More Cartagena camouflage at CT?

[takeout]

CT, 12/20/08 - What’s with the Dunlevy horses (really Cartagena horses) now switching to trainer Kevin Joy’s name? Has a positive come back on Dunlevy or is it some other reason?

I think this is the first time I’ve seen a winner for owner Robert Cole that had a low percentage trainer. Joy is currently a 3 or 4-percenter. If the horses stay in his name though, I imagine he will quickly go to 25% or more just like the “names” before him.

[JWBurnie]

I'm not sure if something is going down with Dunlevy, but I do know K. Joy was one of "the" trainers at CT a few years back; winning more than his fair share of races. If memory serves me, he was running a lot of Michael Gill hand me downs, as well a bunch in his own name. Something happened. Over the last few years he has fallen off. A winner here, and there. This was his first runner and winner for R. Cole. Speaking of, I also saw that O. Figgins is now training for R. Cole at CT.

[takeout]

I'm not sure if something is going down with Dunlevy, but I do know K. Joy was one of "the" trainers at CT a few years back; winning more than his fair share of races.I remember back when Joy was winning. He was almost the leading trainer at one meeting. Hasn’t done anything now for years. He kept getting caught for the same thing over and over but I can’t remember what it was. I think he must’ve gotten “the talking to” because all of a sudden he went from 2nd in the standings to not being able to train a rat to eat cheese.

[jotb]

CT, 12/20/08 - What’s with the Dunlevy horses (really Cartagena horses) now switching to trainer Kevin Joy’s name? Has a positive come back on Dunlevy or is it some other reason?

I think this is the first time I’ve seen a winner for owner Robert Cole that had a low percentage trainer. Joy is currently a 3 or 4-percenter. If the horses stay in his name though, I imagine he will quickly go to 25% or more just like the “names” before him.

There was no positive test this time. Dunlevy is very ill. It looks like everything that was under Dunlevy's name will now be Kevin Joy.

Joe

[jotb]

I remember back when Joy was winning. He was almost the leading trainer at one meeting. Hasn’t done anything now for years. He kept getting caught for the same thing over and over but I can’t remember what it was. I think he must’ve gotten “the talking to” because all of a sudden he went from 2nd in the standings to not being able to train a rat to eat cheese.

Yeah Kevin Joy won tons of races in 2004 (117) but was suspended several times during and after 2004. This year he's only win 4 races until the other day so, you can't count that one. Some horse trainer! He couldn't train a cat to go in the liter box.

Joe

[JWBurnie]

Some horse trainer! He couldn't train a cat to go in the liter box.

Thank you, Joe. I needed a good laugh.

[takeout]

There was no positive test this time. Dunlevy is very ill. It looks like everything that was under Dunlevy's name will now be Kevin Joy. Thanks. Sorry to hear about Dunlevy.

I always get curious when I see changes like this in the pps. The explanations are often not easy to come by. Any idea why Cole switched that horse in the 5th race Sunday from Beattie to Dilodovico? Just feels like maybe something’s up. ??

[jotb]

Thanks. Sorry to hear about Dunlevy.

I always get curious when I see changes like this in the pps. The explanations are often not easy to come by. Any idea why Cole switched that horse in the 5th race Sunday from Beattie to Dilodovico? Just feels like maybe something’s up. ??

I don't know why the change because Beattie is not suspended. Could it be Cole is trying to get better priced horses thus the reason for the change to another trainer. I know the horse paid $3.60 but if the horse was under Beattie's name the horse would have paid $2.60. Damon Dilodovico has run over 1,300 horses since 1999 and not one of them were owned by Cole. Recently, Dilodovico claimed a filly for Cole at LRL on Oct 15 for $7,500. The race was a NW3L. They ran the filly back on Nov 13 for 5,000. The condition was for F&M that have not won a race in 6 months or NW4L. There were 7 entered in the race (including the filly) and by post the field was cut down to 3 horses. The filly won by a 1/2 length and went off at 20 cents to the dollar. The place horse went off at 2-1 but the race before (same condition) she had finished 10th and was beat by 38 lengths.

The bulk of Robert Cole's horses are with Howard Wolfendale, Stephanie Beattie, and Cartagena. At one time, Scott Lake was the man but that's a thing of the past. You have to pay attention to all his horses in order to figure out his every move. Many horses are entered and scr. at various places with no intent of running. This helps make races go and it's usually for someone that he has a connection to. With as many horses and connections Cole has, it's very easy to control many different types of race conditions. I believe Cole sends most of his 4.5F horses to Cartagena because Cartagena excels at this distance. I'm not saying Beattie is not capable of winning at this distance because she has, but this year she's only ran 22 times at the distance. The Cartagena crew (daughter, Dunlevy, Ceciliano) runs most of their horses at the 4.5F distance. Just Julio Cartagena himself has 73 starts at this distance winning 31 races. He's 42% and 79% ITM. This is not counting the other 56 wins at the distance with the other trainer names. This guy Cartagena can't win a race over 7.0F. If you ever see them run a horse at CT going 8.5F or 9.0F (which you probably won't see) you can just throw the horse out. So, Cole knows exactly what trainers to use for specific horses.

Joe

[takeout]

I know the horse paid $3.60 but if the horse was under Beattie's name the horse would have paid $2.60.Good point. That may well be the reason.

Cole certainly appears to be calling the shots. He wins no matter who the trainer is and his win percentage as an owner at CT is amazing. He’s averaged over 40% for the last 3 consecutive years and I’ve seen him as high as 48. I just checked at the Equibase site and it looks like he has the national title for most wins locked up this year with 232 as of 12/22.

[lamboguy]

obviously the game has changed these days. it looks like the trainer is secondary to the owner. cole has a win % over 40% while mike gill a bigger owner these days is under 12%. another factor you can take under consideration is cole knows when he has a live horse or is laying an egg. he has many options these days as to where, when and how to place and bet his money. with a 40% win rate it is very tough to lose money at this game in slot machine tracks.
jotb is on to something here as you can tell. he has it broken down to which trainers can win at certain distances. he probably eliminates all mike gill horses because not only do they underacheive, they are also usually overbet.

and that folks is night time racing in the USA


merry christmas

[JWBurnie]

12/26 CT 4th Race No. 1 - Kevin Joy trainer - Awilda Cartagena owner.

[Mineshaft]

12/26 CT 4th Race No. 1 - Kevin Joy trainer - Awilda Cartagena owner.





ran 9th..

[The Bit]

I have a friend that trains at Delaware Park who once told me ...

"You can only bet a Robert Cole owned horse if he is under even money. Anything higher and the horse probably isn't going to run."

It has proven to be true more often than not.