Nicanor Wed DEL

[WinterTriangle]

Nicanor, 6th race, Wed. at Delaware Park.

For anyone following him.

[joanied]

Hey, WT....you know I am. I just came over to post it...and guess what...it's on the TURF:jump: This might be just what Nicanor needs to break his maiden:ThmbUp:

:)

[jognlope]

betcha he likes lawn, good luck to him

[toussaud]

whistlejacket FTW @ 4-1

[cj]

The horse should be on dirt. He has run well his last couple without winning and would tower over pretty much any dirt field at Delaware.

[andymays]

Just guessing from watching his last couple of races that he is best suited to run on the lead in a route. If they send him to the lead he will probably run a freakish race!

[098poi]

Thanks for posting. Good luck Nicanor. :ThmbUp:

[Gorgeous George]

i remember the unbelievable hype there was before this horse ever ran, and i can remember saying that it probaly wont ever win a race, how true.

[Judge Gallivan]

i remember the unbelievable hype there was before this horse ever ran, and i can remember saying that it probaly wont ever win a race, how true.


How false!

[toussaud]

someone likes the turf

[Watcher]

He romped by 10+ ... video coming in the next 2 minutes.

[Watcher]

KFxTN1krFuY

[toussaud]

good for you anna N.

how edgar prado could not win on this thing i don't know.

[andymays]

Just guessing from watching his last couple of races that he is best suited to run on the lead in a route. If they send him to the lead he will probably run a freakish race!


That's the right style. Nicanor wants to run on the lead!

[SmartyLane]

He looked great........

[jldonah]

I imagine most will agree that the others were a soft bunch compared to him, but Nicanor looked like he was just loping along by the middle of the second turn and on the way to the winner's circle was still ready to run. If he has the guts to try to win against more talented horses, he should be able to to trim a little time off of today's final time.
By the way, everyone (for the most part) was happy to see him win at Delaware Park--I wish I had been able to get there in time to see what he looked like in the paddock.

[Radar]

Toussaud, do you not realize that for some horses the surface makes a lot of difference? It is not Prado's fault that the colt is just now being run on the grass, for which he seems to show a marked preference.....a little thinking can be useful!

[Robert Fischer]

BEL-MONT :jump:

BEL-MONT :jump:

BEL-MONT :jump:


arsenio hall "HOOHOOHOOHOOHOOHOOHOOHOOHOOHOOHOOHOOHOOHOOHOO"

[toussaud]

not 15 lengths better.

he should have broken his maiden on class alone.

you had people here thinking that the horse was a hopless horse.

[cj]

Toussaud, do you not realize that for some horses the surface makes a lot of difference? It is not Prado's fault that the colt is just now being run on the grass, for which he seems to show a marked preference.....a little thinking can be useful!

I don't think the horse ran any better today than he did on dirt in his last start. He just faced slower horses and had a better trip. The horse handles dirt just fine, as he obviously does turf.

[toussaud]

there were some pretty good horses in this race. not a hell of alot of them but WHISTLEJACKET was no slouch and on paper was a better horse. 2 back to back places at keeneland. Today's man finished 2nd on the turf in a MSW his last out, and he trounced both of them.


the he was better would have credence if he didn't anhiilate WHISTLEJACKET, who like I said, on paper was actually better than nicacnor.

[Judge Gallivan]

good for you anna N.

how edgar prado could not win on this thing i don't know.


He was ridden by Prado only in his first start when he had a lot of trouble (and M. Matz rarely wins 1st time out). In his 2ns and 3rd start he was ridden by Jose Lezcano.

[098poi]

Here's a link to Barbaro's maiden win. (I don't know how to insert it)
Barbaro was #10 that day and Nicanor was #10 today! (Does that mean anything?)

LhYxeW6aUus


(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LhYxeW6aUus&feature=related)

[Saratoga_Mike]

He ran his last 5/16 in 32 flat - that was unimpressive to say the least (and no I don't care that he was ridden out).

I think he'll have a tough time winning beyond basic allowance conditions. Hope I'm wrong b/c I think the Jacksons are a class act.

[jognlope]

they train him right!!!!!! YEEHAW!!!! Please keep him on then lawn!!!

[JustRalph]

Looks like he likes the lawn...........but the fractions were pretty slow

[joanied]

i remember the unbelievable hype there was before this horse ever ran, and i can remember saying that it probaly wont ever win a race, how true.

:p

[joanied]

Beautiful win...yeah, fractions were slow, but he was just loping along easy...he looked like he finished up nice and strong and it was simply an easy win...
I'm thrilled:jump: and I hope his big brother was up there watching him:ThmbUp:

Thanks for posting the video:)

[Gorgeous George]

trust him to win just when i say he wont...it doesnt matter anyway because at the end of the day this horse is nothing. Just because hes the great barbaro's brother people expect too much from him. He hasnt shown one ounce of talent to suggest he will be even half as good as him.

[Judge Gallivan]

...it doesnt matter anyway because at the end of the day this horse is nothing.

And what exactly are you?

[Gorgeous George]

And what exactly are you?

a millionaire

[JustRalph]

trust him to win just when i say he wont...it doesnt matter anyway because at the end of the day this horse is nothing. Just because hes the great barbaro's brother people expect too much from him. He hasnt shown one ounce of talent to suggest he will be even half as good as him.

I never for the life of me will understand why people will outwardly go against a horse?

It goes the other way too. Some get very attached to special horses. If you ask me............the becoming attached to a nice horse is relatively natural........like cheering for the underdog. But showing disdain for a horse is totally different. I don't get it? What does it matter how well he does? He is another story to follow. Another piece of the racing puzzle to get enjoyment from. We have too many bad things in the game........... bad people......etc. This part can be a positive.

But to just plain go after the horse because he doesn't measure up to his brother........??? Now that is odd if you ask me.

So what, you're a millionaire............ big deal......

[The Hawk]

He got a 100 Beyer. Maybe he IS better on turf.

[sandpit]

trust him to win just when i say he wont...it doesnt matter anyway because at the end of the day this horse is nothing. Just because hes the great barbaro's brother people expect too much from him. He hasnt shown one ounce of talent to suggest he will be even half as good as him.

With the constant, daily stream of races that are nothing in the racing landscape, the fact that a maiden race on Wednesday at Delaware Park can draw the kind of interest it does suggests that Nicanor is far from "nothing".

And, no, I'm not one of those overzealous Barbaro fans, but I did admire his talent.

[Robert Fischer]

He got a 100 Beyer. Maybe he IS better on turf.

He is a versatile horse who can run well over any surface.
Dirt, Turf, Keeneland poly track would likely be his 3 best. The more important things to look at are how tiring a specific surface happens to be, and the expected general dynamics of the race and how they fit his weaknesses and strengths.

[Robert Fischer]

If you compare Barbaro and Nicanor on video, the first thing that should stand out is that Barbaro had a higher left knee kick.

with the knee kick you have to guess a little. Did Barbaro have a slight confirmation problem? maybe/ most likely?. Was it just a bigger range of motion? could be.

Then you also see that Barbaro had a choppier almost wilder way of going. Again this is subject for interpretation. It could be that Barbaro was a wild extremely game beast and more wild than Nicanor. It could be that his higher left knee action throws off his stride slightly and is responsible for the "game" appearance of his going - or any combination of things.


Nicanor should be pointed toward long distance races where his superior stamina and his tactical speed would give him an advantage over his rivals.
The Belmont stakes isn't as crazy as it sounds. (but remember i am the nut who thought pointing to the Bluegrass for his maiden wasn't all that far fetched...)

9 and 10 furlong turf races are the likely next best step.

he could be a bet-against going only a mile in a good allowance race.

[toussaud]

the secreteriat


and from what I understand barbaro was by no stretch of the imagation, nice.

[joanied]

I never for the life of me will understand why people will outwardly go against a horse?

It goes the other way too. Some get very attached to special horses. If you ask me............the becoming attached to a nice horse is relatively natural........like cheering for the underdog. But showing disdain for a horse is totally different. I don't get it? What does it matter how well he does? He is another story to follow. Another piece of the racing puzzle to get enjoyment from. We have too many bad things in the game........... bad people......etc. This part can be a positive.

But to just plain go after the horse because he doesn't measure up to his brother........??? Now that is odd if you ask me.

So what, you're a millionaire............ big deal......


:ThmbUp: JustRalph.... you took the words right outta my mouth...great reply post:ThmbUp:
right down to the part about being a millionaire....
:)

[Ian Meyers]

I don't think the horse ran any better today than he did on dirt in his last start. He just faced slower horses and had a better trip. The horse handles dirt just fine, as he obviously does turf.


Funny you should say that. I commented to a fellow handicapper yesterday after the race that I think his stride says pure dirt and that he will be a good bet against on grass at some point in the near future. That was a pretty bad field he beat.

Conversely, his race on dirt against a high quality colt in Custom for Carlos demonstrated ability. It will be interesting to see how Matz spots him going forward.

[joanied]

Quoting Sandpit....


"With the constant, daily stream of races that are nothing in the racing landscape, the fact that a maiden race on Wednesday at Delaware Park can draw the kind of interest it does suggests that Nicanor is far from "nothing".

Another good reply:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:

[jognlope]

The Jacksons: "I got plenty 'o nothin and nothins plenty for me..."

[Saratoga_Mike]

He got a 100 Beyer. Maybe he IS better on turf.

He probably is better on the turf, but I think that's one of the worst Beyer estimates I've ever seen. There were only two turf races on Wednsday at Delaware, which makes the estimated track variant less trustworthy. I hope I'm wrong b/c I really like the Jackson, but I'd be surprised if he ever runs a 100 on the turf (or dirt) again.

[Gorgeous George]

With the constant, daily stream of races that are nothing in the racing landscape, the fact that a maiden race on Wednesday at Delaware Park can draw the kind of interest it does suggests that Nicanor is far from "nothing".

And, no, I'm not one of those overzealous Barbaro fans, but I did admire his talent.

The reason people turned up was to see Barbaro's brother not a good racehorse. A waste of time. This horse is only known because of Barbaro and not his performances on the racetrack.

[Gorgeous George]

I never for the life of me will understand why people will outwardly go against a horse?

It goes the other way too. Some get very attached to special horses. If you ask me............the becoming attached to a nice horse is relatively natural........like cheering for the underdog. But showing disdain for a horse is totally different. I don't get it? What does it matter how well he does? He is another story to follow. Another piece of the racing puzzle to get enjoyment from. We have too many bad things in the game........... bad people......etc. This part can be a positive.

But to just plain go after the horse because he doesn't measure up to his brother........??? Now that is odd if you ask me.

So what, you're a millionaire............ big deal......

I find it sad that some people judge a horse on its breeding and not by its performances. How many bad horses are remembered...zero. Im not against this horse i just dont understand why people hype up a horse so much based on breeding. It doesnt matter who its brother is or who the sire is until a horse shows raw talent on the track then we can begin to dream. The fact that you can judge me shows your contempt for posters. I regularly donate to Remember Me Rescue in the states and hold fund raising events for the Irish Horse Welfare Trust here in Ireland. Being a millionaire i can afford to fund this great charities so thats why it is a big deal.

[Gorgeous George]

I find it sad that some people judge a horse on its breeding and not by its performances. How many bad horses are remembered...zero. Im not against this horse i just dont understand why people hype up a horse so much based on breeding. It doesnt matter who its brother is or who the sire is until a horse shows raw talent on the track then we can begin to dream. The fact that you can judge me shows your contempt for posters. I regularly donate to Remember Me Rescue in the states and hold fund raising events for the Irish Horse Welfare Trust here in Ireland. Being a millionaire i can afford to fund this great charities so thats why it is a big deal.

:ThmbUp: Gorgeous George.... you took the words right outta my mouth...great reply post:ThmbUp:
right down to the part about being a millionaire....
:)

[JustRalph]

stand up guys............we gotta millionaire in the thread............

[PaceAdvantage]

Only on a horse racing board would someone brag about being a millionaire (they're a dime a dozen these days, are they not???)!!! :lol:

[Gorgeous George]

stand up guys............we gotta millionaire in the thread............

im honoured really

[Relwob Owner]

I find it sad that some people judge a horse on its breeding and not by its performances. How many bad horses are remembered...zero. Im not against this horse i just dont understand why people hype up a horse so much based on breeding. It doesnt matter who its brother is or who the sire is until a horse shows raw talent on the track then we can begin to dream. The fact that you can judge me shows your contempt for posters. I regularly donate to Remember Me Rescue in the states and hold fund raising events for the Irish Horse Welfare Trust here in Ireland. Being a millionaire i can afford to fund this great charities so thats why it is a big deal.



You say you are not against this horse but you had posted this....

it doesnt matter anyway because at the end of the day this horse is nothing

Sounds like someone who is against this horse......I am not judging you(or you unneccessary claims about your wealth) but am analyzing your posts and they arent consistent as far as I can tell.....

[Gorgeous George]

You say you are not against this horse but you had posted this....

it doesnt matter anyway because at the end of the day this horse is nothing

Sounds like someone who is against this horse......I am not judging you(or you unneccessary claims about your wealth) but am analyzing your posts and they arent consistent as far as I can tell.....

The horse is nothing because it has done nothing. Ill give you an example

Charles Town 02:15

1 (1)



864965

Layton (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

2 (2)



324154

Northern Linkage (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

3 (3)



341-56

Loveme Lovemenot (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

4 (4)



62137

The Real Seal (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

5 (5)



541114-

Mojave Storm (USA) What do I think of this horse? RESPECT IT BECAUSE IT WINS

6 (6)



6615-11

Mr. Deputy Kat (USA) What do I think of this horse? RESPECT IT BECAUSE IT WINS

7 (7)



8-81423

Farleyshelonwheels (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

8 (8)



4-68437

Six String (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

9 (9)



4-03422

Behavioral Finance (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

10 (10)



133585-

Ungi Blanc (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

11 (11)



444434

Another Vow (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

12 (12)



564-456

Sonic Boom (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

13 (13)



1-31860

Bomber D Back (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

[Relwob Owner]

The horse is nothing because it has done nothing. Ill give you an example

Charles Town 02:15

1 (1)



864965

Layton (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

2 (2)



324154

Northern Linkage (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

3 (3)



341-56

Loveme Lovemenot (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

4 (4)



62137

The Real Seal (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

5 (5)



541114-

Mojave Storm (USA) What do I think of this horse? RESPECT IT BECAUSE IT WINS

6 (6)



6615-11

Mr. Deputy Kat (USA) What do I think of this horse? RESPECT IT BECAUSE IT WINS

7 (7)



8-81423

Farleyshelonwheels (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

8 (8)



4-68437

Six String (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

9 (9)



4-03422

Behavioral Finance (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

10 (10)



133585-

Ungi Blanc (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

11 (11)



444434

Another Vow (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

12 (12)



564-456

Sonic Boom (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing

13 (13)



1-31860

Bomber D Back (USA) What do I think of this horse? Nothing



Ok, then you have something against it...you think its nothing. I get it

[cj]

He probably is better on the turf, but I think that's one of the worst Beyer estimates I've ever seen. There were only two turf races on Wednsday at Delaware, which makes the estimated track variant less trustworthy. I hope I'm wrong b/c I really like the Jackson, but I'd be surprised if he ever runs a 100 on the turf (or dirt) again.

I agree, not sure where they got a 100 from. The used a variant 6 points faster for the other turf race meaning this one could have been a 94, which is actually about what I'm giving him. He did, however, run pretty damn fast early (dirt horse?) to get a pace figure on my numbers of 107.

[Patrick333]

No doubt about that he wasn't pushed yesterday. But I didn't see anything that said he couldn't be a good serviceable stakes horse.

[joanied]

Gorgeous George....
You might be a millionaire, but you still don't get it :bang: Whether or not Nicanor turns into a stakes horse, a champion, or ends up in a claiming race...can't you open your eyes long enough to see that it's not always about how good a horse is or isn't...or wether or not a horse will be as good as any of it's full siblings....and sometimes, are you ready...it has nothing to do with placing bets....sometimes a horse is simply great for the sport...there were folks at Delaware last Wensday that probably wouldn't have been there if not for this one horse...they were there to see Nicanor...forget about his 'numbers' or anything else related to the game of handicapping...any time we get a horse that draws a crowd...it can only be a good thing.
So, please, don't come in here to bash Nicanor (or any fan favorite horse) because you don't think much about him...maybe just stay out of the thread so we can have some fun with this horse...he has a following, whether or not you like that aspect of the sport of horse racing, please, don't knock it.

[Saratoga_Mike]

I agree, not sure where they got a 100 from. The used a variant 6 points faster for the other turf race meaning this one could have been a 94, which is actually about what I'm giving him. He did, however, run pretty damn fast early (dirt horse?) to get a pace figure on my numbers of 107.

I've seen several people cite your pace figures. Are they based off of the Beyer scale?

I didn't pull up the Beyer for the other turf race. How can they justify a split variant when there was nothing to trend it off of? Absurd.

He may have run fast early based on your pace figs, but he plodded home in 32 flat for the final 5/16. Gosh I think 20k claimers on the turf typically do better than that. As we both know, there aren't too many successful high-caliber turf horses that walk home during the last part of the race.