preakness to stay in maryland!!

[bisket]

magna's on the block, but the preakness will stay in md
from the baltimore sun
http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/horse-racing/bal-md.magna13oct13,0,6634341.story

[Bochall]

My father, brother and I went to our first Preakness the year Red Bullet upset Fusaichi (in 2000?) and it is the highlight of our year. We've been every year since; living the high of Afleet Alex's breathtaking recovery and run to victory, and the low of watching Barbaro's career end right in front of us. The Afleet Alex run is still the greatest sporting event I have witnessed live...without a doubt. We've heard every year about how Maryland may lose the Preakness and never gave it much thought...until this year. Lets hope this race stays at Old Hilltop where it belongs (they will NEVER move the Rose Bowl out of Cali, right?). Yeah, the grandstand is a fire trap and the old bathroom stalls were built for a skinnier America, but the place has CHARM and nostalgia. Do the right thing Marylanders, just like Boston stopped the move outta Fenway, and keep the Preakness at Pimlico!

[lamboguy]

My father, brother and I went to our first Preakness the year Red Bullet upset Fusaichi (in 2000?) and it is the highlight of our year. We've been every year since; living the high of Afleet Alex's breathtaking recovery and run to victory, and the low of watching Barbaro's career end right in front of us. The Afleet Alex run is still the greatest sporting event I have witnessed live...without a doubt. We've heard every year about how Maryland may lose the Preakness and never gave it much thought...until this year. Lets hope this race stays at Old Hilltop where it belongs (they will NEVER move the Rose Bowl out of Cali, right?). Yeah, the grandstand is a fire trap and the old bathroom stalls were built for a skinnier America, but the place has CHARM and nostalgia. Do the right thing Marylanders, just like Boston stopped the move outta Fenway, and keep the Preakness at Pimlico!alot of history in that place. i was there only twice in my life and wound up in the winners circle both times on preakness day, once for the SIR BARTON STAKES that jsut got renamed to THE BARBORO

[Java Gold@TFT]

Did I just read all of this wrong? I read that whoever bids on Laurel and Pimlico HAS to agree to keep them as race tracks and not develop them into anything else? That's the only way the Preakness can remain in Maryland the way it is written. IF there is no buyer who says they will keep both tracks open will the bankruptcy judge deny a valid bid for the properties just because the buyer will not agree to run them as race tracks? If Frankie doesn't get a buyer who agrees to run the properties as race tracks then he will just be forced to shut them down and thus no Preakness anyway. Common legal angles - caveat emptor and admission by omission.

No slots, threat to close down racing in the state, bankrupt owner, degradation of the Pimlico Special and Blackeyed Susan, rundown properties, etc.. and they are going to try to legally wrangle over one race? Get it over with and make the TC a Real TC - run the Preakness on the same 3rd Saturday in May at 1 3/16 miles on Arlington's turf course.

Not trying to be 100% racist but doesn't Maryland have one recognized native American tribe who would be willing to buy Pimlico and somehow put slots in under eminant doamin? It's happenned in other states.

[bisket]

java; frank defrancis has no say in what's going to happen. when he sold to magna the agreement was that if and when slots were legalized defrancis and magna would share the proceeds from slots. he still holds interest in the jockey club, but not controlling interest. this is why magna won the bidding for the tracks in the first place. churchill wanted to buy, but wouldn't give defrancis this kind of deal. this deal (defrancis and magna sharing slots proceeds) is why slots took so long to pass in maryland. with magna having to share this money the only way it would have been economically feasible for magna was if they could build a racino with strippers and all. well the maryland legislature would never pass legislation to allow this to happen to the tracks. our former governor took all kind of campagne contributions from magna to try and ram it through the legislature, but the house would never pass the bill. most of the general public never really knew about this aspect of the bill (the racino) because its difficult to explain all this in 40 second sound bite. if you'll notice the bill was passed to allow slots when it was known that magan was going to bankruptcy. magna finally gave up on the racino. magna was hoping that they could renegotiate the deal with defrancis in bankruptcy court, but as one knows magna has little control of everything once they filed. the legislation was passed for magna, but magna couldn't come up with the deposit to bid on a site for the slots. when that happened the writing was on the wall. there's a group of investors that are very interested in buying the tracks that are from maryland, and they now have the inside track because the biggest asset (the preakness) is going to be tough to move out of state if someone purchases and trys to move the race. defrancis isn't among this group of marylanders, and thank goodness and good riddence. use this background information i just gave you to better understand this article from the baltimore sun. defrancis got screwed!!
also the maryland government has the right to match any bid from interests outsidemaryland that want to move the race. although the maryland group has plenty of cash to get it done!!
http://www.baltimoresun.com/business/bal-magna-track-1014,0,3090442.story

[bisket]

My father, brother and I went to our first Preakness the year Red Bullet upset Fusaichi (in 2000?) and it is the highlight of our year. We've been every year since; living the high of Afleet Alex's breathtaking recovery and run to victory, and the low of watching Barbaro's career end right in front of us. The Afleet Alex run is still the greatest sporting event I have witnessed live...without a doubt. We've heard every year about how Maryland may lose the Preakness and never gave it much thought...until this year. Lets hope this race stays at Old Hilltop where it belongs (they will NEVER move the Rose Bowl out of Cali, right?). Yeah, the grandstand is a fire trap and the old bathroom stalls were built for a skinnier America, but the place has CHARM and nostalgia. Do the right thing Marylanders, just like Boston stopped the move outta Fenway, and keep the Preakness at Pimlico!
my favorite preakness was my first. i watched affirmed and alydar duke it out. incidentally md tracks were the only tracks that magna owned that finished in the BLACK THE LAST FEW YEARS!!!!!

[cj's dad]

Not trying to be 100% racist but doesn't Maryland have one recognized native American tribe who would be willing to buy Pimlico and somehow put slots in under eminant doamin? It's happenned in other states.

No, they were smart and moved out many moons ago !!

[cj's dad]

my favorite preakness was my first. i watched affirmed and alydar duke it out. incidentally md tracks were the only tracks that magna owned that finished in the BLACK THE LAST FEW YEARS!!!!!

Were you at Laurel Park last saturday ??

There was a band that was quite good playing in the grandstand area and the crowd was large for an average Saturday of racing.

Next saturday (10-24)- the DeFrancis dash

[bisket]

i was at the md million, the defrancis dash is a day i sometimes go, but i can't this year. the tracks just need to be updated. pimlico really needs to be torn down and rebuilt. we just need owners that have a clue. did you see barry levinson's balimore colt's band movie on espn this week. the irsay analogy fits. most likely this time we're getting rid of the owners and keeping the tracks :ThmbUp: theres absolutely no reason that preakness can attract 100k fans every year and not have a regular crowd of 7-10k every day at the tracks. the owners for the past 30 years just haven't put any money back into the facilities. i've felt for some time that maybe the stadium authority should take over the tracks and manage them like they do with the stadiums. then pimlico can definately be rebuilt. maryland has an advantage over many states in that they have enough breeding operations to fill races. its just that most of the horses are running at delaware and charlestown. this is all going on because of the ridiculous deal that was agreed to years ago by magna and defrancis. the bettors and fans are there the track owners just need to get their stuff together and capitalize on it.

[Java Gold@TFT]

bisket, I was just really refering to Stronacks/MEC bankruptcy. Nothing more without following every bit of the lawsuits/bankruptcy.

[bisket]

when you said frank i thought you meant defrancis not stronach :D . the real problem has been when magna purchased the tracks from defrancis. everyone was well aware that the tracks needed many capital improvements. the government was aware of this and wanted to give magna slots money to achieve this. its just the ageement between defrancis and magna pretty much sabotaged the whole idea. with another party outside of magna and the government splitting the proceeds of slots. it just wouldn't leave the money for the capital improvements. the real losers in all this are the maryland breeders and owners of thoroughbreds. slots also was intended to boost purses to the same level as delaware park so ther breeders could remain competitive. md breeding operations have been slowly dying for some years now. hopefully theres a new beginning on the horizon for md tracks like the one alfred vanderbilt provided in the late 1930's and early 1940's. incidentally vanderbilt's sagamore farms has been revived by the owner of under armor. so md breeding operations have been given a shot in the arm. i wonder if plank (owner of under armor) will be part of the md group bidding on the tracks :ThmbUp:

[Cratos]

When I was last there in 1999 the plumbing system had to be shut down and I vowed never to return until the place was refurbished because the facility is a dump in the strictest definition of the word.

However I was very tempted in 2007 to go because of the Street Sense-Curlin duel and I missed what was probably one of the greatest Preakness ever.

I wish the people in Maryland the best of luck in keeping the Preakness because it is to Maryland as the KY Derby is to Kentucky. Also I hope that a buyer with pockets deep enough will buy Pimilco and update the facility.

[bisket]

When I was last there in 1999 the plumbing system had to be shut down and I vowed never to return until the place was refurbished because the facility is a dump in the strictest definition of the word.

However I was very tempted in 2007 to go because of the Street Sense-Curlin duel and I missed what was probably one of the greatest Preakness ever.

I wish the people in Maryland the best of luck in keeping the Preakness because it is to Maryland as the KY Derby is to Kentucky. Also I hope that a buyer with pockets deep enough will buy Pimilco and update the facility.
the money is there to make it happen

[thespaah]

Pimlico is in bad shape. The surrounding neghborhood is a high crime slum.
That's a bad combination.
Truth is, Pimilco would be a memory if were not for the Preakness Stakes.
The time for recriminations has passed.
Investment capital for Pimlico must be found or it's see ya later.
All the optimism and talk of tradtion cannt stop econimic reality.
One thing that should NEVER happen is the taxpayers of Maryland getting slapped with the bill for the sole prupose of keeping the Preakness in MD. The resident sofg MD are already over taxed. They should not have to foot the bill.

[bisket]

the state isn't going to have to put money out. the fact of the matter is whoever decides to take ownership of the track will be in the black on a regular basis. both the ravens and the orioles franchises are valued in the top of each of its sports, and the tracks will certainly be able to support themselves. magna has been making money in maryland inspight of all the issues with pimlico and laurel. all the basic are available most importantly a large pool of quality runners to fill the fields and attract bettors. i think a rebuilt pimlico would be a big splash locally, and would attract plentry of new fans :ThmbUp:

[Track Collector]

the state isn't going to have to put money out. the fact of the matter is whoever decides to take ownership of the track will be in the black on a regular basis. both the ravens and the orioles franchises are valued in the top of each of its sports, and the tracks will certainly be able to support themselves. magna has been making money in maryland inspight of all the issues with pimlico and laurel. all the basic are available most importantly a large pool of quality runners to fill the fields and attract bettors. i think a rebuilt pimlico would be a big splash locally, and would attract plentry of new fans :ThmbUp:

Bisket,

You sure do have a positive outlook on the future of Maryland racing.

I wish I shared that same view, but the Maryland legislature has hindered the benefit of slots revenue from the very beginning due to incompetence and differing internal factions. While implementation of the slots program is on the horizon, there is still time for the Maryland legislature to mess it up AND shaft the local horse industry. Time will tell.

[thespaah]

the state isn't going to have to put money out. the fact of the matter is whoever decides to take ownership of the track will be in the black on a regular basis. both the ravens and the orioles franchises are valued in the top of each of its sports, and the tracks will certainly be able to support themselves. magna has been making money in maryland inspight of all the issues with pimlico and laurel. all the basic are available most importantly a large pool of quality runners to fill the fields and attract bettors. i think a rebuilt pimlico would be a big splash locally, and would attract plentry of new fans :ThmbUp:
Ok....Hang on..If the state of MD takes over Lrl and Pim, how is it you can say the state government ( read taxpayers) will not have to spend any money.
That is impossible. ANd just what do the respective pro sports franchises have to do with anything?
With attendance at MD racetracks down to a trickle, how is it they will be self supporting?
If magna is making money in MD, why is the company allwing their porperties to be auctioned off?
Are you claimimg that the two MD trracks are somehow immune to the problems magna is facing?
The only way Pimlico becomes a success is if mega investors are willing to buy up the surrounding dilapidated properties in the neighborhood surrounding Pim and revitalize.
UNfotunately that plan is not politically correct. IF the residents got wind of a revitalization plan they would scream bloody murder. "How dare they move us out"?....Meanwhile the same people complain to local authorities and city hall about how bad the crime is.
Can't have it both ways.
One of the reason why HIaleah went ouit of business is the deterioration of the surrounding area. Yes the battle for prime race dates was won by Gulfstream and the politically connected former owners the Donn family had a alot ot do with the scuttling of Hialeah.
I went over there in 1989 just to look at the track. It was dark because Guulfstream was open. Anyway, the neighborhood was a slum. Terrible. It was not a place I wanted to be.

[bisket]

magna is not "allowing" these properties to be auctioned off they are being forced to auction them. do you think its by accident that the md tracks and santa anita are two of the last to be auctioned. why because they're worth the most!! magna has cash problems and they couldn't come up with the deposit to bid on the slots site for their tracks :confused: thats why they the tracks are up for auction. jiminy!!! they attempted to sue the state to get the slots license after they were eliminated. maybe your not aware that another company OWNS THE SLOTS LICENSE TO LAUREL PARK!!!!!!!!!! you shouldn't jump to these uninformed conclusions. by the way that company that owns the slots license to laurel park is first in line at the auction table!!!!!

[thespaah]

magna is not "allowing" these properties to be auctioned off they are being forced to auction them. do you think its by accident that the md tracks and santa anita are two of the last to be auctioned. why because they're worth the most!! magna has cash problems and they couldn't come up with the deposit to bid on the slots site for their tracks :confused: thats why they the tracks are up for auction. jiminy!!! they attempted to sue the state to get the slots license after they were eliminated. maybe your not aware that another company OWNS THE SLOTS LICENSE TO LAUREL PARK!!!!!!!!!! you shouldn't jump to these uninformed conclusions. by the way that company that owns the slots license to laurel park is first in line at the auction table!!!!!
Whatever. Fact is if they were self supporting (MD tracks)) there'd be no need for a fire sale, now would there?
What makes you think that PIM is worth more than say SA, LS or any other Magna property?
Tell ya what , go ahead and pull tax records on each property or find a link to an article that indicates your claim of value is true.
I ma not discussing nor am i interested in who owns a slots license. This discussion is on where the Preakness strakes will be held in the future.
It is nice that Pimlico and the City of Baltimore have such a cheerleader. And I admire your dedication. BUt reality has set in..Pimlico is long in the tooth and the surrounding neighborhood a broken down crime infested dump

[cj's dad]

Whatever. Fact is if they were self supporting (MD tracks)) there'd be no need for a fire sale, now would there?
What makes you think that PIM is worth more than say SA, LS or any other Magna property?
Tell ya what , go ahead and pull tax records on each property or find a link to an article that indicates your claim of value is true.
I ma not discussing nor am i interested in who owns a slots license. This discussion is on where the Preakness strakes will be held in the future.
It is nice that Pimlico and the City of Baltimore have such a cheerleader. And I admire your dedication. BUt reality has set in..Pimlico is long in the tooth and the surrounding neighborhood a broken down crime infested dump

Apparently you know the "hood" -where exactly are the intersections you are referring to ?? Park Heights Ave and Reisterstown Rd. ???

I know the area well !! please enlighten me so I can avoid these areas.

Yes, there are sections around Baltimore which are not so nice as in the case of ALL big cities- but in all my years of going to Pimlico, there has been 1 (one) person attacked/robbed/assualted as he came into the track.

And yes, Pimlico needs work, as does Belmont, Hollywood, and other tracks, so your point is ???

[thespaah]

Whatever. Fact is if they were self supporting (MD tracks)) there'd be no need for a fire sale, now would there?
What makes you think that PIM is worth more than say SA, LS or any other Magna property?
Tell ya what , go ahead and pull tax records on each property or find a link to an article that indicates your claim of value is true.
I ma not discussing nor am i interested in who owns a slots license. This discussion is on where the Preakness strakes will be held in the future.
It is nice that Pimlico and the City of Baltimore have such a cheerleader. And I admire your dedication. BUt reality has set in..Pimlico is long in the tooth and the surrounding neighborhood a broken down crime infested dump

Apparently you know the "hood" -where exactly are the intersections you are referring to ?? Park Heights Ave and Reisterstown Rd. ???

I know the area well !! please enlighten me so I can avoid these areas.

Yes, there are sections around Baltimore which are not so nice as in the case of ALL big cities- but in all my years of going to Pimlico, there has been 1 (one) person attacked/robbed/assualted as he came into the track.

And yes, Pimlico needs work, as does Belmont, Hollywood, and other tracks, so your point is ???
My point is that Pimlico is in dire shape. The suurounding neighborhood is in decline. No amount of happytalk is going to save Old Hilltop until a major revitalization in the track and the surpounding area takes place.
Hollywood Park unfortunately will be sold and developed as something else once the economy recovers.
NYRA has no money to fix up AQU and BEL ..That is until the slots casino is built at AQU...
It is my opinion that NYRA is holding back on capital improvements to the downstate tracks until that happens.
Additionally, it is no secret that NYRA spends most of it's cash on the Saratoga facility.

[castaway01]

I would add that the same problems (crime, urban blight, etc) that make Pimlico unattractive to visit also make it unattractive for someone to buy that property and develop it at anything less than giveaway prices, especially in this economy. There is little racing at Pimlico at this point anyway---six weeks? It will probably stay that way and linger on in its present state for some time.

[thespaah]

I would add that the same problems (crime, urban blight, etc) that make Pimlico unattractive to visit also make it unattractive for someone to buy that property and develop it at anything less than giveaway prices, especially in this economy. There is little racing at Pimlico at this point anyway---six weeks? It will probably stay that way and linger on in its present state for some time.
That is my point. Before Pimlico is re established as a first rate racing venue, the surrounding area needs investemnt and revitalization.
All it takes is a few people with investment capital and an idea.
This happens all the time.

[bisket]

its quite obvious neither of you are familiar with the real estate market in baltimore city. properties values have INCREASED during the recession. maryland tracks are going to survive no doubt.

[bisket]

from today's baltimore sun
http://www.baltimoresun.com/business/bal-bz.slots29oct29,0,6491503.story

magna asked the bankruptcy court to terminate its profit sharing deal with joe defrancis jr. this article explains why slots were not passed in md for 6-7 years now. the really sad part of this ordeal is churchill bid on the tracks back in 2002, but wouldn't give defrancis part of the slots proceeds. defrancis had to sell, and magna could have probably bought the tracks without the deal to share slots proceeds with defrancis. negotiating deals like this is why magna is going belly up!!!

[bisket]

reading between the lines. cordish is gonna buy the tracks. it has the slots license for anne arundel county; which is the jurisdiction laurel park is located. if they buy the tracks and the deal is still in effect with defrancis. cordish will simply put the slots parlor in a different location in anne arundel county; not laurel park. this way it cuts defrancis out of the slots revenue. if magna can get the court to terminate its deal with defrancis; cordish will throw a couple more bucks in the deal because they can put the slots parlor at laurel park. the big question is what's gonna happen to pimlico?