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Otis11
06-04-2008, 10:46 AM
Most people, if not everyone, thought it was impossible. Build a race track in less then a year. Here is the latest update from www.mihbpa.com (http://www.mihbpa.com)
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ON SCHEDULE: Pinnacle Race Course President Michael McInerney indicated to the Board of Directors that the "project is on schedule and budget". Phase I projections:

1) Track to be completed June 27/28, Open for training June 30th.

2) Corporate Pavilion to be open June 30th.

3) 5 Barns under construction, 12 to be completed by June 27 and 15 by July 11.

At this time, Phase I will offer 600 stalls

4) Starting Gate to be open 2 weeks prior to opening day

5) Hot Walker Machines will be available

6) At this time,straw will be the required bedding

7) Temp. Backside Office facilities available June 30th

8) Simulcast to start July 1st, Live racing July 18th.

9) Post Time 2:30pmTuesday, Friday, Saturday,and Sunday until Aug.

August: Monday, Tuesday, Friday and Saturday

A job fair was conducted recently and the turn out was tremendous. Pinnacle has a large number of applications to review. It was reported that many of the applicants were looking for positions on the backside working with horses. Management staffing has been completed.
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Mag
06-04-2008, 11:09 AM
Wow! I'm glad it's moving right along. Looks like they will race when they said they would. I hope people show up and they do a decent business.

http://www.mtoba.com/pinnacle.htm

rrbauer
06-04-2008, 12:46 PM
What will their takeout structure be?

beenacoach
06-04-2008, 01:54 PM
The information I have received puts the start of racing closer to early to mid August based on how things are coming along

cj
06-04-2008, 02:29 PM
Just what we need...another track for bad horses.

beenacoach
06-04-2008, 03:09 PM
So no one should be allowed to race a horse unless they can afford one that costs a Million bucks or more?

cj
06-04-2008, 03:19 PM
Very poor interpretation of my statement. There are tons of tracks around to race bad horses. I just don't think we need another one. You want a list?

beenacoach
06-04-2008, 04:01 PM
How is one to interpret your statement? You want to label certain horses as "bad". Who appointed you the judge of what horse is good and what horse is "bad"?If you want to go after tracks for being poorly run, turning a blind eye to drug use, having too high a take out, or whatever other problem you have with them that is one thing. But, I certainly don't think you are the know all be all when it comes to saying what horse is good or bad.

From some perspectives there is no "bad" horse. As long as they are run in like company it can make for an interesting race.

I suppose that minor league baseball should not exist either because compared to the major leagues they are all ""bad" teams. It doesn't matter that they develope players that then move on to the majors. And yes, small tracks with "bad" horses do serve a purpose in providing a training ground for horsmen and a place for the once "good" horses to remain useful for a period of time on their way down.

There are more perspectives involved than just yours so don't be so quick to crap on someone elses project.

Otis11
06-04-2008, 05:03 PM
The information I have received puts the start of racing closer to early to mid August based on how things are coming along

Just curious. Can you elaborate on your sources?

I've been by the plant a few times recently, and while it doesn't look anything like a complete facility, it does appear that they'll make they July date.

Keep in mind, the goal is to race horses on 7/18, not to have a 100% complete, fan ready, race track. Jerry Campbell has stated that he doesn't want people to judge their Pinnacle experience on this year but wait until next year when they are, or close to, 100% complete.

... even if your sources are correct and they don't start until mid - August, it's still a good news. I've been waiting for the return of live racing in this area since 98. Southeast Michigan needs anything and everything we can get to help the economy. I'll be realistic and concede that this will be the single A version of a track for the time being, but how can that be a bad thing?

beenacoach
06-04-2008, 05:15 PM
I won't post any names as I don't have their permission to do so but one is employed in a capacity which gives them some inside information. The other is a rather prominant owner in Michigan that lives in the area and sees the track regularly.


I have high hopes for the track but only time will tell. In the mean time is gives the Michigan bred horses a place to run and keeps the industry alive. If things go as I think they may it could become a decent endeavor in the future.

I am still not sure if I will try to run anything there this year but it is nice to have the option at least.

Wiley
06-04-2008, 05:40 PM
I for one am looking forward to the new track, it will be nice to see live TB racing in the area again. In a way this track is more a replacement to GLD or the old DRC than a completely new track. I live in the area and hope to be there opening day. I'll also take a dirt surface blue collar horse track over the fake stuff of the blue blood tracks like Keeneland and Delmar any day. :ThmbUp:

beenacoach
06-04-2008, 05:49 PM
I am kind of looking forward to it as well but I am just getting my feet wet in the TB racing end of it so ............


I come from the Quarter Horse racing world and the politics and jealousy of it were not fun. If the TB industry is like that in Michigan I may just stick with running farther away from home anyway.

It would be nice to be able to only go an hour and a half to see my horse run though.
If the plans go through as I have read them it could be a very nice deal. Especially if the mall deal is a hit and they can get some slots to boost the purse structure.

I am still very undecided about the AWS's. IF they could be perfected so they are more like dirt it would be nice to have them in the climate we have.

Wiley
06-04-2008, 06:05 PM
I am still very undecided about the AWS's. IF they could be perfected so they are more like dirt it would be nice to have them in the climate we have.
Right now isn't Pinnacle just looking at summer/early fall racing only? Can't see the need for a poly surface unless they are going into the later months of say late October/ early November which I guess could be the plan in the future. I don't have a problem with poly use like at Turfway where there is a real need for a surface other than dirt due to weather conditions but in situations like Delmar and Keeneland that is not the case. Good luck if you bring horses into race.

beenacoach
06-04-2008, 06:10 PM
yes I think it is a short meet that is planned. But, to put up a facillity like that and not use it for as long a period of time as possible just wouldnt make sense to me. With the weather we have had in recent years I would see them being able to go until mid November many years with the right surface.


Not to mention the alledged increased safety for the horses (assuming that those claims prove to be true in the long run).

Murph
06-04-2008, 06:24 PM
So no one should be allowed to race a horse unless they can afford one that costs a Million bucks or more?Not in the mid-west coach. I think there may be a regional bias in that regard with statements deriding a new track. It's just sour grapes. These nice new midwestern facilities are a crown jewel for our communties and a blessing to our horsemen. I hope everyone in Michigan is PUMPED for the Grand Opening of their new track.

I wish you better luck than has been had in the past with some of the previous track operators in your area. Pinnalce will make a major economic impact on a struggling agricultural community and help to revitalize a stoic unemployment scene in the urban area. A 5k claimer is a 5k claimer. Not a great difference in quality of runners where ever they are spotted. Hope to see some fit MI shippers taking purses around the area very soon. Might be hard to get good speed figures on that lot. ;)

Murph

JustRalph
06-04-2008, 06:33 PM
Gotta go with CJ on this one.................way too many tracks already..........

beenacoach
06-04-2008, 06:39 PM
It just seems that some posters are negative about most everything they post on and I dont understand that kind of attitude.

I agree with what you posted about the new midwest tracks and I really do think that the "cheap tracks running cheap horses" have a place in the industry.
Trainers and jockeys have to start someplace and they cant all start out as assistents to the big boys. Even if they do they have to have a place to put together their first string and prove their metal.

I like to think I am a pretty smart guy over all. I have a lot of horse experience and experience in racing in general but I am new to TB racing. So, I think starting out with a bottom level claimer at a "second" rate track can be a valuable learning ground for me. I could chip in a couple hundred bucks on one of the partnership deals and call myself an owner but what would I really learn by doing that? Little contact with the actual trainer or the jockey's, NO decision making abiltity at all, just no real hands on education at all. That isn't going to get me where I would like to be. But being forced to race at a track where the day rate is a hundred bucks a day and a bottom level horse cost me twenty five or thirty grand could put me out of the business before I have a chance to learn anything if I wasnt lucky as hell.

So, I think the cheap horses and second rate tracks are invaluable in growing the industry and the handle too. The more local tracks easily accessable for people to go out for a day at the races and get hooked on the game the better.

Murph
06-04-2008, 07:04 PM
Gotta go with CJ on this one.................way too many tracks already..........I understand the reasoning of less tracks and why that could be an option for improved "quality" on a national level racing circut. That option seems to only drive more business to CD and NYRA et al at the expense of folks who truly want to race their homebred stock. Kentucky would never have allowed an exception to their structure for a single Indiana bred race let alone a competetive series of races. Thoroughbred, standardbred and qtr. horse all, Lexington and Louisville rebuffed any such notions for 100 years.

They hold the same disregard of Ohio racing stock as well. Turfway Parks' location is based on the Cincinnatti market area and has always been a sore spot in relationships with Kentucky and River Downs. On the other side of that coin, Indiana (Hoosier Park) runs an evening of parimutuel races for Alabama bred runners each thoroughbred season I think they card a couple of AL bred qtr horse races the same evening. This idea was implemented while CDI was majority shareholder. This would never happen in Kentucky for an Indiana horseman, though.

I am truly sorry about the state of horse racing in Ohio but this is one more positive for the new racinos opening in Indiana and the comming of an excellent new racing facility in the Detroit area. Both areas should be seeing plenty of Ohio stock running. The folks in our area have always been fine with wagering on 5k thoroughbreds and 2.5K standardbred and qtr horses. The major track operators have proven they don't want our horses and OH IN and MI have had little choice but to promote their own racing and breeding industry.

Blame it on Churchill, 100 years of arrogance and hard handed dealings with their neighbors. I think the citizens of our areas deserve these new dwellings especially considering the benefits to the entire community.

Murph
06-04-2008, 07:14 PM
So, I think the cheap horses and second rate tracks are invaluable in growing the industry and the handle too. The more local tracks easily accessable for people to go out for a day at the races and get hooked on the game the better.Next thing you know there is a new generation of "hillbilly horsemen" making life tuff on the poor major circut. I think it's sour grapes. Some of the complaints stem from the state of racing in a posters home area. Maryland is a perfect example.

I feel for my friends and the ag community in Ohio, believe me. I miss seeing guys like Larry Morgan and others put their homebreds on the track. One of my favorite horses of all time was an Ohio bred runner named Private School. He went on a five race win streak at TP one winter rising from the claiming ranks of Ohio to annex the winners share of a minor stakes race one fine cold winter afternoon. I recall an NY shipper and a stakes dropper from KY were both rebuffed by the 1/16 pole in that race - major score.

cj's dad
06-04-2008, 07:39 PM
Some of the complaints stem from the state of racing in a home area. Maryland is a perfect example.


I have in the past said some negative things about Md. racing and stand by them. If things do not change here, (and slots are not the answer, IMO)there will be serious repercussions including the possible closing of Pimlico and Laurel Park.

The positives include however:
1-Preakness
2-Black-Eyed Susan
3-DeFrancis Dash
4-Maryland Million day (the first such event of it's type in the country).
5-Pimlico Special

I agree that Midwest breds need a place to run close to home. So give them one and let the chips fall where they may.

Good luck in Michigan- with the current state of affairs in horse racing in general, you will need it.

beenacoach
06-04-2008, 07:46 PM
Thank you for the good wishes.

You are right, the new track will need a lot of luck and a lot of forsight if it is going to really make it. On the other hand, horse racing of all breeds has been on its death bed in Michigan for almost thirty years now. Somehow, it just keeps drawing one more breath. I suspect that is the way it will still be long after I am gone as well.

We may just under rate the staying power of the industry.

cj
06-05-2008, 11:22 AM
Maybe I should have used the term slow instead of bad. Michigan has had a few chances already.

I understand we need places for lower quality horses to race. My only point was that we have enough of them already. If an alleged top tier track was proposed, I would say the exact same thing.

We have too many slow horses being bred these days. A bunch more Michigan breds isn't going to help.