Why can't anyone give Mine the Bird any credit?

[Zippy Chippy]

I mean jeez, this horse just won the KD.. Everyone is so fast to put up posts, "this horse has no chance to ever make the money again".... I think it sucks that a horse can run such a good race, and no one can even say anything good about him.

[ghostyapper]

If a favorite had made that kind of move we'd be comparing him to secretariat right now. I've seen everyone praise borel's ride but that was one of the most impressive closing kicks in derby history.

Hopefully this guy can stay healthy and show us his talent down the road

[Saratoga_Mike]

I mean jeez, this horse just won the KD.. Everyone is so fast to put up posts, "this horse has no chance to ever make the money again".... I think it sucks that a horse can run such a good race, and no one can even say anything good about him.

Humans have a difficult time processing "Black Swan" events.

[Relwob Owner]

I mean jeez, this horse just won the KD.. Everyone is so fast to put up posts, "this horse has no chance to ever make the money again".... I think it sucks that a horse can run such a good race, and no one can even say anything good about him.


I agree....someone said the beyer was over 100, maybe a 108--that is not a "fluke" number. I think that it will be cool to see if the horse can repeat and prove he is legit....Barbaro wins by 6 and he is Secretariat, this horse does and he takes a beating...


I think sometimes people forget these are horses and crazy things happen

[FantasticDan]

If a favorite had made that kind of move we'd be comparing him to secretariat right now.
I thought the same thing. If IWK or Dunkirk had made that move, the word "superstar" would be seen in all the articles tomorrow.

I give Bird all the credit in the world. That overhead shot of him powering past all those horses in the stretch was awesome.

[BeatTheChalk]

If a favorite had made that kind of move we'd be comparing him to secretariat right now. I've seen everyone praise borel's ride but that was one of the most impressive closing kicks in derby history.

Hopefully this guy can stay healthy and show us his talent down the road

Umm I praised both of them. And the trainer. What a great story it is..To see
Calvin in tears was unreal .. And the horse ! Didnt phase him a but. Wasnt
even blowing or anything as he cooled down. Hell the horse has Smart Strike
and Grindstone waiting to tell him " Yah done good son "
:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: :cool:

[toussaud]

the only thing flukish about that turn of foot is I think it ws adided by mud. as birdstones and smart strikes (his damsire ) have a liking for an off track. He's ovbiously taken a step.. a big one.. up in his career. he's a player. and you can throw out all the races in his past.

i have a feeling the trainers barn might see a couple of new horses as well

[oddsmaven]

If a favorite had made that kind of move we'd be comparing him to secretariat right now. I've seen everyone praise borel's ride but that was one of the most impressive closing kicks in derby history...
From what I've seen over many years (Silky Sullivan was before my time), good horses rarely come from downtown like that...this horse caught up faster by saving ground but he still was pretty far back at the top of the lane...many of the booming longshots I've seen win come from nowhere late like they were shot out of a cannon.

[Run Nicholas Run]

I agree....someone said the beyer was over 100, maybe a 108--that is not a "fluke" number. I think that it will be cool to see if the horse can repeat and prove he is legit....Barbaro wins by 6 and he is Secretariat, this horse does and he takes a beating...


I think sometimes people forget these are horses and crazy things happen

BARBARO was a proven winner and MTB was a low beyer number earner,
dont insult the LEGEND of BARBARO.

[CBedo]

Humans have a difficult time processing "Black Swan" events.
great book. Taleb's other book is good too.

[Relwob Owner]

BARBARO was a proven winner and MTB was a low beyer number earner,
dont insult the LEGEND of BARBARO.

wow. Relax man.I wasnt insulting Barbaro at all....I was comparing the fact they both won by a similar number of lengths in the Derby and comparing reactions.....I am a Beyer man and trust me, I realize the horses arent in the same galaxy on the whole--I was just making a comment on how negatively people are judging teh horse today....

[MNslappy]

"I'm just so tickled that me and my horse are now going to be part of the history of the Kentucky Derby," said Woolley, a former bareback rodeo rider turned horse trainer. "We're going to do it and they won't ever be able to take that away from us.

"It's down to racin' luck and what happens."



http://www.thewhig.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1548363

[Jinxed]

Borel knows when to ride the rail. Point proven today, and he was awesome. I give him all the credit for a great ride. The other jocks don't seem to learn anything from him..a wet/fast track, a horse bred for mud, and Borel on his back. I just don't think we are in any way looking at a Triple Crown winner, or even the Preakness winner. fluke, but it played right into his hands. I still give the jockey all the credit, or most of it. I would love for him to win again, because I can't even imagne what Beyer is going through with all his stats..he sucked on this one, but then again for the most part I completely ignore the arrogant bastard.

[cmoore]

I give Calvin just as much credit as the horse. That's a big stretch for me..I'm always a horse first handicapper..I hardly ever handicap based on jockeys..But for him to drop all the way back to last..Probably over 20 lengths and to have the confidence to stick with his game plan..You got to give him all the credit in the world..Any other jockey on Mine That Bird today doesn't win..He would of been to close to the pace early on and wouldn't of had that much energy left late..

When Calvin is in the ZONE!!! No one comes close..

[Greyfox]

Personally, I'd love this one to be the favorite next time out.
For all of you who think that he's being "knocked" too much, be sure to put money on his nose.

[JustRalph]

I was just watching the replay.......... NBC said he was a late foal..........

He turns 3 for real on May 10th..............he might get better.........?

[Jinxed]

I give Calvin just as much credit as the horse. That's a big stretch for me..I'm always a horse first handicapper..I hardly ever handicap based on jockeys..But for him to drop all the way back to last..Probably over 20 lengths and to have the confidence to stick with his game plan..You got to give him all the credit in the world..Any other jockey on Mine That Bird today doesn't win..He would of been to close to the pace early on and wouldn't of had that much energy left late..

When Calvin is in the ZONE!!! No one comes close..

I'll take a fair horse with a great jockey anytime. I'm much more liable to look at a great jockey change. I feel they have a lot to do with getting that horse to the finish line. I guess you could say I look at both, but I favor the jockeys. A great horse can have a sorry ass jockey on his back. Along with being a great jockey, Borel is without an enemy. Everyone loves this goofy little guy.:)

[The Judge]

If you just look at the number of wins, the horses with the most wins finished 2nd and 3rd with 5 each, the $103 winner had 4 wins tied with Fruiesan Fire, Chocolate Candy and Desert Party. So with those 6 horses you would have the exacta and the trifecta.

Yeah I know it won't happen next year.

[kenwoodallpromos]

If you just look at the number of wins, the horses with the most wins finished 2nd and 3rd with 5 each, the $103 winner had 4 wins tied with Fruiesan Fire, Chocolate Candy and Desert Party. So with those 6 horses you would have the exacta and the trifecta.

Yeah I know it won't happen next year.
3 favorites have injuries, track condition is unpredictable, crowd didn't know who to bet on, this one casn get 1 1/2!

[jwel14]

Even though he messed up my Exacta and Double . I do give him credit. What he did was truly remarkable. But, I also feel that he was aided by the track conditions. The others were tired from trying to get the lead, with the track as sloppy. If, I had only put him with my 3 horses, I would have had the super! But, horse racing is full of that.
The Derby is the one race that beginners do great on. They bet all the long shots and end up with Giacomo and Mine That Bird!

[boomman]

Great ride by Calvin Bo"rail" and congratulations to a solid trainer who was always was one of the nicest guys on the backside during my many years in New Mexico!

As the late Charlie Isles would say:

Way to go Chipper!!:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:

Boomer

[bettheoverlay]

Good to hear he's a nice guy but what's his history? I still can't imagine a trainer of such obscure and limited thoroughbred success winning the Derby. Has he been a big-time quarter horse trainer? Has he won stakes races?

[joanied]

boomman...do tell us more, if you can...I think we are all curious about this man.

I agree with everyone that said if it had been one of the favorites making that run...he would be hailed as a possible great one...Calvin was brilliant, but that little horse turned on the afterburners...amazing run.

[Niko]

The reason he isn't getting the credit he deserves is the same reason Giacomo didn't get the credit he deserved. The horse didn't have the credentials of many others coming in, he has to continue to prove us "poor" handicappers wrong.

You'll get good odds in the Preakness so fire away.....

[W2G]

We need to face reality and admit that this horse unleashed a powerful kick and left them all eating mud. This isn't Giacomo. And with all the injuries it's tough to say just how talented the Preakness and Belmont fields are going to be.

I'll bet him in Baltimore. 5-1? Could be a gift.

[kenwoodallpromos]

We see the industry refuse to move off of old standards and I think more modern- handicappers are the same way, same old same old.
Us handicappers think "class" is purse or prestige, that the track is always the same, that a winner of 2 races can beat a 4+ time stakes winner as long as the 1 of the 2 races is at high Beyer's and on a major circuit.
Charismatic was a claimer; Funny Cide only won statebreds; Smarty Jones came through Arkansas; War Emblem was underrated because he went through Illinois; many this year came mfrom fake dirt; Giacomo only finished ITM instead of W in big preps; Barbaro was a grass horse.
The last time a rash of favs won was the 1970's, but everybody wants the easiest pick and to be proven right. Good luck with that when the FRONT RUNNERS BURN OUT and there is an OFF TRACK!
But hey, I thought that was part of (non-computerized) basic handicapping was all about! Everbody knew before the gate opened it was an off-track, 19 racers, 17 longshots, many with few wins, race had a good chance of being unpredictable.
The result- high dosage (=speed) did best on a sealed track.
_____________________
Myself, here is what I said:
"04-30-2009, 07:53 AM #18
kenwoodallpromos: My kind of odds!
When Giacomo won, 15 horses went off at 20-1 or longer; Now M/L has 16 at 15-1 or longer- I'll bet all 16!!"
__________________

[fmolf]

Personally, I'd love this one to be the favorite next time out.
For all of you who think that he's being "knocked" too much, be sure to put money on his nose.


if he is the favorite i will be shocked.With that much foolish money available i will dutch as many horses as finacially feasable to turn a profit...he will be the best kind of underlay to play against!

[fmolf]

i also belive my horse would have won if bejarano was not scared of the rail...they all should have known that the rail was the place to be...if he takes his horse papa clem down to the rail others would have followed effectively shutting borel off......just needed to get these sour grapes off my chest :D

[BeatTheChalk]

Humans have a difficult time processing "Black Swan" events.

Sooo are all big longhot wins ...Black Swans ? Take your time.

[JustRalph]

From the Equidaily site...........this graphic gives him some credit

http://www.equidaily.com/images/2009/news9503.jpg

[Niko]

I admit the race was visually impressive....stunning actually.

I'd like to know more about the vetinarian owner and his background, stats for taking over horses etc. Then I may be able to make a more informed decision on Preakness day.

[joanied]

JustRalph...hey thanks...great headlines...I love it:jump: