Class is Speed?

[JimL]

At any given track, on average, each class of horse runs about one-or two-fifths faster than the next-lower class, and that the classes all line up in neat, lineal fashion, top to bottom, fast to slow. If this is true and it is, why not say class is speed with some confidence? If you read the book, Champions, you will see some horses that do not agree with the above however they are the exceptions. JimL

[Tom]

Each class may line up neatly when you look at averges or medians, but not so individual times. Say the Beyer par for $25,000 claimers is 90 and for $30,000 it is 93. Many 25K races will be won in 95 and many 30K raes will be run in 89.
Speed is an attribute of class, but in and of itself, it is not class.

[keilan]

Speed – Stamina – Heart -- are three characteristics I use to define Class.

[so.cal.fan]

I agree with Tom.
Class is the ability of a horse to carry it's speed for as far as nature intended it.
In my opinion, if a horse is bred and built to go a middle distance, then the faster it can carry it's speed over the distance of ground the better class it is.

[B. Comin']

I like James Quinn's definition of class:

class is speed and competitiveness for winners at various conditions of eligibility.

[so.cal.fan]

Actually, class is like the Tao..........you really can't define it.
You just intuitively know it exists

[GameTheory]

I think of class (partly) as the ability to best make use of your speed. There are horses that if running alone can run the same times as classier horses, but are handicapped by their running style -- their speed is not "tactical". In other words, if you have a die hard E horse and somehow train him to be an E/P horse, he should be able to move up in class successfully without actually getting faster -- he will be able to "be fast better".

[David McKenzie]

Originally posted by so.cal.fan
Actually, class is like the Tao..........you really can't define it.
You just intuitively know it exists

Ooooooh....I like that! :)

[VetScratch]

I have wondered why consistency does not seem to find it's way into class discussions or ratings.

Of course running style will influence how many checks a horse will earn, but the class ladders tend to neutralize this issue for many horses. As a general rule for dirt horses, E/P and P types offer the most management flexibility, while E and S types have to be carefully placed if you want to hit the board with any frequency. We always try to turn E-type youngsters into E/P runners, and confirmed S types generally have to be run a notch below their topmost levels in order to earn consistently.

All things being equal, we've also had horses that could hold good form longer than others. Over the career of two such horses, both may seem comparable if you isolate their winning efforts, but one will throw 8 good races out of 12 while the other will deliver 4 good races out of 12. The phrase "more common of the two" gets used when you compare the latter to the former.

In other cases, you have horses with known recurring problems such as quarter-cracking and weak immune systems, the latter being the kind that catches every bug that courses through the backside and gets his blood counts clobbered so that it takes time to get him built up again. These kind never show their class on a consistent basis, but may pay their way off a handful of good efforts when they are right.

Then you have your bottom feeders, both the kind that belong there and the kind that thrive there until you have to cart them off. What current class rating do you assign to the back-class opportunist who may win 5 or 6 of 12 at the bottom while carrying a bowling ball in one knee and throwing the other leg around like baton?

All handicappers mentally take consistency into account when they study a race, but I have never seen it quantified as part of a class rating fig (except off last race or relatively recent efforts). An earnings box formula cannot be used blindly for this purpose because of the way claiming class ladders respond to the wide variance in purse structures from track/state to track/state.

For the computer/numbers guys who are downloading and scanning lots of races each day, I would think some kind of consistency rating (together with all the other figures) might help find fields they want to pause and take a close look at. When you get past the obvious contenders, a high-degree of consistency variance might help formulate efficient exotic wagering strategies for 3 and 4 horse gimmicks.

[netherworld]

class is speed is form is greed
and we are all together

GOO GOO G’JOOB

[Derek2U]

ALL 2gether Now ...all toGetHer NOW.

[Secretariat]

Vetscratch,

I agree with you about measuring consitency, but how? Earnings Per Start, APV, or Quirin's formula. It is difficult to measure class and consistency accurately.

Ideas?

[Tom]

Originally posted by netherworld
class is speed is form is greed
and we are all together

GOO GOO G’JOOB

And the fireman rushes in,
from the pouring rain,
very strange

[kenwoodall]

Class is when your horse wins. Luck is when another horse wins!!

[Show Me the Wire]

Class is..

the instinct to run further and faster than the rest of the pack, to avoid being eaten, while being limited by its soundness and physical ability.


Regards,
Show Me the Wire

Perception is reality

[so.cal.fan]

SMTW:
That's probably as accurate of a definition as it gets.

[gino]

Barry White was Class.
R.I.P.
gino
p.s. Independence Day still has about 20 minutes to go here in Cali, and most of my neighbors, many of whom migrated from places where freedom and fireworks are in short supply, have run out of ammo...i've got "Can't Get Enough of Your Love" cued up, dialled to a zillion decibels, and it's time for some soulsome racket...just for drill, i'm coming in on the chorus with a burst or two of quasi-legal semi-automatic gunfire...safe and sane is for chalkplayers...
Happy Birthday, America and Happy Trails, Barry...
"keep on , baby, keep on doin' it..."

[VetScratch]

Barry sent chills up and down my spine! If you boosted the bass, he made your bones vibrate. Talk to me Barry, your little girl is listening! His lyrics (which seldom strayed off topic) were pretty direct, but something subliminal in his voice said, "Here is finally a man you can trust."

[Shacopate]

Hat's off to Barry White. Before my time, but chilly as a mother.

Rest in peace, my good man.

[Shacopate]

Speed is not class.

A horse that runs 6f in 1:09 at 10k will not likely repeat it against better at the 30k level.

The pace will be much faster and contentious.

[so.cal.fan]

"Speed is not class.

A horse that runs 6f in 1:09 at 10k will not likely repeat it against better at the 30k level".

Another accurate statement! No wonder so many horseplayers read this board!

[Tom]

Class is not speed.
However, pace is weight.
And recency is trainer intent.
Sometimes, consistency is weight, but usually it is pace.
Post position is pace, so you might think that post position is also weight, but it is not. That is a common error.

[JimL]

First of all I want to thank you for explaining the Taulbot Box. If that 10k claimer you speak of also cut a 44.4 half in that race then a two level jump in class would be the proper move. She would also be a good price! A horse that can run 44.4 109.0 does not belong with 10k stock.

[Show Me the Wire]

Originally posted by JimL
First of all I want to thank you for explaining the Taulbot Box. If that 10k claimer you speak of also cut a 44.4 half in that race then a two level jump in class would be the proper move. She would also be a good price! A horse that can run 44.4 109.0 does not belong with 10k stock.

Maybe maybe not, its herd instincts may stop it from running a 44.4 half against classier animals. However, it would be wise to try and move the animal up in class structure.

Regards,
Show Me the Wire

Perception is reality

[lousycapper]

a horse that cost $10,000,000, never ran, shot blanks when put to stud and I will show you a horse that ain't got no class! Heh, heh! :D :D :D

[gino]

Originally posted by Tom
Class is not speed.
However, pace is weight.
And recency is trainer intent.
Sometimes, consistency is weight, but usually it is pace.
Post position is pace, so you might think that post position is also weight, but it is not. That is a common error.
tom-
i think it was " the mortar with the pestle holds the brew that is true..", but then again "a smile is just a frown turned upside down." or as Nick Yemana, one of Barney Miller's crack detectives(played by the late,great Jack Soo), once said, "you can shoot the horse, but it will still have a broken leg..."
gino
all 4 now