Show me where Poly to Dirt is a problem for Any Horse ?

[MrHotStuff]

I have heard over and over what a problem it could be switching to Dirt.

i have look as deep as I can, but nothing pops up. Only the opposite ! Every horse in this field that has attempted Dirt has done well. Hold me back the acception. But he was going from an Allowance to a grade 2 off of a 7 week lay-off.

Horses that have made the switch :

West Side Bernie
Advice
Papa Clem
Mine That Bird
REGAL RANSOM
Join The Dance
General Quarters
IWR (out)
dESERT pARTY
Flying private

Stepping up and ran OK :

Hold me Back
Advise (Allowance to 800K) still moved Forward.

Why would POTN, CC, and MrHotStuff not move over without a Problem. The pamplemousse was clearly the best Horse out West. But his speed numbers are only equal to POTN. I think POTN if he had went to NY. He would have done the same as IWR. IWR would have won the SA Derby just like POTN (in the same time) ! The Beyer numbers are not adjusted fairly. it makes every horse that runs on poly look slow. Poly is just slower.

[andymays]

I have heard over and over what a problem it could be switching to Dirt.

i have look as deep as I can, but nothing pops up. Only the opposite ! Every horse in this field that has attempted Dirt has done well. Hold me back the acception. But he was going from an Allowance to a grade 2 off of a 7 week lay-off.

Horses that have made the switch :

West Side Bernie
Advice
Papa Clem
Mine That Bird
REGAL RANSOM
Join The Dance
General Quarters
IWR (out)
dESERT pARTY
Flying private

Stepping up and ran OK :

Hold me Back
Advise (Allowance to 800K) still moved Forward.

Why would POTN, CC, and MrHotStuff not move over without a Problem. The pamplemousse was clearly the best Horse out West. But his speed numbers are only equal to POTN. I think POTN if he had went to NY. He would have done the same as IWR. IWR would have won the SA Derby just like POTN (in the same time) ! The Beyer numbers are not adjusted fairly. it makes every horse that runs on poly look slow. Poly is just slower.


I think it's more dirt to poly being a problem than poly to dirt!

[GaryG]

The issue of turf and poly didn't start with the derby, it has been going on for several years. There are many horses that clearly prefer one or the other and the performance figures are not always interchangeable. Because some derby runners made the transition has no bearing on the others. I would give you some examples but we are in the middle of a great betting card with lots of money up for grabs.

[46zilzal]

Watch the race: it will be obvious.

[toussaud]

The issue of turf and poly didn't start with the derby, it has been going on for several years. There are many horses that clearly prefer one or the other and the performance figures are not always interchangeable. Because some derby runners made the transition has no bearing on the others. I would give you some examples but we are in the middle of a great betting card with lots of money up for grabs.
this.

[fmolf]

poly must be tiring to run on which could be why the races resemble turf races...slow early-fast late

[andymays]

poly must be tiring to run on which could be why the races resemble turf races...slow early-fast late


After watching for a couple of years now I think the horses coming from poly are much more fit!

That's why I'm all for training on it but not running on it!

[Bobzilla]

Each horse is unique in this regard. Regardless of what many like to say, "a good horse can run at the same level on any surface", it's been my observation that the vast majority of performers do have a preferred surface. Of course over the history of racing there have been some notable exceptions.

Some we've seen who began their careers on AWSs have stepped up once on dirt as the latter was always their preferred surface, as we may or may not see later this afternoon. As Andy mentioned earlier there are more cases where a horse established a level of performance on conventional dirt and was unable to maintain that edge at that level of competition once asked to do it on an AWS. It was as if they had earned a stellar reputation running in grade 1 stakes races on dirt then asked to run against the best grass horses in the world in a grade 1 grass race and win. It's a different game entirely.