Hello from Chicago

[Danieljay]

Hi all,
Mods feel free to move this if I put it in the wrong section, apologies. Anyways, My name is Dan and Im from the Chicago area, im 29, placed my first bet when I was 21 at the Crestwood OTB. I bet at the new one in Hodgkins now. I remember it like it was yesterday, I put $2 on a 62 to 1 shot at Evangiline and the sucker won, I was hooked from then on.

I've been lurking here for a while now and just decided to join up, figured it should do me some good. Currently, I am a consistently LOSING player. I go to the OTB with $200 maybe twice a month and lose every penny of it. I dont play gimicks, I'm a win/place better only atm. Plus when I do bet, I bet huge, 50wp every time, sometimes 100wp. The horses I am picking to win are coming 3rd and 4th, starting to really make me mad.

I think that I know "some" about racing, enough to get me by. I've read a couple books, the beyer speed one and picking winners, but they seem to be just stories of a guy winning and not really telling you anything. I have no idea what Im doing wrong but I definately need some help.

All that said, hi again from chicago.

Danieljay

[lilmegahertz]

Hi from Oklahoma. I'm the one that goes to the track with $60 and if I come home empty handed, I only lost $60. I'm not much of a bettor but I love the track experience.....the horses, the excitement, the sights and smells. As a beginner bettor, I have asked questions and the folks on here are pretty great at helping you out. :)

[GaryG]

Dan,

There is a wealth of information in the PA archives. If you take the time to search through them it will be worth your while. There are some good players who post here and most are anxious to help if you have a specific question or topic.

Best of luck.

[illinoisbred]

Hi all,
Mods feel free to move this if I put it in the wrong section, apologies. Anyways, My name is Dan and Im from the Chicago area, im 29, placed my first bet when I was 21 at the Crestwood OTB. I bet at the new one in Hodgkins now. I remember it like it was yesterday, I put $2 on a 62 to 1 shot at Evangiline and the sucker won, I was hooked from then on.

I've been lurking here for a while now and just decided to join up, figured it should do me some good. Currently, I am a consistently LOSING player. I go to the OTB with $200 maybe twice a month and lose every penny of it. I dont play gimicks, I'm a win/place better only atm. Plus when I do bet, I bet huge, 50wp every time, sometimes 100wp. The horses I am picking to win are coming 3rd and 4th, starting to really make me mad.

I think that I know "some" about racing, enough to get me by. I've read a couple books, the beyer speed one and picking winners, but they seem to be just stories of a guy winning and not really telling you anything. I have no idea what Im doing wrong but I definately need some help.

All that said, hi again from chicago.

Danieljay
Immediately reduce your bets,give youself a chance to learn something.Make the 200-500 your bankroll and try to play a meet out on it.Since we race here 101/2 months a year , consider concentrating locally or with 1 circuit only.Quickly make friends with others that are serious about handicapping, shun hopeless gamblers/low lifes.Review the past performances later on and see if you can form any opinions on who won and why.Most of all, take it easy if you enjoy this sport.I remember guys like you when I was young-they quickly went broke and soon were never seen.You can gain a lot of knowledge by just reading many of the posters here-on many different aspects of racing.Again enjoy yourself with this-the greatest game of all-and welcome neighbor.

[Steve 'StatMan']

Hi DanielJay. If you get the chance, check out my good friend Scott McMannis and his seminars at the IL Trackside OTBs this fall/winter, I'm sure he'll be coming to Hodgkins at least once, but don't recall the date. There are also contests where Scott is on those Saturdays where he is, and on Fridays and Sundays Hawthorne has on-track contests as well. Scott is a great teacher, was a great mentor to me and is a great friend. Don't know if he covers any of his course materials at his semiars, he no longer has the 6-8 week classes that HAW & SPT(R.I.P.) used to sponsor.

[illinoisbred]

Ditto to Steve's remarks regarding Scott.

[rokitman]

Great to have you in the pools :ThmbUp:

[illinoisbred]

Great to have you in the pools :ThmbUp:
Yes, we need"new blood" in the pools, but it would be nice if they stuck around for a while. We need more Mickey Rooneys in the pools. Once, on a local replay show here in chicago, he said he bet his 1st 2 dollars in 1945 and has spent the last 50 years trying to win it back.

[Light]

I dont play gimicks, I'm a win/place better only atm.

That's your problem.

[Tom]

Welcome Dan.
You will come to ignore light.

[BombsAway Bob]

Welcome Dan.
You will come to ignore light.
:D

[boomman]

Welcome Dan: Ditto on the money management advice and Scott McMannis-had the pleasure of meeting Scott when I was doing book signings at Hawthorne-I agree that he is a great teacher and knows Illinois thoroughbred racing like the back of his hand-Go slow and easy on your bankroll, as we want you to be around and enjoy this sport for many years to come-;)

Boomer

[senortout]

Hi all,
Mods feel free to move this if I put it in the wrong section, apologies. Anyways, My name is Dan and Im from the Chicago area, im 29, placed my first bet when I was 21 at the Crestwood OTB. I bet at the new one in Hodgkins now. I remember it like it was yesterday, I put $2 on a 62 to 1 shot at Evangiline and the sucker won, I was hooked from then on.

I've been lurking here for a while now and just decided to join up, figured it should do me some good. Currently, I am a consistently LOSING player. I go to the OTB with $200 maybe twice a month and lose every penny of it. I dont play gimicks, I'm a win/place better only atm. Plus when I do bet, I bet huge, 50wp every time, sometimes 100wp. The horses I am picking to win are coming 3rd and 4th, starting to really make me mad.

I think that I know "some" about racing, enough to get me by. I've read a couple books, the beyer speed one and picking winners, but they seem to be just stories of a guy winning and not really telling you anything. I have no idea what Im doing wrong but I definately need some help.

All that said, hi again from chicago.

Danieljay

Welcome to the group....some pretty good heads here all in all. First off, I had a big winner like you almost right away when I started, maybe around the time of Secretariat!...and it took me a while to stop shooting for the moon so to speak...Once I hit a nice exacta at Northfield trotters and the following week at Saratoga, 6 days and cashed not a ticket.

Anyway, nowadays I seldom bet more that 3 straight races before cashing a ticket. The reason for this is the way I have cut back. I purchase 5 by 8 legal pads. I write the conditions atop the page, one page per race...I know, the conditions are on the racing form, but I WRITE THEM DOWN atop the page.
Then I give two lines per horse for each horse, don't even write down the scratched horses on the page.

Then I try to write the best thing about each horse in a VERY CONDENSED FASHION. If the best thing I can write about the horse is HOPELESS, I still write that down, something about every horse in the race!

Here's the kicker and I know I will hear about this from others in the group, but I am gonna suggest that you bet TO SHOW ONLY until you get your game straightened out. Couldn't be more genuinely serious about this. Show betting lets you see the whole picture. And if you stick to straight betting like I do(very very few exactas, hardly a trifecta a year, and a few 10 cent superfectas if I'm feeling invincible(these are overall losers for me, by the way, I keep track) Above somewhere I mention the whole picture, and show betting. Well if you are looking for value in the show pool, it will force you to see what REALLY HAPPENS IN A RACE. Soon, you will start noticing(just one example how this helps) those jockeys who are quite interested in winning a race but could NOT CARE LESS about getting third monies for their connections. Believe me, without mentioning names, there are jockeys like this!....and other things too, I could go on and on, third place will straighten you out. More often than not, I repeat, more often than not, when I have had a successful day betting 'SHOW', I won more money than had I played either win, or place. Also, 'WIN, PLACE, AND SHOW' COULD NEVER CUT IT EITHER.

On the surface(first time I read anything you wrote) I'd have to say you may not have the temperament for following suggestions such as these, but consider it anyway!

Best of luck always,
senortout

[KidCapper]

Welcome to the board! Being a 20 year vet. of the racing game I can tell you that the people on this board are filled with knowledge. Whether you're a speed figure player, a computer spreadsheet player, trip handicapper, etc. etc. You can find advice here. The one thing I will tell you is the search for the "Holy Grail " of handicapping has been ongoing for years and no one has found it yet. That being said, there are ways to make money at this game. My advice to you is to find a handicapping style and betting level you can be comfortable with and enjoy the game. With experience you will learn what works and what doesn't.

Good luck n Good Racing from the KidCapper

[Bochall]

Welcome to our world Danieljay....sadly, my education as a horseplayer can be summed up as: lose and learn. More correctly it was lose, get pissed, lose more, get more pissed...finally learn! There is more than one way to skin a cat. Some are speed fig guys (like me), others pour over the charts for trip notes and biases, some only bet certain types of races...If Chicago is your circuit then stick to it. Lotsa players play too many tracks on a typical visit to the OTB. Go to the live races as much as possible. The book that started it for me was a William Quirin book called, Thoroughbred Handicapping:State Of The Art. It may be outdated (circa mid 80's) though. The best modern book is Davidowitz's Thoroughbred Handicapping. Good luck and may you never quench your thirst for value!

[toetoe]

That's your problem.

I disagree. It sounds like you are inured to the inevitale losing streaks, so bet win only. Just scale the bets down, eh ? :ThmbUp: .

[toetoe]

The best modern book is Davidowitz's Thoroughbred Handicapping.

Mark Cramer is the best I've read.

Don't discount the harness game. The "darksiders" may be a bit easier to get comfortable/confident with, and without even trying, you will become good at following trips and noticing trouble, which skills will well serve in the thoroughbred game.

[Space Monkey]

Dan, first thing is PLEASE, scale back your bets. You seem to have the "lottery" attitude towards this game and that doesn't work. You didn't mention how you handicap, what form you use, or how you determine your selections. That is the base for every successful horseplayer. Choose your material, experiment with different forms, develop a routine and keep records of all your bets. I like Seniortout but I have to disagree with his show betting suggestion. Cashing $2.20 tickets doesn't make it. I would suggest playing exactas and doubles. Arlington had a rolling double, I don't know if Hawthorne offers that, but those are the 2 exotics that have the potential for meaningful profit and have generally the lowest takeout in the exotic menu. You called exotics "gimmicks". Thats a bad name for a bet that gives you a chance for high profit as a reward for good handicapping.

Good luck and I would also suggest continue reading this forum. Lots of really smart people here :)

[Light]

I disagree. It sounds like you are inured to the inevitale losing streaks, so bet win only. Just scale the bets down, eh ? :ThmbUp: .

W/P betting 1 horse is the hardest way to make a profit in this game. Too many ways for your horse to lose. Spread out you must (Yoda imitation). Betting 2 horses to win will improve your ROI over betting one,if you are in a slump. It's also a good slump buster psychologically to get some winners when you are in a slump.

Another point is Dan says he bets $50 WP. You really shouldn't bet WP equally and you should be reading the board if you bet place or show. It may or may not be worth it. I rarely bet to place. I subscribe to Cramer's tactic in "Kinky Handicapping" of using the horse in the 2nd spot in exactas instead of placing him. Dan said alot of times his horses are running 3rd or 4th.I sometimes single a deep closer for 3rd in trifecta's instead of a show bet and will use a plodder in the 3rd and 4th spots in supers. But alas, Dan doesn't like gimmicks. So help I cant.

[senortout]

Dan, first thing is PLEASE, scale back your bets. You seem to have the "lottery" attitude towards this game and that doesn't work. You didn't mention how you handicap, what form you use, or how you determine your selections. That is the base for every successful horseplayer. Choose your material, experiment with different forms, develop a routine and keep records of all your bets. I like Seniortout but I have to disagree with his show betting suggestion. Cashing $2.20 tickets doesn't make it. I would suggest playing exactas and doubles. Arlington had a rolling double, I don't know if Hawthorne offers that, but those are the 2 exotics that have the potential for meaningful profit and have generally the lowest takeout in the exotic menu. You called exotics "gimmicks". Thats a bad name for a bet that gives you a chance for high profit as a reward for good handicapping.

Good luck and I would also suggest continue reading this forum. Lots of really smart people here :)


# of Bets Win % $1 ROI Wagered Payoff Profit/Loss
434 52.77% -.01 $465.00 $461.10 $-3.90


This is a wagering period covering Sept 01, 2009 thru Oct 04, 2009

My total wagering action during that period. I could copy and past the individual wagers but that does not help prove my point. What the new member needs is a confidence booster...well thats what show betting will offer.

Granted, I have not made money during this period. Truthfully, not too many of us have.

But, I had plenty of action, I did not pass many races, and I now fear no type of race. My weaknesses are less obvious, and my confidence level is high.

Like, my enjoyment of the game is higher that its ever been.

I feel that, yes, I can handicap with the very best of you now. However, I cannot invest as wisely, that part is true as well. There are many instances of lost opportunities. However, that is personal redboarding. I have the occasional long shot winner too, but only get the show end of that. It no longer bothers me. Whereas I highly recommend this show betting to a learner, I also recommend a big step back from large show bets themselves...they, indeed are a recipe for disaster for those financially and mentally unprepared for a jolt to the wallet.

Since the new guy has said he drops 200 each and every trip to the OTB....I know he can't be having much fun. It may even be embarassing for a gambler to overcome his ego enough to step back from financial disaster, take a look see, and play in a more relaxed manner!

senortout ps my account was low on Sept 1,so, I put $25.00 in on that day and have churned it *or rebet *that $25.00 over 17 times....think about it....my balance after playing October 5th is $22.39......

[Space Monkey]

Senior, if you're happy that's all that matters. If its working for you, I'm certainly not going to suggest you change your ways. But I do think that you're a rare individual. I'm sure there are some, but I don't know anybody that would be satisfied approaching the game the way you do.

I would suggest the OP should bet less, but more often. Hes not going to learn the game playing only once or twice a month. The kind of bet he chooses should be one that has a medium to high hit rate, with a lower takeout. That is why I suggested the 2 easiest exotics to hit, the double and exacta. OK, the Quinela if you play Mountaineer. Thats his choice to make. I recently have picked the Pick 4 for my primary bet. Thats me. I've been around for awhile and I want some real excitement to my play along with playing to my handicapping strengths. I certainly wouldn't recommend the Pick 4 for Dan.

[TurfRuler]

Danieljay, if you don't want to lose on your bi-weekly trips, Dutch the race.