Sadler's barn got raided...

[Mag]

http://www.drf.com/news/article/97457.html

[bigmack]

Dr. Rick Arthur, the racing board's equine medical director, said Tuesday at a meeting of the racing board's medication committee that in July, 38 of 418 steroid tests were found to be in violation. Of those 38, however, "17 were with one trainer, and 11 with a second trainer," Arthur said.

"Two trainers have been responsible for 70 percent of the violations for anabolic steroids at Hollywood Park and Del Mar," Arthur said. "The rest are a trainer here and there."

Speculation that the racing board's investigators were at Sadler's barn looking into a steroid violation was fueled by comments made Tuesday at the medication committee meeting by Richard Shapiro, the chairman of the racing board.

"Just look at the top of the trainers' and owners' list," Shapiro said while waving a sheet of paper.

Gary and Cecil Barber are the leading owners at Del Mar. Sadler is one of the trainers they employ.

[pandy]

Dr. Rick Arthur, the racing board's equine medical director, said Tuesday at a meeting of the racing board's medication committee that in July, 38 of 418 steroid tests were found to be in violation. Of those 38, however, "17 were with one trainer, and 11 with a second trainer," Arthur said.

"Two trainers have been responsible for 70 percent of the violations for anabolic steroids at Hollywood Park and Del Mar," Arthur said. "The rest are a trainer here and there."

Speculation that the racing board's investigators were at Sadler's barn looking into a steroid violation was fueled by comments made Tuesday at the medication committee meeting by Richard Shapiro, the chairman of the racing board.

"Just look at the top of the trainers' and owners' list," Shapiro said while waving a sheet of paper.

Gary and Cecil Barber are the leading owners at Del Mar. Sadler is one of the trainers they employ.


This is exactly why, as a racing writer, I rarely praise a trainer. The other day on TVG they were raving about what a sensational meet Sadler was having, but it was the steroids they should've been praising.

Of course there are exceptions, I will rave about Allen Jerkens, because he is a very successful trainer and never gets a positive.

[highnote]

"Frankly, we gave the trainers more credit than we should have for being ethical," Arthur said. "Trainers playing by the rules are getting the short end of the stick. We have actually seen horses treated three days before a race in the past week.

"It's unfair to the wagering public and the trainers and owners who are playing by the rules."

Shapiro said he believes "two or three people have taken an abusive, screw-you attitude."


Ethics is should be a required course in elementary, middle and high school.

[DJofSD]

Ethics is should be a required course in elementary, middle and high school.Yes, in the government schools, they should be teaching ethics. Where they will find the teachers smart enough and brave enough to be able to do so is beyond me. Private schools especially the religious based ones have never stopped.

[DrugS]

In Pennsylvania you had just four trainers account for more than half of the steroid violations: including Steph Beattie who accounted for a quarter of the states violatons by herself.

I guess two unnamed trainers accounted for 70% of the violations in Cal.

It really seems to boil down to a VERY small number of high powered trainers who want to play with fire - and a few ship-in guys who aren't familiar enough with the rules getting single violations.

The rest of the trainers seem to be taking horses off of steroids cold turkey.

It will be interesting to see if a bunch of Clenbuterol overages are to follow. The sharp trainers who stop using steroids are now using way more Clen.

You are finally starting to see a bunch of overages for Clen up here lately - and I've seen horses with my own eyes up here administered Clen on race day, get tested after winning a race, and not test over the limit for it.

It's very impressive to get an overage for that stuff here. You'd have to send the horses over so loaded up that they would be shaking from it - but somehow they've managed I guess.

[bigmack]

Ethics should be a required course in elementary, middle and high school.
As they might put more in the collection plate on Sundays to "justify," let's forget about the general "ethics" and ask not, how they learned this behavior, (cause it's real easy to figure out) - ask why they would continue to do it under such obvious scrutiny.

Hold on to your lug nuts - It's time for an ......

[highnote]

There is no penalty yet, right? Isn't there still a grace period?

If so, then these guys are pushing it to the limit. It's probably stupid to still be using steroids so heavily because now they'll be scrutinized extra closely from here on out -- or at least they should be.

[lamboguy]

i have a philly running in pennsilvania,. she won msw as a 3 yo in a good maryland race. she ran second in a 1x allowance in a real tough field. all this while on winstrohl. she had an injury so i stopped with her until last november. never put her back on the steroids, she has gone backwards ever since. she has had a bunch of seconds in nw2 5000 claimers. lately you can notice her coat is getting much better, and she actually is showing some semblance of improvement. the point i am trying to make is that it is taking alot of time to get the steroids out of the system. these trainers are probably not going to run their horses after the drop dead date hits them with the steroids. they are just milking the system now for all its worth. i had thought that the date was going to be april 1 in penn. but it looks like they had to extend that because of trouble filling fields.

even though the horses eat and train better on steroids, i can really see the reason for not allowing them. when it comes time to breeding the steroids show up all the time. you wind up with more soft bone horses, meaning more chips. the horses don't fit their bones. you have more catastrophic injuries.

in the old days, new york racing had it right. no lasix, no clembuterol, no steroids, no nothing. but they took it on the chin, and was the last to give in. the tables have been turned, now you have to send a horse to run in new york that has steroids, because other jurisdictions don't allow them and they still do!

the other day i was offered a horse that ran in saratoga. he was in a 20k b race. the guy wanted 10k for the horse after a very credible race. i said i would buy it if he wasn't on steroids.so that was the end of that.

the only place i could have taken that horse to was sulfolk downs for no purse.

[john del riccio]

You know, I kept asking myself why thi sguy was winning so many races recently....I am glad I didn't answer:faint: out loud...

John

[BUD]

in the early days at my job...many off the officers would partake in steroids, of course to give that big guy cop look......then testing came in with the potential to lose your job for a positive.......it was hell for these guys cleaning their system....then getting their strength back....some never did....because the juice was masking several joint problems...none ever returned to juice form either after being clean..etc

if its tough for a human...i imagine the same for the horse......performance wise too.

[pandy]

in the early days at my job...many off the officers would partake in steroids, of course to give that big guy cop look......then testing came in with the potential to lose your job for a positive.......it was hell for these guys cleaning their system....then getting their strength back....some never did....because the juice was masking several joint problems...none ever returned to juice form either after being clean..etc

if its tough for a human...i imagine the same for the horse......performance wise too.

Quest Venture goes first off the claim AWAY from Sadler today at Del Mar, has been freshened but could still be a steroid bounce.

[john del riccio]

it was hell for these guys cleaning their system....then getting their strength back....some never did....because the juice was masking several joint problems...none ever returned to juice form either after being clean..etc


Bud,

YOU hit the nail right on the pervebial head. The roids not only build muscle, they calm joint inflamation as well. Roids-Off means less muscle mass and joint problems that were being soothed get exposed. I should repeat that a dozen times for emphasis...

John

[SeattleSlew@BP]

This is exactly why, as a racing writer, I rarely praise a trainer. The other day on TVG they were raving about what a sensational meet Sadler was having, but it was the steroids they should've been praising.

They were PRAISING Sadler just today, and never mentioned one word about the raid. And this is one of our sport's "major" networks.

The protection these guys get from media and fans is stunning.

[JustRalph]

They were PRAISING Sadler just today, and never mentioned one word about the raid. And this is one of our sport's "major" networks.

The protection these guys get from media and fans is stunning.

This is my chief complaint about TVG and HRTV.

You realize quickly that they aren't about "covering the sport" they are about promoting online handle. I understand it, but would really like an objective viewpoint or a real journalistic version of TVG etc.

Jocks, Trainers and more get a pass on tons of stuff.............

[DJofSD]

This is my chief complaint about TVG and HRTV.

You realize quickly that they aren't about "covering the sport" they are about promoting online handle. I understand it, but would really like an objective viewpoint or a real journalistic version of TVG etc.

Jocks, Trainers and more get a pass on tons of stuff.............I always thought the talking heads were just trying to be buddies with the principals.

[pandy]

This is my chief complaint about TVG and HRTV.

You realize quickly that they aren't about "covering the sport" they are about promoting online handle. I understand it, but would really like an objective viewpoint or a real journalistic version of TVG etc.

Jocks, Trainers and more get a pass on tons of stuff.............

Mr B has been openly critical of judges, which I applaud him for, but he also heaps praise upon these cheating trainers, some of whom are probably his friends, such as Bob Baffert, who has had his share of positives over the years.

[kenwoodallpromos]

= coverup.

[Greyfox]

Ethics is should be a required course in elementary, middle and high school.

You can teach ethics all you want, but that ain't the way to go. That just gives a verbal frame work to spring board away from.

It is my belief that most human beings are born with an internal moral compass. Down deep, from a very early age, we know what is right and what is wrong intuitively. A very small portion of individuals whose moral compass is miswired are called psychopaths. Another small portion chose to ignore their moral compass because they see any easy way to make gains. They're cons.
Nevertheless, it still boils down that we don't need ethics courses.

Most of us know "right" from "wrong." Those who don't, won't learn it in a class room. A cheating horse trainer would never learn from an ethics course. Fact.
He/She would learn by having his livelihood income taken away.

[Cangamble]

You can teach ethics all you want, but that ain't the way to go. That just gives a verbal frame work to spring board away from.

It is my belief that most human beings are born with an internal moral compass. Down deep, from a very early age, we know what is right and what is wrong intuitively. A very small portion of individuals whose moral compass is miswired are called psychopaths. Another small portion chose to ignore their moral compass because they see any easy way to make gains. They're cons.
Nevertheless, it still boils down that we don't need ethics courses.

Most of us know "right" from "wrong." Those who don't, won't learn it in a class room. A cheating horse trainer would never learn from an ethics course. Fact.
He/She would learn by having his livelihood income taken away.
I agree with you 100%. We evolved right and wrong. Even a baby can show guilt. Empathy and guilt are hardwired in us and all social animals. If our ancestors (way prior to when the bibles were written) went around naturally stealing, murdering and raping, we wouldn't be here today as a species.

And you are right on when it comes to psychopaths and sociopaths. Either nature or nurture or a combination of the two turned them into beings where guilt may not exist or weakly exist in them and there is close to a void in them when it comes to empathy.

[DJofSD]

If our ancestors (way prior to when the bibles were written) went around naturally stealing, murdering and raping, we wouldn't be here today as a species.

I guess then all of the history of western civilization was all false? And the prehistory of the middle east? Oh ya, then there's Gengis Kahn -- something like 25% of the world population are descendants.

[Greyfox]

An ethics class wouldn't have helped the likes of Ghengis Khan either.
Survival and power took prevalence over individual human rights in many parts of history. That's doesn't mean that Ghengis Khan didn't know "right" from "wrong"
down deep. That just meant that he chose to ignore his moral compass in favour of satisfying personal needs.
You are right. History is full of examples of pillaging, looting, and so on.
Ethics classes wouldn't have helped any of those individuals either.

[Cangamble]

I guess then all of the history of western civilization was all false? And the prehistory of the middle east? Oh ya, then there's Gengis Kahn -- something like 25% of the world population are descendants.
The psychopaths didn't prevail. Do you think that the people wiped out were necessarily immoral or lacked empathy?
If you are right about the 25% total, it would only take 4 Khans to have wiped out the total population. And they probably would have all been male, so good luck trying to make babies:)

[Cangamble]

An ethics class wouldn't have helped the likes of Ghengis Khan either.
Survival and power took prevalence over individual human rights in many parts of history. That's doesn't mean that Ghengis Khan didn't know "right" from "wrong"
down deep. That just meant that he chose to ignore his moral compass in favour of satisfying personal needs.
You are right. History is full of examples of pillaging, looting, and so on.
Ethics classes wouldn't have helped any of those individuals either.
There are many examples of societies and cultures that did very well without the New or Old Testament. Most Native American tribes did very well as social groups. Same with the Mexican and South American Indians as well.
They didn't need ethics classes either to know right from wrong.

[levinmpa]

The timing of this raid is very interesting, considering that John Sadler was on The Roger Stein show on Sunday 8/17. He basically said that he's preparing his barn for a "no medication" policy. I took it as him saying that his horses are already being weened of whatever medications they may have been taking. It was a very good interview. Stein always goes straight to the point. You can hear the segment at the link below. The interview begins at about the 37 minute mark.

http://www.rogerstein.com/archives/080817.wma

[Greyfox]

There are many examples of societies and cultures that did very well without the New or Old Testament. Most Native American tribes did very well as social groups. Same with the Mexican and South American Indians as well.
They didn't need ethics classes either to know right from wrong.

:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: Agreed.

With respect to DJofSD's claim, I've found the following:

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2003/02/0214_030214_genghis.html

"Genghis Khan, the fearsome Mongolian warrior of the 13th century, may have done more than rule the largest empire in the world; according to a recently published genetic study, he may have helped populate it too.
An international group of geneticists studying Y-chromosome data have found that nearly 8 percent of the men living in the region of the former Mongol empire carry y-chromosomes that are nearly identical. That translates to 0.5 percent of the male population in the world, or roughly 16 million descendants living today. "

He was a very prolific man. But .5 % is not 25 %.
Of course just because one passes the genes along, doesn't mean that any specific traits will be inherent in the offspring.

At any rate, the main point is that the majority of individuals are born with wiring that allows discrimination of right from wrong. Those that don't develop or inherit empathy templates will serve only self interests.

P.S. Even the British Royals? (From a different source.)
It is estimated that 17 million people worldwide - including the British Royal Family, Iranian Royalty, and the family of Dracula - are direct descendents of Genghis Khan.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/london/3860339.stm

[Imriledup]

The timing of this raid is very interesting, considering that John Sadler was on The Roger Stein show on Sunday 8/17. He basically said that he's preparing his barn for a "no medication" policy. I took it as him saying that his horses are already being weened of whatever medications they may have been taking. It was a very good interview. Stein always goes straight to the point. You can hear the segment at the link below. The interview begins at about the 37 minute mark.

http://www.rogerstein.com/archives/080817.wma

The way his stock is performing these days, it doesn't appear that there's much weaning going on.

[JustRalph]

You can teach ethics all you want, but that ain't the way to go. That just gives a verbal frame work to spring board away from.

It is my belief that most human beings are born with an internal moral compass. Down deep, from a very early age, we know what is right and what is wrong intuitively. A very small portion of individuals whose moral compass is miswired are called psychopaths. Another small portion chose to ignore their moral compass because they see any easy way to make gains. They're cons.
Nevertheless, it still boils down that we don't need ethics courses.

Most of us know "right" from "wrong." Those who don't, won't learn it in a class room. A cheating horse trainer would never learn from an ethics course. Fact.
He/She would learn by having his livelihood income taken away.

Good post....... :ThmbUp:

[joelouis]

HE WAS WINNING AT A 26% CLIP, YOU HAVE TO ASK YOURSELF!

[joelouis]

They were PRAISING Sadler just today, and never mentioned one word about the raid. And this is one of our sport's "major" networks.

The protection these guys get from media and fans is stunning.

You sound surprised, they can't bite the hand that feeds them. 3 monkeys no see no hear no speak.

[socantra]

Yes, in the government schools, they should be teaching ethics. Where they will find the teachers smart enough and brave enough to be able to do so is beyond me. Private schools especially the religious based ones have never stopped.

DJofSD,

Having children and friends who are smart, brave and dedicated public school teachers, I cannot begin to tell you how vicious and contemptible I find your post. If you truly believe that all virtue resides with private and religious school teachers, I am sure you would find any response of mine to be equally offensive.

As an alternative, might I suggest that we keep this discussion out of the horse racing forums and confine it to the off topic area, where this sort of trash belongs.

[highnote]

DJofSD,

Having children and friends who are smart, brave and dedicated public school teachers, I cannot begin to tell you how vicious and contemptible I find your post. If you truly believe that all virtue resides with private and religious school teachers, I am sure you would find any response of mine to be equally offensive.

As an alternative, might I suggest that we keep this discussion out of the horse racing forums and confine it to the off topic area, where this sort of trash belongs.


I agree socantra. My niece is an incredibly dedicated and smart public school teacher in Colorado. She has an Ivy League education by virtue of getting her teaching degree from Columbia University.

Some of my son's public school teachers are Ivy League and his principal has a Ph.D. And this is just one school in thousands across the country.

These are smart people who could make a lot more money in the private sector, but they love being educators.

[JustRalph]

A few good teachers will never make up for the crappy ones that are supported by bad teachers unions...............

the proof is in the pudding...............

[highnote]

A few good teachers will never make up for the crappy ones that are supported by bad teachers unions...............

the proof is in the pudding...............


This thread has gone off on a bit of a tangent -- from Sadler's steroid positives to teacher's unions. :D

[big frank]

what about the owners ? Barber would win races if i trained for him . Peter Miller also trains for him. What is Sadlers percentage with other owners ? if anyone doesnt think some of these owners arent pulling the strings and paying off the vets is nuts ! Bone, Repole , Goldfarb , i could go on and on.. they use a few trainers and every trainer they have is a high percent trainer

[joelouis]

what about the owners ? Barber would win races if i trained for him . Peter Miller also trains for him. What is Sadlers percentage with other owners ? if anyone doesnt think some of these owners arent pulling the strings and paying off the vets is nuts ! Bone, Repole , Goldfarb , i could go on and on.. they use a few trainers and every trainer they have is a high percent trainer

Yea kinda makes you wounder!

[LottaKash]

This thread has gone off on a bit of a tangent -- from Sadler's steroid positives to teacher's unions. :D

Too Funny,....... and don't forget Genghis Kahn, and the south american indians, as when they weren't bashing each other over the head, they were sacrificing themselves for god.....Do you think the teachers and the war mongers, are for, or against steroids ???

[socantra]

It is my understanding that Genghis Kahn and the South American natives are pro steroid.

A small group of dedicated teachers are against steroids, but the evil teachers unions force public school children to eat steroids in their pudding every day.

[njcurveball]

A small group of dedicated teachers are against steroids, but the evil teachers unions force public school children to eat steroids in their pudding every day.


Just as Ralph said above, the proof is IN the pudding. ;)

[HEY DUDE]

what about the owners ? Barber would win races if i trained for him . Peter Miller also trains for him. What is Sadlers percentage with other owners ? if anyone doesnt think some of these owners arent pulling the strings and paying off the vets is nuts ! Bone, Repole , Goldfarb , i could go on and on.. they use a few trainers and every trainer they have is a high percent trainer

I tend to agree with you with the exception of pay-offs. Don't know if that is going on. However, I do believe that owners rule this game. And yes, look at the stats. Barbers, Ramseys, Bone, they do well and I will usually key thier horses automatically in exotics in most cases. Just like the old saying, "Follow the Money". They are the money in this game IMO. I have always contributed thier success to the fact that they are just simply smart business people in their industry.

[big frank]

Yea kinda makes you wounder! one of my best win bet score was on a new claim by James Ferraro in Ny ... Ferraro was and is a VERY low % trainer ,, but i happened to notice the owner was an owner who had ,, Ferriola , Serey , Levine and others train for him. Does anyone think Serey and Ferriola were smart enough to give there horse the ,,, ''' Performance enhancing drugs ' ???? Anyway they claimed this horse off a good trainer , Mark Henning ,, and the horse stepped up and jogged at 30-1 . It is one of my favorite angles , finding a new claim or purchase by one of these owners and they give the horse to a low profile trainer. I was nailing Mike Pupye early on when Bone gave him a few horses instead of Mullins.

[098poi]

It is one of my favorite angles , finding a new claim or purchase by one of these owners and they give the horse to a low profile trainer.

Although I don't have the patience to follow the ins and outs of all the trainers this seems like a good angle! My applause.:ThmbUp:

[proximity]

what about the owners ? Barber would win races if i trained for him . Peter Miller also trains for him. What is Sadlers percentage with other owners ? if anyone doesnt think some of these owners arent pulling the strings and paying off the vets is nuts ! Bone, Repole , Goldfarb , i could go on and on.. they use a few trainers and every trainer they have is a high percent trainer

great post big frank. but your list should have started with COLE.

[big frank]

great post big frank. but your list should have started with COLE.you are right on. i do follow Cole. remeber when he was claiming horses in ny last month under the trainer d cannzio ? has anyone seen him run one back in ny with this trainer ? Today at philly the ny claiming owner Dubb had one jog under the care of Gerald Delp ...... Reploe also had a winner at deleware jog under a different trainer. by the way ,,,, did anyone see Levine @ Reploes ny bred who all of a sudden become the next Groovy run a hole in the wind under a Dominguez death grip the other day ???? Breeders Cup Sprint ??? thank god for hay, water , and oats !