That acceleration from Big Brown....

[HolyBull29]

looks like when a G1 horse runs against cheap handicap horses as a tightner.

[classhandicapper]

He was accelerating away from a weak group, but he did it so easily and quickly it was very impressive (did you see the overhead? it was amazing to watch). I think that's the kind of intangible that tells you things about a horse that the figures sometimes do not.

[Robert Fischer]

He was accelerating away from a weak group, but he did it so easily and quickly it was very impressive (did you see the overhead? it was amazing to watch). I think that's the kind of intangible that tells you things about a horse that the figures sometimes do not.

I agree with that.
If we watched a horse do that by itself in a workout, we would drop our jaw.

[Shenanigans]

It's always thrilling to watch a horse accelerate and make his opponents look like they're standing still. Remember Arazi in the BC Juv.? He was running so fast coming out of the turn he almost blew it.

[46zilzal]

Not too many since Secretariat's Derby have ever actually accelerated late in the race. Relative to the field it looks like it, but fractional velocity says otherwise.

[Citation33]

Well I'll say if Recapturetheglory ran against a slow small stakes group at Aqu or something,he would probably accelerate on the weak group just like that. Its actually how fast you are running,not just accelerating because that can be deceiving if the group is just so slow that you look to be going fast.

When Secretariat actually accelerated in these races he did it fast and set track records.
Accelerate on a top horses and I'll give it to him.,but accelerating on slow horses can be decieving on how fast you are actually going. Have to see him against fast top shelf horses. This group of 3 yr old's is just so bad and so slow,that anyone with slight turn of foot can look like Secreteriat,except Sec. set track records doing it.

[46zilzal]

Muhammed Ali decides after winning the Kentucky Golden Gloves and the Gold Medal in the Olympics to hang it up.

Michael Jordan stops playing basketball after college graduation.

Tiger Woods quits after winning the Junior Amateur.

Brent Farve decides to become a coach at Southern Miss rather than play in the NFL.

Brilliance never put to the test=Big Brown to date. Come to compete in the arena against all comers, then the mantel of greatness might be properly bestowed, but until then a junior champion against other juniors remains just that.

[Citation33]

Good points Zil.

Hey what if Gretzky hung up the skates early.

Secretariat retires after the Belmont Stakes.

Cigar retires after not being able to run on grass.

John Henry retires after bouncing around in claimers.

As I said before when Big Brown wins or "accelerates" on a group that is actually fast or can run then I will give him all the credit. These 3yo slow horses would struggle in a low level handicap. Nothing against them,as they do try,but they are brutally slow! They basically can not even get close to a 100 beyer.

[46zilzal]

Secretariat retires after the Belmont Stakes.


He had already earned the title great by then.

[john del riccio]

Muhammed Ali decides after winning the Kentucky Golden Gloves and the Gold Medal in the Olympics to hang it up.

Michael Jordan stops playing basketball after college graduation.

Tiger Woods quits after winning the Junior Amateur.

Brent Farve decides to become a coach at Southern Miss rather than play in the NFL.

Brilliance never put to the test=Big Brown to date. Come to compete in the arena against all comers, then the mantel of greatness might be properly bestowed, but until then a junior champion against other juniors remains just that.

Now that puts things in perspective...I would love to see BB & Curlin slug it out at 1 1/4 miles on a good old fashioned dirt track.

John

[Greyfox]

All of the above examples stayed in the game because of Money.
Big Brown is leaving because of Money.

Bobby Jones quit when he got the Grand Slam. He did not hang around for money.

[Citation33]

Wait GreyFox you are saying none of those guys played for the sport itself or to be the best or to win championships? Most of these guys started way before the ego filled big money years of today.Cmon.

MICHAEL JORDAN was playing in 1984 and did'nt even make a million dollars in a year until the 1989 season. Could'nt have been his top scoring or dominating or him turing around a franchise that was the reason for going into the NBA. Pretty sure he knew he was great and wanted to prove it on the highest level,as he did.

BRETT FARVE He was'nt even a superstar when he was drafted 33rd overall and only made 4 pass attempts his first year for the Falcons. What big money? There was'nt any money back then for guys like that. It could'nt have been his desire to play the game and win championships as his reasoning for playing in the NFL?

TIGER WOODS. Sorry but I would'nt say big money when someone says Golf escpecially when he first broke in. Yeah now it has payed off for him and it's changed. I mean could it have been his desire to to play the game and win titles and challenge Jack and his titles. Pretty sure he knew he was great and wanted to prove it.

WAYNE GRETZKY. Would never say hockey was a big money sport and I'm pretty sure too the Wayne knew how good he was and wanted to dominate and win on the higher level,which he clearly did.

They all played these sports since they were kids,I'm pretty sure they wanted to play in the big time and win championships. Like we all did. I would'nt say these guys were in the time of 100 and 300 million dollar contracts. Most did'nt make big money until after a few years. It was for the game.

Thank God Cigar,John Henry,Secretariat,etc and whoever else kept running. What great shows they put on to prove how great they were against the best.

Anyway BB should run against actual contenders and horses who can run faster than a 95 beyer if he wants to prove himself great. That's all. Hey if he does and he beats them,then my hats off to him!

[garyscpa]

All of the above examples stayed in the game because of Money.
Big Brown is leaving because of Money.

Bobby Jones quit when he got the Grand Slam. He did not hang around for money.

Bobby Jones was an amateur.

[Shenanigans]

Muhammad Ali decides after winning the Kentucky Golden Gloves and the Gold Medal in the Olympics to hang it up.

Michael Jordan stops playing basketball after college graduation.

Tiger Woods quits after winning the Junior Amateur.

Brent Favre decides to become a coach at Southern Miss rather than play in the NFL.

Brilliance never put to the test=Big Brown to date. Come to compete in the arena against all comers, then the mantel of greatness might be properly bestowed, but until then a junior champion against other juniors remains just that.

None of those men had a lucrative stud deal lined up for them after their flash of brilliance. :p
Good points, nonetheless. Is there a blue moon out? I am actually agreeing with ZZ for once. :D

[slewis]

Fellow postee's:


There were approx. 35-40,000 Thoroughbred's born the year Big Brown was born.
He's toyed with his peers in EVERY SINGLE one of his races, even when he was a two year old.
What he has accomplished against what everyone is calling a "weak" crop is STILL AMAZING, and history has shown that perceived "weak" crops have eventually faired well in their 4 yr old seasons when racing against older stakes horses, thus not being as "weak" as perceived.

If you look back at history, Seattle Slew whipped Affirmed twice, 4yr old vs 3 yr old, only to have Affirmed whip Spectacular Bid the next season. Curlin vs. BB would be great fun, but would not really be completely "fair", unless they raced in early 2009.
But aside from Curlin, at this time, right now, I dont think there's another handicap horse who could beat BB, even at this stage of his career.

[bigmack]

Stop to take a gander at the ease in which this animal has crushed all on-comers thus far. Kicks - like he's displayed - don't come around very often and offers a breath of fresh air that reminds us some of the greats.

The game has changed. We can't follow an illustratively productive running career anymore.

Folk hang out on the Internet and at the track and vicariously speculate what these contemporaries "could do" if only they were allowed to be the true blue athletes they, & we, would like for them to be.

A pile of loot for the owners to "shut down the operation". Take the money & let people theorize, now, for years to come, on what could have been. More conjecture of events that stand little chance of ever happening.

Give me a reason to become seriously involved in following a most assuredly brief racing life.

Some things were better back in the days. Not only is this game one of them, but it has no hope of ever seeing them again.

I sometimes wonder if my joy of the game in watching the effort of a nice Alw race pales to the chorus of folk that get wrapped up in each years "stars". One answer always comes up - Probably not.

For what it's worth, I'd can the Sec/BB comparatives.

[Murph]

A step beyond "Wow" (http://www.ntra.com/content.aspx?type=news&id=32564)
IEAH Stables, Special to NTRA.com</SPAN> 5/20/2008

Well, Big Brown somehow took his game to yet another level this past Saturday at Pimlico, and I think we are still all somewhat awestruck. The Derby was certainly a "Wow" effort, but the ease at which he won the Preakness made your heart skip a beat and mutter to yourself, "What am I watching? I can't believe this." Those types of performances are a step beyond "Wow," and happen far less frequently.
-------

Interesting comments from IEAH. Truth or propaganda?

I learned my lesson in the Derby and must tip my hat to his connections. As a handicapper, I know to say "if" he wins the TC, he will be a deserving champion.

Murph

[ghostyapper]

Fellow postee's:


history has shown that perceived "weak" crops have eventually faired well in their 4 yr old seasons when racing against older stakes horses, thus not being as "weak" as perceived.

That may be but it doesn't change the fact that these 3yo right now are running slow. If gayego comes back next year running 120 beyers that doesn't mean BB gets any more credit for beating gayego at 3.

[rastajenk]

It also sounds like a general overview without attribution. I wonder if it would stand up to any kind of fact-checking.