Why do some horses quit if they don't get the lead?

[menifee]

I have always been curious about this. A perfect example is the horse finallymadeit. PP's - Calder 3/25 Race 10.

This horse runs triple digit beyers, but he needs the lead. If he does not get it, his beyers drop remarkably. Even if the pace is slow, he still cannot rate off the pace.

I am curious about the science of this. I wonder if anyone has read or written about this and why some horses are like this.

Tx

[Imriledup]

Some horses get their 'air' shut off if they are grabbed too hard. When they are 'sent' they can go really fast and keep going because the rider isn't grabbing 'into' them. I think its partially because of this and maybe the other part is that the horse just has no heart.

[Onion Monster]

Supposedly, it has to do with herd mentality.

Oddly, you can see similar traits in people. Some people have to be the center of attention or group leader. If they can't lead, they "pick up their toys and go home." They often find a "lesser field" to lead (you can't be CEO of your company, so you become head of the local Elk Lodge). People take class drops all the time.

Your "need the lead" types have naturally nervous personalities. And they can't stand pressure situations. When the going gets rough, they often quit.

On the other end of the spectrum, you have the closers. They're easy-going and tend to be a bit lazy. They're quite content to let the others go on ahead. They'll catch up with them in a minute.

The closers are consistent. No matter the scenario, they'll do their thing. And sometimes, because things are so chaotic ahead of them, they just hang around long enough to reap the rewards.

:) :) :)

[46zilzal]

Some just quit when challenged, old Groovy was a good case in point. No clear sailing, no run....Laughed when he went down at 3/5 or so at Santa Anita after Pine Tree Lane outbroke him and Smile finished him off.

[Cadillakin]

It's not such a mystery.. Think back to when you were a kid and your friend poked you and ran.. If he was faster than you, how long did you chase him before you realized you couldn't catch him... And after you realized you couldn't catch him, did you continue to chase him or did you quit.

Horses are very keen about where they fit.. It's not quite that simple but that's about the gist of it..

[kenwoodallpromos]

It's not such a mystery.. Think back to when you were a kid and your friend poked you and ran.. If he was faster than you, how long did you chase him before you realized you couldn't catch him... And after you realized you couldn't catch him, did you continue to chase him or did you quit.

Horses are very keen about where they fit.. It's not quite that simple but that's about the gist of it..
I always waited until next time he came around the corner and jumped him- gets close to the pace nexrt time for payback? I've seen that on the track!
I think Musket Man and General Quarters did that in some preps!

[andymays]

On a traditional dirt surface some horses need the lead to win unless they are dropping in class. For example a 20k claiming horse that needs the lead at that level can probably rate against a 10k speedball.

My opinion is that is a mental thing that some horses when challenged on the lead or, when they have another horse in front of them, get "stressed out" or anxious and as a result they get physically tense as well. It is unusual for a "frontrunner" on a dirt surface to be able to change a frontrunning style successfully at the same class level.

On a synthetic surface the opposite is true. For the most part it depends on how the Jockey decides to ride the horse. Most horses on a synthetic surface can change styles with success.

Why is there a difference when it comes to changing running styles between dirt racing and sythetic racing?

I don't know.

[robert99]

I've yet to see a "losing/ quitting" horse kick down the winning post in a sulk, nor any "winner" standing up on its hind legs milking the applause of the crowd. :)

[DeanT]

It's not such a mystery.. Think back to when you were a kid and your friend poked you and ran.. If he was faster than you, how long did you chase him before you realized you couldn't catch him... And after you realized you couldn't catch him, did you continue to chase him or did you quit.

Horses are very keen about where they fit.. It's not quite that simple but that's about the gist of it..

very nice :ThmbUp:

[Brogan]

I've yet to see a "losing/ quitting" horse kick down the winning post in a sulk, nor any "winner" standing up on its hind legs milking the applause of the crowd. :)
You, sir, haven't been around horses enough to understand what you see. There's many a horse that after getting beat has sulked for days, and many after a win get very full of themselves.

[Oaklawn]

You, sir, haven't been around horses enough to understand what you see. There's many a horse that after getting beat has sulked for days, and many after a win get very full of themselves.

That's very interesting and makes sense. I know when the family dog sulks if he can't stay inside, so I'm sure trainers know when there horse sulks after a loss.

[bobphilo]

I've yet to see a "losing/ quitting" horse kick down the winning post in a sulk, nor any "winner" standing up on its hind legs milking the applause of the crowd. :)

Well put. As if horses understood the abstract notion that "winning" in human terms mean having their nose in front at some arbitrary invisible finish line? That doesn't mean that they aren't competitive animals and some of them like to be in front whenever possible. It's just that thinking that they understand the human concept of either having the early lead or winning is taking anthropormorphizing way too far.

A simpler explanation is just that horses have good and bad days physically, and frontrunners having an off day will be unlikely to get the early lead for the same reason they finish poorly that day - they're just not at their peak that day.. The simplest explanation is the best. Ocam's Razor rules.

Bob

[Robert Fischer]

I have always been curious about this. A perfect example is the horse finallymadeit. PP's - Calder 3/25 Race 10.

This horse runs triple digit beyers, but he needs the lead. If he does not get it, his beyers drop remarkably. Even if the pace is slow, he still cannot rate off the pace.

I am curious about the science of this. I wonder if anyone has read or written about this and why some horses are like this.

Tx

A lot of horses that have very good speed have never been trained to rate. They can't relax with other horses in front of them.