Kentucky could ban steriods this summer

[highnote]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080709/ap_on_sp_ot/rac_horses_steroids;_ylt=A0WTcXbs03RIPYUBbRSs0NUE

[cj]

I hope bettors don't think these kinds of things effect them. They are for horsemen. As a bettor, what do I give a shit if horses run on steroids or not?

Medication policy changes won't help us. New whipping rules won't help us. Stricter trainer penalties won't help us. The list could go on and on.

When is some news coming that actually helps bettors?

[highnote]

I hope bettors don't think these kinds of things effect them. They are for horsemen. As a bettor, what do I give a shit if horses run on steroids or not?

Medication policy changes won't help us. New whipping rules won't help us. Stricter trainer penalties won't help us. The list could go on and on.

When is some news coming that actually helps bettors?


If you don't think banning steroids will help you then you haven't spent every Saturday in the paddock for a year at NYRA tracks.

You would see everything from scrawny little runts by Storm Cat to muscle bound Schwarzenegger-type Storm Cat colts. I know who I put my money on.

I haven't been to the paddock often in the past several years because my life priorities have changed. But I know that I never feel as confident now when I bet because I don't get the same visual information.

In my opinion, steroids matter. Lasix matters. Bute matters. In fact, the more drugs you can eliminate, the more guesswork that can be taken out of the equation.

[cj]

I understand that, and my post wasn't meant to knock you for posting the link.

In this case, there may be some benefit to bettors, but we are not the reason it is being considered. In this game, some new "cause" always seems to come along to hide the real problems in the game. Synthetic tracks haven't fixed anything, and a steroid ban will have very little effect.

I just get tired of these minor issues being pushed like they are some big deal, while things like a 1970s tote system allowing people to bet after the race is over is barely mentioned.

[so.cal.fan]

http://www.dmtc.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=28270&highlight=&sid=9f6e1f0472e7ba248734cb741dd96cbb

According to clocker/horse owner Bruno DeJulio......they are going to matter big time.
All the horsemen I have spoken to in So. Cal. agree. I don't agree with Bruno on "milkshakes", but he is right on about the effect of steroids, in fact, he understates it, according to one of the leading trainers at Santa Anita.

[cj]

Sounds like he basically agrees with me. It probably won't help, and might hurt.

[highnote]

I understand that, and my post wasn't meant to knock you for posting the link.

In this case, there may be some benefit to bettors, but we are not the reason it is being considered. In this game, some new "cause" always seems to come along to hide the real problems in the game. Synthetic tracks haven't fixed anything, and a steroid ban will have very little effect.

I just get tired of these minor issues being pushed like they are some big deal, while things like a 1970s tote system allowing people to bet after the race is over is barely mentioned.


I hear what you're saying and I don't mean to argue. Pharmaceutical companies who manufacture and sell steriods and vets who administer them will NOT think this is a minor issue. It's big money.

The tote system is a major issue. No one wants to spend the money to fix it.

[john del riccio]

I hope bettors don't think these kinds of things effect them. They are for horsemen. As a bettor, what do I give a shit if horses run on steroids or not?

Medication policy changes won't help us. New whipping rules won't help us. Stricter trainer penalties won't help us. The list could go on and on.

When is some news coming that actually helps bettors?

CJ,

Its even worse, are you going to keep track of which juristictins allow roids & which ones don't ?

Going from roids-on to roids off is a big negative... Whata C-F this is going to turn into...

John

[Tom]

CJ,

Going from roids-on to roids off is a big negative... Whata C-F this is going to turn into...

John

That sound like gelding, John! :eek:
Roids on, though, that's a new one.

[highnote]

In Argentina horses are gelded far less frequently than in the U.S.

If a horse is unruly, maybe gelding it is not the answer. Maybe a horse's unruliness says something about the quality of the person who is caring for the horse?

I believe it was War Admiral's or Citation's owner who said, "If I had gelded all my horses I would have only made one mistake."

Point well taken, but hardly fair to the horse.

[witchdoctor]

I believe it was War Admiral's or Citation's owner who said, "If I had gelded all my horses I would have only made one mistake."

Point well taken, but hardly fair to the horse.

Actually it was the breeder of Native Dancer.

[so.cal.fan]

IF the crackdown on Winstol and Equipoise is making a difference.....I can't figure anyway a horseplayer could take advantage of the situation with the exception of close inspection of horses in the paddock....LIVE....not on TV.

[KMS]

okay, how will past performances of non-drug horses look like vice horses on steroids? More/fewer stunning form reversals, more/fewer layoffs, more/less consistency?

I'm guessing one effect will be a lot more "bounces" off a good last race.

[ElKabong]

SOCAL Fan is right. Horses that were on roids just 10 days ago, those pace figs, speed figs, (temporarily, the workout reports), etc are going to be meaningless in about 10-15 days from now. If it takes (example) 3-4 weeks for the roids to leave a hoss, then some big form reversals are going to take place.

And everyone will blame it on DMR's "surface", just like they do on the del mar board. It will be nothing of the sort. People in the paddock are going to have a nice advantage, one I wish I were there to partake.

IMO....By the early part of the Oak Tree meet, trainers will find a way around this. One way or another.

Bruno hit on some very good points, he's a guy that doesn't post to read his own words.

[so.cal.fan]

It may even be before Oak Tree, El Kabong
I agree with you.....I have tremendous faith in the ingenuity of California trainers......
The purses are huge at Del Mar......big stables who spend big money to win these prizes will probably prevail, and of course, they have the better horses.
Perhaps you people who watch TVG (if they cover this year) will do okay by waiting until one of the better commentators comments that a horse looks good on the track, then making your play, if that is one of your contenders.
That said, if your choices are doing well, regardless, it can be ignored as usual.
It should be interesting.

[cj]

Did I miss something? Is California also banning steroids?

[Niko]

CJ,

Its even worse, are you going to keep track of which juristictins allow roids & which ones don't ?

Going from roids-on to roids off is a big negative... Whata C-F this is going to turn into...

John

I agree 100% John. I've already said to myself that I'll totally stop betting at that point or only play races where all the horses have been racing in one circuit I'll have no idea who's on what cycle and when it started. At least now I just assume they're all on it or when they go to a better barn they'll be getting it. I could be wrong there too?

It becomes a guessing game if ever jurisdiction is different. I would think any betting stables or owners could really use it to their advantage.

I still can't believe that some people don't think steroids make much of a difference...

[ElKabong]

Did I miss something? Is California also banning steroids?

The link SCF posted (by Bruno de Julio) was directly related to the CA rule. Testing began 7/1/08. Warnings to be given early on, then stiffer penalties.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/sports/20080524-9999-1s24horses.html