Drug test

[karlskorner]

HORSE TRAINED BY BILL SPAWR TESTS POSTIVE

http://espn.go.com/horse/news

The Califorina Horse Racing Board has issued a complaint against trainer Bill Spawr after one of his horses test positive for albuterol, etc.

Bob Buffert, Nick Zito, Bill Spawr, who is next ?

Karl

[HorseLady]

Albuterol? How would that affect their racing? By making them able to breathe?

I understand they are extremely out of control with this zero tolerance policy. Like Bafferts appealed suspension with just nanograms, just Toscano, et all.

Here's the silly question of the day - What does Albuterol do to the horse??

Myself, my husband and two kids take albuterol for asthma attacks, so I'm a little confused.

[andicap]

Not an expert, but just asking: Do any of these drugs mask the prescence of other, performance enhancing substances?

[Tom]

Originally posted by andicap
Not an expert, but just asking: Do any of these drugs mask the prescence of other, performance enhancing substances?



Good point. there might more to this than we are hearing about. Maybe while eveyone is looking for trace amounts of sweet rolls, other horses are running on
"fastamixodol"
Tom

[Dave Schwartz]

Horselady,

I would assume that "helping them to breathe" would be a performance increaser by itself. Wouldn't it?

Then again, Lasix improves their ability to run... and it is permitted. Of course, now we have a breed that must have lasix to run.


Regards,
Dave Schwartz

[HorseLady]

Obviously if the horse can breathe, it can run better :) What I meant was that if the horse is breathing fine, giving it albuterol (in the way my family is used to inhaling it) does not make you breathe better.

I also am not understanding why this drug would be a problem??? Obviously this is either a shot or oral med for the horses or else it wouldn't be showing up in urine/blood.

I'm still learning more and more. Thanks for the help!

[karlskorner]

Horse Lady

Albuterol is a bronchodilator and is availlable by perscription.

Albuterol is " NOT FDA " approved for use in veterinary medicine. The medication works by relaxing the bronchial smooth muscle and opening airways making it easier for the horse to breath. It is given orally.

[andicap]

What I don't understand Karl is why these medicines are outlawed for horses but not for humans (other than than the Olympics, which is a whole 'nother story).
If a medicine helps a horse breathe better why not let him use it.Football players take steriods for chrissakes.

[karlskorner]

Originally posted by andicap
What I don't understand Karl is why these medicines are outlawed for horses but not for humans (other than than the Olympics, which is a whole 'nother story).
If a medicine helps a horse breathe better why not let him use it.Football players take steriods for chrissakes.


Andicap;

Before becoming to critical let me offer a solution. The main objective should be to see that drugged horses do not race. This can be accomplished by simply drawing a blood test on "every" animal before they go to post. If they show a positive test simply scratch them from the race with no penalty. Such a procedure would be far more effective in detecting horses that have been drugged than the hit and miss procedure of testing just the winners as is present practice, with only a urine test.

The "test and scratch" method would permit trainers and veterinarians to use any drug of choice to best treat the animal. If he came to post still carrying a residue that might effect the horse or outcome of the race, he would be withdrawn before running.

Another possible solution is requiring veteranarians to report all drugs used and the date given. This would permit them to use any drug and still provide safeguards for the public. There needs to be effective controls, but these need to be tempered with good judgement and consideration for the welfare of the horse.

Karl

[hurrikane]

Good idea Karl...problem is we may see a lot of 2 horse races at first!!

I think the zero tolerance is fine. First we complain the trainers are cheating, they crack down, now we're going to complain they are too tough. Can't have it both ways.

I for one think they are just cracking down, finally, on a problem that is rampant in the industry.

That is a good thing!

[karlskorner]

Originally posted by hurrikane
Good idea Karl...problem is we may see a lot of 2 horse races at first!!

I think the zero tolerance is fine. First we complain the trainers are cheating, they crack down, now we're going to complain they are too tough. Can't have it both ways.

I for one think they are just cracking down, finally, on a problem that is rampant in the industry.

That is a good thing!

Hurrikane;

If Traners/Vets knew that the horse would be tested before the race, the would get in line very quickly.

I know several trainers who wheel (wps) their horse if they thinks it's got a shot in a trifecta. In fact they are very happy that their horse came in 2nd/3rd as there is no test, meanwhile they put $168.00 into the race and collected $1800.00 and walk back to the barn very content.

Karl

[John]

How can a horse have blood drawn before his race. At 9:00a.m. and the horse does not run untill 3 or 4:o'clock in the after noon . Also I don't think an hour before the race is long enough where the horses blood has to checked out at some Lab....

[karlskorner]

Originally posted by rocajack
How can a horse have blood drawn before his race. At 9:00a.m. and the horse does not run untill 3 or 4:o'clock in the after noon . Also I don't think an hour before the race is long enough where the horses blood has to checked out at some Lab....

Rocajack;

It can be done. The horse is brought to the "receiving barn" an hour or so before the race which is usual, at that time the blood test could be taken. The Lab of course would be in the receiving barn, an immediate expense to the track but in the long run would pay for itself, considering the cost of sending a split urine sample to some "low bid" labs elsewhere in the country and not the getting the results until 8 months later than defending the suspension through the courts etc.

Karl

[Tom]

Originally posted by karlskorner


Rocajack;

It can be done. The horse is brought to the "receiving barn" an hour or so before the race which is usual, at that time the blood test could be taken. The Lab of course would be in the receiving barn, an immediate expense to the track but in the long run would pay for itself, considering the cost of sending a split urine sample to some "low bid" labs elsewhere in the country and not the getting the results until 8 months later than defending the suspension through the courts etc.

Karl


I wonder howmany tracks are capable of handling something like this? Most tracks I have visited have a tough time cooking a hamburger all the way through.
Remember, these are the guys that can't figure out how to synchromize post times and can't get the lates scratches announced much before 11:30 every morning. It would be hard to get a lab accredidation and find qualified people to run them. I like the idea, but I think it is too technical for racing to handle.
Tom

[John]

Tom,

I think your right. Management has to play a little ball with the horseman and they don't want it to be to tough on them...

[hbo2t]

horselady, albuterol could help horses who didn't have trouble breathing by acting as a stimulant. Much the same way that humans who take albuterol may get shakey with increased heart rates afterwards. Plus, how do we know if a horse has a breathing problem? Only if it is obvious. There are probably a lot of horses with subclinical disease (meaning they're not obvious wheezers or in obvious respiratory distress, but have a low lying bronchoconstriction). You can't really get horses to breathe into a peak flow meter readily. Just because a horse doesn't "need" albuterol, doesn't mean it can't help them. I'm sure there are a lot of olympic athletes without sinus congestion problems who could improve their performance ever so slightly with sudafed.

[HorseLady]

Thanks for the wakeup call. I really should have known all that, luckily we've been wheezy free for awhile here in our house!

I would love to get a picture of a horse trying to puff into a peak flow meter :)

I guess I could see your point now. This whole zero tolerance testing for such minimal amounts of drugs just gets annoying, that's all.

[hbo2t]

exactly horselady. The levels they are finding in these horses wouldn't even have an effect on a fly.

Another note i should add to my last post is that medications do not necessarily have the same effect in horses and humans. Case in point is morphine. Puts me to sleep, but stimulates horses. weird.

[hurrikane]

hbo2t - in what dosage are you taking the morphine. :D

[Figman]

I've got a couple of observations about equine drug tests and their results.

It is not the amount of medication found that is important. The important and key factor is if a lab can prove non-compliance with the medication rule of the state concerning the "out time".

An example...a medication is prohibited by the state rules to be used any closer than seven days to the horse's raceday. Proof is offered that the medication was given hours or even a day or two before the race. Using the Baffert or Zito defense of 1/100th of a grain of salt doesn't mean diddily! If the time of administration of the drug broke the "out time" rule in effect in the state, that is really the offense and the trainer is responsible and punishable.

If I as a human take medication in the early morning, the concentration of that medication in my blood or urine is not as potent later on in the day. And on top of that, I am not taking any furosemide (Salix or Lasix) to flush out my system.

Suppose a horse is given a drug two days before its race. Do you think the drug concentration in that horse is as concentrated later on raceday and after the horse races when the samples are actually collected? It sure seems to me that metabolism of the drug would be constantly occuring over the two day timeframe.