000,000,000,000.00 lotta zeroes

[pktruckdriver]

:ThmbDown: :ThmbDown: http://130.94.230.21/debtclock.html (http://130.94.230.21/debtclock.html)


Did I not hear that Clinton claimed to get us out of Debt???


Where is the proof of that??



When was the last time we were not in debt??? never??

[DJofSD]

When was the last time we were not in debt??? never??

I think the only time is when I believe it was JP Morgan paid off the debt the US had at the time.

[Valuist]

I think the only time is when I believe it was JP Morgan paid off the debt the US had at the time.

And now the company that bears his name pays off the massive Bear Stearns debt.....

[JustRalph]

If you are so worried about the national debt, just remember the debt clock has been around for a long long time. All the way back through Reagan I can remember the Dems screaming about the Debt, the deficit and more.

It goes up and down and it affects very little. Get over it.

I know, people will log on to this thread and scream about borrowing money from China etc...........it really doesn't matter. If we ever wanted to tell the people we owe money to pound sand.........we could.

We could take care of our economy, we could do a thousand things to offset the debt............ but the national debt and the deficit in all of their spooky forms are just another talking point.......... don't look behind that curtain,,,,,,,, the debt might get you.............

[DJofSD]

I wouldn't worry about the national debt. I'd be more worried about the trade deficit.

However, having said that, I think between the economy being better than what the pundits and the Democrats would have us believe and the huge potential for a increasingly stronger dollar starting right after the Olympics are over, the US will not be as bad off as the nay sayers proport and the general media would have you believe.

[jonnielu]

:ThmbDown: :ThmbDown: http://130.94.230.21/debtclock.html (http://130.94.230.21/debtclock.html)


Did I not hear that Clinton claimed to get us out of Debt???


Where is the proof of that??



When was the last time we were not in debt??? never??

There are many other good questions to ponder:

An income tax payer in this country gives half of his paycheck in taxes to government supposedly to cover the tremendous cost of government.

The income tax payer does this mostly based on what he earns, not based on what government may actually need.

Yet even with this weekly cash bonanza going on, Congress needs to borrow in order to make ends meet. Borrow from whom?

Isn't it too bad, that the 14th amendment bars the taxpayer from questioning the expenses of government. Oh yeah, that is the same amendment under which you waive your rights under the Constitution in exchange for becoming that taxpayer that is barred from questioning the expenses of government.

My country tis of thee, sweet land of Liberty, of thee I sing.

jdl

P.S. Clinton is a known liar.

[pktruckdriver]

Jon :lol: :lol: :lol:

[kroebuck67]

So 25% of our entire national debt was incurred this fiscal year?

[kroebuck67]

Oh, the second figure is spending, not debt... my bad!

[JustRalph]

Let's stir the pot a little

http://zfacts.com/metaPage/lib/National-Debt-GDP-L.gif

[ddog]

If you are so worried about the national debt, just remember the debt clock has been around for a long long time. All the way back through Reagan I can remember the Dems screaming about the Debt, the deficit and more.

It goes up and down and it affects very little. Get over it.

I know, people will log on to this thread and scream about borrowing money from China etc...........it really doesn't matter. If we ever wanted to tell the people we owe money to pound sand.........we could.

We could take care of our economy, we could do a thousand things to offset the debt............ but the national debt and the deficit in all of their spooky forms are just another talking point.......... don't look behind that curtain,,,,,,,, the debt might get you.............


But yet we don't do 1 thing of the thousand.
We are better off to pay interest on the debt outstanding and borrow more and more?
You see no problem with that , ever?

Do you know what is actually in the debt?

Do you know how much "debt" is owed that is not in the "debt"?

You think that "debt" financed by borrowing from others who then turn around and buy up our production is fine?

You really think we could declare Friday that we owe nobody nothing and ain't paying nothing and that would be fine?

You are fine with any level of spending that Congress and OBy want in the future? just hike the debt ceiling, after all it doesn't affect us at all.

Why does not everyone have everything paid off by Uncle Sam, just put it in the debt?
Where's my 20 Million check???

Splended idea there.


You really need to stay away from sharp objects.

beyond bizzare.


For you other experts, Clinton did not claim to get us out of debt, the deficit (different althogether) was much better during most of his term and if the glide path(so called) had remained then we would have STARTED to pay down the debt since the deficit was now a surplus.

However, even then the "debt" figure was/is a joke and an outright fraud on the public.

As to the "chart", one could post a pot and piss in it , for without context, just pasting some prez names on it does nothing.

I think small things like coming out of a great depression and spending to win WWII might influence figures some.

Are we saying that as long as we stay under that ratio we are ok.

Other pot pissing point, is that 2008-2010 "projections" as goes without saying are wildy off on the good side and that the GDP is being revised and will be for several years to come and I suspect it ain't gonna be higher.

New pot needed next year.
Stir and take two and call in the morning.

[PaceAdvantage]

Does anyone ever wonder why people who seemingly have "all the answers" spend their precious moments posting on horse racing off-topic message boards?

Shouldn't you be out saving the world from itself (or at the very least the United States)?

(And if you wonder why I posted this kind of drivel, it's in response to your equally 'drivelous' "You really need to stay away from sharp objects. beyond bizzare.")

[Secretariat]

If you are so worried about the national debt, just remember the debt clock has been around for a long long time. All the way back through Reagan I can remember the Dems screaming about the Debt, the deficit and more.

It goes up and down and it affects very little. Get over it.

I know, people will log on to this thread and scream about borrowing money from China etc...........it really doesn't matter. If we ever wanted to tell the people we owe money to pound sand.........we could.

We could take care of our economy, we could do a thousand things to offset the debt............ but the national debt and the deficit in all of their spooky forms are just another talking point.......... don't look behind that curtain,,,,,,,, the debt might get you.............

Wow. I thought you were a conservative JR. Conservatives have always preached the wisdom of avodiing debt and fiscal responsiblity. But you state, "It goes up and down and it affects very little. Get over it." and later that borrowing from China..."It really doesn't matter."

I beg to differ. The increased debt is a tax raise on the American people. Try charging your credit card and living high on the hog. At some point that debt starts to weigh on your future as that interest eats into your take home pay.

I laugh at this tax cut statement from the Rpeubls. With the debt they've given us some of the biggest tax raises in history in the form of interest on the debt. But they know that if we say it's a tax cut and pile it onto our credit card leaving future generations to pay it off we'll get elected.

People are wising up, but it'll take a McCain presidency to drive it home. So please vote for him. It'll create pain for us, but one more term of a GOP presidency and I think Dem's will be set up for generations to come.

btw..thanks for posting that graph. Nice to see ole Lib Bill Clinton saw that debt dip down nicely during his administration.

[wonatthewire1]

Wow. I thought you were a conservative JR. Conservatives have always preached the wisdom of avodiing debt and fiscal responsiblity. But you state, "It goes up and down and it affects very little. Get over it." and later that borrowing from China..."It really doesn't matter."

I beg to differ. The increased debt is a tax raise on the American people. Try charging your credit card and living high on the hog. At some point that debt starts to weigh on your future as that interest eats into your take home pay.

I laugh at this tax cut statement from the Rpeubls. With the debt they've given us some of the biggest tax raises in history in the form of interest on the debt. But they know that if we say it's a tax cut and pile it onto our credit card leaving future generations to pay it off we'll get elected.

People are wising up, but it'll take a McCain presidency to drive it home. So please vote for him. It'll create pain for us, but one more term of a GOP presidency and I think Dem's will be set up for generations to come.

btw..thanks for posting that graph. Nice to see ole Lib Bill Clinton saw that debt dip down nicely during his administration.


But Sec, getting tax cuts while increasing the debt was the Reagan legacy - don't you know nothing?

Papa Bush screwed that all up with his no new taxes, but here they come anyway to pay for all those years under the cowboy. He lost to a nobody from Arkansas.

Could Barry be a nobody from Illinois who rides in on the wave of debt to raise taxes to pay for our wars? Or will Juan McCant have to do the same? We can always borrow some more from the Chinese (now that they have the 3 of the 4 largest capitalized banks in the world) and our banks sit around with worthless pieces of paper based on no income verification mortgage loans!

We can't get the Bushwackers out of Washingtoon fast enough (and for some reason, the Bushwackers seem to want to get out of there too). But watch what you wish for, the next Prez is going to be a complete loser based on what sh*t he is stepping into...


Bank source:
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601013&sid=aIrcHuN7lHzM&refer=emergingmarkets

http://skorcareer.com.my/blog/10-worlds-largest-banks-list-in-2008/2008/06/18/

[JustRalph]

Sec, Electing McCain won't do a damn thing with a Dem Congress that can over-ride him on everything................

You might get your wish, but Congress will be fully loaded with Dems

[skate]

:ThmbDown: :ThmbDown: http://130.94.230.21/debtclock.html (http://130.94.230.21/debtclock.html)


Did I not hear that Clinton claimed to get us out of Debt???


Where is the proof of that??



When was the last time we were not in debt??? never??



The last time we were out from Debt was a period from 1823 till 1836/outfrom debt.

What followed was a Big Big Big Recession:bang: ;)

Hello down there, debt=growth:jump:

[skate]

Oh yeh, before i forget, during the 90s our Gov. spent 15% of our tax rev. to pay the interest on debt (which gave us growth), while today the gov. spends 9% of our tax money to pay interest on debt. Hello! again!:eek:

[wonatthewire1]

A little from the Minyanville crowd

http://www.minyanville.com/articles/fnm-fre-fannie-Mae-Freddie-Mac/index/a/18346

[ddog]

Does anyone ever wonder why people who seemingly have "all the answers" spend their precious moments posting on horse racing off-topic message boards?

Shouldn't you be out saving the world from itself (or at the very least the United States)?

(And if you wonder why I posted this kind of drivel, it's in response to your equally 'drivelous' "You really need to stay away from sharp objects. beyond bizzare.")


Don't let envy make you jealous.
If you are so offended get a crying towel.
You don't show any need for excuses to post drivel.

Others either.

I noticed you didn't address any of the main points.
Time got you down again?

You agree someone that says debt goes up and down doesn't affect us much is serious or maybe just pot stirring?

grow up



PSPA

never claim to have all the answers , just better ones sometimes.

Yeah, you can see I am spending all my time posting here.

really???

You know THAT how???

drivel indeed!

PPSPA

Most all of that are posted as my opinions , you can feel hurt and take them as THE ANSWERS if you feel the need.

Most message boards I post on are FULL of people's opinions that can be taken as THE ANSWERS if you want to see them that way.

drivelous,,,nah just foolishness

[PaceAdvantage]

Yeah, you can see I am spending all my time posting here.

really???

You know THAT how???

drivel indeed!I never said you spend all of your time posting here. Please note I said you spend "PRECIOUS MOMENTS" posting here when you could be out saving the world.

On second thought, maybe you don't have all the answers after all.

[equicom]

How to stop being in debt, lesson one:

Stop giving your money to other countries.


(jeez....)

[DJofSD]

Stop giving your money to other countries.
Which ones would you put at the top of the list?

[equicom]

Well, I would say "all" but... if I have to pick just one... it would have to be Israel. Root of all your problems, and what do they give you in return? Bagels?

[PaceAdvantage]

Well, I would say "all" but... if I have to pick just one... it would have to be Israel. Root of all your problems, and what do they give you in return? Bagels?Here we go....who didn't see this one coming?

Isn't it odd how some folks can easily poke fun and use racial stereotypes for one set of folks, yet they wouldn't DARE DREAM of using the very SAME type of racial stereotype for another set of folks?

[equicom]

What? How do you get racial stereotyping into it? That's a really left-field play.

This has nothing to do with them being Jews (or whatever they want to identify themselves as).

It has everything to do with the US sending money to a bunch of people who are illegally occupying land that was purchased by the Palestinians a very long time after the original Israelis had willingly abandoned that land (which, according to their own scriptures, was the will of God).

Although in recent times there have been other factors fuelling the animosity towards the US by Arab nations, the major catalyst was always the US support for Israel. Remove that, and you restore quite a lot of good will, even though it will take a long time before the more extreme and crazy elements can let go.

Then they'll be able to turn their attention back to the European "crusaders" which will take quite a lot of heat off the US.

[PaceAdvantage]

What? How do you get racial stereotyping into it? That's a really left-field play.Is it all that left-field?

Your little bagel reference wasn't a racial stereotype for Jews?

And for the record, Bagels weren't invented in Israel, that credit goes to Austria in 1683 although other historic accounts point to Poland as the nation of origin.

[PaceAdvantage]

It has everything to do with the US sending money to a bunch of people who are illegally occupying land that was purchased by the Palestinians a very long time after the original Israelis had willingly abandoned that land (which, according to their own scriptures, was the will of God).Why won't any of those very wealthy Arab nations that comprise the Middle East (plus those non-Arab Iranians) get behind the Palestinians and help them take back "their land?" I'll tell you why...because they really don't give two shits about the Palestinians, that's why.

Although in recent times there have been other factors fuelling the animosity towards the US by Arab nations, the major catalyst was always the US support for Israel. Remove that, and you restore quite a lot of good will, even though it will take a long time before the more extreme and crazy elements can let go.Now why would we do a stupid thing like throw Israel under the bus? On the off chance that it might increase our standing in the Arab (and non-Arab Iranian) community? Are you kidding me? Talk about left-field.

Then they'll be able to turn their attention back to the European "crusaders" which will take quite a lot of heat off the US.Yeah, that's definitely the American way! Duck and run and find the easiest way out of a difficult situation.

There's a reason why the USA still runs the world, and it's definitely not because of thinking like yours.

[Tee]

Is it all that left-field?

Your little bagel reference wasn't a racial stereotype for Jews?

And for the record, Bagels weren't invented in Israel, that credit goes to Austria in 1683 although other historic accounts point to Poland as the nation of origin.

Who made that 1683 bagel in Austria?

[JustRalph]

damn, now I am hungry..................

[equicom]

Your little bagel reference wasn't a racial stereotype for Jews?

No it wasn't. In fact, it was a question, because apart from Bagels, I can't think of much else that Israel has provided to America in return for the oodles of cash being handed to them for no reason.

Quite beside the point, anyway, since I did say that you shouldn't be giving money to anyone else at all. You have more than enough problems in your own country you should be fixing before you "try to take the log out of your brother's eye".

[skate]

dang, now i'm sick.

[PaceAdvantage]

No it wasn't. In fact, it was a question, because apart from Bagels, I can't think of much else that Israel has provided to America in return for the oodles of cash being handed to them for no reason.Do you realize I received "Reported Post" emails from folks asking why I would allow you to post such racial slurs? And this was BEFORE I ever addressed you publicly on the issue. Obviously, I am not alone.

It exposes you for who you are, which only makes my job easier in the long run.

[equicom]

No. It doesn't. There are a lot of crackpots who complain about every little thing that could possibly be interpreted as an insult. It doesn't indicate that any insult was actually intended.

I think it is very petty to take that as a "slur", or consider it "racial". There was no discrimination, hatred, or other sentiments expressed. It was a question of why you should give aid to a country that gives you nothing tangible in return.

My point in mentioning bagels was simply that there is no other obvious token object that would have sufficed. In hindsight, I could have avoided the whole fiasco simply by not mentioning a token object.

But it was not a "bad" thing to do. I certainly do not agree that there was anything in that comment that could have been reasonably interpreted as a slur or insult.

It's interesting that nobody actually posted a comment on the forum saying "I am a jewish person and I am offended by that comment"... and even then, there is some basis upon which to question the eligibility of the complaint, since the so-called "slur" was not referring to jews but to Israel, which as any schoolboy could tell you is a country inhabited by people of diverse religious faiths and not only by Jews. Furthermore, Jews and Israelis are not the only people who make bagels, as even you pointed out that the bagel was an Austrian invention.

And finally, I would like to state once and for all, on the record....

The comments made in the post that has been referred to in this one were not intended as an insult to anybody. If anybody was offended by the comments, I unreservedly apologise for the fact that you felt offended by the comment.

For the benefit of all who read this thread, I would ask that persons who did feel offended please add additional comments to this thread to indicate what specific elements of the comments were considered to be offensive, how, and why.

Doing this will help us to understand your sensitivities to this situation and avoid future conflict. This is also a far better way of dealing with these situations than to bother the webmaster with your complaints. The former remedy fosters empathy and understanding, or at the very least, considered debate and informative discussion. The latter approach only fosters negative sentiment.

[JustRalph]

Did you put on your tap shoes before you wrote that last post? :lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

It's interesting that nobody actually posted a comment on the forum saying "I am a jewish person and I am offended by that comment"... You caught me. I'm making the whole thing up. Nobody emailed me. :rolleyes:

[equicom]

You caught me. I'm making the whole thing up. Nobody emailed me. :rolleyes:

Well, my point was that if they did e-mail you, they're gutless wimps (at the very least). If somebody really cared about the issue, they'd have the courage to stand up publically and declare it openly, not scurry about in the darkness passing secret messages to the webmaster.

[Tom]

Not at all. Many people are not looking for a confrontation but are nonetheless offended by inappropriate crap on a public board. They don't care about your issues, just your presentation of them.

[equicom]

That would be fine but I did not say anything inappropriate or offensive. Sure, some people chose to take offense, but that was their choice to do that, nobody forced them to be offended.

I mean, it is ridiculous for anyone to think that comment was offensive. It's like saying "What has Australia ever given you?... bad movies?"

(and in fact that is more offensive than my original comment could ever be, because firstly it actually implies that the movies are bad - which was not the case regarding the bagels - and of course it is untrue that all Australian movies are bad, because some of them are quite good).

Simply pointing out that Israel has done nothing in return for the money you're giving them does not make my comments offensive. Besides, I apologised for people being offended.

The comment should not even have been offensive to Jews, as I pointed out, because it was not a comment about Jews. It was a comment about Israel.

To say that all Israelis are Jews is like saying that all Indians are Hindus. That really is racial sterotyping. What I said was nothing of the sort, and still nobody has come forward to say that they were offended. Not one of the millions upon millions of people that PA claims read this board has the courage of their faith to come forward and say that they were offended.

Anyway, put an end to it. I apologised already... we should be moving on.

[Tom]

You're the one calling people gutless wimps.

[equicom]

Because they are.

If you believe something strongly enough, you make a stand. You certainly should not go skulking around whinging about things and getting a third party to do your dirty work.

[Tom]

God your are denser than 46 is. I never thought that was possible.
Dirty work? What a joke you are. Seriously, a total joke.

Are the wombats mating and you can't go outside?

[equicom]

You guessed it. Well done.