Owner Stats

[SMOO]

Lots of trainer & jockey stats for each track out there, anyone have a link for owner stats per track, such as starts & wins?

I would assume that at least some tracks must keep track of these rankings?

TIA.

[stu]

It is easy to track an owner who doesn't collaborate often like Lael Stables.

But imaginge, R. D. Hubbard. He is in at least 20 different partnerships. Do you want the owner stats on when he is part owner in any partnership or do you only want his record with Johnny T. L. Jones, Jr.? Allred? Helzer?

It is an impossible incomprenhensible task to create a meaningful owners list.

[SMOO]

It is easy to track an owner who doesn't collaborate often like Lael Stables.

But imaginge, R. D. Hubbard. He is in at least 20 different partnerships. Do you want the owner stats on when he is part owner in any partnership or do you only want his record with Johnny T. L. Jones, Jr.? Allred? Helzer?

It is an impossible incomprenhensible task to create a meaningful owners list.

I was thinking more of a track by track listing, which might be more specific in terms of ownership?

[so.cal.fan]

I'm pretty sure they print these stats in the programs in So. Cal.
Not sure if they print them everyday, but they do print them.
They should print them in the Daily Racing Form's Simulcast Weekly, but I don't think they do.
Good question SMOO. Most handicapping books tell you it isn't an important factor, but for several reasons it is.

[ryesteve]

I was thinking more of a track by track listing, which might be more specific in terms of ownership?
I'm guessing that if you specify exactly what you want to see, someone with a db will answer you pretty quickly.

[SMOO]

I'm guessing that if you specify exactly what you want to see, someone with a db will answer you pretty quickly.

I realize that not all tracks would keep such figures, I just thought that any that did might be useful to add to the jock & trainer stats.

Anyone that has such stats or access to such stats would be helpful, as the specific track itself is not that important to me.

[Light]

Not sure if this is what you're looking for but Equibase has the top 100 owners ranked by earnings or wins:

http://equibase.com/Leaders/racingleaders.cfm

[Light]

I find the win percentage list very interesting but you still have to do research on your own. For example Web's Gem Stable and Jagger, Inc. has a 71% wins and 93% ITM. Is this because they have a win machine horse or is this stable that good? One guy I know at the track made more money than most handicappers without a form simply by keeping track of Trainer/Owner combos.

[horsesense]

I think trainer stats are more reliable and representative, since they will often include stats for dozens of horses, thus minimizing the impact a single "great" horse can have.

For example, Steve Klesaris is a trainer with the following stats for the last 365 days: Win 28%, In-the-money 65%.

Anyway, if I had to focus on on element, I would lean towards trainers.

[Norm]

Owners are pretty important folks in this game. At the very least, it helps to know which owners are active and which are passive at your circuit. If you don't believe it, spend a little time watching how Maggi Moss operates, it'll learn ya somethin' about owners.:cool:

[Bill Olmsted]

Check out owner Robert L. Cole Jr. on Equibase. He is currently winning 41% (147 starts this year), a rate that he normally achieves year after year. He uses several trainers, Scott Lake, Howard Wolfendale, Stephanie Beattie, and others. He is a handicapper and obviously has a big say in his stable. I have been cashing in on the "Cole Factor" for over two years now. So, yes sometimes it does pay to follow the owner.

B :)

[ryesteve]

For example, Steve Klesaris is a trainer with the following stats for the last 365 days: Win 28%, In-the-money 65%. He has a couple of XXXXXXXXXX that are part of a partnership with XXXXXXXX.
... and now back to our regularly-scheduled thread after that commercial interruption...

[xtb]

He/she has 3 posts and is 3 for 3 pushing horse partnerships.

[BIG49010]

I have tried making a set of owner stats, but names and partnerships as posted in bris files make it difficult. You do uncover some gems once in a while.

[northerndancer]

I think trainer stats are more reliable and representative, since they will often include stats for dozens of horses, thus minimizing the impact a single "great" horse can have.

For example, Steve Klesaris is a trainer with the following stats for the last 365 days: Win 28%, In-the-money 65%. He has a couple of XXXXXXXXXX that are part of a partnership with XXXXXXXXXXXX.

Anyway, if I had to focus on on element, I would lean towards trainers.

This one goes on ignore the nerve if you want to advertise than do what the others have done and pay Pace Advantage for that right....... people like this really............ :mad: :mad:

I know Steve real well and will make sure this gets back to him as he is not this type of gentleman.

[Norm]

Originally Posted by horsesense
For example, Steve Klesaris is a trainer with the following stats for the last 365 days: Win 28%, In-the-money 65%. He has a couple of XXXXXXXXX that are part of a partnership with XXXXXXXXXXX
.
... and now back to our regularly-scheduled thread after that commercial interruption...
Even though this is a blatant advertisement, there is something for the fledgling handicapper to learn here. Keep a list of all stables that offer shares in their horses. These are passive owners. The trainer is in control here. Other owners, active owners, such as the afore mentioned Maggi Moss, Robert Cole, et.al. are hands-on owners who 'employ' trainers who will cooperate with their M.O. While they share a common goal of winning purses (and profiting from the sale or claim of improved horses), their approach is different and recognizing these differences aids in the handicapping process.

[ryesteve]

Keep a list of all stables that offer shares in their horses. These are passive ownersI don't think you can generalize. Some partnerships do have managers who are very much involved day-to-day. And I know of at least two partnership groups whose entrants have been flat-bet profitable in the win pool over hundreds of starts.

[takeout]

I have tried making a set of owner stats, but names and partnerships as posted in bris files make it difficult.
Amen! And I wonder why they put the trainers’ last names first and the owners’ first names first?

Here’s an example of how many different ways this same owner was listed in the pps in a span of only two years:

1. In For A Tag Racing Stable vllc
2. In For A Tag Racing Stable villc
3. In For A Tag Racing Stable llc
4. In For A Tag Racing Stable ivllc
5. In For A Tag Racing Stable iillc
6. In For A Tag Racing Stable iiillc

How do six different endings like that happen? Is it the track, Equibase, TSN, or who? A lot of programs probably treat that like six different owners.

Another thing that occurs to me lately is that there are a fair amount of wrong owner names in the pps (more than I ever realized) which then get corrected in the result charts. If your program pulls this connection info from the pps instead of the result charts, it stays wrong. Likewise, if you’re using a result file that doesn’t contain connections, it stays wrong. I made this mistake with a home grown program that I hired a friend to write for me.

[ryesteve]

How do six different endings like that happen?I'd say it's because each time they acquire a horse, they register as a new LLC

[PaceAdvantage]

I love how you guys rail against the thinly veiled free advertising, but then you REPRODUCE the ad three times when you quote the original post.....:lol:

But seriously, thanks for catching that....I would have missed it....