation. Then they believed their enemies would slaughter them as they entered the land of Canaan etc. But more than this: They also lamented their own deliverance from their former oppressors! They actually wanted to return to Egypt! They were more willing to place their trust in their wicked slave masters than in the Righteous God of all Heaven and Earth. When men start to feel sorry for themselves and adopt and fully embrace a victimization attitude (which certain the Jews did), they were even willing to go back to their old situations. Forget about trying something new -- they're willing, like dogs, to return to their own vomit!

Jefferson was right. This is why it will be so easy for all mankind to flock to the Beast at the end. Man is so gullible and so self-deceived, he will eagerly follow after the antichrist -- believing this mere mortal will deliver mankind into a new kind of promised land. This is why socialism and Marxism and all man-centered, godless forms of government are so naturally embraced throughout the world today. Men looking to other men for their deliverance -- just as the ancient Jews would have easily turned back to the Egyptians to deliver them from their trials and tribulations in the wilderness, had it not been for God's grace. The parallels here are striking!

Boxcar

[Leonard]

Don't hate anyone or any thing, just gross inequality gets me.

I fully support equality of opportunity. Equality of results? Not in a million years.

[johnhannibalsmith]

I fully support equality of opportunity. Equality of results? Not in a million years.

Prediction: you get a rambling story about how a rich guy's kid he knew from youth had WAY more opportunity than he did as 46er was BORN into the working poor and yet, 46er STILL got a higher score on the SAT, LSAT, passed THE bar, graduated FROM Tufts Medical School, WON an Oscar, an Emmy, and an Eclipse, before earning a PURPLE Heart for opposition to war... and then it will register that he's making your point for you...

[boxcar]

Prediction: you get a rambling story about how a rich guy's kid he knew from youth had WAY more opportunity than he did as 46er was BORN into the working poor and yet, 46er STILL got a higher score on the SAT, LSAT, passed THE bar, graduated FROM Tufts Medical School, WON an Oscar, an Emmy, and an Eclipse, before earning a PURPLE Heart for opposition to war... and then it will register that he's making your point for you...

Bingo! That's why 46er (as slow on the uptake as he can be) evidently did see the trap I laid and, therefore, never bothered to answer my questions about how he managed to gain access to everything that was denied his family. Obviously, if he can overcome the system, then so can anyone else. Therefore, there is no need for the welfare state.

But to be honest, I was really hoping to hear a great story chock full of miracles describing how he managed to overcome all the obstacles that the less fortunate face every day. But I suspect that we're going to be denied that opportunity. Access to his life story will be denied to us. :D

Boxcar

[Leonard]

Prediction: you get a rambling story about how a rich guy's kid he knew from youth had WAY more opportunity than he did as 46er was BORN into the working poor and yet, 46er STILL got a higher score on the SAT, LSAT, passed THE bar, graduated FROM Tufts Medical School, WON an Oscar, an Emmy, and an Eclipse, before earning a PURPLE Heart for opposition to war... and then it will register that he's making your point for you...

:lol: