No Tampa on Twinspires

[Tampa Russ]

So far, no deal in Florida. As much as I love to play Tampa, if the FL HBPA/Horsemen don't come to their senses, my money stays in my pocket. My message to them is to enjoy the purse cuts. I'm sure they are on the way.

[CincyHorseplayer]

That stinks.Here in Ohio an already low brand of racing has become worse and unbettable with purse cuts and I can't bet it from home anyway.So I looked around and thought Tampa Bay would be a good track to adopt this winter and now this.Then I have Turway park here in the Cincinnati tristate,but the track refuses to open the 4th floor,which is the best spot to watch the races if you have a pair of binoculars,and there are few tables on the 3rd floor,plus they too are not going to be available on TS so I'm told because I'm an Ohio resident.So I can go to the track,not see the races very well and if I get there late I end up doing odds lines on my lap because there are no tables,or I can go to the lightless basement and forget it all,or just stay home and not be able to bet TP.

Talk about anti-hospitality.

Any other suggestions as to any solid winter meets that are beginning soon????I'd prefer they'd be in temperate weather and not a synthetic track and be able to bet on Twinspires.

Thanks,

Displaced horseplayer!!

[point given]

Youbet has them listed as a track of choice under My Youbet. Will they be able to carry it due to the FL horsemans situation ? no calder now. I guess I will be betting the Big A and Fairgrounds if not, something i've not done in many moons.

[NoCal Boy]

So far, no deal in Florida. As much as I love to play Tampa, if the FL HBPA/Horsemen don't come to their senses, my money stays in my pocket. My message to them is to enjoy the purse cuts. I'm sure they are on the way.

A little premature to write off Tampa just yet. Meet opens in 13 days and typically these signal deals get done at or near the last minute. Fair Grounds was done a few days before the meet.

As for winter racing, Aqueduct, Fair grounds, Santa Anita, Golden Gate, Hawthorne, Delta Downs, Retama, Turfway are available, with Oaklawn also being viable if the horsemen there consent. It would be nice to have Tampa and Gulfstream, but the horsemen are cutting their own throats if they balk.

I do believe track management at both GP and Tampa desperately want deals.

[NoCal Boy]

A little premature to write off Tampa just yet. Meet opens in 13 days and typically these signal deals get done at or near the last minute. Fair Grounds was done a few days before the meet.

As for winter racing, Aqueduct, Fair grounds, Santa Anita, Golden Gate, Hawthorne, Delta Downs, Retama, Turfway are available, with Oaklawn also being viable if the horsemen there consent. It would be nice to have Tampa and Gulfstream, but the horsemen are cutting their own throats if they balk.

I do believe track management at both GP and Tampa desperately want deals.

I forgot to add other available signals this winter...Philly Park, Mountaineer, Sunland Park, Turf Paradise, Los Alamitos, Meadowlands harness, Charles Town Penn National, Woodbine

California, NYRA and Louisiana being available mitigates against the horsemen remaining steadfast in Florida.

[JustRalph]

:ThmbDown: I forgot to add other available signals this winter...Philly Park, Mountaineer, Sunland Park, Turf Paradise, Los Alamitos, Meadowlands harness, Charles Town Penn National, Woodbine

.


some of those tracks you mention are on my "too high a takeout list" sorry. never play most of them.

[Tom]

Oh boy oh boy, Aquedrab in the winter!
Off the turf and 26 scratches today.
Mmmmmmm, can't wait.

Think I'll go bowling.:bang:

Without Tampa, I think racing goes away completely for a long, long time.
My betting down so much from last year it hardly pays to buy a card anymore.
2009 will be my leanest year since the 60's.

[Steve 'StatMan']

Oh boy oh boy, Aquedrab in the winter!
Off the turf and 26 scratches today.
Mmmmmmm, can't wait.

Think I'll go bowling.:bang:

Without Tampa, I think racing goes away completely for a long, long time.
My betting down so much from last year it hardly pays to buy a card anymore.
2009 will be my leanest year since the 60's.

Well, won't have to worry about being off the turf staring on Wednesday.

I know many of the NY regulars don't care as much if at all for the Inner Dirt meet, but I'll say it again here, there are many of us where that racing is at least as good if not better than our own local product all year round, so I'm perfectly content with the Inner Dirt meet.

[CincyHorseplayer]

Youbet has them listed as a track of choice under My Youbet. Will they be able to carry it due to the FL horsemans situation ? no calder now. I guess I will be betting the Big A and Fairgrounds if not, something i've not done in many moons.

How long has Calder been unbettable???You're the second person in 2 days lamenting not being able to bet on Calder.I just can't imagine the horsemen not wanting to have something in place at the very least by the time Gulfstream Park opens.

I've always liked Fairgrounds and it's a pretty decent circuit.Sunland is possibility.Anywhere in non-winter conditions.I've come to detest wintertime racing the last few seasons because form just doesn't seem to be as predictable as in the summertime,yet this time of the year is when I have the most free time.Wintertime racing is beatable but it's far more hit or miss.Hit % stay around the same but cash rates drop off with no rhyme or reason.

No snow,no synthetic,the classier the better,and starting soon.Whatta you got??!!

Fair Grounds,Sunland???

[Si2see]

this is an email I received when asking about florida tracks 2 days ago with Twin spires customer service.

"Dear Jason,

We do plan on having Tampa Bay, but they are in the same situation as Gulfstream. Like Nancy said earlier, we are hopeful something gets resolved by the time Tampa and Gulfstream open, and if anything is decided, we will post any news on our website. Thanks for your e-mail."

[CincyHorseplayer]

this is an email I received when asking about florida tracks 2 days ago with Twin spires customer service.

"Dear Jason,

We do plan on having Tampa Bay, but they are in the same situation as Gulfstream. Like Nancy said earlier, we are hopeful something gets resolved by the time Tampa and Gulfstream open, and if anything is decided, we will post any news on our website. Thanks for your e-mail."

I got the same thing too Si2see.I'm about to ask around on their websites and see what's happening.Let you know.

[CincyHorseplayer]

I contacted Tampa Bay Downs and the Florida TOBA,and left them emails.No response yet.Judging from their mission statement they take care of their own and could care less what goes on outside their world.And they must not even want to see it,hear it,live it,or breathe it.There was absolutely no information or links or articles anywhere.And no public forum.

[rrbauer]

I contacted Tampa Bay Downs and the Florida TOBA,and left them emails.No response yet.Judging from their mission statement they take care of their own and could care less what goes on outside their world.And they must not even want to see it,hear it,live it,or breathe it.There was absolutely no information or links or articles anywhere.And no public forum.

As I posted in another thread, this is the outfit that will decide for
the Tampa Bay situation as far as horse owners are concerned.

tampabayhbpa@aol.com

Another email won't hurt.

[Nmytwenties]

To Cincyhorseplayer.

I don't completly agree on the statement that there is nowhere to sit at TP. The 4th floor doesn't open anymore because they just don't do the business they used to I guess. I do agree that they are not fan friendly though. They don't open on Monday (the only day that I have off work) and Tuedays and on Sundays they do this advanced betting BS on night racing. They also do that advance only stuff on the select Mondays and Tuesdays they do decide to open. I have and will never bet on a race that i can't even see run at the track.

I live closer to Turfway but I choose to go to River Downs for Monday simulcasts, even when TP is open. Not to say that RD customer service is much better but at least they stay open until the last race at MNR has run.

I don't agree that Calder is unbettable. Maybe there are some races that are ones to lay off, yesterday's (Mondays) 6th and 7th are an example. But I did ok there yesterday and missed a pretty good Pick three because of a wagering error on my part. I do agree the quality of racing is drastically worse than 2007. Then again I am a bettor that doesn't mind if quality is not that of Saratoga or DelMar, I actually prefer middle to lower level circuits because they have a good number of horses you can totally eliminate right off the bat and I can tell you that it is not impossible to come out ahead as long as you stay away from the carbon copy races..lol..That's my term for a whole field of horses that run the exact same times and beyers. Beulah,a track with worse racing than Calder was profitable for me yesterday,cancelling out loses I took at Philly Park and MNR which are two many would say are much more "bettable" tracks.

Finally I think that some bettors do better in the winter than others. I know I do pretty well in the winter, again you just have to be selective on what races you particpate in. That is the most underated thing in this sport, being shrewd in knowing what races to lay off of.

[RichieP]

As I posted in another thread, this is the outfit that will decide for
the Tampa Bay situation as far as horse owners are concerned.

tampabayhbpa@aol.com

Another email won't hurt.

Thanks for the link Rich. I just sent them a little note:

I am looking forward to wagering your races on Twin Spires when the meet opens. I understand that as of now all the issues regarding fees to you have not been resolved.

I hope for everyone’s sake this gets resolved for opening day.



I wagered almost xxxxxxx at Tampa Bay last year and can provide records. If for some reason the signal/horsemen issue is not resolved for opening day I will take my money elsewhere for at least 3 years regardless of when it is settled.



True leadership is needed now with the tough economic times and lower handles being reported in the racing industry nationwide. I would suggest that you consider a small piece of something better than a lot of nothing.



Thank you for your consideration and I wish everyone’s families a very Merry Christmas!

Sincerely

Richard Pizzicara

New Rochelle,NY

[miesque]

I also sent an e-mail to the Tampa Bay HBPA and basically I stated that I was very disappointed in the situation as I have enjoyed playing Tampa Bay Downs in the past, so much so that I was planning a trip down to visit the track for the first time during the upcoming meet however if a succesful conclusion was not met soon I would not only not be wagering on Tampa Bay Downs at all this meet but I would also cancel my plans to visit the track because as I stated in my letter..

I have no intention of supporting actions which are punitive to the industry overall and are eerily reminiscent of the restrictive economic fiscal and trade policies which helped usher in the Great Depression. I am very cognizant that the economics are tough on the owner side of the equation, but right now its tough throughout the industry and making every effort to shrink the pie instead of instituting expansionary policies which will grow the game is extremely short sighted and will result in nothing but an acceleration of the death of horse racing in the United States.

[INFRONT07]

Thanks for the link;
I just sent my letter in.I mean it I ;LL take my money to another track and I live very near this track so I go there and give them more then just betting money.:bang: :bang: :bang:
INFRONT07

[CincyHorseplayer]

To Cincyhorseplayer.

I don't completly agree on the statement that there is nowhere to sit at TP. The 4th floor doesn't open anymore because they just don't do the business they used to I guess. I do agree that they are not fan friendly though. They don't open on Monday (the only day that I have off work) and Tuedays and on Sundays they do this advanced betting BS on night racing. They also do that advance only stuff on the select Mondays and Tuesdays they do decide to open. I have and will never bet on a race that i can't even see run at the track.

I live closer to Turfway but I choose to go to River Downs for Monday simulcasts, even when TP is open. Not to say that RD customer service is much better but at least they stay open until the last race at MNR has run.

I don't agree that Calder is unbettable. Maybe there are some races that are ones to lay off, yesterday's (Mondays) 6th and 7th are an example. But I did ok there yesterday and missed a pretty good Pick three because of a wagering error on my part. I do agree the quality of racing is drastically worse than 2007. Then again I am a bettor that doesn't mind if quality is not that of Saratoga or DelMar, I actually prefer middle to lower level circuits because they have a good number of horses you can totally eliminate right off the bat and I can tell you that it is not impossible to come out ahead as long as you stay away from the carbon copy races..lol..That's my term for a whole field of horses that run the exact same times and beyers. Beulah,a track with worse racing than Calder was profitable for me yesterday,cancelling out loses I took at Philly Park and MNR which are two many would say are much more "bettable" tracks.

Finally I think that some bettors do better in the winter than others. I know I do pretty well in the winter, again you just have to be selective on what races you particpate in. That is the most underated thing in this sport, being shrewd in knowing what races to lay off of.

Nmytwenties,

If I'm at a live racing venue I like to have my 10 X 50's in hand,in the most view accessible place at the track.I also like to have table space to adjust oddslines and chart payoffs and just have a place to lay my stuff at.The 4th floor argument is weak on their part because they have Blinker's Off bar open up there and it would be minimal maintenance to open up the left side of the grandstand,which is what they did until 2005.Turfway isn't a very attactive track but the 4th floor view is awesome and it's a comfortable betting enviroment with 8 giant TV's in front of you to watch the simulcast races from.That should be the goal for customers="..to put them in their comfort zone...".But that is miniscule on their priority list.The 3rd floor is recessed and you don't have a great view of the track.Plus there are about 20 tables total with a view of the track in the whole place.Not very accomodating for promoting live events.Or you carry your stuff around with you like a bag lady,do oddslines and charts on your lap with nowhere but the floor to set your stuff.Whatever.I really only like to be there on the weekends anyway and I just get there early to get set up.I'd like to be able to bet from home any of the other days though.Not so at TS.

How do you like those Mondays at River Downs clubhouse???!!!That place is pure comedy.All those retirees in there beerdrunk by race 2 are a riot and every time I have to use the fanless bathrooms I'm reminded of the campfire scene in Blazing Saddles where they have the Philharmonic version of fart and poop noises!!Yuck.But at least there is always a table waiting and the staff will do anything for you.

I only mentioned Calder as unbettable from an ADW standpoint not from a handicapping one.

I have survived in the winter.I have been laid off during the winter and have made some excellant money at the track during that time since 2001.I had a run of 10 days betting Beulah and Thistledown back in 2004 where I rung up $3700.00 plus dollars.Excellant return for the small bettor I am,no big pick 3-4's,not lopsided by a single payoff,just was on my A game and ground it out.

But because of the purse slashes in Ohio and the ADW disputes I refuse to go to the track to bet simulcast on low level racing that is even more watered down than normal.The wintertime conditions drive me crazy too.During 3 days last year,a Friday,Sat,Mon,the track alternated from fst/speed + on the outside to MY(snow) and closer favoring,to Fst/speed on rail early-drying out and playing normal late.It's no accident at least IMO that I make more money during the spring-summer in temperate weather so I am looking to cater to my strength.But had all of this not occurred I might not have changed my routine at all.Now when it gets resolved I might never go back to it.But that's there loss.

[turfnsport]

Pretty sad the game has resorted to horseplayers having to write to their favorite tracks and beg them to take our money.

I too was hoping to make TB one of my tracks this winter. But I like to do some prep work, not wait until the morning of opening day to see if I can bet on it.

[shoelessjoe]

Just wondering how you all placed bets before online wagering because you might have to start doing that again.

[cj]

Just wondering how you all placed bets before online wagering because you might have to start doing that again.

There are a few other options:


Find something else to gamble on
Find another hobby
Bet with an offshore, no money goes to the pools type book

[rispa]

There are a few other options:

Find something else to gamble on
Find another hobby
Bet with an offshore, no money goes to the pools type book


Does anyone know what offshore takes Tampa?

[Nmytwenties]

Getting back with you Cincy,


Everyone has their preferences and their ideal betting enviornment and it is a shame Turfway doesn't suit your style. Have you ever been to Lebanon or Indiana Downs for simulcasts?? I have been to Indiana Downs once,never to Lebanon and I prefer RD over them all. I prefer to sit as far away from the crowd as possible. Most of the older folks, which you see every time,lol, are pretty tolerable but some of the other regulars are real trash to be honest. Can't stand hearing people frustrated with a race saying things like "break a leg" and other similar commentary and you hear that quite a bit there. The tellers are pretty surly as well but they are less so than the TP ones,which have to be the worst.

I find River a place that you can find a place off and away from the screamers and have learned to expect nothing but button pushing from the tellers, which is much more tolerable now that I don't try to be in any way less business like than they. I try to avoid more than one trip to the bathrooms for the reasons you mentioned.

I would hate to see Ohio racing scale back as I am extremely accurate with my picks at TDN, not quite as good at Beulah and RD but more of my winners there have bigger payoffs.

I read some posts a while back with you talking about making horse racing a profession, how is that going???

[cj]

Does anyone know what offshore takes Tampa?

I can't think of any off hand that don't.

[turfnsport]

There are a few other options:


Find something else to gamble on
Find another hobby
Bet with an offshore, no money goes to the pools type book


All viable, the options don't seem to dawn on horsemen.

[INFRONT07]

Just wondering how you all placed bets before online wagering because you might have to start doing that again.:bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang: :bang:

[rrbauer]

Just heard from reliable source that Tampa HBPA is a go with all ADW's including PTC.

SANITY!

[PaceAdvantage]

Just heard from reliable source that Tampa HBPA is a go with all ADW's including PTC.

SANITY!Very good news. Thanks for the update!

[Tampa Russ]

Just heard from reliable source that Tampa HBPA is a go with all ADW's including PTC.

SANITY!

Excellent! Thanks.