WHY ALL THE DEMOCRAT BASHING??

[pktruckdriver]

I am curious why all the democrat bashing and blaming in in these posts, there is definetly alot of it going on.

You all know who you are, come on out of the wood-work and show your self proudly.

My God how anyone could claim to be a republican after what GW has done to this country and you wish to praise the man or party as the second coming, why?


I know Bill or Hillary ain't all that or yes him either, but they should be better than GW ever was or could be. Name something good he's done for this country or his party has done, nothing, zip, nada.

Now has the Democrats done anything , no not really, there just as non-productive as your republicans are.


But bashing them seems to be fun here, Just curious?

[Tom]

They deserve it.
They are the enemies of this country.
Cowards, quitters, thieves, liars.


How did you miss all the Bush/REpub bashings?
Or is that alright?

[46zilzal]

But bashing them seems to be fun here, Just curious?
They are incapable of anything else. Johnson was an idiot about the war and the rutabaga was as well. They can't seem to differentiate the person and the deed from a political party and a deed.

[JustRalph]

They deserve it.
They are the enemies of this country.
Cowards, quitters, thieves, liars.


How did you miss all the Bush/REpub bashings?
Or is that alright?

That about sums it up

[Marshall Bennett]

They deserve it.
They are the enemies of this country.
Cowards, quitters, thieves, liars.


How did you miss all the Bush/REpub bashings?
Or is that alright?
... and they hate the United States , only live here because nowhere else in the world could you trash your country and get by with it . they badmouth vertually everything sacred we beleive in , and any basic morals toward family values have long since been left in the gutter .

[BlueShoe]

Because they are not the Democratic Party anymore;they are now the Socialist/Communist Party.It really is that simple,all the other criticism just adds a few more details.

[King Ritchie]

I am curious why all the democrat bashing and blaming in in these posts, there is definetly alot of it going on.

?

You must be kidding! With the likes of Reid, Peloski, Kennedy, Shummer, Durbin, Obama, Clinton we have the makings of the new communist party. These people want Government to take over and with an Iron Fist. We will have gas rationing. They will tell you want to eat, what to wear, what temperature to set your house at. They will indocrtrinate your children. They hate America and what it stands for. They allow people to stomp and spit on the American Flag. They will not allow English to be our official language. They want to dismantle our miltary, stop our missle defense programs, stop new weapons technology. They want government, government and more government to control YOU. We will become the next France, only much worse. Over the next few years this will be an all out war for our freedoms. They have duped millions of people. Obama says "CHANGE", but he never defines what change is.

[jballscalls]

... and they hate the United States , only live here because nowhere else in the world could you trash your country and get by with it . they badmouth vertually everything sacred we beleive in , and any basic morals toward family values have long since been left in the gutter .

The scary thing is he probably believes this.

I know as a liberal, i wake up in the morning and say "Hey how can i hate America today??" Apparently me going to work, paying my taxes, paying my bills, doing volunteer work, spending time with family and and friends is part of my hating America and everything we believe in.

WHAT A CROCK!!

[JustRalph]

The scary thing is he probably believes this.

I know as a liberal, i wake up in the morning and say "Hey how can i hate America today??" Apparently me going to work, paying my taxes, paying my bills, doing volunteer work, spending time with family and and friends is part of my hating America and everything we believe in.

WHAT A CROCK!!


I don't think Marshall is too far off............. Jball, maybe you should re-evaluate what kind of labels you put on yourself.

[Indulto]

... and they hate the United States , only live here because nowhere else in the world could you trash your country and get by with it . they badmouth vertually everything sacred we beleive in , and any basic morals toward family values have long since been left in the gutter .ll tt,
Dem bashing is virtually the only thing you bring to this forum. Consequently your remarks are of little consequence other than to raise the noise level of right wing ranting here.

I'll bet it burned your bottom to see Obama get the nomination yesterday. Get set to watch him garner even more support in the general population because people are sick of proven Rep incompetence, greed, and deceit with very few exceptions.

My guess is that you're a supporter of Tom Delay which would explain everything.

[newtothegame]

I am curious why all the democrat bashing and blaming in in these posts, there is definetly alot of it going on.

You all know who you are, come on out of the wood-work and show your self proudly.

My God how anyone could claim to be a republican after what GW has done to this country and you wish to praise the man or party as the second coming, why?


I know Bill or Hillary ain't all that or yes him either, but they should be better than GW ever was or could be. Name something good he's done for this country or his party has done, nothing, zip, nada.

Now has the Democrats done anything , no not really, there just as non-productive as your republicans are.


But bashing them seems to be fun here, Just curious?

To base the ENTIRE republican party on one president seems a bit unfair...but if you wish to do so becareful what ya wish for. I seem to recall a Carter in office who was ONE HELL OF A PRESIDENT (SARCASM). Should he be the represenative by which the democrats are judged?? Based on your philosophy ...well I would take GW any day of Carter. I also seem to remember a president called Reagan...who do you not use him as your basis for judging a party?? My point is you can find faults in almost everyone based on the SLANT YOU are trying to put on your post.
You go on to say why all the democratic bashing...again YOUR slant!!! Have you not seen all the republican bashing?? Ohhh wait...you dont want to see that side (slanted view).

[jballscalls]

I remember thinking when i first read this site that there was a lot more left bashing than there was right bashing. But members of THE FAB FIVE told me i was only thinking that cause the liberal media was making me believe it.

So we're wrong, there is more right bashing than left. right FAB FIVE???

[dutchboy]

President Osama
Vice President Al Gore
Secretary of Defense Hillary Clinton

Should be amusing to watch the Democrats embarrass themselves in the new few months. All idle talk. Barry Osama has a good line of b s but no content.

[jballscalls]

President Osama
Vice President Al Gore
Secretary of Defense Hillary Clinton

Should be amusing to watch the Democrats embarrass themselves in the new few months. All idle talk. Barry Osama has a good line of b s but no content.

I think you spelled his name wrong, its oBama, oSama is the terrorist we're trying to catch.

[Indulto]

I think you spelled his name wrong, its oBama, oSama is the terrorist we're trying to catch.jbc,
I'm sure db knows the difference. His deliberate substitution is an attempt at cleverness which almost all of us engage in with mixed results.

I think every reference to Bin Laden hurts Reps because of Bush's claim to "not think about him much."

Basically, Dem-bashng is a sport here. And the fact that PA engages in it sets the tone and encourages the usual suspects. At least Tom and JR occasionally offer some worthwhile commentary as lsbets usually does, but the buzzing of the wannabees is definitely getting louder.

[Marshall Bennett]

ll tt,
Dem bashing is virtually the only thing you bring to this forum. Consequently your remarks are of little consequence other than to raise the noise level of right wing ranting here.

I'll bet it burned your bottom to see Obama get the nomination yesterday. Get set to watch him garner even more support in the general population because people are sick of proven Rep incompetence, greed, and deceit with very few exceptions.

My guess is that you're a supporter of Tom Delay which would explain everything.
Didn't burn my bottom at all . He's been odds on for months now . Wonder if your bottom will burn when you when you see what he does to the country if elected . Then again , doubt it would bother you the least ...

[46zilzal]

Politicians are OUT FOR THEMSELVES in the guise of helping their electorate. ALL OF THEM.

One tries to find the least offensive.

[lsbets]

Indulto, I'm glad you think I make worthwhile comments, but then you also admire 46's posting, so I should probably take that as an insult. ;)

Seriously, I very rarely see anything of value coming from the loudest lefties on here. The folks who used to post from the left with sense seem to have given up as their voices were drowned out by the cartoon nonsense that became the norm.

There is no reason to get worked up about Obama. Outside of the media love affair, he is completely unelectable. John McCain will end up being President by default, he might even end up with 300 electoral votes. I cannot believe that anyone takes Obama seriously when he offers empty rhetoric and slogans from children's cartoons. "Yes We Can" - that's Bob the Builder. My son might have voted for Obama when he was 3, but he outgrew it, he's 6 now.

[46zilzal]

The presidential candidate of course will lose the South no differently than if he were running in 1870 as if it were today.

I find it difficult to believe that separation in people, but then I recall many of my relatives in that neck of the woods are just as racist today as they were when I first visited New Orleans in the late 50's and saw segregation for the first time. IT is taught but one would think the more enlightened would have reasoned it as stupidity. Glad I never was there during my growing up years.

"Since announcing his presidential campaign in February 2007, Obama has emphasized ending the Iraq war, increasing energy independence, decreasing the influence of lobbyists, and providing universal health care as top national priorities."

WOW real dangerous STUFF!!

Having just watched Schindler's List again the bashing here is much akin to the style the Nazi's put out in their time.

[riskman]

This is not the time for "politics as usual" at all. The Bush Regime long ago took anything resembling "politics as usual" off the table. Get that through your head already. The current presidential campaign -- an utter farce, a multi-billion-dollar carnival of despair and deception -- is meaningless. Anyone who pays attention to it for more than two minutes a day is wasting their time. Do you think that the candidates -- any of them -- are putting all their cards on the table? Do you think that anything that any of them is saying right now can be taken on trust, or will be translated into actual policy once they are in office?

The brutal fact of the matter is that the more likely they are to actually change things in a fundamental way, the less likely it is that they will ever be allowed to take office, or come anywhere near it.A person who breaks in from the outside and spearheads a mass movement that seriously questions the social, economic and military underpinnings of the America will most likely be gunned down. Why would a genuine agent for genuine change want to be associated with such farces – and with such corrupted and compromised parties – in the first place?

We all know that nothing is going to happen. Because it would call into question the whole greasy system upon which all of our national leaders have slithered to the top. It would undermine the conglomeration in which our elites live and move and have their being.

The history of the past seven years has shown that the American people, as a whole, cannot be stirred enough--(their memories are short) even by the most brazen outrages. Not by the wholesale assault on their liberties; not by the rot of their roads, bridges, towns and cities; not by the massive perversion of their electoral system; not by the deaths of their sons and daughters, their friends and neighbors, in a war of aggression they were tricked into by deliberate deceptions; not by their government's embrace of torture, concentration camps, secret prisons, and death squads; not even by the murder – in their own name – of more than one million Iraqis.

[46zilzal]

Exactly what was said a long time ago:"accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."

Change scares the crap out of people even if there is NOTHING to be said for staying the course. The Chinese, in their infinite wisdom, produced the I CHING long ago as a way to understand the wisdom and nature of change.

[46zilzal]

I never thought I would see the day the Richard Milhous Nixon was not the worst president in my life. The DICK was pitiful, but in comparison to the stupid, moronic excuse of a leader in office now, the comparison is made easy: the rutabaga wins hands down as the worst most incompetent prez in my lifetime. He comes in 2nd , 3rd and 4th as well.

[Marshall Bennett]

I never thought I would see the day the Richard Milhous Nixon was not the worst president in my life. The DICK was pitiful, but in comparison to the stupid, moronic excuse of a leader in office now, the comparison is made easy: the rutabaga wins hands down as the worst most incompetent prez in my lifetime. He comes in 2nd , 3rd and 4th as well.
both elected 2 terms ...

[46zilzal]

both elected 2 terms ...
Folks have really bad taste but with what we now know about voter fraud the rutabaga may have stolen one of those.

[dutchboy]

No, I spelled it correctly. The best chance to remove Osama was during Clintons regime when he refused to send in cruise missles when Osama was located in Afganistan. Bubba was too busy playing with the fat girls to make a decision but it was typical Democratic action.

I think you spelled his name wrong, its oBama, oSama is the terrorist we're trying to catch.

[HUSKER55]

Let's see, Obama gets the delegates and Hillary says "count the votes" and we hear the same old tired tune.

She still won't admit defeat. On MSNBC even some of her suporters are saying give it up.

As I have said before, the crap coming up the pike is no different than the crap going down the pike. If you believe any of those bastards genuinly care about you then you are on drugs.

If Obama gets elected it will be the beginning of the end of America. If McCain gets elected at least he will sleep thru it and do no harm.

[Valuist]

both elected 2 terms ...

That makes it all the more difficult to take.

[Valuist]

[QUOTE=HUSKER55] If you believe any of those bastards genuinly care about you then you are on drugs.

/QUOTE]

Yeah, and Bush has shown he cares so much about everyone else :rolleyes:

[JustRalph]

The presidential candidate of course will lose the South no differently than if he were running in 1870 as if it were today.

I find it difficult to believe that separation in people, but then I recall many of my relatives in that neck of the woods are just as racist today as they were when I first visited New Orleans in the late 50's and saw segregation for the first time. IT is taught but one would think the more enlightened would have reasoned it as stupidity. Glad I never was there during my growing up years.

"Since announcing his presidential campaign in February 2007, Obama has emphasized ending the Iraq war, increasing energy independence, decreasing the influence of lobbyists, and providing universal health care as top national priorities."

WOW real dangerous STUFF!!

Having just watched Schindler's List again the bashing here is much akin to the style the Nazi's put out in their time.

nice, you just called a bunch of people Nazi's............ wow! aren't you slick............. get real.

[46zilzal]

nice, you just called a bunch of people Nazi's............ wow! aren't you slick............. get real.
The STYLE is much akin to the Nazi's. STYLE is not membership in the National Socialists Party. CLOSE minded, script following accusations are in that style and you, in particular, have fine tuned that to an the art.

[46zilzal]

Script continues, as hardly original, BLAME it all on them Furr-ners.

[pktruckdriver]

I know Bill or Hillary ain't all that or yes him either, but they should be better than GW ever was or could be. Name something good he's done for this country or his party has done, nothing, zip, nada.

All these post's made here and not one could answer that one question, could they, of course not.

Also I have said that both sides deserve bashing and blame for what they have done and allowed to be done to this country on their watch, they're all accountable as far as I'm concerned.


Now to think Obama will not be elected is absurd, I knew it was over the very minute that Oprah endorsed Obama for president,TRY TO PROVE me wrong on this, YOU CAN'T.

I admit he scares me, he is really unknown to me, but he will be the next president of this country, unless he dies , which I am not wishing upon him, but that would be the only thing that would prevent him from becoming our next prez, is death.

And as far as GW goes, I'll take Carter anyday over him, not Reagan, but GW for sure, I mean I'd love to go back 8 yrs,mY God we come down so far in these 7 1/2yrs, who else can you blame, GW or the party or both, or even both parties, most likely,for allowing it to happen.

Yep how'd you like those apples.

[ddog]

No, I spelled it correctly. The best chance to remove Osama was during Clintons regime when he refused to send in cruise missles when Osama was located in Afganistan. Bubba was too busy playing with the fat girls to make a decision but it was typical Democratic action.


the best chance was when we knocked out the taliban.
of course, if you want to use 9/11 as a yardstick, then yeah, it was clinton, but i got news fer ya, cruise wasn't going to do even then.

[PaceAdvantage]

I am curious why all the democrat bashing and blaming in in these posts, there is definetly alot of it going on.It's the Newtonian "equal but opposite" reaction to all the Republican bashing that has gone on here...but since you probably think Republicans are evil-incarnate, I suppose you feel they DESERVE all the bashing they get HERE (after all, they are responsible for all your misery, correct?).

Or haven't you noticed all the Republican bashing threads? Maybe your browser mysteriously blocks them....

[JustRalph]

The STYLE is much akin to the Nazi's. STYLE is not membership in the National Socialists Party. CLOSE minded, script following accusations are in that style and you, in particular, have fine tuned that to an the art.

yeah, I know, I am a Nazi............... :sleeping:

[PaceAdvantage]

yeah, I know, I am a Nazi............... :sleeping:No, you're a Nazi thug looking to taze anyone who looks at you funny....get it straight!

[jonnielu]

Now has the Democrats done anything , no not really, there just as non-productive as your republicans are.


But bashing them seems to be fun here, Just curious?

Patrick,

It is what the Democrats have produced, that is the problem. What they have produced is the exact same tyranny that we had a revolution over 234 years ago.

They have replaced your Republican form of government with a dictatorship that revolves around the dollar, in which the politician of either party is king four years at a time. They come on television and dictate to your state legislature what laws they will pass. And it goes un-noticed.

All of this from a democrat vision of you trading in your rights and your authority so that you can participate as their property in what they call the income tax system.

At least there have been republicans that have tried to tell you this in recent years, but at this point, they are just as guilty as the democrats. But, the real blame has to lie at the feet of the people that believe in the democrat fee lunch program. Someone pays for everything, and usually it is you.

jdl

[Tom]

I never thought I would see the day the Richard Milhous Nixon was not the worst president in my life. The DICK was pitiful, but in comparison to the stupid, moronic excuse of a leader in office now, the comparison is made easy: the rutabaga wins hands down as the worst most incompetent prez in my lifetime. He comes in 2nd , 3rd and 4th as well.

Yes, the worst was Jimmy Carter. And now Obama is here to serve his second term. :lol::lol:

[Marshall Bennett]

... that and to do his first all over again . :p

[pktruckdriver]

All I can Say about this is that

1st. my browser works fine Bossman

2nd my problems come from my government, not 1 party in particular, ok

3rd. Is this government by the people, for the people, yes it is, has it gotten
away from that, yes it has, could it be fixed , of course it could, now
will it get fixed, probally not, america lost it cojones, it's will power

4th Still no has answered the question, name 1 thing good GW did , you can't

5th Obama scares me as our next president, I hope me fears are unfounded

[46zilzal]

name 1 thing good GW did , you can't


HE married well.

[Lefty]

pttruck? Name one thing good GW did, you say?
Quite easy. After 9-11 the economy had the potential to really slip into the toilet. He kept it going at record levels for about 7 years. Of course if you read nothing but mainstream papersand listen to mainstream tv, he gets nada credit for it.
2. He lowered taxes and that spurred the economy. All the naysayers did not sway him. The man stuck to his guns and he was right.
3. There has not been another tewrrorist attack in this country since 9-11 and that's directly because he has had the balls to engage them in Iraq and has weakened them considerably. Everyone that's been to Iraq recently says we're now winning this war. Also the policies GW has put in place has helped thwart many attacks in this country. This 3rd thing, in my view, qualifies him as a great President. Now stick that up your tailpipe!

[King Ritchie]

Remember the Jimmy Carter years? Mortgages over 20% interest, gas lines. Well with the dems in power the next 4 years you'll just wish you had Jimmy back. It will be much worse except NOW we'll get terror attacks on our own soil. I just hope we have a country left for the conservatives to take back.

The Commies are coming!

[Lefty]

King, boy do I. I bght a mobile home and pd 19% interest and the bastards even stuck in a rule of 76 on me. I was lucky after 8 yrs to get out from under it and bght a old boarded up house cheap, and I still livein it.

[46zilzal]

Remember the Jimmy Carter years? Mortgages over 20% interest, gas lines. Well with the dems in power the next 4 years you'll just wish you had Jimmy back. It will be much worse except NOW we'll get terror attacks on our own soil. I just hope we have a country left for the conservatives to take back.

The Commies are coming!
They are not around anymore,,,,excuse me, THEY NEVER WERE.

[ddog]

King, boy do I. I bght a mobile home and pd 19% interest and the bastards even stuck in a rule of 76 on me. I was lucky after 8 yrs to get out from under it and bght a old boarded up house cheap, and I still livein it.

there's your problem.

nobody forced you to buy aything and actually sign a deal with 19% interest.
My God!
I would have slept in a tent or a truck first, and by the way I did back in the day and would again before I would bend over for that deal.

You know, there isn't a commandment that thou MUST OWN a home.
Many times the sensible thing to do (like now) would be to stay out of the market and keep your powder dry.

The buy to rent cost ratio is way unfavourable now.


Carter ain't coming back and neither is the boom housing era for many years(decades).

[ddog]

pttruck? Name one thing good GW did, you say?
Quite easy. After 9-11 the economy had the potential to really slip into the toilet. He kept it going at record levels for about 7 years. Of course if you read nothing but mainstream papersand listen to mainstream tv, he gets nada credit for it.
2. He lowered taxes and that spurred the economy. All the naysayers did not sway him. The man stuck to his guns and he was right.
3. There has not been another tewrrorist attack in this country since 9-11 and that's directly because he has had the balls to engage them in Iraq and has weakened them considerably. Everyone that's been to Iraq recently says we're now winning this war. Also the policies GW has put in place has helped thwart many attacks in this country. This 3rd thing, in my view, qualifies him as a great President. Now stick that up your tailpipe!


taxes without reduced spending was the greatest mistake even more so than Iraq no matter how it turns out.
I know you can't get it.
But you are now and will be paying many times over for what little in tax breaks you think you got.
To assume the country stops when you do is not the attitude that built what we have.

[ddog]

Patrick,

It is what the Democrats have produced, that is the problem. What they have produced is the exact same tyranny that we had a revolution over 234 years ago.

They have replaced your Republican form of government with a dictatorship that revolves around the dollar, in which the politician of either party is king four years at a time. They come on television and dictate to your state legislature what laws they will pass. And it goes un-noticed.

All of this from a democrat vision of you trading in your rights and your authority so that you can participate as their property in what they call the income tax system.

At least there have been republicans that have tried to tell you this in recent years, but at this point, they are just as guilty as the democrats. But, the real blame has to lie at the feet of the people that believe in the democrat fee lunch program. Someone pays for everything, and usually it is you.

jdl

extremly selective memory or you are very young.
there have been many DIMS along the same lines.
Maybe you just can't hear them.

No, if one side IS demonstrably wrong , but seems to tell you what they want to do and then tries to do some of it and the other side which you seem to imply is mainly goodnes and light ,even recently(?) but when in power does almost exatly the same or worse as the commies, then the real worst is of course easy to see if you have "eyes" left outside the spin machines.

[ddog]

no this is not what is needed.
no more fluf up of the home mess.
gvt stay out and get out of what you are in as fast as possible.
let's try the market for once right here!



“The fact that new-home sales are up slightly from a dismal beginning to the spring home buying season in March isn’t much to celebrate,” said Sandy Dunn, president of the National Association of Home Builders (NAHB) and a home builder from Point Pleasant, W. Va. “We still need a great deal of help from the Administration and Capitol Hill to halt the downward trends in home sales and house prices that are producing such a drag on our nation’s economy and disrupting financial markets.”

rest is below, laughable absolute siilyness.
no recession(PA) , market off bottom(sa) and still need the commie props huh!


http://www.reuters.com/article/blogBurst/investing?type=hotStocksNews&w1=B7ovpm21IaDoL40ZFnNfGe&w2=B7pJeHult9GszE37UXlSpmUm&src=blogBurst_investingNews&bbPostId=BBcuQI6d5owjAH5qJk43SrCCzADVfRRqKjGuCz48P X3umrhDB&bbParentWidgetId=B7gSUbux1hpbz8uOa7TWsLnV

[Tom]

:lol: Looks like some here have decided to give us real world examples of why the dems are bashed with thier new postings! :lol:

[Marshall Bennett]

One thing for sure , they have a lot of time on their hands .

[dav4463]

pttruck? Name one thing good GW did, you say?
Quite easy. After 9-11 the economy had the potential to really slip into the toilet. He kept it going at record levels for about 7 years. Of course if you read nothing but mainstream papersand listen to mainstream tv, he gets nada credit for it.
2. He lowered taxes and that spurred the economy. All the naysayers did not sway him. The man stuck to his guns and he was right.
3. There has not been another tewrrorist attack in this country since 9-11 and that's directly because he has had the balls to engage them in Iraq and has weakened them considerably. Everyone that's been to Iraq recently says we're now winning this war. Also the policies GW has put in place has helped thwart many attacks in this country. This 3rd thing, in my view, qualifies him as a great President. Now stick that up your tailpipe!

I like Bush. :ThmbUp:

[wonatthewire1]

You must be kidding! With the likes of Reid, Peloski, Kennedy, Shummer, Durbin, Obama, Clinton we have the makings of the new communist party. These people want Government to take over and with an Iron Fist. We will have gas rationing. They will tell you want to eat, what to wear, what temperature to set your house at. They will indocrtrinate your children. They hate America and what it stands for. They allow people to stomp and spit on the American Flag. They will not allow English to be our official language. They want to dismantle our miltary, stop our missle defense programs, stop new weapons technology. They want government, government and more government to control YOU. We will become the next France, only much worse. Over the next few years this will be an all out war for our freedoms. They have duped millions of people. Obama says "CHANGE", but he never defines what change is.


...maybe that will happen because the govt is continuing to tap your telephone conversations...hmmmmmmm?

:lol:

[wonatthewire1]

Man, all you old women are criers

Too funny - y'all got guns - whatcha worried about?

:cool:

[Lefty]

Same old lib bovine feces. Tom, you're right, they provide us with real life examples.
No I didn't have to buy the mobile home. I could have continued to live in a crappy apartment. There were no better loans to be found and you blame the consumer? Pure unadulterated liberalism.
The tax cuts saved the economy when it was at its most precarious. I understand it doesn't fit with your lib agenda.
Yeah, we got guns and we may just need em.

[pktruckdriver]

Lefty I'd like to share what you been smoking, and we both canuse my tailpipe,ok.


Dave You're got every right to like GW, go right ahead, ok

Now ddog

extremly selective memory or you are very young.
there have been many DIMS along the same lines.
Maybe you just can't hear them.

No, if one side IS demonstrably wrong , but seems to tell you what they want to do and then tries to do some of it and the other side which you seem to imply is mainly goodnes and light ,even recently(?) but when in power does almost exatly the same or worse as the commies, then the real worst is of course easy to see if you have "eyes" left outside the spin machines.

Somebody please help me , WHAT'D HE SAY, no dis-repect meant, serioulsy

[ddog]

Same old lib bovine feces. Tom, you're right, they provide us with real life examples.
No I didn't have to buy the mobile home. I could have continued to live in a crappy apartment. There were no better loans to be found and you blame the consumer? Pure unadulterated liberalism.
The tax cuts saved the economy when it was at its most precarious. I understand it doesn't fit with your lib agenda.
Yeah, we got guns and we may just need em.


I wasn't blaming the "consumer". Just stating facts.

You signed the deal, you posted it as if that was Carter's fault that you had to sign it.

So, since no good loans were avail in the last couple of years for all these nuts that signed and are now out on their ass , is that Bushes fault?

After all, you can't blame the consumer.

I love it how you blame your poor descision on the prez and the dims.

Lefty , you are a hoot.

I have seen very few posts anywhere of a more lib nature than yours.

Nothing was my fault, it was the gvt that victimized me and that evil loan guy.

the only thing you would hit with a gun is your dog or yourself, or your crazy uncle locked in the basement, if you shoot as straight as you reason, I want to be sure to be right in front of you.

lock and load, Lefty lock and load.
you wouldn't know what hit you.

[ddog]

Lefty I'd like to share what you been smoking, and we both canuse my tailpipe,ok.


Dave You're got every right to like GW, go right ahead, ok

Now ddog

extremly selective memory or you are very young.
there have been many DIMS along the same lines.
Maybe you just can't hear them.

No, if one side IS demonstrably wrong , but seems to tell you what they want to do and then tries to do some of it and the other side which you seem to imply is mainly goodnes and light ,even recently(?) but when in power does almost exatly the same or worse as the commies, then the real worst is of course easy to see if you have "eyes" left outside the spin machines.

Somebody please help me , WHAT'D HE SAY, no dis-repect meant, serioulsy

pk,
i mean ......

DIMS - advertise their bad crap and try to do it if in.
Pugs last few years - advertise their less bad crap - do other bad crap once in.

[wonatthewire1]

I wasn't blaming the "consumer". Just stating facts.

You signed the deal, you posted it as if that was Carter's fault that you had to sign it.

So, since no good loans were avail in the last couple of years for all these nuts that signed and are now out on their ass , is that Bushes fault?

After all, you can't blame the consumer.

I love it how you blame your poor descision on the prez and the dims.

Lefty , you are a hoot.

I have seen very few posts anywhere of a more lib nature than yours.

Nothing was my fault, it was the gvt that victimized me and that evil loan guy.

the only thing you would hit with a gun is your dog or yourself, or your crazy uncle locked in the basement, if you shoot as straight as you reason, I want to be sure to be right in front of you.

lock and load, Lefty lock and load.
you wouldn't know what hit you.


Don't feel too bad ddog - that mobile home deal guy's only deal that month was on that mobile home - and Jimmy sent him a signed pic congratulating him on invigorating the economy.

[pktruckdriver]

DDOG


You don't mean political promises do you, everyone knows they are never to be taken serious, Is that what you meant.

Or is it the crap they try to get thru the house , or so they say anyway, with never the intention of anything ever getting anything done??

Maybe I am still not getting it, but I'm trying to.

[ddog]

oh and your tax cuts and most precarious is hillarous.

You and GM have a lot of the same ideas.

You see how it worked out for Gm so far.

If tax cuts were paid for , or anything was paid for then I would be fine with it.

They were not so that was a huge mistake.

Just as running a war that you won't pay for is a traitor move.

Again, I say , suck it up and give up the extra coffee a day from the tax cut you got and get with a CONSERVATIVE program, pay for what you use, don't dump it on the next gen.

[Lefty]

That away guys, overlook the argument that Carter was a bad pres and that 19% was exorbitent, but if we wanted anything we had to pay it, and demean me. That's all you got.

[ddog]

DDOG


You don't mean political promises do you, everyone knows they are never to be taken serious, Is that what you meant.

Or is it the crap they try to get thru the house , or so they say anyway, with never the intention of anything ever getting anything done??

Maybe I am still not getting it, but I'm trying to.

Sorry, paint me the last of the goon-idealists.

When they say they are going to cut spending, i think one should not raise spending, but at least keep level spending.
When they say , we need a new energy policy, it's not enough to cry about wacko lefties that keep us from doing it

Just one of many examples.

probably a topic not worth posting to start with.

[Lefty]

ddog, your unsound economics is laughable. Tax cuts pd for. By what higher taxes that actualy stifle what's coming in to the IRS? How do you escape the logic that tax cuts led to record collections by the IRS? I guess you have to be a lib to understandthis kind of fuzzy thinking.

[ddog]

That away guys, overlook the argument that Carter was a bad pres and that 19% was exorbitent, but if we wanted anything we had to pay it, and demean me. That's all you got.

Lefty, you demeaned yourself by taking that deal.
I agree Carter , while in the last couple of years was not a good prez, i did not vote for him.

I also agree that 19% was outrageous.

I don't agree as you don't either that the Prez can do a lot about setting rates or gas prices.

the prices now of gas are almost exactly the same when adjusted as they were back then.

Bush can't drop them and neither could Carter.

[wonatthewire1]

That away guys, overlook the argument that Carter was a bad pres and that 19% was exorbitent, but if we wanted anything we had to pay it, and demean me. That's all you got.

Unfortunately Lefty, there's been a lot of bad presidents

I think we're going to find out how bad a fed reserve chairman Greenspan was - yet the guy walked on DC water. Tuning out 95% of the political scene works well for me at least

[Lefty]

taxes without reduced spending was the greatest mistake even more so than Iraq no matter how it turns out.
I know you can't get it.
But you are now and will be paying many times over for what little in tax breaks you think you got.
To assume the country stops when you do is not the attitude that built what we have.
Those tax cuts kept this country from slipping into a depression right after 9-11. I agree we need reduced spending that's why we need to get rid of earmarks, several social prgms etc. But the cuts were needed and the record economy that followed proves it.

[ddog]

ddog, your unsound economics is laughable. Tax cuts pd for. By what higher taxes that actualy stifle what's coming in to the IRS? How do you escape the logic that tax cuts led to record collections by the IRS? I guess you have to be a lib to understandthis kind of fuzzy thinking.


LESS SPENDING IS HOW YOU PAY FOR THEM.
LESS SPENDING IS HOW YOU PAY FOR THEM.

I didn't know that needed to be explained again.

Left, pls , for your own sanity , and to not demean yourself anymore, i beg you stop now. PLS.

record economy, as compared to what exactly.
I didn't realize the economy stopped in 2005?

there was ZERO chance ZERO of slipping into a depression.
no way no how no chance.

It's like saying we were going slip into depression after Pearl Harbor.

frankly the blubbering about 9/11 in this light is the whimper of child in the night.
We are tougher than that, always.
have some faith.




truce.

[wonatthewire1]

Volker was the Fed Chairman under Carter and reappointed by Reagan - his take was that inflation had to be brought under control - therefore the higher rates. That is why there is a lot of debate on whether the govt suppresses inflation rates currently and the argument of why take out food/energy when people have to buy both of those?

We may have to bite the bullet again with this Fed - inflation, no matter what the govt numbers show now - is showing up on the people's bottom line

[chickenhead]

inflation hit 12% I believe under Nixon, the guy who brought us gov't price controls on wages and domestic oil production. Good move Dick.

appointing Volker and having him jack the rates up was about the best thing Carter did as pres. Like ddog said, when rates are 20%...that's kind of a clue not to buy.

[ddog]

Volker was the Fed Chairman under Carter and reappointed by Reagan - his take was that inflation had to be brought under control - therefore the higher rates. That is why there is a lot of debate on whether the govt suppresses inflation rates currently and the argument of why take out food/energy when people have to buy both of those?

We may have to bite the bullet again with this Fed - inflation, no matter what the govt numbers show now - is showing up on the people's bottom line

Volcker was correct then and he has been correct on the current stuff too.
The nbr one thing to guard against is always inflation.

it is a silent killer of eveything good in a fiat economy.

a fact no doubt.


lefty can only see things through a political prism so he is very limited at times.

FREE LEFTY FREE LEFTY.
:)

it happens.

[ddog]

inflation hit 12% I believe under Nixon, the guy who brought us gov't price controls on wages and domestic oil production. Good move Dick.

appointing Volker and having him jack the rates up was about the best thing Carter did as pres. Like ddog said, when rates are 20%...that's kind of a clue not to buy.

Dick was a true weird dude, that's for sure.

[Lefty]

wow, ddog, how do you go from interest rates to gas prices. Funny how the interest ratres dropped way down after Reagan became Pres.
I took the deal cause I didn't like apt living but it doesn't mean i had to like it and does not mean i cannot condemn Carter for it. I lived there 8 yrs and then bght a home. I didn't ask the govt to bail me out.

[Lefty]

Sorry, paint me the last of the goon-idealists.

When they say they are going to cut spending, i think one should not raise spending, but at least keep level spending.
When they say , we need a new energy policy, it's not enough to cry about wacko lefties that keep us from doing it

Just one of many examples.

probably a topic not worth posting to start with.
Did you ever hear of baseline budgeting? It does not give inspiration for any dept to cut anything. We have to rid ourselves of earmarks and the idea of putting pork into important bills.

[chickenhead]

Funny how the interest ratres dropped way down after Reagan became Pres.

You mean they didn't have to stay at 20% forever? That's a shocker. :lol:

[Lefty]

ddog, I agree that we need less spending and that enhances tax cuts but doesn't pay for them. The increased busainessfrom tax cuts lead to increased jobs and increased revenues to the IRs and that's fact.
When you say I demean myself and personal things of that nature does not permit me to accept youyr truce.

[Lefty]

chick,only if Carter had been a 2nd termer.
And yes, my loan remained at 19%, because it's almost impossible to refinance a mobile home on leased land. But ol lefty found his own solution.
I educated myself on howto find real estate deals and did it.
And you say 20% a clue not to buy...
That certainly stimulates the economy, doesn't it? Say what?

[ddog]

wow, ddog, how do you go from interest rates to gas prices. Funny how the interest ratres dropped way down after Reagan became Pres.
I took the deal cause I didn't like apt living but it doesn't mean i had to like it and does not mean i cannot condemn Carter for it. I lived there 8 yrs and then bght a home. I didn't ask the govt to bail me out.

you condem Carter because you didn't like apt living.
ok. got it. agree.
i didn't go from rates to gas , i tried to show you what a prez affects.
they do not control the rates, sorry.

did the rates go down under Bush because he lowered them?
Before they were lowered had he raised them?

You make no distinction , economically , between now and when Carter or Reagan was in office?

Nothing in the world has changed?

that's some baseline you are basing your reasoning on.

I may have underestimated your economic prowess!

Oh and you need to look at your baseline budgeting again.
it don't work like you say and generally we don't get budgets anymore, just signings and continuing resolutions.


Even if we stuck to the baseline we would have spent many less dollars in the last 7 years on crap and foolishness.

The gvt should be shutdown to control spending if that's what it takes.

[ddog]

chick,only if Carter had been a 2nd termer.
And yes, my loan remained at 19%, because it's almost impossible to refinance a mobile home on leased land. But ol lefty found his own solution.
I educated myself on howto find real estate deals and did it.
And you say 20% a clue not to buy...
That certainly stimulates the economy, doesn't it? Say what?

yes it does, it stimulates the economy to get back to sanity.
if you don't buy prices come down, then you buy.

Oh and ol Left, let me give you some advice I implemented as a 20 year old, BUY the land first, then build on it.
Amazing how much better deal you can get.

to each his own, you did it , if your happy with it ....

oh and your not demeaning yourself now anymore.
i realize now.

[PaceAdvantage]

4th Still no has answered the question, name 1 thing good GW did , you can'tWell, let's see. While the media was telling us in the aftermath of 9/11 that MORE ATTACKS WERE CERTAINLY ON THE WAY in the weeks and months to come....this is just the start of Al-Queda's WAR ON AMERICA, GWB went proactive and invaded Afghanistan and Iraq. No more attacks going on seven years now....that's a long time....

I guess he did something right after all. It took the big wake up call, but that's what happens when all the smaller wake-up calls during Clinton went unanswered as well....

[PaceAdvantage]

Maybe I am still not getting it, but I'm trying to.No you're not. Stop fibbing.

[ddog]

Well, let's see. While the media was telling us in the aftermath of 9/11 that MORE ATTACKS WERE CERTAINLY ON THE WAY in the weeks and months to come....this is just the start of Al-Queda's WAR ON AMERICA, GWB went proactive and invaded Afghanistan and Iraq. No more attacks going on seven years now....that's a long time....

I guess he did something right after all. It took the big wake up call, but that's what happens when all the smaller wake-up calls during Clinton went unanswered as well....

Afg was fine , would have been nice to commit and finish it before proacting into Iraq.
that was enough.

[ddog]

Well, let's see. While the media was telling us in the aftermath of 9/11 that MORE ATTACKS WERE CERTAINLY ON THE WAY in the weeks and months to come....this is just the start of Al-Queda's WAR ON AMERICA, GWB went proactive and invaded Afghanistan and Iraq. No more attacks going on seven years now....that's a long time....

I guess he did something right after all. It took the big wake up call, but that's what happens when all the smaller wake-up calls during Clinton went unanswered as well....

Once again, the media wasn't the only one shouting this.

I seem to recall some others involved.

oh well, you don't need to be even handed, it's your dime.

So, you think another call is needed to wake up the DIMS?

[chickenhead]

And you say 20% a clue not to buy...
That certainly stimulates the economy, doesn't it? Say what?

That's the entire point Left, inflation had to be killed and that's what it took to do it. Once it's killed, and sanity comes back...then the economy can get back on track, but not until.

Like I've said before, sometimes you've got to take some medicine to get better, even if it tastes bad. 20% interest rates was the medicine then. Now, it's 30% housing price declines. A few years back, it was 50% stock market losses.

It's always something.

We seem to have a history of refusing to take our medicine. We don't act like big boys very often.

[Lefty]

right right. We just sit for 4 yrs and refuse to buy anything.
No dog, Carter wasn't a bad pres because I didn't like apt living. He was just a bad pres on many lvls. The fact that changed dramatically when Reagan took the helm is proof positive.
And yes, yes and yes again, spending needs to be controlled. Problem with you is you won't take yes for an answer.

[Tom]

appointing Volker and having him jack the rates up was about the best thing Carter did as pres. Like ddog said, when rates are 20%...that's kind of a clue not to buy.

And of course the BEST thing Jimmy "the Hammer" Carter did as president was leave the WH.:rolleyes:

[chickenhead]

And of course the BEST thing Jimmy "the Hammer" Carter did as president was leave the WH.:rolleyes:

hey I don't necessarily disagree, I don't see a lot of bright spots in his record. Of course that goes for Ford and Nixon, and dare I say many more of our most recent, also. Being worthless isn't exactly a distinguishing characteristic when it comes to Presidents, or politicians in general. Hell, in people.

[ddog]

right right. We just sit for 4 yrs and refuse to buy anything.
No dog, Carter wasn't a bad pres because I didn't like apt living. He was just a bad pres on many lvls. The fact that changed dramatically when Reagan took the helm is proof positive.
And yes, yes and yes again, spending needs to be controlled. Problem with you is you won't take yes for an answer.

no my f**kin problem is that no one will DO IT.
THEY ALL SAY THEY WILL.
b*st*rds. scum pos liars all of them.

I hope there is a just universe, they will fry.

[ddog]

right right. We just sit for 4 yrs and refuse to buy anything.
No dog, Carter wasn't a bad pres because I didn't like apt living. He was just a bad pres on many lvls. The fact that changed dramatically when Reagan took the helm is proof positive.
And yes, yes and yes again, spending needs to be controlled. Problem with you is you won't take yes for an answer.

I know you won't believe this , but given the choice of "buying" at 19% a depreciating asset that I could live without or waiting, I would wait.


just me.

[Tom]

hey I don't necessarily disagree, I don't see a lot of bright spots in his record. Of course that goes for Ford and Nixon, and dare I say many more of our most recent, also. Being worthless isn't exactly a distinguishing characteristic when it comes to Presidents, or politicians in general. Hell, in people.

Chick, at this point, I would love to upgrade to a "worthless" president.:mad:

[JustRalph]

anybody who lived through the Carter era knows that the current economy is head and shoulders above the Carter era.

The only President ever attacked by a Swamp Rabbit...........

http://www.narsil.org/politics/carter/killer_rabbit.html

http://www.narsil.org/politics/carter/rabbit_original_750x564b.jpg

[NJ Stinks]

Well, let's see. While the media was telling us in the aftermath of 9/11 that MORE ATTACKS WERE CERTAINLY ON THE WAY in the weeks and months to come....this is just the start of Al-Queda's WAR ON AMERICA, GWB went proactive and invaded Afghanistan and Iraq. No more attacks going on seven years now....that's a long time....

I guess he did something right after all. It took the big wake up call, but that's what happens when all the smaller wake-up calls during Clinton went unanswered as well....

Over 4,000 American soldiers have been killed in Iraq. Thousands more have been injured severely. I'm not even sure how many innocent Iraqi's have been killed.

How many Americans were killed on 9-11? Is there another country in the world that had over 4,000 citizens killed by Middle Eastern terrorists since 9-11? How about ever?

If this is Bush's shining moment, I should jump up and down with joy on the golf course when I shoot 102.

[PaceAdvantage]

Over 4,000 American soldiers have been killed in Iraq.Over 5 years. That's a pretty low average for a war. Look up how many soldiers died during Clinton's reign of peace....

I'm not even sure how many innocent Iraqi's have been killed.It's indeed tragic when any innocent falls in the crossfire. But, such is life outside the Garden of Eden.

How many Americans were killed on 9-11?2,646

If this is Bush's shining moment, I should jump up and down with joy on the golf course when I shoot 102.Nobody asked for a shining moment. They asked if Bush ever did anything right. I cite the fact that USA & GWB have been terror-free since 2001 as "something right." If you want to call it a shining moment, well, that's your call.

[Lefty]

Well, Ddog, you add in how miserable apartment living is, you pay the price. But that's just me. The point is, friggin interest rates shouldn't have been that high in first place.

[Indulto]

... It's indeed tragic when any innocent falls in the crossfire. But, such is life outside the Garden of Eden. ...PA,
Nothing else you have posted so clearly illustrates the differences in our perspectives.

To me it seems critical to do whatever is possible to prevent unnecessary and undeserved loss of life AND LIMB short of inflicting unjustifiable casulaties in the process. That is why I supported the action in Afghanistan and investigation of the Saudi government's involvement with AQ, but not the invasion of Iraq.

Assuming your figures are accurate, a dozen fanatic Muslim foreign nationals murdered 2646 innocent people; and that doesn't include any injured/wounded/orphaned. Those criminals could not be brought to justice, but it was clear that others like them existed who were also involved and would continue to murder innocent U.S. citizens if not killed or captured.

These remaining criminals would never be brought to justice by any existing government in their known geographical location in Afghanistan and Pakistan. That is why we received support from most of the world for taking military action in Afghanistan, but not against Iraq.

So exactly what have we accomplished after 9/11 in protecting our citizens when one considers how many U.S. military personnel have died and been wounded in Iraq since then (not to mention innocent Iraqi lives that would have escaped the murderous Saddam)? Oh yes. Now I remember. They died or were wounded THERE rather than HERE where their families mourn and try to mend them.

While no known terrorists have yet gotten through our current (but previously porous) airport security, innocent U.S. citizens die daily as a result of urban terrorism (criminal gangs) and we have no idea of what dangerous people may have crossed our still porous borders and patiently lie in wait like the 9/11 plotters. Although we are much more prepared today, we are NO SAFER from terrorism now than we were on 9/12/2001.

The distribution of wealth during the last 7½ years predominantly into Republican pockets, and the accumulation of massive government debt, have – along with our declining stability (as compared with other nations) – resulted in lowering the value our currency and made us a hostage to OPEC and market speculators; further lowering the quality of life for the majority of Americans.

I don’t know why your well-documented concern for the welfare of horses appears far more evolved that that for humans, but it presents an interesting contradiction. I am not calling you a bad person, or even an insensitive one, but all your spinning support for the Bush Administration and McCain is IMO at best unconvincing and at worst misguided.

It might be interesting to see what would happen if board policy required that each post about either party had to contain a positive statement regarding the individual or collective target for every negative one; if a poster couldn’t say anything positive … he/she could only make the negative statement once. :cool:

[ddog]

Well, Ddog, you add in how miserable apartment living is, you pay the price. But that's just me. The point is, friggin interest rates shouldn't have been that high in first place.


nope , the point is those rates had to be that high.
you can't make enough to stay ahead of inflation like we were getting then.

you just don't get the longterm nature of economic forces and the "silent destruction" of a strong economy as you have demonstrated over and over.

that is your god given right.
lucky for lefty , there are and were a few grownups around.

I was adding in that the economics at times favour being "miserable" (all in your mind of course) in the short term when that is indicated by a sober view of ones choices.

[ddog]

anybody who lived through the Carter era knows that the current economy is head and shoulders above the Carter era.

The only President ever attacked by a Swamp Rabbit...........

http://www.narsil.org/politics/carter/killer_rabbit.html

http://www.narsil.org/politics/carter/rabbit_original_750x564b.jpg


well, the spin certainly is more refined nowadays.

who knows jr, anyone that has lived at all would understand that in general the "economy" doesn't start/stop on a dime between prezs.

prezs are holding onto the tail not leading by the nose, always.

your star-struck with authority complex always shows through.

[ddog]

just a guess , but PA posts sometimes like a guy that hasn't seen much outside the "garden" first hand.

just my rough uninformed take.
so, yeah i could be wrong.

[pktruckdriver]

INDULTO Hope I got the name right, the post, FANTASTIC, WELL DONE:jump:

[ddog]

the gains part into whose pockets.... the gains at the top don't know party.

the sordid pay differences between CEO and avg wage earner in their own company are a sin against GOD.

It really is that bad.
has the gilded age beat to hell on that score.

those that celebrate wild disparities on this score will be bringing about a backlash that reverses all they hope for.

when the top .01 have more than the bottom 50-85% and the trend is accelerating then you have capitalist-totalitarianism in your country.

you really want that small a group to have that much power?

[46zilzal]

you really want that small a group to have that much power?
too late. They did and set a disastrous course with the current economy as the results.

[PaceAdvantage]

Are ya'll trying to say that ya'll are the experts, and ya'll have the correct answer for everything in this world? Because that is sure how it sounds. A bit arrogant today, aren't we?

[PaceAdvantage]

just a guess , but PA posts sometimes like a guy that hasn't seen much outside the "garden" first hand.Please elaborate. What haven't I seen first hand? If you're saying I haven't seen an innocent person in the middle of war take a bullet to the head, or have his home blown to smithereens, then you've got me there.....

[PaceAdvantage]

These remaining criminals would never be brought to justice by any existing government in their known geographical location in Afghanistan and Pakistan. That is why we received support from most of the world for taking military action in Afghanistan, but not against Iraq.Your selective memory when it comes to Iraq and their culpability regarding global terrorism and aggression is astounding, but not unexpected.

[Indulto]

Your selective memory when it comes to Iraq and their culpability regarding global terrorism and aggression is astounding, but not unexpected.I notice you didn't try to refute any of my statements. ;)

Let's look at Iraq's "culpability " regarding "global" terrorism and agression AFTER he was driven back from Kuwait and the oil well fires were put out approx. 10 years before. Do you really believe Palestinian suicide bombers were going to stop attacking Israel with the termination of Saddam's cash rewards program for their parents?

SH was a sanity-challenged dictator who deserved to be overthrown no less than Mugabe or Kim Jung, but he was no immediate threat to the U.S. -- or even to his own neighbors -- and that's the way the rest of the world saw it as well.

Iraq was never anything but a target of opportunity for the Dubya administration, and the U.S. troops used to pressure and then invade Iraq might well have finished the job on AQ and the Taliban.

What's really astounding is your continued defense of the Bush administration's indefensible motivation, actions, and blunders.

[Tom]

Well they might be indefensible to you, but who the hell are you?
Just one more with an opinion and a butt. Which one is doing the talking today? :lol::lol::lol:

[delayjf]

Indulto,

Your viewing the Life loss equation from a static position - we will never know how many lives are saved by our involvement in Iraq. Saddam admitted that once the US took its eye off Iraq, he would seek to renew his WMD program. The US involvement in Iraq gave Libya "the proper motivation" to give up its WMD program. Given Saddams / Osama's / Omar's shared hatred for the west, how long do you think it would be before some of those WMD's made their way into terrorists hands?

[46zilzal]

Indulto,

Your viewing the Life loss equation from a static position - we will never know how many lives are saved by our involvement in Iraq.
What a joke! A piss ant little army on the other side of the globe. Wow.

[Indulto]

Indulto,

Your viewing the Life loss equation from a static position - we will never know how many lives are saved by our involvement in Iraq. Saddam admitted that once the US took its eye off Iraq, he would seek to renew his WMD program. The US involvement in Iraq gave Libya "the proper motivation" to give up its WMD program. Given Saddams / Osama's / Omar's shared hatred for the west, how long do you think it would be before some of those WMD's made their way into terrorists hands?djf,
We never concluded our previous debate. What's the point in starting another? :(

[Indulto]

Well they might be indefensible to you, but who the hell are you?
Just one more with an opinion and a butt. Which one is doing the talking today? :lol::lol::lol:S'matter too much reality to try and respond seriously? I hope your next post contains sufficient humor to merit three emoticons.:ThmbDown:

[delayjf]

What a joke! A piss ant little army on the other side of the globe. Wow.
Question:
How many piss ants does it take to fly a plane into a building containing 10s of thousands of people.

How many piss ants does it take to drive a truck full of exposives into a military barrecks.

How many piss ants does it take to detonate a truck bomb outside a building causing the collapse of that structure.

bottom line, you don't need an Army

[Tom]

Agree Jeff.
My orignal plan to nuke everything that moved would have been far cheaper and more effective.

[ddog]

long as SH was there , Iran would not have let him have one.
we wouldn't need to do a thing.

it was dumb and then dumber reasons.

now Iran and Iraq , bossom buddies.

some war you got there.

the longer we go the worse it looks.

Of course Pak and the Taliban signing peace treaties turning over half the damn country as long as they behave, a country that has wmd for sure is of no concern.

we need to bring democracy to a backwards slum we bombed to hell and chase all over Iraq looking for 5-6 Al Qeida types to keep them from blow up some damn mud hut police station.

Some grand strategy we got there now.

Men know when to cut the deal off, stop digging.

Man up, put this country first over personal hubris and pride.

[Lefty]

Interest rates had to be that high? What a crock. Then Reagan came along and they went down. So guess they didn't hafta be that high at all. Seems like you're suggesting Carter was some kinda economic genius when he was just an inept dictator loving fool.

[chickenhead]

Lefty, do you pay attention to how things actually work?

The President doesn't control interest rates, the Federal Reserve does. Carter appointed Paul Volcker head of the Federal Reserve, and yeah I guess you could say Volcker is an economic genius, close enough. The same guy that took the rates up took them back down in Reagan's term, as Volcker was reappointed by Reagan (I guess Reagan must of thought Volcker knew what he was doing, eh?)

The funny thing about your complaint...is Volcker decided to kill inflation he needed to worry about the money supply and not the rates, figured he'd leave the rate part up to you....in other words, he didn't set interest rates so high, YOU did (and the other peeps of the day) by continuing to BID UP the price of money, like taking out mortgages at 20%. If people hadn't been willing to pay 20% for money, the rates wouldn't have been 20%.

Once people figured out it wasn't a good idea to pay 20%, the rates came down. It didn't take long.

[Lefty]

And to think I was blaming Carter when it wasmy fault all along. Me and my out of control spending, and for decent shelter of all things. Damned selfish of me. Well, I really want to thank all of the people who didn't engage in this out of control spending, especially the shiftless who didn't work, lived on govt assistance and charity and i guess by buying the least of anyone really helped out the most.
But when interest rates came down during Reagan I blithely kept on spending. I bght 4 houses, and later a new car. Over the years i've bght numerous TV's, Computers, a few refrigerators but I have been unable to drive those interest rates back up. ????
Oh, well, please accept my apologies for what I did to screw up the economy during Carter. Sorry, Jimmy.

[chickenhead]

you ever seen how a vet gives medicine to some big dumb beast?...they take a big pill gun, jam it down their throats, and shoot the pill right down into their stomach. Cause the beast doesn't know it needs the medicine.

And then afterwards...once the medicine has worked it's magic and the beast feels all better...he thinks to himself....that guy with the dispenser thing sure was an asshole!

Volcker jammed that medicine right down everyones gullets, and people are still pissed about it. We've got some big medicine in our future, it doesn't give me much hope that we're going to be willing to take it without a fight.

Hopefully, there'll be a good doctor around with a dispenser gun before we get too far gone. Until then...we'll just have to self medicate. :cool:

[chickenhead]

I should say too...I'm not singling you out Lefty....WE are the big dumb beast.

I know we don't like to hear we are the problem...but....in this country above all others, we have nowhere to hide. We are responsible for everything. WE. WE THE PEOPLE.

That's what it means to be an American...to take responsibility. If we absolve ourselves of responsibility, we've give up on being American. Once it's gone, it's not coming back.

Maybe it's already gone. Maybe WE THE PEOPLE lost out long ago to THEM. THEM is all we ever talk about. Ever hear about.

[ddog]

Ol left

How did you do under Nixon?

price and wage controls on everything , beginning of gas lines, don't recall that huh?
that fools errand set the stage for carter/volcker.
they had no choice, none at all, along with the oil embargo that was that.

How about Ford , WIN program, whip inflation now.
only thing that did was drive up the price of the metal they made the stupid buttons out of.



you really don't get the fact, even though you claim to, that all the admins that promise you tax breaks and don't pay for it are really treating you like a welfare case.

In fact the spending cuts should come first before the tax breaks, but they never seem to.

gee, I wonder why they get away with it?.
would seem a country serious about this would protest like with the imigration bill and get the priority straight.

they give you a bit now, which you blow on a tv or something and then they print money/inflate so someone can pay for it (or default on it) someday in the future with debased money.

So, by supporting them , you really have no standing to worry about what any other presz did.
You are just another welfare case begging for a handout to finance your next set of wants.

simple and clear as that.

shame on you and those of your ilk.

that's the real medicine, swallow hard.

[ddog]

i am using ol left as the "stand-in" for all the others who "run" in that crowd that never quite seem to get to the day of the cuts in spending.

They will take the candy now and always but by their votes and support never the medicine.

[Lefty]

I remember, ddog. But I did ok bk then. Was tending bar, bouncing the trblmakers, and having a ball.and ddog, the same old mantra about not paying for tax cuts has been proven untrue by the math. Do the math: More money came in under tax cuts than did with tax raises. And yes, we need to control spending. But imagine if we had the spending and the tax raises. What a mess that is. And even though the R's spent too much, the dims always manage to outdo them, plus raise the damn taxes and stifle business and investment.

[Tom]

I should say too...I'm not singling you out Lefty....WE are the big dumb beast.

I know we don't like to hear we are the problem...but....in this country above all others, we have nowhere to hide. We are responsible for everything. WE. WE THE PEOPLE.

That's what it means to be an American...to take responsibility. If we absolve ourselves of responsibility, we've give up on being American. Once it's gone, it's not coming back.

Maybe it's already gone. Maybe WE THE PEOPLE lost out long ago to THEM. THEM is all we ever talk about. Ever hear about.

Interesting, so I conclude that since the sytems so thoroughly corrupted that THEY never give US a choice, only sorry excuses of has-been's or wanna-be's who cannot hack in the real world, that the only thing WE can do is emulate our founding fathers and overthrow this POS governemt and put in a new one, with iron clad provisions to prevent it from being stolen from US like THEY did with this one.

First order of busniss - single term limits - and prohibit ALL political campagining. Then zero lobbyists alowed. Then the death penaly for any crime - including parking tickets - while in office.

But don't throw the bottom feeders of the planet at me - Bush, Gore, Bush, Kerry, Obama, McCain, and tell me it is my fault. This is a sick joke that even SNL would not try to tell. Bobcat Goldwieth would be a major improvement over this bunch of losers, liars, and thieves.

[ddog]

glad you were having a blast, but it has been proven exactly the opposite and is being reinforced today.

most of our problems today are a result of exactly the policies you cry out for.

no unfunded tax cut has ever paid for more than half of the cut, much less added to anything.

in the meantime "the avg guy wages" are undercut by the inflation and dollar debasement due to wild and unsupporatble(we are past that level now by the way) debt -deficits used to "finance" what we won't pay for.

As an example , take your food and energy costs from 2006 and holding constant for usage compare them to today.
Now compare that cost to your 600.00 gift. not much left.
Now only ONE of the most obvious REAL BAD efects of that, you get to pay finance charges on that gift forever.

Some gift, you pay more than you ever received.

have a blast, sure sounds more like slavery to me , but what do I know.


You will not be happy with the outcome unless a dramatic reversal is adopted.
It will hopefully be of our choice as opposed to forced on us.

people are blind to so much.

it's hard for them to break bad habits they have been sold by the MSM but it will happen one or the other way.

[robert99]

Agree Jeff.
My orignal plan to nuke everything that moved would have been far cheaper and more effective.

But what if they all stood still ?? ;)

[Tom]

D'oh!

[exactaplayer]

There is no reason to get worked up about Obama. Outside of the media love affair, he is completely unelectable. John McCain will end up being President by default, he might even end up with 300 electoral votes. I cannot believe that anyone takes Obama seriously when he offers empty rhetoric and slogans from children's cartoons. "Yes We Can" - that's Bob the Builder. My son might have voted for Obama when he was 3, but he outgrew it, he's 6 now.
Aw shucks

[PaceAdvantage]

Aw shucksAre you saying we're now going to go back and pick out every post someone ever wrote that happened to turn out wrong?

Make sure you don't let 2004 smack you too hard. I'd point out 2000 as well, but we were running different software back then, thus the archives are lost.

[hcap]

Are you saying we're now going to go back and pick out every post someone ever wrote that happened to turn out wrong?
I guess that would be arrogant? :rolleyes: Just all your posts alone saying all of us are wrong for thinking Obama would or could win, would take up a huge amount of server space. :D

Then there's the generic "Dems can't win" crap

[lsbets]

Aw shucks

Yep, I was wrong - and if you payed attention you would see I changed what I had to say about a month ago.

I am happy for you we elected Obama. You don't seem to be smart enough to survive without government assistance. Things should work out well for you.

[Tom]

The weak, lazy, and ignorant are dancing in the streets.
They finally got a piece of our pie.

[hcap]

The weak, lazy, and ignorant are dancing in the streets.
They finally got a piece of our pie.Totally misogynist, racist and despicable.

Your a fun guy for right wing reactionary whiner.
Face it you lost big time. Can't rise above monkey level to human?

[Tom]

Thanks you for confirming that.

[hcap]

Thanks you for confirming that.
Which one?

misogynist?
racist?
despicable?
Monkey?

All of the above

[Tom]

No, this.

I am happy for you we elected Obama. You don't seem to be smart enough to survive without government assistance. Things should work out well for you.

The dregs of society are dancing in the streets. Go join them. Call if Free Lunch Day.

[hcap]

The dregs of society are dancing in the streets. Go join them. Call if Free Lunch Day.As I said
All of the above
You are one sorry excuse for a human being.

[Tom]

Coming from you, that is a compliment.
Can't handle the truth yet, huh, little girl?

[hcap]

You really are paranoid.
The rabble, and the dregs of society dancing and rioting in the streets?
Free lunches? Welfare queens, Willie Horton deja vue? :lol: :lol:

Most Orangutans are more socially evolved than you appear to be.
Using that avatar is giving monkeys a raw deal. :cool:

[PaceAdvantage]

Totally misogynist, racist and despicable.How do you get misogynist and racist from Tom's comment?

Just curious. I see blacks, whites, all sorts of colors, men and women celebrating in the streets for Obama.

[hcap]

The weak, lazy, and ignorant are dancing in the streets.
They finally got a piece of our pie.People celebrating Obamas' Presidency. A historical moment in this country's history. And Tom shows his true colors.

So do you PA, by claiming to not understand words Tom posts.

Clear as a bell.

[Tom]

Did you listen to the comments? Sounded like a lot of people are lining up for handouts to me. Did you watch his infomercial? Ditto.
Save you tired old racist-branding lib tactic - it won't work on me.I know what I say and what I mean, and your inability to understand it means nada. If you can't take political reality, you should stay out of OT. This is no whining in OT.
You want to talk about racism? How about the Black Caucus, affirmative action? What if they started a White Caucus? I can hear you now.
Grow up.

[PaceAdvantage]

People celebrating Obamas' Presidency. A historical moment in this country's history. And Tom shows his true colors.

So do you PA, by claiming to not understand words Tom posts.

Clear as a bell.Seriously. Please explain it to me.

I saw every color, every age, and each sex celebrating Obama's win. How is what Tom posted misogynist if there were men and women celebrating, and how was it racist if there were multiple races celebrating? He called them all weak, lazy and ignorant. Not very nice, but certainly not misogynistic or racist.

Maybe you can educate me how this can be otherwise.

[pktruckdriver]

This post is kinda like a post that got closed earlier today, entertsining to those reading it, maybe not to those participating in it, even though I did start it, and still know on this board it is hardcore Republican here, with Dem thrown in for fodder, it seems.


No dem was ever good for America, same no republican was either, we could say both, and then we debate it and show how both are wrong, there wasbith good dems and Rep's too at one time, but to me , not lately, not in the last 8 years fro sure, maybe not even last 10-20 years either, we could debate that can't we.


Now this post is great, and you are entertaining to read, and I get my head ripped quite often over here in OT General, as I am not college educated, only street educated, and I speak what I believe to be true most of the time and have been proven wrong more than once here, and it will happen again , I am sure, but when it is , it was not posted with ill intent, just ignorance of the true facts, there is a difference , and I hope y'all can understand that.

But why all the dem bashing was what this thread was all about to begin with, so are we in for 4 years of crying and complaining, everytime Obama farts, same as me crying over the mess W made for me and this country, for all the families who lost loved ones for IMO no real good reason, except maybe Afghan, but not Iraq, that to me should be a criminal offense and he,W, should be hel liable in front of the world court for it,, but it will never happen , but that ius how feel about it, does that make me a bad american, heck no , just one with his opinion, and stating here on this board for all to see, so Thank god this president's reign of muderous terror is almost over, and the we get to see what will happen , will ther be chasnge , who know, I would guess to say no, there will be no major changes, why , politicians are the biggest corrupt individuals in the world, ask TED STEVENS, ALASKA, re-elects him even after conviction, where is the change going to come from, Stevens is a republican, does that matter, he is corrupt, like the rest of them, being rep had niothign to do with it, dems are just as bad, they too are corrupt, whoile darn buch of them are, a few may not be, but they won't last, 2 terms most likely, they know and learn there is nothing they can do about it, so they leave or become corrupt too, TELL ME I AM WRONG....


Just a thought about this beautiful thread here

Patrick

[Valuist]

both elected 2 terms ...

THAT'S a big part of the problem. NOBODY should be elected for a second term. Once a guy gets into office, in 2 years all they do is campaign to get re-elected. I thought McCain should've played this up more; that he was only going to try to get 4 years.

[Stillriledup]

How do you get misogynist and racist from Tom's comment?

Just curious. I see blacks, whites, all sorts of colors, men and women celebrating in the streets for Obama.

And they're still dancing. :p

[JustRalph]

Patrick, Just for the record. Ted Stevens has been dead for few years now.

Btw, his conviction was overturned due to several improper acts by the prosecution that were brought up on their own charges. Stevens was accused of getting a discount on some work on his home by a contractor. BFD.

If you want to play tis game, you better be able run with the big dogs. Try this link, and take a look at who the Dems re elected after being censured by Congress for Schtupping a 17 yr old Congressional page. He was re elected more than once

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerry_Studds

[Stillriledup]

Patrick, Just for the record. Ted Stevens has been dead for few years now.

Btw, his conviction was overturned due to several improper acts by the prosecution that were brought up on their own charges. Stevens was accused of getting a discount on some work on his home by a contractor. BFD.

If you want to play tis game, you better be able run with the big dogs. Try this link, and take a look at who the Dems re elected after being censured by Congress for Schtupping a 17 yr old Congressional page. He was re elected more than once

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerry_Studds

Sorry JR, i bumped an old post, Ted was alive when this post last saw the light of day. :blush:

[JustRalph]

Sorry JR, i bumped an old post, Ted was alive when this post last saw the light of day. :blush:


I didn't even notice the date. It's amazing the archive that's developing here.

:ThmbUp:

[Capper Al]

There are a few angry old men that hang around here and want to show the world that caring and consideration is a futile process. That's why they are Republicans, or they just might be in the top 2% then at least it would make some sense.


Be progressive or become extinct! The world waits for no one.

[PaceAdvantage]

There are a few angry old men that hang around hereDefine old.

And hasn't Europe been embracing progressivism for quite a while now? How are they doing over there? How is Greece doing? Spain? They're pretty progressive, aren't they? They've embraced it...would you like to live in Greece right about now?

[Capper Al]

Define old.

And hasn't Europe been embracing progressivism for quite a while now? How are they doing over there? How is Greece doing? Spain? They're pretty progressive, aren't they? They've embraced it...would you like to live in Greece right about now?

Over 50.

Europe, Greece, Spain, California, Nevada, Florida, Michigan and on have their problems. The question is how are their super-states going to help them solve their problems. You couldn't be making a point that capitalism is better than socialism? You'd be forgetting Norway, Sweden, Holland, Switzerland, and even Canada now. These countries for the last decade have come up in the happiest places to live, better education than the US, better health care statistics, better chances of getting a head and working oneself up the ladder. Your mental picture of the US hasn't changed since the fifties. Maybe you are in the top 2% then I'll understand your stance. Their lives have gotten better in the last decade.

[PaceAdvantage]

I'm 43. Born in 1969.

I have no mental picture of the US in the 1950s... :lol:

[Tom]

There are a few angry old men that hang around here and want to show the world that caring and consideration is a futile process. That's why they are Republicans, or they just might be in the top 2% then at least it would make some sense.


Be progressive or become extinct! The world waits for no one.

Here is the folly in your post - all the dems/libs/progs depend on taking from the republicans to take care of them.

The question is how are their super-states going to help them solve their problems. See, this is your system at work - it doesn't. Why is it someone else's problem to take care care of them?
They created the mess they are in, let them solve it - instead of rioting in the street like friggin losers and babies.

Looks to me like you need rich people a lot more than rich people need you.

When your side ever figures out how to create jobs give me a call. We'll talk.:lol::lol::lol:

BTw, you are correct in one aspect -- the world is not waiting for us - it going under and broke a lot faster than we are! Greece, here we come! :lol:

[delayjf]

better chances of getting a head and working oneself up the ladder

(Norway) With a 40% tax rate an 25% sales tax, plus a 180% tax when buying a car, I seriously doubt that.

[Capper Al]

(Norway) With a 40% tax rate an 25% sales tax, plus a 180% tax when buying a car, I seriously doubt that.

Yet- they are happier, better educated, with more opportunity to advance and live longer. Do you ever wonder why?

I'm guessing that between my employer and me we pay about 3,000 to 4,000 a year for family health insurance. Now if that amount was transferred to taxes then my percentage of taxes would go up. It isn't as simple as you make.

[Capper Al]

Here is the folly in your post - all the dems/libs/progs depend on taking from
the republicans to take care of them.

Then become a dem silly.

[Capper Al]

I'm 43. Born in 1969.

I have no mental picture of the US in the 1950s... :lol:

We still have those images from life of the 50s and early 60s messing our heads.

[ElKabong]

Yet- they are happier, better educated, with more opportunity to advance and live longer. Do you ever wonder why?



Norway, "more opportunity to advance"? To what, stamp licker? Your bar is too low, I call bullshit on your post.... I'm makin' in RAIN in heeyah.....

Norway, nowhere to be found in millionaires per capita in this top 20 list.


http://images.businessweek.com/slideshows/20110602/twenty-countries-with-the-highest-proportion-of-millionaires#slide21

[Capper Al]

Norway, "more opportunity to advance"? To what, stamp licker? Your bar is too low, I call bullshit on your post.... I'm makin' in RAIN in heeyah.....

Norway, nowhere to be found in millionaires per capita in this top 20 list.


http://images.businessweek.com/slideshows/20110602/twenty-countries-with-the-highest-proportion-of-millionaires#slide21

You don't have a clue. In the end it isn't about how many millionares. It is about making a more perfect union. It's a democracy working for the general welfare of the whole. And on your own millionaire list, we rank 7th. "more opportunity to advance", doesn't imply becoming a millionare.

[ElKabong]

You don't have a clue. In the end it isn't about how many millionares. It is about making a more perfect union. It's a democracy working for the general welfare of the whole. And on your own millionaire list, we rank 7th. "more opportunity to advance", doesn't imply becoming a millionare.

7th grade, still?

It's not about a perfect union when I see the Obamapho' woman, and multiple generations on welfare since the 60's. These people will never buy into your "perfect union". Never have. They didn't buy into education, they don't buy into improving their lot in life. They just want enough to get by and will sell their vote to any enabler.

Sorry to kick your claim of better advancement in Norway in the nuts. That's the way it is. You can make it in this country if you apply yourself, catch a break, and continue to work hark and smart

[JustRalph]

Over 50.

Europe, Greece, Spain, California, Nevada, Florida, Michigan and on have their problems. The question is how are their super-states going to help them solve their problems. You couldn't be making a point that capitalism is better than socialism? You'd be forgetting Norway, Sweden, Holland, Switzerland, and even Canada now. These countries for the last decade have come up in the happiest places to live, better education than the US, better health care statistics, better chances of getting a head and working oneself up the ladder. Your mental picture of the US hasn't changed since the fifties. Maybe you are in the top 2% then I'll understand your stance. Their lives have gotten better in the last decade.

That's why Sweden is paying it's kids to move to Norway. They are trying to unload the unemployed off on each other.... They are just trading their problems back and forth. Because they have run out of other people's money.

Btw, if you want to live in a socalist country why arn't you moving?

[Tom]

See new thread just started by PA....truly a genius stroke by our fearless leader!

Dems can't even fix on major urban city, in spite of massive amounts of entitlement money flowing in, let alone an entire country.

Dems are all talk no walk, Fact of life.

Norway, Al? Start in Detroit. Even when the auto industry was flourishing, the place looked like Beirut. I know, I went there hundreds of time from the late 70's through 2005. It deteriorated worse every time I went there.

Fix Detroit, then call me about Norway! :lol::lol:

[fast4522]

I'm 43. Born in 1969.

I have no mental picture of the US in the 1950s... :lol:

I remember 1969 as if it was just yesterday, having the best pizza in the world with a young lady in a pizza place listening to :Here come the judge on the juke box, then getting to first base later, those were the days.

[johnhannibalsmith]

... Start in Detroit. Even when the auto industry was flourishing, the place looked like Beirut...

I was just at the track talking to a friend who is from Detroit and a bunch of family was in for the weekend and they met up.

That was exactly the way they phrased it as they all discussed how sad it was fifty years later and finally getting the hell out.

[Stillriledup]

See new thread just started by PA....truly a genius stroke by our fearless leader!

Dems can't even fix on major urban city, in spite of massive amounts of entitlement money flowing in, let alone an entire country.

Dems are all talk no walk, Fact of life.

Norway, Al? Start in Detroit. Even when the auto industry was flourishing, the place looked like Beirut. I know, I went there hundreds of time from the late 70's through 2005. It deteriorated worse every time I went there.

Fix Detroit, then call me about Norway! :lol::lol:

Im sure Romney's first order of business as president would have been to get on the ground in Detroit and figure out how to clean up the bad areas!

[johnhannibalsmith]

Im sure Romney's first order of business as president would have been to get on the ground in Detroit and figure out how to clean up the bad areas!

You are aware that there are local elections as well as Presidential elections, right??

[jognlope]

It's why Obama and the Dems hate America that they funded last year the Alliance for American Manufacturing, and bunch of companies like Alcoa are training people have the skills in manufacturing and they go on to have meaningful skilled job. And a health care based on arithemetic, not socialism, that the more people who share the cost of health care, the lost the cost will be per person. There would be much more, but out of love for themselves and not the country, the Repugs filibustered over 280 attempts by the Dems to do other things.

[Ocala Mike]

jognlope, you used arithmetic and Repugs in the same posting; don't you know they don't mix.

Seems to me that the D's had GPS, printed maps, timetables, and a route to electoral victory, while the R's were like the guy lost on the road who refuses to stop and ask for directions.

[PaceAdvantage]

while the R's were like the guy lost on the road who refuses to stop and ask for directions.You forgot the part about the R's getting beaten up by the MSM at every rest stop along the road.... :lol:

[johnhannibalsmith]

... And a health care based on arithemetic, not socialism, that the more people who share the cost of health care, the lost the cost will be per person. ...

I really can't wait to see how this arithmetic works.

[HUSKER55]

A man goes onto business to make a profit. That is called capitalism.

Now if you are a dem then I guess all of the profit goes to anyone except the person who owns the business?

[Capper Al]

A man goes onto business to make a profit. That is called capitalism.

Now if you are a dem then I guess all of the profit goes to anyone except the person who owns the business?

What world are you in?

[PaceAdvantage]

Probably the same world where some Dems think all Reps are racist old white guys busy waging war on women.

[Stillriledup]

Probably the same world where some Dems think all Reps are racist old white guys busy waging war on women.

There's a stereotype that Reps are old racist white guys who dont think women are their equals. Does the stereotype have any merit at all? Well, its up to all of us to decide that on our own.

[PaceAdvantage]

Does the stereotype have any merit at all?All stereotypes have at least some merit, or they wouldn't exist in the first place.

[Stillriledup]

All stereotypes have at least some merit, or they wouldn't exist in the first place.

Makes sense, i agree.

[JustRalph]

I really can't wait to see how this arithmetic works.

Here's a second to that motion.

Try this arithmetic

Add 30 million people with almost free healthcare to a system that is completely stretched to its limit now.

Cut payments to hospitals and Doc's by 30%

Do nothing to eradicate the nursing shortage

Cut the pay across the board in Hospitals (ancillary non medical positions) due to the 30 % loss hospitals will endure. At minimum pay freezes will be permanent.

Add all this fancy arithmetic up and what do you think your healthcare looks like?

Private Doctors and Nurses for the rich will become common. That's on the horizon.

[Tom]

Put a tax on medical devices and wave good bye to all the jobs that are now in the process heading south. More democrat arithmetic! :lol:


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444620104578012281306687070.html

The 2.3% tax will be charged to manufacturers on each sale and takes effect in January. Many U.S. device companies, in response, have already announced layoffs, canceled plans for domestic expansion and slashed research-and-development budgets. This month, Welch Allyn—a maker of stethoscopes and blood-pressure cuffs—announced that it will lay off 10% of its global workforce over the next three years, but all of the jobs being cut are in the U.S.

[jognlope]

Yes I'm also eager to see the breast cancer patient who needs another round of therapy doing her arithmetic and not have to add "additional life saving treatment" to the bankruptcy column.

[jognlope]

Medicare payments will be cut incrementally over 10 years. Doctors and hospitals have been charging for all other patients to cover or "cost shift" the lower income from Medicare and Medicaid since the 1970s. It's a non-issue. And check the stock page for insurance companies.

[johnhannibalsmith]

Yes I'm also eager to see the breast cancer patient who needs another round of therapy doing her arithmetic and not have to add "additional life saving treatment" to the bankruptcy column.

Yes, I know. It is easy to overlook all of the realities to only focus on the "feelgood" aspects of legislation without a care for the consequences that may not be so "feelgood". It's fine to acknowledge what may be good, but you also have to recognize what may be bad.

What about the woman who thinks that she may have found a lump and is tied up in the red tape while her cancer progresses from stage I to stage III?

Perhaps the best known example of this approach has been Massachusetts, which since 2006 has mandated that every resident obtain health insurance and those that are below the federal poverty level gain free access to health care. But although the state has the second-highest ratio of primary care physicians to population of any state, they are struggling with access to primary care physicians.

Dr. Randy Wexler of The John Glenn Institute of Public Service and Policy said he has concerns that this trend could be reflected nationwide.

"Who is going to care for these people?" he said. "We are going to have problems just like Massachusetts. [They] are struggling with access problems; it takes one year to get into a primary care physician. Coverage does not equal access."

...

"Looking at shear reality, we can't turn on a spigot and drop out new doctors," he said. "Expect long waits if we cannot figure out how to resolve it, the only place left to go for primary care will be the emergency room."

Green's outlook was not as rosy.

"[Patients] won't be able to see a primary care physician hardly," he said. "Primary care will be past saturated with wait times longer and will not accept any new patients. There will be an increase in hospitalizations and increase in death rates for basic preventable things like hypertension that was not managed adequately."

So, if you want to cite computational hypotheticals about women not going bankrupt because of the law, can we also take a look at the computational hypotheticals of being short about 50,000 primary care physicians? What about the people that won't go bankrupt because of their disease, because they may not ever get a chance to have it treated and rack up those bills before expiring? Is that a better scenario?

Things are rarely perfect. For every upside there tends to be a downside. I'm a little curious if and when someone like yourself can acknowledge the downsides or if you remain in a permanent state of rebutting any criticism with tales of women that won't go bankrupt because of treatment - even if one of the downsides is the reality that there's credible evidence to suggest that many of those women that had insurance and paid their premiums diligently will now be negatively affected at the diagnostic stage of the game.

http://news.yahoo.com/doc-shortage-could-cause-healthcare-crash-172501425--abc-news-health.html

(courtest of ABC/Obama news, not Breitbart or FOX)

[JustRalph]

Medicare payments will be cut incrementally over 10 years. Doctors and hospitals have been charging for all other patients to cover or "cost shift" the lower income from Medicare and Medicaid since the 1970s. It's a non-issue. And check the stock page for insurance companies.

Cost shifting is a real thing. But the cost shifting that is done now is going to be babyshit compared to what's coming.

Btw, you cite Breast cancer, far many more are killed every year by other cancers. Bret cancer is down the list. As usual you are just reciting what you read at whitehouse.gov

[Capper Al]

Cost shifting is a real thing. But the cost shifting that is done now is going to be babyshit compared to what's coming.

Btw, you cite Breast cancer, far many more are killed every year by other cancers. Bret cancer is down the list. As usual you are just reciting what you read at whitehouse.gov

So insightful. I'm glad you only post stories that are the objective truth.

[Valuist]

Over 50.

Europe, Greece, Spain, California, Nevada, Florida, Michigan and on have their problems. The question is how are their super-states going to help them solve their problems. You couldn't be making a point that capitalism is better than socialism? You'd be forgetting Norway, Sweden, Holland, Switzerland, and even Canada now. These countries for the last decade have come up in the happiest places to live, better education than the US, better health care statistics, better chances of getting a head and working oneself up the ladder. Your mental picture of the US hasn't changed since the fifties. Maybe you are in the top 2% then I'll understand your stance. Their lives have gotten better in the last decade.

We have seen plenty of people move from Norway, Sweden and Holland to here. I must've missed that mass migration from US citizens to those socialist countries. Enlighten us when that happened, Al.

[JustRalph]

So insightful. I'm glad you only post stories that are the objective truth.

Context, my kingdom for some context?

Care to elaborate?