Delay in implementation of UIGEA regulations affecting account wagering!

[andymays]

Horse racing industry gains delay in implementation of UIGEA regulations affecting account wagering - NTRA

http://www.ntra.com/content.aspx?type=pac&style=red&id=43543

Excerpt:

Contact: Peggy Hendershot (859) 621-6929

The U.S. Treasury Department and the Federal Reserve have authorized a six-month delay in the implementation of the regulations associated with the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act (UIGEA).

The regulations were to have taken effect on December 1. The delay will extend through June 1, 2010.

UIGEA and the corresponding regulations require payment systems to implement policies and procedures to block unlawful forms of online gambling, termed “restricted transactions.” Activities permitted under the Interstate Horseracing Act (IHA) are expressly excluded from the definition of restricted transactions, meaning that the regulations do not require anyone to block IHA activity. However, the regulations do provide a legal safe harbor for those wishing to “overblock” online transactions, even those that are conducted legally under the IHA.

The National Thoroughbred Racing Association (NTRA) and others petitioned the Treasury Department and the Federal Reserve in September to delay the UIGEA regulations, citing concerns regarding overblocking. More than 40 Members of the United States House and Senate also expressed strong bi-partisan support for the delay, which is broadly endorsed by the banking community.

http://www.ntra.com/content.aspx?type=pac&style=red&id=43543

[Pace Cap'n]

UIGEA and the corresponding regulations require payment systems to implement policies and procedures to block unlawful forms of online gambling, termed “restricted transactions.” Activities permitted under the Interstate Horseracing Act (IHA) are expressly excluded from the definition of restricted transactions, meaning that the regulations do not require anyone to block IHA activity. However, the regulations do provide a legal safe harbor for those wishing to “overblock” online transactions, even those that are conducted legally under the IHA.



The act is only intended to block the funding of accounts for online gambling.

Currently there is no such thing as "unlawful online gambling" at the Federal level.

[slew101]

The mere presence of the Act has done all the Feds wanted to, without actually enforcing the law on the banks.

It's forced all the money processors out of the U.S. market and made it more difficult to move funds to and from online gambling accounts offshore.

Does it shut down internet gambling? Of course not. People are still gambling plenty, but it's not easy to move the money as it once was. But the act makes it much more difficult and forced dozens of offshore books to pull out of the U.S. market.

The banks confusion about horse racing transactions will continue.

[CBedo]

I find it interesting that the title makes it seem that the NTRA or some other horse racing lobby actually had something to do with this. I'm somewhat involved in the PPA (poker players alliance) and know that we have had people on the hill trying to get this done for some time. The PPA is a million members strong and currently chaired by Alfonse D'Amato who obviously has tons of Washington experience.

I know that it takes many voices on the hill to get through to our reps sometimes, and maybe the NTRA did have a lobby presence, but I didn't hear anything about them working on this effort, and it sure seems like they are trying to take credit for "bettering" the industry. I hope they really did.

[andymays]

I find it interesting that the title makes it seem that the NTRA or some other horse racing lobby actually had something to do with this. I'm somewhat involved in the PPA (poker players alliance) and know that we have had people on the hill trying to get this done for some time. The PPA is a million members strong and currently chaired by Alfonse D'Amato who obviously has tons of Washington experience.

I know that it takes many voices on the hill to get through to our reps sometimes, and maybe the NTRA did have a lobby presence, but I didn't hear anything about them working on this effort, and it sure seems like they are trying to take credit for "bettering" the industry. I hope they really did.


I think your instincts are right! :ThmbUp:

[Horseplayersbet.com]

I read where it is estimated over $5 billion is still being wagered by Americans offshore. And it is estimated that over the next few years that number will reach $20 billion.

And despite the current act that one would figure would help horse racing because horse racing is the only sport that can be "legally" wagered upon without deposit and withdrawal hurdles, horse racing wagering is still on the downslide.

The question is did this bill actually help horse racing, or does it take gamblers out by making gambling in general less fashionable in the US?

[Robert Goren]

This bill is the work of Sen Jon Kyl (R-Az) who is currently Republican Whip. He is considered one of the most conservative senators around. He stated that he believes that internet gambling sites are being used to fund terrorist activities. Arizona really knows how to pick them.

[rrbauer]

The act is only intended to block the funding of accounts for online gambling.

Currently there is no such thing as "unlawful online gambling" at the Federal level.

The Justice Department still holds firm that the Wire Act of 1961 is the prevailing law (An excerpt is listed below.) and preempts the Interstate Horse Racing Act. However, they have not pursued charging or prosecuting those involved with horse racing's interstate simulcasting or internet wagering.

"Whoever being engaged in the business of betting or wagering knowingly uses a wire communication facility for the transmission in interstate or foreign commerce of bets or wagers or information assisting in the placing of bets or wagers on any sporting event or contest, or for the transmission of a wire communication which entitles the recipient to receive money or credit as a result of bets or wagers, or for information assisting in the placing of bets or wagers, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both."

Why hasn't the JD moved forward in the application of the 1961 law to horse racing?
Fear that the Supreme Court would toss a case that would make the law moot and serve as a judicial precedant for other gambling cases?
Fear of political fallout?
Recognition of the change in public attitude towards gambling since 1961?
Bigger fish to fry?

Between the workarounds that the offshore gambling industry has developed to facilitate gamblers' money transfers and the resistance to implementation of the UIGEA on a number of fronts it's looking like it may never get off the ground.

[turfnsport]

I find it interesting that the title makes it seem that the NTRA or some other horse racing lobby actually had something to do with this. I'm somewhat involved in the PPA (poker players alliance) and know that we have had people on the hill trying to get this done for some time. The PPA is a million members strong and currently chaired by Alfonse D'Amato who obviously has tons of Washington experience.

I know that it takes many voices on the hill to get through to our reps sometimes, and maybe the NTRA did have a lobby presence, but I didn't hear anything about them working on this effort, and it sure seems like they are trying to take credit for "bettering" the industry. I hope they really did.

Bingo.

I laughed when I saw the press release. The NTRA has ZERO clout in DC.

[Pace Cap'n]

The Justice Department still holds firm that the Wire Act of 1961 is the prevailing law.


Not many internets around in 1961.

In no way is it illegal to play online poker.

[Horseplayersbet.com]

Not many internets around in 1961.

In no way is it illegal to play online poker.
You mean you never played Party Line Hold Em?

OK, I just made that up.

[CBedo]

You mean you never played Party Line Hold Em?

OK, I just made that up.no, but internet relay chat poker was about the equivalent!

[PaceAdvantage]

He stated that he believes that internet gambling sites are being used to fund terrorist activities.As if this couldn't be true? Hell, I never thought some of the more "known" online cardrooms would be CHEATING either, but they were...

I think any reasonable person can reasonably assume that there is at least ONE online gambling site out there funneling its profits towards nefarious ends.

[Judge Gallivan]

I think any reasonable person can reasonably assume that there is at least ONE online gambling site out there funneling its profits towards nefarious ends.

You can say that about any business anywhere in the world, can't you?

Like, 'there is at least ONE grocery store out there funneling its profits towards nefarious ends'.

Singling out gambling sites without any proof is disingenuous in the least.

[slew101]

Kyl is just another in a long-line of useless politicians trying to tell people what to do in their own homes and with their own money.

It was interesting that the House's main sponsor of the bill for years, Jim Leach (great name, BYW) of Iowa was upset in his reelection bid in 2007. Unfortunately, we weren't so lucky with Kyl.

You can say that about any business anywhere in the world, can't you?

Like, 'there is at least ONE grocery store out there funneling its profits towards nefarious ends'.

Singling out gambling sites without any proof is disingenuous in the least.

[PaceAdvantage]

You can say that about any business anywhere in the world, can't you?

Like, 'there is at least ONE grocery store out there funneling its profits towards nefarious ends'.

Singling out gambling sites without any proof is disingenuous in the least.There is little to no oversight with these offshore gambling establishments (proven by the fact that rampant cheating was going on in at least two major poker sites), along with TONS of cash.

You do the math.

[andymays]

There is little to no oversight with these offshore gambling establishments (proven by the fact that rampant cheating was going on in at least two major poker sites), along with TONS of cash.

You do the math.


You're right and that's why all this stuff should be kept in the United States. Let the Casinos have a deal where they run it with a real gaming commission (not an Indian Casino Gaming Commission).

[Judge Gallivan]

There is little to no oversight with these offshore gambling establishments (proven by the fact that rampant cheating was going on in at least two major poker sites), along with TONS of cash.

You do the math.

As there is rampant cheating going on with insider trading on every stock market in the world.

Offshore gambling industry is probably not as regulated as it should be, but to brand the whole industry as a terrorism funding cover is a political witch-hunt. If that was the case I'm sure the US Government would do much more than just make it more difficult for its citizens to deposit and withdraw funds.

[Robert Goren]

Whenever there is gambling there is always a chance for cheating. I seen cheating go on in home games and online. It is the chance you take. My gripe about online poker regulation is that it has been forced overseas. All that rake going out of the country because of few holier-than-thou nuts. The American companies should be getting that money. We invented poker and the internet and some island country gets the rewards. Stupid.

[GMB@BP]

There is little to no oversight with these offshore gambling establishments (proven by the fact that rampant cheating was going on in at least two major poker sites), along with TONS of cash.

You do the math.

Dont pay attention to this stuff anymore, do you know who they were?

[PaceAdvantage]

Dont pay attention to this stuff anymore, do you know who they were?Absolute Poker and UltimateBet

[PaceAdvantage]

Offshore gambling industry is probably not as regulated as it should be, but to brand the whole industry as a terrorism funding cover is a political witch-hunt.I seriously doubt if he believes every single off-shore gambling entity is funding terrorism.

However, if you had to choose between an offshore website that sells pet food, and one that is set up as a gambling operation, which one would you think was more apt to be funding terrorism/laundering money?

[CBedo]

Absolute Poker and UltimateBetIt wasn't actually UB/Absolute; it was a group of players along with an ex-employee I believe.

[Robert Goren]

I seriously doubt if he believes every single off-shore gambling entity is funding terrorism.

However, if you had to choose between an offshore website that sells pet food, and one that is set up as a gambling operation, which one would you think was more apt to be funding terrorism/laundering money? Off hand I would say the pet food store. True believers of the Islam consider gambling a sin. Muslim terrorists if nothing else are true believers. At least Poker Stars will not let you withdraw money from your account that been transfered from someone else's account without it being used a game first. This is a constantly being discussed by someone who has had their accounts frozen on the 2+2 forums. I believe that most of the laundering of terrorist money uncovered so far has been done inside charitable organizations. Maybe if the senator from AZ was really interested in stopping terrorist money he should look at laws on that. To me this is just a made up excuse to stop some gambling. Don't think for one momment that he wouldn't outlaw betting on horses if he could.

[adwplayingfool]

Both senators involved in sponsoring this bill received significant donations from harah's and other casino/ horse wagering venues. This bill was meant to eliminate offshore books where you can get near track odds and 3-7% refunds on wagers to push players back into "pools" although banks "over-regulating" have injured the industry by restricting ADW's and other depository bodies for domestic horse wagering

[Robert Goren]

It wasn't actually UB/Absolute; it was a group of players along with an ex-employee I believe. A former part owner of UB was involved. When Absolute bought UB, they didn't change their security protocols. That a wide open door for him and his band of thieves. The site reimbursed millions of dollars to players who had been cheated. Let's see when was the last time a race track reimbursed betters when cheating found out on a race. That would be like NEVER.

[Robert Goren]

Both senators involved in sponsoring this bill received significant donations from harah's and other casino/ horse wagering venues. This bill was meant to eliminate offshore books where you can get near track odds and 3-7% refunds on wagers to push players back into "pools" although banks "over-regulating" have injured the industry by restricting ADW's and other depository bodies for domestic horse wagering Sen Kyl took gambling money? Really? I need a link to believe that.

[adwplayingfool]

http://www.equineonline.com/roundtable_05.asp?section=5

I could not find the specific stories I was looking for but do a document search for "kyl" here and read down, through PAC's senator Kyl and the others involved were responsible for contributions to make exceptions to ADW's

[adwplayingfool]

I may be in error I think I was referring to frist and goodlate accept my apologies...


Despite these happenings, the infamous Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act is passed in October of 2006 - primarily at the hands of Senate Majority Leader, Senator Bill Frist, who sneakily attaches the bill to a "must-pass" non-debatable Port Security Bill in the wake of global terrorism. Frist claims that online gambling revenue is being used by offshore companies to fund terrorist activities, yet has no proof to back his claims. Critics of Frist claim that his motivations are tied into his own conservative southern Baptist religious and moralistic convictions, which apparently do not add up with many U.S. citizens, the Washington Ethics Committee, and Citizens for the Responsibility of Ethics in Washington, who cited Frist as the most corrupt politician in Washington DC. Despite Frist's claims that gambling is evil, he received nearly $50,000 in campaign contributions from land-based Harrah's Casinos, whose stock just so happened to raise nearly 20% when the UIGEA was passed (That amounts to a $1.7 billion increase in net worth for Harrah's). Furthermore, Frist received $21,800 in contributions from the tobacco industry and $29,550 from the liquor industry. Frist has also been documented for misappropriating his own charity funds ($456,000 worth) to members of his party.
As for the bill's author, Virginia House Congressman, Bob Goodlatte, critics find it interesting there are several carve outs for online gambling, including lotteries, horse racing and fantasy sports betting. Even more interesting is how Goodlatte received $10,000 in campaign contributions from the National Thoroughbred Racing Association (which would strongly benefit from internet betting on land-based horseracing events), $27,000 from Philip Morris and $41,700 from the liquor industry. Goodlatte claims that online gambling puts underage and problem gamblers at risk, yet has no provisions protecting children from buying online lottery tickets in his legislation.
All of this becomes too much to take for the nearly 30,000,000 U.S. citizens who disagree with the prohibition, as well as many U.S. politicians - many of which did not even know Frist had attached the UIGEA to the Port Security Bill. One such politician is House Financial Services Committee Chairman, Barney Frank, who refers to the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act as the "stupidest law ever passed". Frank gets support from colleagues, including the European Union, and draws up the first draft of the Internet Gambling Regulation and Enforcement Act (IGREA) in April, 2007 - two months prior to when the UIGEA is scheduled to go into enforcement. Meanwhile, Nevada Congresswoman, Shelley Berkley pushes to implement a comprehensive study of the U.S. facing online gambling industry, which could very well be used to dictate regulatory legislation of further IGREA drafts. As the UK as proven, there is plenty of evidence showing technological advancements in underage and problem gambling prevention, protection of minors and fair gaming software. The IGREA still awaits its fate at this time.

[Robert Goren]

Those two I believe.

[adwplayingfool]

What I still find interesting is the charcoal black face of the DOJ claiming ANY form of gambling online is illegal due to the wire act while ignoring ADW's whom operate all over the US under the IHA..... The WTO has already ruled it is in absolute breach of current treaties to allow gamblers in the US to wager on horse racing at ADW's onshore without allowing offshore books to offer the same service yet these companies trade, advertise and report openly from a state level such as njbets in NJ, ezhorseplay in VA, betamerica ND as well as national providers such as twinspires, xpressbet, youbet etc the hypocrisy is unreal and state's rights must stand against the aggression of an overzealous federal government

[PaceAdvantage]

charcoal black face of the DOJHuh?

[PaceAdvantage]

It wasn't actually UB/Absolute; it was a group of players along with an ex-employee I believe.You make it seem as though the two sites where a group of people were able to see everyone else's cards bears no responsibility for this massive breach of security?

[PaceAdvantage]

Off hand I would say the pet food store. True believers of the Islam consider gambling a sin. Muslim terrorists if nothing else are true believers.Yeah...ok....except that to them, the means to an end are far less important than the end itself. Many tales of the 9/11 hijackers visiting strip clubs and drinking alcohol abound (same with Major Hasan, the Fort Hood shooter, who was reported to visit strip clubs).

[Horseplayersbet.com]

Yeah...ok....except that to them, the means to an end are far less important than the end itself. Many tales of the 9/11 hijackers visiting strip clubs and drinking alcohol abound (same with Major Hasan, the Fort Hood shooter, who was reported to visit strip clubs).
How do you know they weren't drinking Shirley Temples?

[PaceAdvantage]

How do you know they weren't drinking Shirley Temples?I'd rather not pursue this line of discussion here in the horse racing section...as a matter of fact, I apologize for taking it this far...

[CBedo]

You make it seem as though the two sites where a group of people were able to see everyone else's cards bears no responsibility for this massive breach of security?If that's how it came across, that's not what I meant at all. I just meant that it wasn't the card rooms themselves doing or benefitting from the actual cheating,.

[Pace Cap'n]

If that's how it came across, that's not what I meant at all. I just meant that it wasn't the card rooms themselves doing or benefitting from the actual cheating,.

Some of the AP owners were directly linked to the scam. And it is highly likely the UB ownership was as well.

[rrbauer]

Play with robbers. Get robbed!

[Robert Goren]

Some of the AP owners were directly linked to the scam. And it is highly likely the UB ownership was as well. No they weren't. Only a former part owner of UB, Russ Hamilton.