Breeders Cup Predictions

[FenceBored]

Predictions:

1. If the Breeders Cup makes Santa Anita the permanent site (regardless of surface type) CD, NYRA, or a partnership of the two will create a competing championship day east of the Mississippi.

2. Now that the ownership of Santa Anita has been settled, the Breeders Cup will announce SA as the permanent site before June 30, maybe even before the current SA meet ends.

[andymays]

Predictions:

1. If the Breeders Cup makes Santa Anita the permanent site (regardless of surface type) CD, NYRA, or a partnership of the two will create a competing championship day east of the Mississippi.

2. Now that the ownership of Santa Anita has been settled, the Breeders Cup will announce SA as the permanent site before June 30, maybe even before the current SA meet ends.


If Santa Anita goes to dirt then people will live with it. I look for them alternating between Churchill and Santa Anita. We'll see but I know that's what the delay is about in getting them to make it official about dirt. They need the Breeders Cup back to stay relevant.

[tzipi]

If they go back to dirt I have no problem. Would be a little better if it was CD and SA though. Also I had no problems with alternating tracks for BC. Just hated the synthetic BC's. Dirt horses are 0-43 in the races. The "dirt" races are filled with turfers,etc.

[FenceBored]

If Santa Anita goes to dirt then people will live with it. I look for them alternating between Churchill and Santa Anita. We'll see but I know that's what the delay is about in getting them to make it official about dirt. They need the Breeders Cup back to stay relevant.

I think you are underestimating the non-appeal of always shipping one way or the other. If BC made CD or BEL the permanent site, I would expect that Cal would create a competing event at OSA, there's no way they'd put up with the "east coast bias." Similarly, someone (I think it was Jay Hovdey in one of his responses to the 'dirt preps before synth BC no good' arguments) made the point that NY runners have never done all that well at BCs in So Cal. If either side feels they are being put at a permanent disadvantage, they'll bail, in part or completely.

[bisket]

i hope the cup becomes a dinasaur. it in my opinion has hurt the game more than its helped. this baloney of avoiding other runners equal in ability to wait for the cup has diluted the product. other than the derby, preakness, and belmont, other stakes races have become as interesting as the afternoon featured allowance race.

[andymays]

I think you are underestimating the non-appeal of always shipping one way or the other. If BC made CD or BEL the permanent site, I would expect that Cal would create a competing event at OSA, there's no way they'd put up with the "east coast bias." Similarly, someone (I think it was Jay Hovdey in one of his responses to the 'dirt preps before synth BC no good' arguments) made the point that NY runners have never done all that well at BCs in So Cal. If either side feels they are being put at a permanent disadvantage, they'll bail, in part or completely.


Rightly or wrongly California still has the most political pull.


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California (State Wide System): Florida:
Del Mar
Fairplex Park
Golden Gate Fields
Hollywood Park
Oak Tree Racing Association
Santa Anita Gulfstream Park
Tampa Bay Downs
California Authority Of Racing Fairs: Kentucky:
Alameda County Fair (Pleasanton)
Fresno District Fair
Humboldt County Fair (Ferndale)
San Joaquin County Fair (Stockton)
San Mateo County Fair
Solano County Fair (Vallejo)
Sonoma County Fair (Santa Rosa)
Cal Expo Harness
Los Alamitos Quarters
Keeneland Race Course
The Red Mile
Virginia
Colonial Downs

Regulatory Associations: New York:
California Horse Racing Board
Thoroughbred Owners of California
Thoroughbred Racing Association
National Thoroughbred Racing Association New York Racing Association
Aqueduct
Belmont
Saratoga ADW Companies: Other Associations:
XpressBet
YouBet
TVG
Twin Spires California Marketing Commission
U.K. / European Wagering Services
eBet Online, Inc.
Let It Ride/Watch and Wager

[Steve R]

i hope the cup becomes a dinasaur. it in my opinion has hurt the game more than its helped. this baloney of avoiding other runners equal in ability to wait for the cup has diluted the product. other than the derby, preakness, and belmont, other stakes races have become as interesting as the afternoon featured allowance race.
:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:

[kenwoodallpromos]

According to The Jockey Club, Fl is and has been 2nd in breeding- So, switch between CD and GP!

[Moyers Pond]

Santa Anita should 100% go back to dirt and make it the permanent place. The weather is just too much of a crapshoot in NY and KY. It MUST go back to dirt though, and this gives them the perfect excuse.

[tucker6]

The problem with SA goes beyond surface. The Euros don't like the heat that time of year due to winter coat. If the BC wants to attract Euro horses, I'm not sure SA is the place to do it. I'd say CD as a central location and everybody live with it.

[W2G]

Some facts and impressions:

The BC is committed to further internationalization of the brand.
SA is considering a surface change.
The Euros have had nothing but praise for the last two BCs at SA.
The BC's strategic planning consultant is London-based.
Weather at SA in the fall is virtually a non-issue.
The BC is considering a permanent site.
If a common global racing surface exists, it is synthetic.

Food for thought, and I wonder how SA switching back to dirt meshes with the above statements.

[tzipi]

.The Euros have had nothing but praise for the last two BCs at SA

Well of course they do, the synthetic is like turf and now their turf horses can win the turf races and are now winning and hitting the boards on all the "dirt" races too. They know the pure dirt horses are 0-43 on the poly so they dont have to worry about top class dirt horses on the synthetic. I would love it too if I was them,who wouldn't :D

[sandpit]

One thing is for certain for 2010: the BC will have a new racing secretary. The one that has been there forever is leaving.

[thespaah]

i hope the cup becomes a dinasaur. it in my opinion has hurt the game more than its helped. this baloney of avoiding other runners equal in ability to wait for the cup has diluted the product. other than the derby, preakness, and belmont, other stakes races have become as interesting as the afternoon featured allowance race.
I agree. The Breeders Cup was a great idea that has lost it's lustre.
It has run it's course.

[magwell]

I agree. The Breeders Cup was a great idea that has lost it's lustre.
It has run it's course. WHAT ?????

[PhantomOnTour]

I agree. The Breeders Cup was a great idea that has lost it's lustre.
It has run it's course.
From a betting standpoint, no it hasn't.

[eastie]

From a betting standpoint, no it hasn't.


+1 VALUE all day long....I think I'm gonna win $50 grand every year. Hasn't happened yet, but Next year for sure....



I think they should check the farmers almanac for a mild winter and have it at Saratoga....the fans would go , It would be an awesome weekend . a little cold weather never hurt anyone.

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[Steve R]

I agree. The Breeders Cup was a great idea that has lost it's lustre.
It has run it's course.
I've been saying the same thing for some time now. The BC never achieved it's objective of highlighting the sport to increase public interest. During the BC's existence, we have seen just the opposite. Public interest has declined dramatically. It has diminished the status and competitiveness of a slew of historical races leading up to it. Races with long-standing tradition have become afterthoughts and their quality has dropped. Without tradition, racing is only gambling. It comes too late in the season and many of the best horses have been put away for the year or are "over the top" by the time of the race. Big names showing up isn't enough. Those big names should be at their best or the quality is an illusion. The projection of the BC as world championships insults racing venues around the world. In fact, if you compare the complete fields of the BC Classic with those of the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe over the last 25 years, an honest person not motivated by some sort of misplaced nationalism, would have to conclude that the latter is a far better candidate for a world championship. The expansion of the BC card to include a half dozen useless races has diluted the quality of the fields to the point where some of these championship races seem like weekend classified allowance races at a mid-level track. Finally, an hour-long racing show on TV is boring enough except for the minute or two the horses are actually running. Four or five hours two days in a row is pure torture.

[PaceAdvantage]

The weather is just too much of a crapshoot in NY and KY.So what? Off-tracks are part of the every day game. It's been a part of the BC since the beginning.

Keep a rotation among the biggest circuits and throw the bone to an outsider every few years. Just like they used to do up until this silly "back-to-back" Santa Anita experiment.

Why do people constantly want to screw with a good thing?

What about Monmouth in 2007 you say? WHAT ABOUT IT? A horse never died at the BC before? Never had a thrilling renewal on an off track before? (Hello Personal Ensign!)

Just stop the nonsense and get things back to the way they were.

[thespaah]

WHAT ?????
My opinion. Ok?
Ratings down. Attendance/Handle down. Few affordable tix available to the general public.
BC Ltd is headed toward running the BC at ONE track. SA.
Not claiming the BS sucks. IMO it's time may be up because like anything that can, The BC has gone a bit stale.

[thespaah]

From a betting standpoint, no it hasn't.
Correct. Large fields and lit up totebaords.
My opinion goes to the concept in it's present form.

[thespaah]

So what? Off-tracks are part of the every day game. It's been a part of the BC since the beginning.

Keep a rotation among the biggest circuits and throw the bone to an outsider every few years. Just like they used to do up until this silly "back-to-back" Santa Anita experiment.

Why do people constantly want to screw with a good thing?

What about Monmouth in 2007 you say? WHAT ABOUT IT? A horse never died at the BC before? Never had a thrilling renewal on an off track before? (Hello Personal Ensign!)

Just stop the nonsense and get things back to the way they were.
Agree. Cuting tracks out because the weather might be poor is not in the best interests of the sport.

BC has been to NY 4 times, Chicago, Toronto and NJ.
Heck when Alysheba won the BS Classic in 1988 the high temp in Louisville that day was in the 40's and it rained. so what.
BC picked the end of October to have it's event. A terrible choice for better odds of good weaher IMO.
I understand why BC Ltd decided to schedule. The company wanted to avoid interfering with long standing fall stakes.
Ok.
Time for BC to get back to the basics or close up shop.

[andymays]

The truth is that it is better for racing when the Breeders Cup moves ever year. It is better for the local fans and the local economies wherever it goes and that helps promote racing.

Having said that the deal is being done right now so don't be surprized if you see a deal cut between Santa Anita and the Breeders Cup. They will cite the weather and the fact that the area can handle all the people coming in from out of town.

[PaceAdvantage]

Having said that the deal is being done right now so don't be surprized if you see a deal cut between Santa Anita and the Breeders Cup. They will cite the weather and the fact that the area can handle all the people coming in from out of town.Racing complains how it wants to be just like all the other major sports...do they hold the Super Bowl in the same stadium every year?

Do they have the World Series in the same stadium every year?

etc. etc.

I wasn't THAT put off when the Breeders' Cup expanded the number of races and split the event into two days. But if they keep the BC at one track from now on, I'm going to be very annoyed.

WHAT IS WRONG WITH ROTATING THE EVENT?

Is it too expensive? I believe there were rumblings of Breeders' Cup Ltd. having some sort of financial issues towards the end of 2008...Is it too difficult to negotiate with these host tracks? I mean, come on...it's only ONCE a year!!

This is bullshit...

[andymays]

Racing complains how it wants to be just like all the other major sports...do they hold the Super Bowl in the same stadium every year?

Do they have the World Series in the same stadium every year?

etc. etc.

I wasn't THAT put off when the Breeders' Cup expanded the number of races and split the event into two days. But if they keep the BC at one track from now on, I'm going to be very annoyed.

WHAT IS WRONG WITH ROTATING THE EVENT?

Is it too expensive? I believe there were rumblings of Breeders' Cup Ltd. having some sort of financial issues towards the end of 2008...Is it too difficult to negotiate with these host tracks? I mean, come on...it's only ONCE a year!!

This is bullshit...


It's politics and bullshit!

Rotating the event is in the best interest of the sport.

[joanied]

Of all the 'problems' with the BC, this is one I know how I feel about...rotate the damned thing...
I wouldn't be surprised if the guys at SA are telling the guys from the BC...we'll go back to dirt if we have the BC every year...gggrrr...

And, IMO...any extra monies a track needs to host the BC is money well spent...whatever a track does to improove upon itself, if only for the sake of hosting the BC, just carries over to it's future...and lord knows, some tracks really need to make improovments. It's an investment.

I also beleive there is a way to have all the races on one day...early post times would not bother anyone going to the event, IMO...and shorter times between races would be a good thing all the way around...if they could trim 10 minutes off that time, IMO, everyone would go for it.

my two cents:faint:

[bisket]

if it goes to one track on the west coast. it won't be supported anymore anyhow by the majority of the country. at this point in time this is the case anyhow. the reason they don't have money is because small breeding operations throughout the country stopped paying the fee to nominate their foals. why? because the cup in years past used some of those funds to increase purses at all the tracks in the country. you remember when the purse of certain stakes were increased if the winner was nominated to the cup. they stopped that for the win and your in baloney. for the small breeders that was a slap in the face. so it'll be good riddence.....

[PaceAdvantage]

It would make much more sense to keep it at SA ONLY IF the track REMAINED an all-weather surface! The BC people could point to the increased Euro participation as one of the unique factors (although the Euros seemed to like Belmont's turf course and climate most years).

Keeping it permanently at Santa Anita AFTER changing back to dirt is pretty much indefensible in my book.

[tucker6]

Keeping it permanently at Santa Anita AFTER changing back to dirt is pretty much indefensible in my book.
Unless your one of the fat cats that makes out in this deal. This would set the sport back significantly if it happens, and would fruther signal that the powers that be haven't a clue nor a care for the sport. It seems to be all about how much they can extract from the sport before its demise.

[andymays]

It would make much more sense to keep it at SA ONLY IF the track REMAINED an all-weather surface! The BC people could point to the increased Euro participation as one of the unique factors (although the Euros seemed to like Belmont's turf course and climate most years).

Keeping it permanently at Santa Anita AFTER changing back to dirt is pretty much indefensible in my book.


As Jerry Jamgotchian always tell me.... "They don't care", just stop betting there! ;)

I agree with your opinion though.