Tellers

[The Hawk]

A while back, we had a thread going about tipping, and what is expected and what is common courtesy.

I just wanted to share a quick anecdote from my weekend of wagering: I cashed a ticket for $582, which originated from a voucher purchased from the same teller, who was friendly and able enough. I bought $60 worth of advance tickets and was leaving for the day. My intent was to take the $520 and leave a $2 tip, which I rarely do but for some reason that was in my head to do.

As the teller was counting out the money, I got the move we all get at some point: five $100 bills very quickly counted and dealt, as if that was all I was to get, clearly in the hopes that I would walk away, either oblivious or ashamed to wait for the $22. Then, after a few seconds of fumbling, a $20 was slowly peeled off, with no immediate move for the singles, which further infuriated me. At that point I was going to wait for the $2 for as long as it took, and it took a full 5 seconds for this guy to locate the suddenly lost singles, and another five to straighten them out in order to count them. I know it's a minor point, and probably petty, but I don't normally tip anyway, and for the guy to subtlely try to clip $22 made it impossible for me to give him money for no good reason. I only wished later there were coins I could have waited for. I would have.

I thought later that this is probably one of those tellers who goes around bitching that no one tips him.

[Imriledup]

Almost all tellers do the 'fumblerooski' where they just can't seem to find the extra dollars or change. I'm the same way, no tip if you fumble at all. Pay me and let me be on my way, don't treat me like an idiot and think that i don't know what you are doing.

[Ron]

I had a similar situation and was told by the teller in the clubouse at Saratoga "You're obviously not a high roller."

[alysheba88]

Get rid of all tellers. Thats what they are telling us basically. Tellers have made themselves replaceable by their thievery. Who needs them. Many are incapable of acting honestly and diligently. Machine can do what they do, but better

[thespaah]

I had a similar situation and was told by the teller in the clubouse at Saratoga "You're obviously not a high roller."
If he/she said that to me, it would have been "on"..No mercy..i don't take crap from anybody.
I'm in customer service. And dammit I expect to be treated as respectfully as I treat my customers.

[DrunkenHorseplayer]

I would have replied "Given your job, I'm doing a hell of a lot better than you."

[DrugS]

I do the vast majority of betting over the computer or phone, but as for tellers, some are more competent than others...I've never been cheated by one.

At worst I always tip my change.

I've never had anything happen like what is stated in this thread - but with the $522 amount - I've seen it more than a few times where they will give you there big bills for the $500 - and for the remaining $22 you will get a ten, two fives and two ones - or even something as exotic as three fives and seven one dollar bills.

A lot of them seem intent on paying you in a way that leaves you most able to tip to your max.

Opposite of that - there are guys when you hit something small for $74.60 or $74.80 that will just give you $75. Those are sometimes the degenerate types that wonder away from their machines a lot and are more interested in betting than working....but sometimes its also the clever type who might see that as a way of making a good long term move.

[Hosshead]

... for the guy to subtlely try to clip $22 made it impossible for me to give him money for no good reason. I only wished later there were coins I could have waited for. I would have.

Good for you for thwarting his attempt at larceny. I have had this done to me and finally decided to report it to the track. (just like attempted pickpocketing )
Just think how many times a day this thief pulls that same stunt !
So it didn't work with you, so all he's thinking is ...Next ?

By the way, a similiar type of trick is also performed by waitress'/waiters in some restaurants.
Some of them will total your bill, then decide what (large) tip they "deserve" and will try to take.
Then, when you pay the check with some large bills, instead of bringing your change and YOU leaving THEM a tip, they will decide that all that money they were going to bring you, ..really belongs to them.
So they will then try to embarrass you into giving the rest of the money to them, by saying (outloud) before going to the cashier, "Do you want your change?". And they realize that they can increase their "leverage", if they try to embarrass you in front of your guests at a table.

I was driving (on vac.) through a town along the coast, had a seafood dinner and was "confronted" by such a person. But have seen it "performed" on other people too.

[classhandicapper]

You guys have obviously never been on the other side of the window. The number of customers that try to cheat the tellers would absolutely astonish you.

I'm not going to educate you guys and tell you where some of the vulnerabilities are and how to exploit them, but they do exist and a high percentage of customers take a shot from time to time - especially if they know you are new.

That money comes out of the pocket of the teller, not the track or OTB.

Tellers are taught to count the money out of the register and then to recount it outside before giving it to the customer. It is intuitive and natural to start with the big bills and work your way down when counting money. So sometimes it appears like they are withholding some of the money hoping you walk away, but they aren't. They are just slow, lazy, and annoying.

Now I'm not suggesting that their aren't some crooked tellers out there. There definitely are. It's just not as bad as you think and certainly not a one way street. Most of the cheating and attempted cheating comes from the other side of the window.

Tellers do learn quickly that when players make a big score, some are willing to tip. But they also learn the "average amount" they might get and sometimes even what the idividual they are dealing with might give. So they do give change that will make it easier for the customer to give a tip and not just walk away because he doesn't want to give a $20 for example. But it's not always that. Sometimes their box is short one denomination or another and they give out change in an illogical fashion for awhile hoping to accumulate the needed bills. You'd be surprised, but sometimes there are actually shortages of certain smaller bills.

[cj's dad]

The machines don't expect a tip and don't make mistakes.

The one down fall to the machines is the sometimes refusal to take a slightly crumpled ticket/voucher.

Overall I prefer the machines; at least if I look at my ticket and have wagered the wrong race/track/horse etc... I have no one but myself to blame.

[Bruddah]

a generous tipper. When I make a score, it's a pleasure to leave a tip and make another person's day, as well.

It makes no difference whether it's a shoe shine person, waitress, poker dealer or teller. Those who supplement their incomes with tips, will always show appreciation when tipped appropriately.

The tellers et. al., at my home track, recognize me and give me great service, for which, I am appreciative. If you don't want to tip, fine! But do not tip and whine about it. It shows a total lack of class, versus not tipping at all.

[SMOO]

I like to tip the machine by leaving change vouchers in them.

[njcurveball]

I like to tip the machine by leaving change vouchers in them.

This was a good joke which I will now steal! Thanks for the laugh! :lol:

[Pace Cap'n]

I found twenty cents on a machine last week, which I promptly appropiated. As I was walking away, I felt positvely furtive.

[thespaah]

You guys have obviously never been on the other side of the window. The number of customers that try to cheat the tellers would absolutely astonish you.

I'm not going to educate you guys and tell you where some of the vulnerabilities are and how to exploit them, but they do exist and a high percentage of customers take a shot from time to time - especially if they know you are new.

That money comes out of the pocket of the teller, not the track or OTB.

Tellers are taught to count the money out of the register and then to recount it outside before giving it to the customer. It is intuitive and natural to start with the big bills and work your way down when counting money. So sometimes it appears like they are withholding some of the money hoping you walk away, but they aren't. They are just slow, lazy, and annoying.

Now I'm not suggesting that their aren't some crooked tellers out there. There definitely are. It's just not as bad as you think and certainly not a one way street. Most of the cheating and attempted cheating comes from the other side of the window.

Tellers do learn quickly that when players make a big score, some are willing to tip. But they also learn the "average amount" they might get and sometimes even what the idividual they are dealing with might give. So they do give change that will make it easier for the customer to give a tip and not just walk away because he doesn't want to give a $20 for example. But it's not always that. Sometimes their box is short one denomination or another and they give out change in an illogical fashion for awhile hoping to accumulate the needed bills. You'd be surprised, but sometimes there are actually shortages of certain smaller bills.
point taken..But the gamne is what it is ..The person in control of the money(teller) has an advantage. I have never been cheated by a teller. I just stand there and wait until the teller lays out the money and say thank you.
I don't use tellers because of the people that bet with them. Too slow. I don't like having to call out my bets. In fact when I am at the track I talk to as few people as possible. Just the people I went with.

[cnollfan]

I like finding a skilled teller and betting regularly with them. A good teller can punch out my tickets way faster than I can input them, and probably more accurately as well. Plus, I don't like having to look back and forth between my notes and the keypad. I don't get into the same rhythm and find it easier to lose my place.

At my primary betting facility I would say maybe 15% of the tellers have the skill set I require, but the ones who do are great.

[The Hawk]

a generous tipper. When I make a score, it's a pleasure to leave a tip and make another person's day, as well.

It makes no difference whether it's a shoe shine person, waitress, poker dealer or teller. Those who supplement their incomes with tips, will always show appreciation when tipped appropriately.

The tellers et. al., at my home track, recognize me and give me great service, for which, I am appreciative. If you don't want to tip, fine! But do not tip and whine about it. It shows a total lack of class, versus not tipping at all.

I think most everyone agrees with all these points. Not sure who said they tipped and then whined about it.

Those who supplement their income with tips will always show appreciation when tipped appropriately, true, but the point is when they try to rob you and then get nothing as a result they shouldn't whine about it.

[The Hawk]

Tellers are taught to count the money out of the register and then to recount it outside before giving it to the customer. It is intuitive and natural to start with the big bills and work your way down when counting money. So sometimes it appears like they are withholding some of the money hoping you walk away, but they aren't. They are just slow, lazy, and annoying.

That may well be but that wasn't the case in this instance. I've been around a long time, and this is not a new trick. If he was slow, lazy and annoying the $100's wouldn't have come out so quick.

Most of the cheating and attempted cheating comes from the other side of the window.

I know there are bad apples on both sides of the window but I can't agree with this statement. I think most of the guys left betting with tellers in the first place are older guys who can't/won't work the machines. There are some sharp guys too, looking to beat the teller, I know that, but maybe we just disagree on what cheating is.

Here's another one, from 8-10 years ago, at Monmouth: I was shorted a dollar (one US dollar, yes), and was annoyed enough to turn around and go back. The guy said, "yeah, here, I put it aside for you." Sure enough, there was a dollar bill right off to the side, near the window, above his box. I took it and left.

I've seen this guy 50 times since that day, in the same window, and there is an omnipresent dollar bill in that same spot, everyday, to this day.

[JPinMaryland]

I found twenty cents on a machine last week, which I promptly appropiated. As I was walking away, I felt positvely furtive.


That was for the machine!

[Pace Cap'n]

That was for the machine!

You know, you are probably right. Tomorrow I'll put two dimes in the ticket slot.

[classhandicapper]

I know there are bad apples on both sides of the window but I can't agree with this statement. I think most of the guys left betting with tellers in the first place are older guys who can't/won't work the machines. There are some sharp guys too, looking to beat the teller, I know that, but maybe we just disagree on what cheating is.


I've been behind the windows. Believe me, the customers are a million times worse. ;)

[Pell Mell]

That may well be but that wasn't the case in this instance. I've been around a long time, and this is not a new trick. If he was slow, lazy and annoying the $100's wouldn't have come out so quick.


I know there are bad apples on both sides of the window but I can't agree with this statement. I think most of the guys left betting with tellers in the first place are older guys who can't/won't work the machines. There are some sharp guys too, looking to beat the teller, I know that, but maybe we just disagree on what cheating is.

Here's another one, from 8-10 years ago, at Monmouth: I was shorted a dollar (one US dollar, yes), and was annoyed enough to turn around and go back. The guy said, "yeah, here, I put it aside for you." Sure enough, there was a dollar bill right off to the side, near the window, above his box. I took it and left.

I've seen this guy 50 times since that day, in the same window, and there is an omnipresent dollar bill in that same spot, everyday, to this day.


I had so much trouble with tellers at Monmouth that I sent letters, went to the super and also threatened to beat the shit out of a couple of them. They were so crooked they probably got screwed into the ground when they kicked the bucket.

Their favorite trick was to make a couple of bets and not clear the machine for the next bettor. If you caught them they would give your money back and say "sorry". The machine must say welcome in that little window and if it doesn't that means the machine isn't cleared of the last transaction.

[toetoe]

I think this is a vital topic for track degenerates like us. My buddy tried to broach the topic on Steve Crist's blog, as SC is arguably the most influential voice for handicappers, but he got the spike. :(

[njcurveball]

Their favorite trick was to make a couple of bets and not clear the machine for the next bettor. If you caught them they would give your money back and say "sorry". The machine must say welcome in that little window and if it doesn't that means the machine isn't cleared of the last transaction.

Monmouth is the sharpest (con) bunch I have seen. I did not even hear of the "mail box" trick until my brother learned it there. That is the one where they leave a little opening between the wooden money stand and the machine.

As they pay you, they put the bills on top and slide them across. Sometimes one of the bills falls in between. Since it is the one on the bottom, most people do not notice.

It is also curious how many people who cash a winning ticket, simply put the money in their pocket. Especially after it was counted in front of them, so why check, right?

I am sure there are many more scams going on there. Join the union work a summer there and get a Masters Class in "grifting". :ThmbUp:

Jim

[njcurveball]

I've been behind the windows. Believe me, the customers are a million times worse. ;)

I tend to agree with you, but just because someone is an A$$, it doesn't mean they are fair game to get "grifted".

Jim

[shanta]

I had so much trouble with tellers at Monmouth that I sent letters, They were so crooked they probably got screwed into the ground when they kicked the bucket.


:lol: :lol:

[46zilzal]

All of them have to make up deficits at the end of the day. They get graded periodically and there are reprimands given out.

[Pell Mell]

All of them have to make up deficits at the end of the day. They get graded periodically and there are reprimands given out.

Jeez, I'm sorry I never recognized you at Monmouth or dozens of other tracks or I might have bought you a drink.:rolleyes:

[toetoe]

Come on zilz. They don't get body searched, presumably having robbed the customers deliberately. Right ??

[Zman179]

I must be one of the few who prefer to go to the track and bet via my ADW account on the cell phone. Can't get ripped off nor have to worry about losing winning tickets or scratches.

[gillenr]

First, by using a machine, you reduce the # of people who can screw up your bet by 50%.

Second, some of the crooks take out from their box, & then short-change the customer and when the boss balances the box, you're screwed.

[The Hawk]

I've been behind the windows. Believe me, the customers are a million times worse. ;)

And believe me, I'd trust a stanger in the grandstand before I'd trust a teller. ;)

The only purpose a teller serves for me is to cash my voucher at the end of the day. Hopefully, tracks will follow the lead of the casinos and let you cash your voucher at a machine in the future. The tellers can get jobs un-jamming the SAM machines. There's not enough of those guys anyway.