Winning at the track

[wes]

Anyone using WINNING AT THE TRACK speed and pace program? Looks like they are coming out with a windows version in august.


wes

[BETKING]

I have the old dos version that I haven't used in years. Its on a 5.5 floppy disc and I have no way to load it on my computer. I hear the new version is very good. I also would like some feed back on this program from anyone that is now using it.
Thanks,

BETKING

[jackad]

Also, any feedback on the Thorobrain 5 neural net program. Please?
Jack

[andicap]

From what I remember Jack it was a very tough learning curve to "train" the program. I never used it, but read much about it.

Dont know how it worked tho. Probably like every other decent program. You have to work hard to learn how best to use it, but it ain't going to give you winners unless you spend the time to learn how best to use it.

I no longer look for the "best" software, but for the software that I can best incorporate into my methodology. There are good programs out there I wouldn't use because they are not right for how I handicap. Other people would love them.

I believer very strongly that before you pick a program you have to know yourself as a handicapper. Do you believe in databases? velocity? Neural nets to "train" your program so that past results predict future results?
Are you a hard-core pace person or more inclined to speed?

You must answer those questions first before using a software.
But blindly trying all manner of software programs without having a handicapping "philosophy" or methodology will bring nothing
but ruin in the long-run, I guarantee it.

[karlskorner]

Liberty Press who sold "Winning at the track" is owned by Jeff Little, they published a dozen or so books on handicapping along with some others, he closed the business a couple of years back and operates from his home.

5-6 years ago he was a regular Saturday visitor to the track with a friend or two. He had a fistful of printouts from WAAT and made many visits to the window, after awhile he would come occasionaly, I haven't seen him for the past 3 years. The one thing I remember was when he had a winner he had to "fan" out the tickets for the race to find it.

[jackad]

andicap,
Thanks for the response. Btw, I too live in New Rochelle. We should get together for a coffee or a drink sometime.
Jack

[David McKenzie]

Originally posted by wes
Anyone using WINNING AT THE TRACK speed and pace program?

I have the DOS based WATT and the two ancillary programs as well -- pace module and something else (the name eludes me at the moment).

It's a good program which works even better if you manually select the three races the program requires for ability computation.

I'd give it a thumbs up for the money.

For me it outperformed all my Sartin programs which cost more, a lot more.

The only reason I stopped using WATT was that I found something I liked better.

The irony of course is that the better a handicapper you are the better your results will be. So, the people that need it the most will benefit from its use the least. Of course that can be said for almost all handicapping software, at least the good ones.

[andicap]

Originally posted by jackad
andicap,
Thanks for the response. Btw, I too live in New Rochelle. We should get together for a coffee or a drink sometime.
Jack

That'd be great. You have a family?

BTW, i never heard of the "Lynbrook" section of New Rochelle.

[Tom]

Are you guys anywhere near Rob and Laura Petrie?
(When you go to visit, watch out for that ottoman!)
:eek: :rolleyes: :eek: :rolleyes: :eek: :rolleyes:

[jackad]

andicap,
I used to live in Lynbroook on the south shore of L.I. I still haven't changed that in my PA profile.
Jack

[FORGO]

Dave what program did you switch to or are you using now. I have the new WATT program. But have sinced moved on. I would like to hear how you used the the program. I haved moved on because the new programs are faster in selecting contenders. You can reach me at heypaul2003@yahoo.com aka FORGO

[Overlay]

I see that Mr. McKenzie hasn't posted since August, 2004, so you might not have much success getting a response out of him, unless he's been lurking all this time.

[Red Knave]

Dave what program did you switch to He did have HSH and was a prolific poster on their board. I have not seen anything from him for quite some time. I don't know if he has moved on ...

[shanta]

Dave what program did you switch to or are you using now. I have the new WATT program. But have sinced moved on. I would like to hear how you used the the program. I haved moved on because the new programs are faster in selecting contenders. You can reach me at heypaul2003@yahoo.com aka FORGO

Forgo,
I just emailed David letting him know of your post ok?

Richie

[Lefty]

I was gonna try Thorobrain a few yrs ago, and the guy even sent me the prgm. He offered to send me some of his readouts and I accepted. But after I asked a few questions he got real "smartass" with me so i told him to forget the whole thing. He hadn't submitted my money to HDW yet for the 3 mos. so I sent him his prgm back.
So before you get involved, ask questions and see how you're going to get treated.

[Lefty]

I bght Watts too, but i'd rather use Procap files and suggested he modify it for those. I told him he'd prob. make more sales. So far he hasn't done it. Most prgms where I have made this suggestion did it, and I'm sure more sales followed. Don't know why he's being so hardheaded cause those that wanted the variant could use Bris and those that preferred the Procap files could use those.

[WaHoo]

Lefty i've also emailed him about changes, the program doesn't pick up 1A's or scratches or tsn files,
i still use the dos version, but can't complain too much it still makes me money. I do pick my own paces lines, i try not to put in over 3 lines, the watts program will use all 10 pp's.
i think it's one of the strongest for picking Maidens if they've had a out.
also the Pacesetters in the pace analysis are strong bets/horses.

[Lou G]

Lefty - if the program accepts Bris files it should accept procaps - try renaming one from .pcs to whatever the Bris extension is and see what happens...

[Lefty]

Doesn't work, Lou. This prgm, as it stands, uses a variant. Procaps doesn't have a variant, that's why the rename doesn't work. Prgm needs to be modified to accept procaps.

[Handiman]

I bought 'Winning at the Track' years ago, the book I mean. Had alot of un with it, but never any money. I was wondering if the WATT program resembles the book in any way what so ever?

Handi

[Lefty]

I don't have the book anymore, but i'm sure, if my memory not completely shot, that the prgm follows the book. The book talks about pole spd, late spd, etc(as I remember) and the prgm computes pole spd, late spd, pace setters etc.

[FORGO]

Handiman I have an original Program and the Book. In its day it was the state of the art program. The book has the paper and pencil method in it. It also has parts of the program in it and it explains how to use it . The paper and pencil method I still use if I don't have my computer with me. Good books from Liberty Publishing well written and fun reading. The latest Book by David Christopher is out know I will soon purchase that also. Its a little bit pricey $40. but I will bet its worth it. The first two books are for novice to amature. The last is for serious handicappers. Hope that shed some light on a good oldie. FORGO

[FORGO]

Thankyou Shanta I appreciated you emailing Dave for me . He got back to me. I got a good email from Buffalo he uses the Watt program even today. He gave me a few of his tips on how to use the program effectively. There are a nice bunch of people on this board. Thankyou Shanta FORGO

[shanta]

Thankyou Shanta I appreciated you emailing Dave for me . He got back to me. I got a good email from Buffalo he uses the Watt program even today. He gave me a few of his tips on how to use the program effectively. There are a nice bunch of people on this board. Thankyou Shanta FORGO

No problem Forgo. Knock em dead at the windows! :ThmbUp:

Richie

[Handiman]

I think I will pull the book out again and look at it. It's still sitting on my shelf in my horseracing library-collection. Since there is a couple of guys here that seem to still like it, I think I will write a program based on the book and see how it works. When I first got it, there wasn't downloadable files...now things have changed so maybe that will be my next project.


Thanks,
Handi

I think I mentioned somewhere on this board about writing a program for a guy in southern california to his specifications. I had to sign notarized documents that I wouldn't ever divulge his "System", which I did. He sent me an email today. He played two races. The 1st and 2nd at tampa. He hit a $15.60 winner and a $72.80 winner and the $461.00 exacta in the 2nd. That's all he played today. I've had a couple of emails from him with similar results. Not sure why he picks certain races to play though.

[FORGO]

Handiman If you did decide to write a program based on the WATT methology please let me know. I would be interested only if it uses downloaded data files that unzip themselves. It should also allow you to pick or change the pacelines and the number of races used in processing the file, accept for scratches. Must be Dbase compatible with window access to Dbase. Probaility fair odds and morning line would be nice. Anyway This is just some food for thought. Point and Click is all I want to do. I don' want spend the night typing anymore. FORGO

[WaHoo]

WATTS has a New Windows version,
I don't have it, so not sure how easy it works compared to the Dos program

[Lefty]

The ver I have, the transfer prgm is in dos but I have the prgm itself in dos and windows and I use that part in windows to look at the data.
But i'm not using it much cause I mainly use prgms that use the Procaps files ans so far we haven't been able to talk Jeff Little into accomodating us. He's the only guy with a prgm that I haven't been able to talk into setting it up to use procaps files.

[Light]

Lefty

What is your favorite handicapping software that you use?

[Lefty]

light, now that's tough; I have so damn many. I like Watts but don't like using the $1.00 bris file.
Right now i'm using AC a lot and I really like it, especially the early late on contenders page. I just need to get better at guessing how a race is going to setup, pacewise. Missed to late runnin longshots yest cause I was betting early. Oh, well.
I just bought Maxcapper, so done done it again.

[Light]

What's AC?

[Lefty]

Oops, sorry. AC is Amazing Capper.
I also have other software I use time to time such as Validator. But it uses Trackmaster files. I also like Contenders 10, but right now i'm having printer probs and can't get it on screen because of other problems. My wife said to me other night while I was cussing and fuming over 3 computers that she thght I was happier when I was doing things with paper, pencil. "I am happy, i'm a masochist," I yelled.

[Lefty]

I also have Computrak and Pace Appraiser, so i'm all over the place. On a day to day basis i'm liable to use anyone of them, but right now think i'm going to concentrate on Max and AC. And a little Watts.

[FORGO]

Light I use several Programs as one will have a good feature and the other will have good numbers and they will all run off the same download. There is no one program that does it all or at least I have'nt found it yet.
After you have located all the contenders now put on the wizzards hat and ask the Magic question. What is the trainer doing with this race today.
Trainers make money betting not training horses. If you know 4 or 5 horses are in the race today are only there for conditioning box whats left and you have a pay check. Stop trying to figure out what the finish order will be and pray for one of the overlays to finish up front. Best simple program with good features or tools is Raceprophet 2.5. Cheap at $50.. Do not Use the Programs picks use the tools and keep records and you will start seeing certain patterns repeat. Easy to use once you read the tutiorial and practice with it . This program used to sell for $285.00. It also has a free demo how can you lose. Latter FORGO