Reminder...National Turf's Workout Report for 11 Races DMR Sunday...124 Entrants!

[Turfday]

Just a reminder if you plan on playing Del Mar's huge, Sunday Pacific Classic card of 11 races with 124 entrants (some are AE's), our National Turf workout report will be available....... after 7 p.m. (Pacific) tonight and thereafter.

I'm going to guess that there will be about 25 pages of workout comments from our clockers Andy Harrington and John Wilson (who is at Hollywood Park) using the "last 90 day" search that I use. (There are three search options available to you.)

The cost is $9.95 and registration takes just minutes at www.nationalturf.com. Click Workout Registration on left hand column.

[Turfday]

nm

[ElKabong]

Props to Andy & John, they had a great report today.

majormotionpicture had the 2nd best report of any fts I've seen all summer....won

tommy's luck, young runner off the claim for mullins, good report (solidfied my bet choice)....won

global hunter "Adored the turf here with Valdivia up, full of run in 37.1, 100.0 (2.4 last 1/4). Is on edge for a big effort.---------------Grade: B+"......ran 3rd at 30-1, tri pd $255 on a $1 (i bet w/s)

Of the 3 reports that I've used for dmr, NT has been the best. I subscribe to NT & HR and d/l Bruno's once in awhile. All are good. HR was very strong at HP, but NT is best at DMR.

Thank your clockers for me.

[cmoore]

major and tommy were 9/5 and 2-1.....uhhhhh next.....Your 3rd horse mentioned was a 29-1 shot who finished 3rd and paid a whopping 8 bucks to show....You'll need more substance then that to get anyone from this board.

[ElKabong]

My comments were directed at the Report's accuracy/ ability to find horses that either were legit favorites, or runners that were going off at odds that would be in the mix. The report yesterday was successful at that.

If you were looking for a redboard session on 10-1 or better winners, sorry to disappoint. Have had a few of those, but mostly at Hollywood. DMR has been pretty chalky..., so Tommy and Major were nice pick 3 keys in addition to win bets.

My win bet on Major, off the monster work report, paid for the whole year's subscription. So yeah, that was substance enough for me.

[joelouis]

Props to Andy & John, they had a great report today.

majormotionpicture had the 2nd best report of any fts I've seen all summer....won

tommy's luck, young runner off the claim for mullins, good report (solidfied my bet choice)....won

global hunter "Adored the turf here with Valdivia up, full of run in 37.1, 100.0 (2.4 last 1/4). Is on edge for a big effort.---------------Grade: B+"......ran 3rd at 30-1, tri pd $255 on a $1 (i bet w/s)

Of the 3 reports that I've used for dmr, NT has been the best. I subscribe to NT & HR and d/l Bruno's once in awhile. All are good. HR was very strong at HP, but NT is best at DMR.

Thank your clockers for me.

Lets see 2 winners won went off at 9-5 the other at 2-1 and the other ran 3rd. Now if you played all the exactas and triples and pic 4's they suggested were you in the plus or minus column. Hummmmm lets see. scratching head. NO

[ElKabong]

This is the reason I post less and less on this site when it comes to handicapping. I post on here to congratulate the clockers on a nice day.... In comes the petty stuff.

One winner was a Mullins claim, taking a young runner off a trainer who gave the horse away at a bargain. That alone is a great angle. The workout report suggested the horse stepped foreward. Do you really think you'll get 10-1 on that horse?

Another winner had the second best set of work comments (on 2 diff reports) that I've seen all summer. He had absolutely nothing to beat, and won as expected.

The horse that DIDN'T win ran 3rd at 30-1 odds. My loser doubled my money. Not bad when your horse doesn't win, and you double your money. When you bet live horses at good odds w/s is a nice way to bet imo. The shorter prices you have to bet to win, and the workout reports allowed me to do just that.

None of this will make any sense to Joe or cmoore. Workout reports, on avg, get you 3-4 confident bets per week, max. Bruno de Julio's book quotes Vlad Cerin as saying it gets him 2 "confident" bets per week. He's probably right too. You wait on the right time and circumstance, and pounce. The replies here remind me of folks that have to bet 10-50 races per day. Given your mindset & posts, workout reports won't do you any good. You don't understand the importance of it nor how to use it from your comments.

Once again, congrats to the HR clockers on a fine day Sunday (and today on the opener).

[BillW]

This is the reason I post less and less on this site when it comes to handicapping. I post on here to congratulate the clockers on a nice day.... In comes the petty stuff.

One winner was a Mullins claim, taking a young runner off a trainer who gave the horse away at a bargain. That alone is a great angle. The workout report suggested the horse stepped foreward. Do you really think you'll get 10-1 on that horse?

Another winner had the second best set of work comments (on 2 diff reports) that I've seen all summer. He had absolutely nothing to beat, and won as expected.

The horse that DIDN'T win ran 3rd at 30-1 odds. My loser doubled my money. Not bad when your horse doesn't win, and you double your money. When you bet live horses at good odds w/s is a nice way to bet imo. The shorter prices you have to bet to win, and the workout reports allowed me to do just that.

None of this will make any sense to Joe or cmoore. Workout reports, on avg, get you 3-4 confident bets per week, max. Bruno de Julio's book quotes Vlad Cerin as saying it gets him 2 "confident" bets per week. He's probably right too. You wait on the right time and circumstance, and pounce. The replies here remind me of folks that have to bet 10-50 races per day. Given your mindset & posts, workout reports won't do you any good. You don't understand the importance of it nor how to use it from your comments.

Once again, congrats to the HR clockers on a fine day Sunday (and today on the opener).

Hang around more S. - Lord knows we need it (and remember the ignore button :lol: )

[ElKabong]

Looking back on my post I credited the HR clockers in that last sentence (doh)....Meant to credit the NT guys, Andy and John. I subscribe to both nt & hr, but NT's reports have been best at dmr by far.

[cmoore]

This is the reason I post less and less on this site when it comes to handicapping. I post on here to congratulate the clockers on a nice day.... In comes the petty stuff.

One winner was a Mullins claim, taking a young runner off a trainer who gave the horse away at a bargain. That alone is a great angle. The workout report suggested the horse stepped foreward. Do you really think you'll get 10-1 on that horse?

Another winner had the second best set of work comments (on 2 diff reports) that I've seen all summer. He had absolutely nothing to beat, and won as expected.

The horse that DIDN'T win ran 3rd at 30-1 odds. My loser doubled my money. Not bad when your horse doesn't win, and you double your money. When you bet live horses at good odds w/s is a nice way to bet imo. The shorter prices you have to bet to win, and the workout reports allowed me to do just that.

None of this will make any sense to Joe or cmoore. Workout reports, on avg, get you 3-4 confident bets per week, max. Bruno de Julio's book quotes Vlad Cerin as saying it gets him 2 "confident" bets per week. He's probably right too. You wait on the right time and circumstance, and pounce. The replies here remind me of folks that have to bet 10-50 races per day. Given your mindset & posts, workout reports won't do you any good. You don't understand the importance of it nor how to use it from your comments.

Once again, congrats to the HR clockers on a fine day Sunday (and today on the opener).

Listen pal..I understand workouts fully. I use them every day. So your telling us you made three bets this particular day and 2 of them were chalks and you made a profit..OK:D..keep pumping the site..Maybe they can hit a eight dollar winner for you next weekend..I won the twinspires contest this past weekend. So put that in your pipe and smoke it. You know what site I used..Its called memyselfandIdotcom..:lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

Listen pal..I understand workouts fully. I use them every day. So your telling us you made three bets this particular day and 2 of them were chalks and you made a profit..OK:D..keep pumping the site..Maybe they can hit a eight dollar winner for you next weekend..I won the twinspires contest this past weekend. So put that in your pipe and smoke it. You know what site I used..Its called memyselfandIdotcom..:lol:First off, I sincerely doubt ElKabong is now, or ever will be your pal.

Second off, why do you feel the need to denigrate ElKabong because he chooses to wait around in the weeds for his kind of prey? All that gets you is bad karma, and good luck winning the next twinspires contest with bad karma.

[ElKabong]

Twin Spares contest... Goodie goodie.

Look, if you are hellbent on not letting NT get some nice comment from a client, why is that? What do you have to gain, other than proving to be socially retarded? Would you butt into a conversation between a client and supplier in this manner if we were at a social setting? I'd hope not (refer to the socially retarded reference).

Not sure why people like you are the way you are.

Final point. I met a PA poster nicked BORIS at Sam Houston yrs ago when I used to drive down there. My first day w/ him I hit an exacta & tri with a $78 horse on top. That race alone I cleared over $6,000. It isn't like I search for $6 winners.

I don't look for chalk, I look for good bets. In that vein NT produces an excellent product at a very fair price.

PA is right, you and I would never be pals. Have met several people on this board in person, liked them all. You? You don't seem very interesting nor sociable.

[cmoore]

First off, I sincerely doubt ElKabong is now, or ever will be your pal.


Second off, why do you feel the need to denigrate ElKabong because he chooses to wait around in the weeds for his kind of prey? All that gets you is bad karma, and good luck winning the next twinspires contest with bad karma.

I already came to that conclusion PACE. He's the one who used my name in his post. He says I don't understand workout reports. He doesn't know what he's talking about. That site must advertise here so that's why you had to put in your two cents. No bad Karma. I just like revealing truths about these so called sites that claim winners. Now if he wants to say they have good information about workouts and it might improve your game..That's one thing. But to come on here and pump 2 chalk winners and a 29-1 shot for 3rd at 8 bucks. Let's get real. That needs to be preyed upon.

[Spendabuck85]

Cmoore,
Congrats on the twinspires contest. I also qualified for the finals with a 4th place finish on Preakness day.

[ElKabong]

Now if he wants to say they have good information about workouts and it might improve your game..That's one thing. .

That's exactly what I've posted. I detailed the reasons why the 2 winners were good bets. The show horse was a good bet as well given the info the clockers provided.

If you want big priced winners, NT's clockers get those from time to time as well. So does HR...and TRD....and Turrell.

It's still interesting/ amusing that you feel so appalled that NT got a pat on the back. Only the socially retarded would feel the need to jump in and say what you did, given the conversation. Very strange.

[cmoore]

Cmoore,
Congrats on the twinspires contest. I also qualified for the finals with a 4th place finish on Preakness day.

Thanks Spendabuck..

[joelouis]

That's exactly what I've posted. I detailed the reasons why the 2 winners were good bets. The show horse was a good bet as well given the info the clockers provided.

If you want big priced winners, NT's clockers get those from time to time as well. So does HR...and TRD....and Turrell.

It's still interesting/ amusing that you feel so appalled that NT got a pat on the back. Only the socially retarded would feel the need to jump in and say what you did, given the conversation. Very strange.

What do you consider a big priced winner? My friend subscribes to NT and If I am not mistaken he let me look at this picks for last Sunday. NT I believe did not have a banner day, it seems that NT covers all the angles, he has a coloumn that has value bets, these are the bets he thinks you should make if they are at a certain odds. They do not really have to be one of his pics, so its kinda like covering all the bases, and how much of a bank roll would you need to play his selections, I do not have a money tree in my back yard. I have seen in the past few weeks the work out report andy harrington, and I have seen long shots that andy gave C's and C- to which would tend to make me believe they looked awfull. If I can't pic a $5.80 winner and a 2-1 shot on my own, then I better take up GOLF.

[InsideThePylons-MW]

The workout report for Del Mar this meet has been miserable. Much worse IMO than other meets. I don't know if it's the polycrap, watering of track, etc, but his negative comments, which is what I look for, have been absolutely useless. Saturday's sheet was a nightmare for any exotic playing follower.

The other day on TVG Todd Schrupp was asked what Harrington said about a horse's workouts and he said that he didn't know, he threw it in the trash because every C/C- work should have been an A/A- work. That's actually good for the future if the report improves because every FTS that Andy has liked has been overbet due to the TVG dolts releasing his info to every viewer.

Any information is good information as long as you know what to look for and decipher it.

[pic6vic]

A good example of using the workouts. On friday 8/22 DMR 5th race Smugdgle do was coming off a bad race and the race before was a QH race at the fair. Before his bad last race NT had a good workout and said the horse was doing fine. On Friday he is wheeled back in about 14 days or so. The trainer (Koriner) is doing well. he changes jockeys from Enriquez to Gomez in a 10K claimer. Now with all the positive moves and remembering the GOOD MENTION this horse was worth a nice play. Also the horse had won 7 races although at lesser venues. He wins and pays 28.60. I was following this horse because of the workout before hisbad race. All the other changes just enhanced the play. I have been using Bob's workouts for over 20 years. He had started HR back in the 80's.

Workouts don't always mean the horse will run good or fits in today's races. As for horses receiving a C grade and winning, there may be circumstances such as all horses receiving a C grade. It is about using the workouts on a consistent basis and learning how to use them.

[Turfday]

First, to those of you who are NOT subscribing or PAYING for the report, yet commenting on it, but somehow get your hands on a copy often, my suggestion is DON'T READ IT. You apparently are doing yourself a disservice by reading "worthless trash" as someone pointed out Todd Schrupp referred to it.

It's interesting, though, isn't it, how MANY TIMES in recent months that Christina Olivares and a couple of the other TVG handicappers have mentioned the National Turf workout report and Andy Harrington on the air? Yet we are not advertising on TVG and not supplying Todd with the report.

If it's "worthless trash," even though guys like Bob Baffert, John Sadler, agent Ron Anderson (Garrett Gomez), agent Vince owner Sean Gerson, DeGregory, Jr (Joel Rosario), Mark Glatt, Dan Hendricks, owner John Harrris, David Ingordo (for John Shirreffs), Dennis O'Neill (Doug's brother), Marty Panza (racing secretary at Hollywood Park), jockey Iggy Puglisi, Ted West, Kentucky clocker Joe Riddell, Tim Yakteen plus many, many other prominent owners.....why do these guys consistently subscribe to or regularly use it ?
So do us a favor. The fewer eyes on the report, the better it is for those that actually PAY for it.

Second, to any of you that you who consistently use other services that offer clocker's report workout information.... I would like to point out that no other service offers the number of workouts on a given day that National Turf does ......and, even more importantly, NONE take a stand like Andy does and include as many C, C- or even a D grades on workouts. By doing so, he's going to be wrong on occasion. But why is it that no one EVER mentions all the C or below grades he gives out on recent works....and those horses finish.............down the track ?

The other services either OMIT those workouts for fear that those horses run well and it makes them look bad, or they wind up with a C+ or B- grade (with the occasional C thrown in). Meanwhile, how often do you see Andy actually give a horse an A or A- grade? Very stingy with them because when he does, users realize those workouts were very special in his eyes.

So do some checking for a period of time ...a few weeks....and see how many BAD grades the other services offer on a consistent basis ...if any at all as compared to the number of glowing or favorable workouts they include. Then report back.

[George Sands]

Bob,

Two quick thoughts:

1: I buy the workout report regularly and think Andy is an excellent clocker. There is no clocker whose opinion I value more, and I appreciate how many horses Andy manages to clock. I think he's terrific.

2: Something bad has happened over the last year or so. There has been way, way too much hype for the workout report, and it is killing prices. It has reached the point where if I really like a horse, I pray that Andy merely gives the horse one of his "B- holds form" write-ups. If he praises a horse heavily, in all likelihood this will take a big bite out of the price and make the horse unbettable. I really believe that the hype and advertising has reduced the usefulness of the product.

[joelouis]

A good example of using the workouts. On friday 8/22 DMR 5th race Smugdgle do was coming off a bad race and the race before was a QH race at the fair. Before his bad last race NT had a good workout and said the horse was doing fine. On Friday he is wheeled back in about 14 days or so. The trainer (Koriner) is doing well. he changes jockeys from Enriquez to Gomez in a 10K claimer. Now with all the positive moves and remembering the GOOD MENTION this horse was worth a nice play. Also the horse had won 7 races although at lesser venues. He wins and pays 28.60. I was following this horse because of the workout before hisbad race. All the other changes just enhanced the play. I have been using Bob's workouts for over 20 years. He had started HR back in the 80's.

Workouts don't always mean the horse will run good or fits in today's races. As for horses receiving a C grade and winning, there may be circumstances such as all horses receiving a C grade. It is about using the workouts on a consistent basis and learning how to use them.

That horse Smugdgle your talking about I was watching TVG that day and I was looking at the probable doubles that day from the winner in the race before to all the DD's in the 4th race Smugdgle DD was paying $77 dollars it was the action double big time, I usually use this as a guy, He was 12-1 on the morning line and went off at 12-1 no action really except in the DD big time, I put in a 20 dollar win bet on him strickly because of the DD payoff and guess what he went wire to wire at 13-1 nice hit for not even having PPS or a work out report, or maybe it was just luck, or whatever you guys call luck. I myself do not believe in Luck. If you want to bet on a report that is up to you we all have a free will and a choice. GOOD LUCK ha ha

[ryesteve]

I was looking at the probable doubles that day from the winner in the race before to all the DD's in the 4th race Smugdgle DD was paying $77 dollars it was the action double big time, He was 12-1 on the morning line, I put in a 20 dollar win bet on him strickly because of the DD payoff
So why didn't you like the #3 or the #10? They were both 10-1 on the ML, and their double probables were $61 and $59... that's way bigger action.

[joelouis]

So why didn't you like the #3 or the #10? They were both 10-1 on the ML, and their double probables were $61 and $59... that's way bigger action.


If you can remember what the odds were on the #3 or the #10 were it might help. If I am not mistaken the odds on the #3 and #10 were around 7-1 or 8-1, the number #6 horse was 12-1 morning line making it the play in the double. I suggest you buy a book published in 1971 called picking winners, has nothing to do with the polytrack they now run on. Gotta run having picking up my new BMW for the wife. later

[ryesteve]

Gotta run having picking up my new BMW for the wife. laterYeah, good idea running to the car dealer at 4am... you gotta beat the rush before all the other red-boarders show up to spend their winnings... :rolleyes:

[ElKabong]

The workout report for Del Mar this meet has been miserable. Much worse IMO than other meets. I don't know if it's the polycrap, watering of track, etc, .

I agree w/ some of what you say, but the past 2 weeks he's been very very good & accurate. Today's report he commented on Carla Gaines' firster that won, one work was missed off the official tab. Only had one legit horse to beat (imo) & blew past late. He did whiff on Tiz West (so did I) but overall the past 2 weeks have been extremely good. His report yesterday on Alpha Kitten was nice, that one's a runner. Add his comment/ report on today's nitecap, and I have to hand it to them. They're finishing the meet quite well.

I appreciate your opinion btw....I was cold as ice the first half of the meet, mostly in that I couldn't find a bet.

[ranchwest]

I already came to that conclusion PACE. He's the one who used my name in his post. He says I don't understand workout reports. He doesn't know what he's talking about. That site must advertise here so that's why you had to put in your two cents. No bad Karma. I just like revealing truths about these so called sites that claim winners. Now if he wants to say they have good information about workouts and it might improve your game..That's one thing. But to come on here and pump 2 chalk winners and a 29-1 shot for 3rd at 8 bucks. Let's get real. That needs to be preyed upon.

ElKabong invests in races. He's a homework guy. If he's telling you about one day of experience, that's just citing examples. I can assure you he's just conveying what hours of study have revealed. And, instead of being grateful that he was sharing his hard work with you, you are critical. Some people can never recognize a good thing.

[cmoore]

ElKabong invests in races. He's a homework guy. If he's telling you about one day of experience, that's just citing examples. I can assure you he's just conveying what hours of study have revealed. And, instead of being grateful that he was sharing his hard work with you, you are critical. Some people can never recognize a good thing.

What hard work..He's quoting information off someone elses workout report and the winners were so low you'd have to hit at a 40% clip. No thanks..

[ranchwest]

What hard work..He's quoting information off someone elses workout report and the winners were so low you'd have to hit at a 40% clip. No thanks..

He's not giving a handicapping seminar. He's telling about the workout reports, but I don't expect you to get it.

[MONEY]

Yeah, good idea running to the car dealer at 4am... :rolleyes:
This is off topic, but many years ago when I was in real estate I realized that many people did not work 9 to 5. So I made myself available to show unoccupied houses to potential customers during the overnight hours. I had many contracts signed between 3 & 4 in the morning. Most of them closed.:ThmbUp:

Money

[cmoore]

He's not giving a handicapping seminar. He's telling about the workout reports, but I don't expect you to get it.

If you say so..