PA Software/Service poll

[Capper Al]

Please vote if you are currently an active user of one or more of the listed products. You might want to tells for how long you have been using them.

Thanks.

[njcurveball]

I am making OTHER 1-9 in my "non-bu-l-l-sh-it-ian" oddsline! :ThmbUp:

[asH]

Why you gotta put spreadsheet with paper and pencil, and last at that!

:D
asH
my spreadsheet is linked to a database...or is it the other way around...

[Capper Al]

Why you gotta put spreadsheet with paper and pencil, and last at that!

:D
asH
my spreadsheet is linked to a database...or is it the other way around...
The bottom line is that you are a do it yourself handicapper.

[njcurveball]

If I were an advertiser on here and saw this poll, I probably would be not too happy, considering the low percentage most will get. Even worse is if this sits out here for days and the advertiser has a big fat GOOSE EGG!

[Capper Al]

If I were an advertiser on here and saw this poll, I probably would be not too happy, considering the low percentage most will get. Even worse is if this sits out here for days and the advertiser has a big fat GOOSE EGG!

I disagree. It would only mean their users didn't vote.

[46zilzal]

How about NONE of the above?

[cj]

How about NONE of the above?

How about " Other Software/Service not mentioned", which is part of the poll.

[46zilzal]

How about " Other Software/Service not mentioned", which is part of the poll.
I'd vote for that.

[socantra]

I'd vote for that.

If you're still using Speculator160, that's now a product of ArtofPace.

[46zilzal]

If you're still using Speculator160, that's now a product of ArtofPace.
When a program is 95% from one source, that is the one it is attributed to, not the 5%.

[podonne]

If anyone votes for Other Software\Service not mentioned, can you post it here. I think a list of everywhere people can get information would be very useful!

[zerosky]

I use formulator and a spreadsheet....

probably why i'm a losing player...:bang:

[asH]

I use formulator and a spreadsheet....

probably why i'm a losing player...:bang:

noooooooo, thats not why your losing.

change your name to millionairesky

:)

[Partsnut]

I am currently using Phase III with the Bris Past Performance Generator and a spread sheet.
The program is an antique with manual input but the readings are by far the best for me and tells me what I need to know.

[46zilzal]

I am currently using Phase III with the Bris Past Performance Generator and a spread sheet.
The program is an antique with manual input but the readings are by far the best for me and tells me what I need to know.
One has to be a magician to use that competently!!!

Talk about bare bones.

Synthesis 4?? what is that?

[turfnsport]

DRF Formulator & Handicapping OS!

MikeD

[Partsnut]

46Zilzal: One has to be a magician to use that competently!!!

Talk about bare bones.

Synthesis 4?? what is that?

Hi Tim, how are you?

In answer to your statement, you are absolutely correct.
The Phase III program gives me the readouts that I want.

I interpret them using an old "Brohammer method".

As I remember from our old P&C days, you were very helpful to me in illustrating the balance of the race and in which you were a master of.. This in every sense of the word, coincides with my method.
Just take a look at the Sartin "Factors Manual" and look for Brohammers piece on Factor W. Also look at the very 1st follow-up manual which addresses Phase III and the Meridian Variant of the race.

Synergism 4 is a program that was written by Bob Purdy. The data files can no longer be downloaded and manual entry is also necessary. Actually, it's an excellent program.

I never did appreciate the way you were treated on P&C and just to let you know that Jeff made made an strong effort on your behalf.

Give me a shout by email and we can expound on this topic.
I'm listed in the members directory.

[rokitman]

noooooooo, thats not why your losing.

change your name to millionairesky

:)
:D

[shanta]

I'm using "Art of Pace's" - Rdss software package. I've been involved in beta testing and idea feedback of the software since it's inception 2 years ago.

When it's released to the general public folks will be very pleased with what they have.

Take care,
Richie

[russowen77]

I just started with HTR but it is sure a big thumbs up for me. I am looking forward to the day that I can use the program to it's full potential.The fact that it is very affordable makes it even sweeter. Oh yea, you also get a really good discussion group.

I am also going to be a Thoro-sheets customer based on a trial they did. Having decent data at several tracks is a much better deal than I ever realized and they are affordable.

I would use the Woodbine figs if they had all my tracks. Their trial was very impressive until you got to a track where many of the horses were not rated. If I ever learn the cali tracks I will give them an extended run because they were impressive in the short term.

[JustRalph]

Oh yea, you also get a really good discussion group.



The best group of software users I have ever seen..........those guys cover that program like the proverbial white on rice. A good group no matter who you are. Very helpful.........Thumbs up to that board........! :ThmbUp:

[Johno]

Hello,

Who is using Keys To Success?

Thank You

[Hosshead]

The list does not include HTR or Synergism (6).
A pretty big omission IMO.

[Capper Al]

The list does not include HTR or Synergism (6).
A pretty big omission IMO.

Isn't HTR the sixth one from the top of the list?

[DanG]

Isn't HTR the sixth one from the top of the list?
No…HTRF vs. HTR

HTR does not advertise on PA that I am aware of. Having said that it’s very good of PA to allow HTR to be discussed as openly as he does. :ThmbUp:

[russowen77]

No…HTRF vs. HTR

HTR does not advertise on PA that I am aware of. Having said that it’s very good of PA to allow HTR to be discussed as openly as he does. :ThmbUp:

Wow, I didn't realize that they were different. Dang, one of my goals was to use products that were advertisers here but I can't give the thing up now. I'll make sure the next one I try is on the list.

A big thumbs up to PA for not slapping me down. :)

[PaceAdvantage]

No…HTRF vs. HTR

HTR does not advertise on PA that I am aware of. Having said that it’s very good of PA to allow HTR to be discussed as openly as he does. :ThmbUp:As long as the product being discussed is not being discussed by the vendor himself, then anything goes here. We can talk about HTR until the cows come home. Now, if Ken Massa were to come here and start promoting upcoming features (of course, he would never do such a thing because he's a class act), or something like that, that would be a no-no.

The main rule is that vendors can't post about their own products without being an authorized advertiser. The normal, everyday member of this board can post about whatever product they wish.....

[InControlX]

My "OTHER" category software...

Data Service: DRF Text Charts Subscription
DRF Entries (Web)

Current Homegrown Visual Basic Programs:
1. Augmented Past Performance Data Base Update (TB only, US & Canada)
2. Multirace Trend Analysis (To find new spot plays or update old ones)
3. Entry Spot Play Scanner (Searched Entries for spots)
4. Spot Play Filter Analyzer (Tests Spots with various filters)
5. Spot Play Results Recorder (Keeps track of finishes, ROI)

Decommissioned Homegrown Visual Basic Programs:
1. AI Pattern Recognition (Up to 12-variable, lots of dead ends)
2. Price/Performance Index Generator (Tried to define "True Class", didn't)
3. Composite Pace Index Generator (Theory was elegant, but no ROI)

All software is private, nothing for sale or vaguely "user friendly".

When something works it's due to brilliant insight, when something bombs it
was only recreational mathematics.

ICX

[Capper Al]

My "OTHER" category software...

Data Service: DRF Text Charts Subscription
DRF Entries (Web)

Current Homegrown Visual Basic Programs:
1. Augmented Past Performance Data Base Update (TB only, US & Canada)
2. Multirace Trend Analysis (To find new spot plays or update old ones)
3. Entry Spot Play Scanner (Searched Entries for spots)
4. Spot Play Filter Analyzer (Tests Spots with various filters)
5. Spot Play Results Recorder (Keeps track of finishes, ROI)

Decommissioned Homegrown Visual Basic Programs:
1. AI Pattern Recognition (Up to 12-variable, lots of dead ends)
2. Price/Performance Index Generator (Tried to define "True Class", didn't)
3. Composite Pace Index Generator (Theory was elegant, but no ROI)

All software is private, nothing for sale or vaguely "user friendly".

When something works it's due to brilliant insight, when something bombs it
was only recreational mathematics.

ICX

Thanks. I was looking for a good feel for what was being used.

[Capper Al]

I was surprised that only 16.92% did their own handicapping. Apparently, most players 38.97% use software/services outside of the PA vendor list.

The top PA vendors in the poll are as follows:

Pacefigures at 11.28%
JCapper at 8.21%
HTRFsoftware at 6.67%
HorseStreet at 4.62%
ArtofPace at 4.10%

[ryesteve]

I was surprised that only 16.92% did their own handicapping. Apparently, most players 38.97% use software/services outside of the PA vendor list.
I think a chunk of that 38% use their own software

[Tom]

What poll are your looking at?
16.9% use paper or spreadsheets, but that is not the groups taht does thier own handicapping. I use HTR and CJ, but I do my own handicapping. I use tools other than a pencil. Under your anaolgy, that 16% has the pencils do thier handicapping.

[Capper Al]

What poll are your looking at?
16.9% use paper or spreadsheets, but that is not the groups taht does thier own handicapping. I use HTR and CJ, but I do my own handicapping. I use tools other than a pencil. Under your anaolgy, that 16% has the pencils do thier handicapping.
I am sure many handicap based on the data they receive from their products or services. The paper and pencil group use a Form as their only input. This is how I read it.

[Tom]

Where do you think the programs get thier data?

[Capper Al]

Where do you think the programs get thier data?

Of course, it is the same source of data. It was how they processed it that I was interested in.

[46zilzal]

I am sure many handicap based on the data they receive from their products or services. The paper and pencil group use a Form as their only input. This is how I read it.
You get processed data when you buy the DRF or any source of past performances.

[njcurveball]

I find it curious that HTRf has so many responses here, yet I never see a post about the software on the board.

Silent Majority, maybe?

[ryesteve]

I find it curious that HTRf has so many responses here, yet I never see a post about the software on the board.

Silent Majority, maybe?
Or maybe russ wasn't the only one who thought HTR and HTRF were the same thing...

[Hosshead]

No doubt that is true.
Because of the popularity of HTR, this skews the results of the poll considerably, especially for HTR(F) and "Other".

[Capper Al]

No doubt that is true.
Because of the popularity of HTR, this skews the results of the poll considerably, especially for HTR(F) and "Other".

A little over the top.

[njcurveball]

No doubt that is true.
Because of the popularity of HTR, this skews the results of the poll considerably, especially for HTR(F) and "Other".

I don't think 6.67% of the vote can be considered "skewed" in most statistical circles.

I just think if people were using HTRf and it pays to advertise here, there would be some posts about it. But again, perhaps a "silent majority".

[Hosshead]

I don't think 6.67% of the vote can be considered "skewed" in most statistical circles.

I just think if people were using HTRf and it pays to advertise here, there would be some posts about it. But again, perhaps a "silent majority".
I'd say more like a silent mistake.
Lets say if half of the people in any of the categories like HTRF or "Other", actually used HTR, then that category would be 50% off. That's what I meant. So if HTRF had lets say 14 votes, and 7 were really HTR, I'd call that result skewed.
Not that it would skew the whole pool, just that category.

[Capper Al]

What's important from the survey is that we recognize Pacefigures, JCapper, HTR/HTRF, HorseSense, and AtrofPace as the local favorites. In time I plan to look at all of these. What I find fustrating is when someone drops a chart in a posting and expects that everyone else understands it. Usually these people are dependant on the software and really don't know what it is that they are using. The paper and pencil players (or spreadsheet cappers) at least could tell you why they picked a horse and what that figure is. So over time, if one plans to be a member here, they should learn the popular local systems.

We also have almost 39% of our players using other services with only 16.92% being their own sole capper. A similar poll about 2 years ago on e-ponies.com found the majority of cappers there were the paper and pencil. The bottom line to this is to know who we are talking to in different forums. PA seems to have a more tech orient audience.

[Tom]

So over time, if one plans to be a member here, they should learn the popular local systems.



You planning on providing copies for us? ;)

[Ted Craven]

Al,

I have a few doubts as to the accuracy (and perhaps the validity) of the poll results. I am flattered that ArtofPace received a few votes (despite my main software RDSS not even being formally released yet), but with 4% of votes, I sincerely doubt that its relative PA user base is about equal to HSH, or two thirds of HTR/HTRf whatever, or half of Jeff's Jcapper or a third of CJ. All of these have been established a lot longer than me and are most likely way more used by PA members, even if you include the Speculator160 and Validator4 software I manage.

I think it more likely that of all the users of all the software products mentioned (and considering a few major exclusions/confusions re HTR and various Pizzolla software), only a small and likely uneven percentage of their users who may even participate on PA chose to vote, or voted in the Other category. For example, I do actually have many more active users of my RDSS and Spec160 software than the 8 votes cast, and I know that many more than 8 of them are members here at PA. So either the rest of my PA member users don't like my software :( or it is not necessarily their main tool, or they don't care or didn't know about the poll, whatever.

I'm guessing that a similar story could be told by several of the other advertisers, which leads me to my initial conclusion that your poll results might not be as representative as you might hope.

Best wishes,

Ted

[Capper Al]

You planning on providing copies for us? ;)


Just tell the vendors that Capper Al said it was okay to get a free copy-- just kidding. :-)

Don't all of them give free demos?

[njcurveball]

Not that it would skew the whole pool, just that category.

I understand now. I am in total agreement with you. :ThmbUp:

[46zilzal]

Usually these people are dependent on the software and really don't know what it is that they are using.
Are you full of wishful thinking. Many in the Sartin Alums Yahoo group have been using ONE software, in various iterations, for over 25 years. They understand only too well what every readout means on the differing race tracks.

Amazing: lump everyone that you don't understand into one group. You are showing your rookie status in spades.

[Capper Al]

Are you full of wishful thinking. Many in the Sartin Alums Yahoo group have been using ONE software, in various iterations, for over 25 years. They understand only too well what every readout means on the differing race tracks.

Amazing: lump everyone that you don't understand into one group. You are showing your rookie status in spades.
That's was a generality and not meant to slight anyone or everyone using software programs. In general, the programmer has to know the whys and wherefores of handicapping to code it into the program. The software user only needs to know how to interpret it for play. You are too quick too fire. By your definition, you must be a rookie.

[46zilzal]

That's was a generality and not meant to slight anyone or everyone using software programs. In general, the programmer has to know the whys and wherefores of handicapping to code it into the program. The software user only needs to know how to interpret it for play. You are too quick too fire. By your definition, you must be a rookie.
Another generalization.

We had Sartin's programmer on site and fed back to him the changes that the PLAYER'S found necessary so the last several versions were player prompted not the other way around.

[Capper Al]

Another generalization.

We had Sartin's programmer on site and fed back to him the changes that the PLAYER'S found necessary so the last several versions were player prompted not the other way around.

I'll be posting picks for races 2 thru 9 at GulfStream Park for Saturday Feb 2 for a contest I'm in. My picks will all be placed before the start of race 2. I'll only be placing $2.00 fantasy win wagers. Do you post any of your picks before the races?

[JustRalph]

You are showing your rookie status in spades.

Wow! Rookie at What?

[46zilzal]

Wow! Rookie at What?
understanding software