Why did McCain lose?

[wonatthewire1]

what do you think?

[pktruckdriver]

:4: letters bush

[Show Me the Wire]

:4: letters bush

You are more literate than Biden.

[hcap]

:4: letters bush:5: letters PALIN

[HUSKER55]

McCain made too many mistakes after Sarah energized the base. His "advisors" were inadequate and he did not get the messsage out. He kept going over his military record which is fine but give it a rest. Vietnam was a long time ago. His age even became an issue and he did not prove to the contrary. If he would have attacked Obama on his policies and showed who he (McCain) really was things might have been different.

The republican party had better straighten up over the next four years or I am afraid that Colin Powell's words will haunt us again. He warned us in 2000 and again in 2004 and again this year 2008. How many times does this general need to give a warning to be heard?

[Greyfox]

Hcap's eloquent and persistent posts changed minds across America.

[highnote]

McCain lost for the same reason Hillary lost -- they both faced an incredibly intelligent candidate who ran a great campaign.

[Boris]

:4: letters bush

WOW! First time I have agreed with you. But it's also the first time I understood you. ;)

[Boris]

:5: letters PALIN

69% of GOP Voters Say Palin Helped McCain

Its from a poll, so we know it's true.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_2012/69_of_gop_voters_say_palin_helped_mccain


Ninety-one percent (91%) of Republicans have a favorable view of Palin, including 65% who say their view is Very Favorable. Only eight percent (8%) have an unfavorable view of her, including three percent (3%) Very Unfavorable.

[PaceAdvantage]

McCain lost for the same reason Hillary lost -- they both faced an incredibly intelligent candidate who ran a great campaign.I'm kind of curious. In what way did Obama "out intelligence" Hillary or McCain?

I mean, yeah, he went to some Ivy League schools, but so did George W. Bush, and nobody is calling him incredibly intelligent.

Of course, Obama has still not released his academic records, so we don't actually have a lot of detail to go on with regards to that type of intelligence.

So, for my own curiosity, give me one or two instances that stand out in your mind that display Obama "out intelligencing" Hillary and McCain.

Is being a better public speaker a sign of greater intelligence? Does Obama write all of his speeches himself, or like many politicians, does he have a speechwriter?

I don't mean to put you on the spot, but I've heard others use this "incredible intelligence" claim about Obama, and while I'm sure the man is intelligent, I'm not sure how he has displayed "incredible intelligence" during this campaign.

[JustRalph]

It has been leaked/revealed by McCain camp, and also verified by email and exit polling that 11 percent of Repubs refused to vote for McCain..........

Among those who described themselves as "Conservative" 13 percent say they either didn't vote for McCain, or voted for another candidate.........

I would say that would be plenty to explain the ass whoop-in he took...........

The same analysis reveals that Palin was worth 4 points .........

[highnote]

I'm kind of curious. In what way did Obama "out intelligence" Hillary or McCain?

I mean, yeah, he went to some Ivy League schools, but so did George W. Bush, and nobody is calling him incredibly intelligent.

Of course, Obama has still not released his academic records, so we don't actually have a lot of detail to go on with regards to that type of intelligence.

So, for my own curiosity, give me one or two instances that stand out in your mind that display Obama "out intelligencing" Hillary and McCain.

Is being a better public speaker a sign of greater intelligence? Does Obama write all of his speeches himself, or like many politicians, does he have a speechwriter?

I don't mean to put you on the spot, but I've heard others use this "incredible intelligence" claim about Obama, and while I'm sure the man is intelligent, I'm not sure how he has displayed "incredible intelligence" during this campaign.


First of all, I think Bush is highly intelligent. I don't believe that high scores on college exams is the only measure of intelligence.

Patricia Williams teaches law at Columbia University: She said, "I submitted a piece that was published in "Harvard Law Review" back in the day. And he was the student editor for that. And, again, I've had many, many editors, professional and unprofessional. And I remember him so specifically. He wouldn't remember me, but I remember him very, very clearly because he was one of the most intelligent people I had ever met and one of the deepest listeners."

Watch Obama on the Letterman show. The one thing I noticed is how good of a listener he was. You can see him taking in what Letterman was saying and digesting it and would come back with an "amazing synthesis". That's the same quality Williams noted.

He made a remark during the debate, I can't remember it exactly, but it was a very difficult sentence to say because of the way it was phrased. He delivered it perfectly. It was similar to this remark, but I don't think this was it: "We should be just as careful getting out of Iraq as we were careless getting in."

In the middle of a hot debate it's hard for anyone to have the presence of mind to speak so eloquently.

You talk to anyone who knew him growing up and they all knew he was an exceptional child, academically.

Sorry, that was more than two examples. ;)

I'm not saying McCain or Hillary aren't bright people, but I do think they might have underestimated his ability to organize a campaign and his political prowess.

[Rookies]

Pace: Here's what he did that was both historic and displayed intelligence. He has completly reengineered how Presidential races will be run in the future.

He realized immediately that U.S. Demographics had markedly changed. That old racist conservatives were dying off and a huge, young group of potential voters could be reached and transformed by harnessing the Internet. It succeeded off the charts !

Before Hillary knew what hit her, his broader appeal to change and hope through the telegenic power of speech had reached millions of persons who understand the outside world with the new technologies of Facebook, My Space, Twitter, blogs, etc. He totally understood that paradigm and embraced it ahead of anyone else.

Mega millions of dollars and correlated ideas started rushing in like a sunami and off he went- never to be headed.Obama always seems to have the presence of mind to be a step ahead of the next turn in the road.

I mentioned this the other day and the following day, Flushed Windbag quoted someone who outlined the same concept. He was VERY concerned that Obama has this army of supporters at his beck and call to both support his legislation AND oppose those who oppose him.

Reemember, just prior to giving his Victory acceptance speech, he e-mailed this huge group to say: " Thanks and stay tuned. "

Nobody had ever thought/ done this before. It demonstrated tremendous smarts.

[Hank]

Mcain loss because of 1.Bush 2.the economy 3.his ill fated "the fundamentals of the economy are strong" remark.

[highnote]

Mcain loss because of 1.Bush 2.the economy 3.his ill fated "the fundamentals of the economy are strong" remark.

He was way off on #3, although he did revise that by saying he meant something else -- like American workers are fundamentally strong, or something to that effect.

It was a tough year to be a republican candidate.

Don't worry, the pendulum will swing back to the right again and we can start these arguments all over again. :D

[NJ Stinks]

I wanted to vote but "On Wrong side of Most Major Issues" was not one of the choices.

[Greyfox]

Pace: Here's what he did that was both historic and displayed intelligence. He has completly reengineered how Presidential races will be run in the future.

He realized immediately that U.S. Demographics had markedly changed. That old racist conservatives were dying off and a huge, young group of potential voters could be reached and transformed by harnessing the Internet. It succeeded off the charts !

Before Hillary knew what hit her, his broader appeal to change and hope through the telegenic power of speech had reached millions of persons who understand the outside world with the new technologies of Facebook, My Space, Twitter, blogs, etc. He totally understood that paradigm and embraced it ahead of anyone else.

Mega millions of dollars and correlated ideas started rushing in like a sunami and off he went- never to be headed..


Rookies, you have a pretty good head on your shoulders too.
Aside from the crash of the economy, your analysis, which I hadn't thought of, seems sound.:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:

[PaceAdvantage]

Pace: Here's what he did that was both historic and displayed intelligence. He has completly reengineered how Presidential races will be run in the future.

He realized immediately that U.S. Demographics had markedly changed. That old racist conservatives were dying off and a huge, young group of potential voters could be reached and transformed by harnessing the Internet. It succeeded off the charts !

Before Hillary knew what hit her, his broader appeal to change and hope through the telegenic power of speech had reached millions of persons who understand the outside world with the new technologies of Facebook, My Space, Twitter, blogs, etc. He totally understood that paradigm and embraced it ahead of anyone else.

Mega millions of dollars and correlated ideas started rushing in like a sunami and off he went- never to be headed.Obama always seems to have the presence of mind to be a step ahead of the next turn in the road.

I mentioned this the other day and the following day, Flushed Windbag quoted someone who outlined the same concept. He was VERY concerned that Obama has this army of supporters at his beck and call to both support his legislation AND oppose those who oppose him.

Reemember, just prior to giving his Victory acceptance speech, he e-mailed this huge group to say: " Thanks and stay tuned. "

Nobody had ever thought/ done this before. It demonstrated tremendous smarts.A very well thought out reply. I appreciate it....but I must counter....

How do we know this was Obama's doing, and not the doing of the folks running his campaign?

I find it interesting that Obama is getting all the credit here, when in 2004, the credit all went to Karl Rove. Of course, Bush himself called Rove the architect, so I suppose that answers that question.

Did some of Obama's campaign chiefs call Obama the architect behind all of the success in the primaries and the general election?

[sammy the sage]

Whether it was Obama or staff or party...they were AHEAD of the curve!

By the way...a smart man SURROUNDS himself w/even better people...you're ONLY AS GOOD as the people around you!

A total and CLEAR victory...and whilst I did not vote for either...

America NEEDS right now...the most ORGANIZED and competant person...and this campaign SHOWED CLEARLY who that was....even if you disagree w/many of his goals.

[PaceAdvantage]

America NEEDS right now...the most ORGANIZED and competant person...and this campaign SHOWED CLEARLY who that was....even if you disagree w/many of his goals.When you get right down to it though, it's the goals that we should be electing. I should say the means to those goals. Both candidate's goals (it is safe to assume) are a successful America, molded in their ideological image of course.

In the case of President of the United States, the means are just as important as the ends.

[Burls]

Why did McCain lose?
I think the answer is obvious.
Dick Cheney's ringing endorsement came way too late. :lol: :lol:

[dav4463]

He lost because Oprah and the media anointed him as the savior of the country. Many people would kill their first-born if Oprah told them to. She has more influence on people than a cult leader.

[LottaKash]

He lost because Oprah and the media anointed him as the savior of the country. Many people would kill their first-born if Oprah told them to. She has more influence on people than a cult leader.

She is a CULT Leader, she has developed her own fashionable "New AGE" type church.....she believes that Nature and the trees are God.....hahahaha....

You can check out her Babble, on XM-Sattelite radio on (ch-807 & on DirectTV)....She is typical of the modern day falling away from the Truth of God, and she has adopted the Falseness of Man's word..........And she wants to take you along with her, on the one-way trip to nowhere, to meet up with the Great Deceiver....:mad:

best,

[hcap]

She is a CULT Leader, she has developed her own fashionable "New AGE" type church.....she believes that Nature and the trees are God.....hahahaha....

You can check out her Babble, on XM-Sattelite radio on (ch-807 & on DirectTV)....She is typical of the modern day falling away from the Truth of God, and she has adopted the Falseness of Man's word..........And she wants to take you along with her, on the one-way trip to nowhere, to meet up with the Great Deceiver....:mad:

best,What a crock! You and Husker, Investorator and Boxcar are perfect examples of why separation of church and state is needed.
Give us a break. The mythical anti-Christ is best represented by posting this kind of idiocy.

[raybo]

McCain showed very little concerning the economy while Mr. Obama expounded on it.

McCain showed too much support for Bush's foreign policies and the war.

Palin was perceived as too inexperienced vs. Biden, especially considering McCain's age and health issues.

Obama spoke to the lower income masses about the that masses' problems, McCain did not.

McCain represented the powerful and wealthy in this country, Mr. Obama did not.

McCain is a very poor public speaker (for this level), Mr. Obama is a very polished, intelligent, well prepared public speaker.

McCain could not handle his own campaign funds which led many Americans to wonder if he could lead the country out of recession and he could not garner enough financial support from his constituents, Mr. Obama managed his campaign funds extremely well and had a grass roots following that joined in the campaign with him.

Mr. Obama offered hope to the younger voters, McCain did not.

Mr.Obama offered hope for the country, McCain did not.

Want me to go on?

[LottaKash]

What a crock! You and Husker, Investorator and Boxcar are perfect examples of why separation of church and state is needed.
Give us a break. The mythical anti-Christ is best represented by posting this kind of idiocy.

You are OK, lock us up.........:jump:

[Tom]

You are more literate than Biden.

Most ar.

:rolleyes:

[lamboguy]

pollitions will say anything it takes to get elected. when they are in office they move to a different beat.

all that happened in this election is one candiate was a better conveyer or a better speaker than the other. content from either candiate was missing.

[delayjf]

He lost for two reasons,

The economy tanked absolutely the wrong time for McCain, Americans were simply pissed and took it out on Repbulicans, if you look at the polls McCain was leading in a lot of states he eventually lost i.e. Florida. Same thing happend in 92 with Clinton.

The other reason, Obama out spent him 3 to one. I'm not sure if this is true or not, but I believe I read somewhere that the candidate who has spent the most money, has never lost a presidential election.

I know a lot of you liberals want to believe that this is the start of a socialist movement in this country, but you're wrong. If this election was heald a year ago, McCain would have won.

[HUSKER55]

Hcap, I firmly believe you could be a poster child for planned parenthood.

Some more fiber in your diet might help

[eastie]

the guy who won is my age, McCain is my mom's age. She is a nice lady, but she can't be in charge of the country if she can't remember to take her meds or not go over her cellphine minutes. The job ages you brutally anyway. He's already given enough to this country.

[highnote]

I know a lot of you liberals want to believe that this is the start of a socialist movement in this country, but you're wrong. If this election was heald a year ago, McCain would have won.


One reason this country is so polarized is because too many people want to split the country into liberals and conservatives.

Reality is, there are many different types of libs and cons.

There are Rove conservatives and there are Goldwater conservatives. Just like there are Reagan democrats and there are Obama democrats. Some Obama democrats are extremely liberal and others voted down gay marriage.

The notion that one size fits all is a gross oversimplification and only leads to divisiveness and bitter fighting.

I'm liberal on social issues, but am financially conservative. I'm a big believer in capitalism. I believe that it is my duty to run my business as successfully as possible and then use a portion of my income to pay taxes to help build a better society -- infrastructure, defense, social programs, etc.

The more successful my business is, the more I keep for myself and the more I help society.

[Suppositionist]

From my experience I would have to say that it was swing voters voting on their whimsy that cost McCain the election. I can’t tell you how many folks I discussed the election with and most conceded my points (which favored McCain) regarding the issues but still said they were voting for Obama. When I asked them why they would do that after conceding my points, most said either, I just want a change, or, a few even said they just wanted to be with the winner. I really didn’t think much about the being on the winner angle till after the election when so many were so proud that their candidate won, that they picked the winner. When I asked them what they thought that meant for the country, only a few had anything substantial to say. Most just said how historic it was or that now things would change for the better but couldn’t say how. I think the fact that folks could vote for a change of party for the White House yet not vote the democratic Congress out, supports the whimsy theory also. It was probably something like a likability factor that influenced these folks. I think if you asked the swing voters who they found more likable regardless of the issues, Obama would have won that race and that, more than anything, swung the election.

What galls me though, is that who ever won this election was pretty much in God’s country. Iraq is winding down and they (who ever won) could take credit for getting us out, and the economy can’t do anything but get better from normal business cycles, so unless they somehow screw it up worse, they’ll be able to take responsibility for the recovery. That’s basically what happened to Clinton with the economy and now its happened to Obama, although granted that the recovery is not guaranteed, still, he’s got three years or so for the recovery to happen, so if I had to guess, Obama’s probably in for eight years because in four years folks will give him the credit for the recovery.

S

[hcap]

Center right is now center left. Maybe you Righties should go out and buy Das Kapitol? :lol: :lol: :bang:

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5iMUMOOvapK1RKXXvcp5SVyFO7xXg

WASHINGTON (AFP) — US voters want the Republican Party, which took a beating in this week's general elections, to embrace progressiveness and work with Democratic president-elect Barack Obama to get America back on track, a poll showed Friday.

More than three-quarters of 2,000 people surveyed on Tuesday, the day of the historic election which saw Obama become the first African-American elected to the White House, and on Wednesday, said the US has gone "pretty seriously off on the wrong track" and needed change.

Only slightly fewer -- 71 percent -- said Republicans "should give Obama the benefit of the doubt and help him achieve his plans," against 24 percent who said it should oppose the progressive changes proposed by Obama, said the poll by the Campaign for America's Future (CAF) and Democracy Corps.

The dire state of the US economy was the "overwhelming priority of voters," it added.

Poll respondents said they voted for Obama because they believed his plans for fixing the economy, ending the Iraq war and making healthcare more accessible were more likely to work than those of his Republican rival John McCain.

"By nearly three to one, voters think the Republicans should support Obama's policies," Robert Borosage, co-director of CAF told reporters.

[fast4522]

For Starters I was wrong, I admit I wanted to wish someone into office.

The facts are that Liberals will climb into bed with anyone (vote for) where conservatives will abstain, I agree some conservatives would not, and did not vote for Senator McCain. Going forward I see little the next President can do to refuse any request from the extreme left of his party in the Congress, and feel the man is a anti Semite. Time will tell with this next President and I have been incorrect more than I like

[Boris]

Poll respondents said they voted for Obama because they believed his plans for fixing the economy, ending the Iraq war and making healthcare more accessible were more likely to work than those of his Republican rival John McCain.


I'm tossing the bs flag on this one. No freaking way poll respondents could tell you anything other than "hope and change" about why they voted for BO. Just another left-wing site hoping to make themselves relevent.

[Hank]

From my experience I would have to say that it was swing voters voting on their whimsy that cost McCain the election. I can’t tell you how many folks I discussed the election with and most conceded my points (which favored McCain) regarding the issues but still said they were voting for Obama. When I asked them why they would do that after conceding my points, most said either, I just want a change, or, a few even said they just wanted to be with the winner. I really didn’t think much about the being on the winner angle till after the election when so many were so proud that their candidate won, that they picked the winner. When I asked them what they thought that meant for the country, only a few had anything substantial to say. Most just said how historic it was or that now things would change for the better but couldn’t say how. I think the fact that folks could vote for a change of party for the White House yet not vote the democratic Congress out, supports the whimsy theory also. It was probably something like a likability factor that influenced these folks. I think if you asked the swing voters who they found more likable regardless of the issues, Obama would have won that race and that, more than anything, swung the election.

What galls me though, is that who ever won this election was pretty much in God’s country . Iraq is winding down and they (who ever won) could take credit for getting us out, and the economy can’t do anything but get better from normal business cycles, so unless they somehow screw it up worse, they’ll be able to take responsibility for the recovery. That’s basically what happened to Clinton with the economy and now its happened to Obama, although granted that the recovery is not guaranteed, still, he’s got three years or so for the recovery to happen, so if I had to guess, Obama’s probably in for eight years because in four years folks will give him the credit for the recovery.

S



Wow you're a real glass half full type of guy,If you received a big gift wraped bag of manure(which is what Obama got) christmas morning you would think of how good your garden might do.

[Cangamble]

Why he lost?
The economy, Bush, and the prolonged war.
Why he got his ass kicked?
PALIN

[Cangamble]

The RR was humiliated in the election. It isn't quite marginalized but it will be soon enough.
Same thing happened in Canada.

Separation of church and state rocks.

If the Republicans want to have any chance in the future to win a major election, they have to respect the separation, regardless of what they think the Constitution really states.

[PaceAdvantage]

Are conservatives and Republicans dead, just like Democrats and liberals were dead after Reagan's landslide?

No, and no.

End of story.

[boxcar]

Are conservatives and Republicans dead, just like Democrats and liberals were dead after Reagan's landslide?

No, and no.

End of story.

Now, now, now...you don't want to bring back bad memories, do you? :lol:

Boxcar

[ponyplayer]

Why McCain lost? He was the wrong guy for the nomination.

The other two conservatives split the vote and he ended up with the nomination. It was like way back when the Party selected Dole, he was to frickin old, but he had been a good soldier for the party and it was like he deserved the nomination even though he wasn't the best man for the job....

Yeah the party thinks they know what is best for us, but they are not always right. :p

[highnote]

Going forward I see little the next President can do to refuse any request from the extreme left of his party in the Congress, and feel the man is a anti Semite.

Your so called "anti Semite" President-elect chose a Jew as his Chief of Staff.

[Hank]

For Starters I was wrong, I admit I wanted to wish someone into office.

The facts are that Liberals will climb into bed with anyone (vote for) where conservatives will abstain, I agree some conservatives would not, and did not vote for Senator McCain. Going forward I see little the next President can do to refuse any request from the extreme left of his party in the Congress, and feel the man is a anti Semite. Time will tell with this next President and I have been incorrect more than I like

Considering the fact that his chief campaign strategist(Axelrod) and and his white house chief of staff(Emanuel) are Jewish , you fit RIGHT in around here.Keep up the good work.:rolleyes:

[PaceAdvantage]

Considering the fact that his chief campaign strategist(Axelrod) and and his white house chief of staff(Emanuel) are Jewish , you fit RIGHT in around here.Keep up the good work.:rolleyes:Oh please. Off-topic has totally turned into Democratic Underground Part 2...who are you kidding....RIGHT....:lol:

[HUSKER55]

Dems were against Bush because of his bail out policies but did you notice that the Dems are now doing the same thing?

Change you can trust.

right. BS as usual.

[fast4522]

I would suggest, it is the company that you keep, not the face your putting on today. I do not care if I "fit in" with people here as if they are less intelligent because of opinions that do not agree with this one or that one. There is so much hate out there, but to hate people because they do not agree with you is even more un american.

[HUSKER55]

fast4522, nobody here hates anybody and we are not unamerican. Each of us is entitled to our own opion and that means you are entitled to yours, even when you are wrong.

hcap is still kicking around here somewhere. If that isn't proof positive of what I said then I don't know what is.

[delayjf]

to embrace progressiveness and work with Democratic president-elect Barack Obama to get America back on track, a poll showed Friday.
Disagree,
Obama did not run on a progressive platform, he ran on a moderate platform. The American people were angry over the economy and the bail out.

[Hank]

I would suggest, it is the company that you keep, not the face your putting on today. I do not care if I "fit in" with people here as if they are less intelligent because of opinions that do not agree with this one or that one. There is so much hate out there, but to hate people because they do not agree with you is even more un american.

Not so fast my friend,BS was called on your opinion because the presented facts prove that your opinion about Obama with respect to antisemitism is flat wrong.Not because it differs from mine.Try another spin, cause that one is weak.

[fast4522]

Weak maybe, I do not have anything to prove. And do suggest it is the company you have kept for years that many will. I share your opinion that you will not judge someone by the company they have kept. We all have one and while we share them we will not always agree.

[hcap]

Mark Salter, McCain biographer:

"No doubt, we made our share of mistakes. In hindsight, the decision to briefly suspend our campaign to help find support for legislation to address the collapse of the global credit system is probably one of them."

.................................................. .................................................. ...

further analysis

"But what is easy to miss in these key moments is that most of them weren't simply what McCain did but how Obama reacted -- and the critical synergy between the two.

The campaign suspension was the key example.

It wasn't just that McCain suspended his campaign (and tried to postpone the debate). That wasn't the point at all. He unilaterally suspended his campaign and dared Obama not to suspend his. That was the key. Either Obama had to follow McCain's lead and suspend his campaign or reveal himself as the self-serving, all-about-himself, unpatriotic freak McCain's campaign had spent so many millions of dollars to portray him as. It was a classic play at the Republicans' 'bitch-slap' theory of electoral politics, with all the gendered weight and macho-hierarchy-setting the unlovely phrase implies.

But Obama didn't budge. I think there were a lot of Democrats who were really worried that McCain had put Obama in some kind of box or that Obama would see it as such and react accordingly. But he didn't.

And it went from McCain bigfooting Obama (with all that would have entailed), to Obama turning the stunt around on McCain. It undermined one of McCain's key selling points against Obama -- that he was tougher, more seasoned under pressure -- and further cemented the image of a man who was erratic and showed questionable judgments under pressure."

--Josh Marshall

[Burls]

Dems were against Bush because of his bail out policies but did you notice that the Dems are now doing the same thing?

Change you can trust.

right. BS as usual.Not so.
The Dems were, and should have been, against Bush's initial 'no strings attached' bail out policies.
Bush's bail out plan would have simply REWARDED the rich and incompetent.
What is needed are RESPONSIBLE economic stimulus packages that are paid back, result in the creation of marketable goods and services and don't reward incompetence.
This is what Obama is aiming for.

[PaceAdvantage]

And it went from McCain bigfooting Obama (with all that would have entailed), to Obama turning the stunt around on McCain. It undermined one of McCain's key selling points against Obama -- that he was tougher, more seasoned under pressure -- and further cemented the image of a man who was erratic and showed questionable judgments under pressure."No, what happened was that once again, the media shaped this event in their image. End of story.

Obama didn't have to do a thing. He just waited for HIS positive outcome of events, which was guaranteed with the fourth estate in his back pocket.

It's amazing how you and everyone else completely dismisses the role the media had in the election of 2008.

The next thing you're going to do is tell me AGAIN how it was all Palin's fault...:lol:

[raybo]

No, what happened was that once again, the media shaped this event in their image. End of story.

Obama didn't have to do a thing. He just waited for HIS positive outcome of events, which was guaranteed with the fourth estate in his back pocket.

It's amazing how you and everyone else completely dismisses the role the media had in the election of 2008.

The next thing you're going to do is tell me AGAIN how it was all Palin's fault...:lol:

The media always has a role in any election, especially a presidential one. The fact that many people believe the media is what disturbs me. Media sells information, true or not, it's always been that way and I suspect always will. If you don't have the ability to avoid the "smokescreen" then you get what you deserve.

Palin was not at fault, McCain was at fault when he made her his running mate. His attempt to grab Hilary's follower's votes failed miserably. Personally, when he named her and I started checking her out I was shocked.

As I've said before, I'm not a Democrat or a Republican, I vote for the person and their platform. All we have is what we hear them say and what we can ascertain on our own, through independent investigation and independent thinking. Relying on the media to do your thinking and investigating for you is plain lazy and stupid.

[hcap]

No, what happened was that once again, the media shaped this event in their image. End of story.

Obama didn't have to do a thing. He just waited for HIS positive outcome of events, which was guaranteed with the fourth estate in his back pocket.

It's amazing how you and everyone else completely dismisses the role the media had in the election of 2008.

The next thing you're going to do is tell me AGAIN how it was all Palin's fault...:lol:McCain played a dumb game of chicken. Instead of playing along, Obama simply opted out of McCains' framing of the issue, and won by shifting the emphasis to being deliberative and having a steady hand.
Much more presidential.


One more time...

Mark Salter, McCain biographer:

"No doubt, we made our share of mistakes. In hindsight, the decision to briefly suspend our campaign to help find support for legislation to address the collapse of the global credit system is probably one of them."

[PaceAdvantage]

Personally, when he named her and I started checking her out I was shocked.You know, you guys ALMOST had me going. I was almost ready to believe Palin was all her opposition made her out to be. Then I watched the hour-long Greta interview which aired last night on the dreaded Fox network (allow me to brace myself for hcap's obligatory post detailing the few seconds during the interview when Palin mentions her faith).

Someone accused me of posting "bile" about Obama, but the real bile was the non-stop character assassination of Palin from every corner of the media.

And yet, people kept showing up to hear her speak at rallies...amazing when you think about that fact for a minute.

So you keep telling me how you "checked her out" with your special Batman political vetting machine. The rest of us, who had actually HEARD of Palin before this summer...we bow down to your investigative techniques and sit in wonderment wondering what exactly it was that SHOCKED you after you started checking her out.

[how cliche]

Remember I voted Libertarian so don't hate the player...I'm an outsider looking in. I will respond as such. When the economy is in the toilet the incumbent party is usually voted out. The end.

If I had to choose one item from the poll however it would be "not convincing enough." That goes for both majors though.

I can only speak for myself. I dislike campaigns that do little more than put down their opponents. Barry and Johnny spent much of their efforts calling each other 'radical' or 'more of the same'. I prefer to hear new information about policies they would put in place. To weigh those policies against each other in order to make a decision.

When the candidates go through their 'This is what's wrong with my opponent' routine, I turn off. I much prefer a 'This is what I propose' platform, especially in these times. There are a lot of problems. Problems can be solved. We do it all the time in our own lives, but it's rarely figured out by negative thought.

(gets off his soapbox)

[raybo]

Remember I voted Libertarian so don't hate the player...I'm an outsider looking in. I will respond as such. When the economy is in the toilet the incumbent party is usually voted out. The end.

If I had to choose one item from the poll however it would be "not convincing enough." That goes for both majors though.

I can only speak for myself. I dislike campaigns that do little more than put down their opponents. Barry and Johnny spent much of their efforts calling each other 'radical' or 'more of the same'. I prefer to hear new information about policies they would put in place. To weigh those policies against each other in order to make a decision.

When the candidates go through their 'This is what's wrong with my opponent' routine, I turn off. I much prefer a 'This is what I propose' platform, especially in these times. There are a lot of problems. Problems can be solved. We do it all the time in our own lives, but it's rarely figured out by negative thought.

(gets off his soapbox)

Here here!!

[ddog]

You know, you guys ALMOST had me going. I was almost ready to believe Palin was all her opposition made her out to be. Then I watched the hour-long Greta interview which aired last night on the dreaded Fox network (allow me to brace myself for hcap's obligatory post detailing the few seconds during the interview when Palin mentions her faith).

Someone accused me of posting "bile" about Obama, but the real bile was the non-stop character assassination of Palin from every corner of the media.

And yet, people kept showing up to hear her speak at rallies...amazing when you think about that fact for a minute.

So you keep telling me how you "checked her out" with your special Batman political vetting machine. The rest of us, who had actually HEARD of Palin before this summer...we bow down to your investigative techniques and sit in wonderment wondering what exactly it was that SHOCKED you after you started checking her out.


you can get a thousand sheeples to show at a tractor pull.
don't mean they can discern day from night.

pugs are becoming the party of know nothings...can't blame them for it i guess, all that bad public ed those real americans had forced on them, well what can you expect but dolts?

tragic.used to be the party of ideas and principle now.... not so much.

trash it and start over.

[PaceAdvantage]

you can get a thousand sheeples to show at a tractor pull.
don't mean they can discern day from night.Would you agree that the masses who showed up for the Obama rallies are also sheeple?

[Tom]

What do we call all those in Harlem who Howard Stern exposed as racist idiots by reversing the platforms of Obama and McCain and everyone of them went for Obama on McCain's stuff?

Obama counted on ignorance and it paid off.
He made people believe he was running on conservative values and they bought it.

[ddog]

Would you agree that the masses who showed up for the Obama rallies are also sheeple?

well from just my "elitist" point of view, yes, I am afraid so, but at least the tractor wasn't made in 1930.

that don't make it better , but you know how kids luv a new toy.

[WinterTriangle]

One reason this country is so polarized is because too many people want to split the country into liberals and conservatives.

Reality is, there are many different types of libs and cons.

There are Rove conservatives and there are Goldwater conservatives. Just like there are Reagan democrats and there are Obama democrats. Some Obama democrats are extremely liberal and others voted down gay marriage.

The notion that one size fits all is a gross oversimplification and only leads to divisiveness and bitter fighting.

:ThmbUp:
You should bump this post up up every week or so. :)

I live in a rural area with nothing but a post office and a general store. My *red* neighbors pet sit for me when I go away; my *blue* neighbors bring me chicken soup when I've got the flu.

I'm not going to *choose* between them. :) All good people. We help each other.

I think that's called old-fashioned conservative values. Not all of us live in a divided nation.

[Burls]

Why did McCain lose?

Isn't that like asking 'Why did Sonny Liston lose?'
Because he had no idea who he was dealing with.
Because he was competing against a superior opponent.

[Tom]

Because Obama was able to lie his way into appearing conservative and convinced the ignorant that he was running against Bush.

[fast4522]

The exact reason is he was very insistent on doing it his way, meaning that he did not wish to have any Lee Atwater or Karl Rove style tactics, Atwater being Rove's mentor. Early on in the campaign, if Rove was in charge its doubtful the result would have been the same or that the choice for VP might not have been the same.

[DanG]

I would hope American gamblers didn’t forget this largely Republican sponsored “save adults from themselves” :rolleyes: gem from 2006. :bang:

H.R. 4411 [109th]: Internet Gambling Prohibition and Enforcement Act

BTW: This garbage got picked up again and is in the news as we speak: http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idUSN1229410220081112

• Sponsor: Rep. James Leach [R-IA]

• Cosponsors [as of 2008-11-08]

• Rep. Mark Kennedy [R-MN]
• Del. Madeleine Bordallo [D-GU]
• Rep. James Walsh [R-NY]
• Rep. Mark Kirk [R-IL]
• Rep. Roy Blunt [R-MO]
• Rep. Frederick Upton [R-MI]
• Rep. Wayne Gilchrest [R-MD]
• Rep. Mark Souder [R-IN]
• Rep. Michael Rogers [R-MI]
• Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz [D-FL]
• Rep. James Ramstad [R-MN]
• Rep. Thaddeus McCotter [R-MI]
• Rep. Christopher Shays [R-CT]
• Rep. Addison Wilson [R-SC]
• Rep. Thomas Osborne [R-NE]
• Rep. Spencer Bachus [R-AL]
• Rep. Jeffrey Fortenberry [R-NE]
• Rep. Charles Dent [R-PA]
• Rep. Roger Wicker [R-MS]
• Rep. Sherwood Boehlert [R-NY]
• Rep. Charles Bass [R-NH]
• Rep. Lee Terry [R-NE]
• Rep. Joseph Pitts [R-PA]
• Rep. John Shadegg [R-AZ]
• Rep. Thomas Latham [R-IA]
• Rep. Todd Akin [R-MO]
• Rep. Bob Inglis [R-SC]
• Rep. Thomas Petri [R-WI]
• Rep. Vernon Ehlers [R-MI]
• Rep. James Barrett [R-SC]
• Rep. Mike Pence [R-IN]
• Rep. Paul Gillmor [R-OH]
• Rep. Michael McCaul [R-TX]
• Rep. Trent Franks [R-AZ]
• Rep. Darlene Hooley [D-OR]

[ddog]

they want people to gamble in state ??

If you allow wide-open Internett then the local tax dollars they get tend to dry up.

They wish to keep/create a "captive" audience for their lottery,casino,racino,keno,bingo you name it.

scum and hypocrites the lot of them.

The biggest "gamblers" in the USA are most of these clowns who are "gambling" your future wealth away via obscene spending and taxing schemes.

Blunt of Mo , anything he thinks is a good idea, RUN FROM IT.
Terry of NE ditto.

Everyone of them should be thrown out of Congress.

[JustRalph]

The latest analysis shows McCain did 11 points worse among white men than Bush did in 04.

He did 7 points better among white women.........

I would say those who declared they weren't going to vote for McCain right after he won the primaries kept their promise........at least most of them did.

[eastie]

Because Obama was able to lie his way into appearing conservative and convinced the ignorant that he was running against Bush.

so you thought he was running against Bush ?;)

i wonder if McCain knows how to check his email.

[ddog]

The latest analysis shows McCain did 11 points worse among white men than Bush did in 04.

He did 7 points better among white women.........

I would say those who declared they weren't going to vote for McCain right after he won the primaries kept their promise........at least most of them did.

if that's national it doesn't mean squat.
break down the states, no???
Why not, the pattern seems clear among certain sections per whitey votes.