Haiti

[karlskorner]

Spent the last 2 days at Ft.Lauderdale airport doing what I could to help the relief flights to Haiti. Spoke to some of the plane crews, sad, very sad, 150,000 dead (probably more) huge graves dug, rich or poor, white or black, male, female and child, dogs, cats and horses all dumped like so much garbage into a common grave.

[46zilzal]

Makes one appreciate NA building standards designed with these natural events in mind.

[boxcar]

Makes one appreciate NA building standards designed with these natural events in mind.

It also makes one really appreciate the great wealth of a free, capitalistic society that makes it possible to build those buildings.

Boxcar

[46zilzal]

It also makes one really appreciate the great wealth of a free, capitalistic society that makes it possible to build those buildings.



The history of the country is based upon STANDARDS. The clowns that build anything would cut every corner possible if it weren't for building inspectors. The transcontinental railway was so shoddy that the almost the entire thing had to be redone not long after it opened.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/tcrr/peopleevents/p_ccrocker.html

[LottaKash]

Those poor people never had a chance....Haiti was knocked back into the stone-age from that quake...They have "NOTHING" now..... absolutely nothing...

best,

[boxcar]

The history of the country is based upon STANDARDS. The clowns that build anything would cut every corner possible if it weren't for building inspectors. The transcontinental railway was so shoddy that the almost the entire thing had to be redone not long after it opened.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/amex/tcrr/peopleevents/p_ccrocker.html

You're partially correct. The history of this country was founded upon sound moral standards, i.e. Judeao-Christian principles, from which in turn flowed Freedom, Individual Liberties, Free Enterprise and Capitalism -- with those building standards being somewhat lower on the totem pole.

Boxcar
P.S. I bet you lament the fact that our dollars don't have inscribed on them, "In Government STANDARDS we TRUST". :rolleyes:

[chickenhead]

building standards come about largely in response to the need to get insurance, which comes about largely in response to banks holding notes. Bank has to protect their capital by requiring insurance, insurance must protect their capital and require standards. Government regulates the banks and the insurance, and takes care of the enforcing the building codes.

probably one of the most fundamental examples of the interplay of government and capitalism having positive results. What countries like Haiti need first and foremost are strong clearly delimited property rights, so that loans against property become more possible in the first place. Then of course they need strong banking and insurance industries to drive the building codes.

I imagine bootstrapping these institutions are incredibly difficult for places with no dough.

[ArlJim78]

What countries like Haiti need first and foremost are strong clearly delimited property rights, so that loans against property become more possible in the first place.

I couldn't agree more. This is fundamental for any society to flourish. Its like the foundation, the supporting structure for the whole economy.

[sandpit]

The U.S. has been very fortunate that a quake of the magnitude that hit Haiti has not hit a major city in this country in over a century, in San Fran in 1906. That devastation was incredible. The event in Port au Prince was also very shallow, which added to it's destructive force. We may have very good building standards, but if the earth ever does shake like that right under LA, SF, or even St. Louis, there will be incredible damage.

Side note: I found this page that is pretty interesting: http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/states/10_largest_us.php

It was a revelation to me that Charleston, SC had one of the 15 most powerful earthquakes ever recorded in the lower 48 states.

[ArlJim78]

you're correct that regardless of building codes, a direct hit by a major quake will be devastating to any major city. however at some distance from the epicenter the building codes do matter. for example; a well constructed building 10 miles from the epicenter might survive, whereas a poorly contructed building 50 miles from the the epicenter might fail.

also there is the degree to which a building fails. a well contructed building might cave in a little, with some amount of damage but remaining basically standing and intact long enough for people to get out. whereas you see like in Port Au Prince row after row of flattened buildings which pancaked to the ground leaving the people inside no chance of survival.

[Pace Cap'n]

Congrats, Karl, on your efforts.

[Boats]

The U.S. has been very fortunate that a quake of the magnitude that hit Haiti has not hit a major city in this country in over a century, in San Fran in 1906. That devastation was incredible. The event in Port au Prince was also very shallow, which added to it's destructive force. We may have very good building standards, but if the earth ever does shake like that right under LA, SF, or even St. Louis, there will be incredible damage.

Side note: I found this page that is pretty interesting: http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/states/10_largest_us.php

It was a revelation to me that Charleston, SC had one of the 15 most powerful earthquakes ever recorded in the lower 48 states.

Haiti 7.0 San Francisco 1989 7.1
It's building standards. There was a lot of damage in older construction. My house built in 1941 wasn't damaged.
http://www.twincities.com/localnews/ci_14200658