Sustained Runners

[michiken]

Please express your opinions on the following:

1. (S) Sustained Pace or Final Fraction horses win their fair percentage of races.

2. These types of horses generally pay much better odds because they are often overlooked by the handicapping public.

3. These types perform better on synthetic surfaces.

[JustRalph]

Hmm......
Please express your opinions on the following:

1. (S) Sustained Pace or Final Fraction horses win their fair percentage of races.

Disagree. But the way you phrase it makes it hard disagree with. they don't win very much..........let's put it that way

2. These types of horses generally pay much better odds because they are often overlooked by the handicapping public.

I think they may be over bet most of the time


3. These types perform better on synthetic surfaces.

why would it be any different? I think these horses are either victims of , beneficiaries of whatever pace scenario is to happen. And this changes race to race.

[46zilzal]

They are OVERBET and pay LESS than they should....EVERYTHING about energy exertion and traffic and statistics, favor the up front crowd on the majority of surfaces.

[mudnturf]

EVERYTHING about energy exertion and traffic and statistics, favor the up front crowd on the majority of surfaces.

Zilzal (one of my favorite milers)
I side with Jim Quinn that this is NOT the case when it comes to Turf routes.

[bobphilo]

Please express your opinions on the following:

1. (S) Sustained Pace or Final Fraction horses win their fair percentage of races.

2. These types of horses generally pay much better odds because they are often overlooked by the handicapping public.

3. These types perform better on synthetic surfaces.

On dirt tracks, sustained types are made to play the sprinters game based on perceived front-runners bias - advantage sprinter.
On all weather tracks where the illusion of track bias is not played, closers run thier race and win their fair share. It's as simple as that.

Bob

[46zilzal]

On all weather tracks where the illusion of track bias is not played, closers run thier race and win their fair share. It's as simple as that.


NOT Woodbine....it hardly changed until this Fall and still remains a front runner paradise, Poly and all.

They brought in tons of jelly cord to try and get it to change:NADA.

[HUSKER55]

I am fairly new so my experience is limited. What I have noticed is that sustained horses generally don't do well unless the pace is slow.

But that is just me.
:)

[46zilzal]

Zilzal (one of my favorite milers)
I side with Jim Quinn that this is NOT the case when it comes to Turf routes.
Turf is a completely different animal and makes up for less than 15% of all races. It is the exception.

[46zilzal]

I am fairly new so my experience is limited. What I have noticed is that sustained horses generally don't do well unless the pace is slow.

But that is just me.


FRONT runners hold on MUCH better with a slow pace. You can take that to the bank thanks to CJ's work.

Closers do much better when the pace horses have to over-extend.

[bobphilo]

FRONT runners hold on MUCH better with a slow pace. You can take that to the bank thanks to CJ's work.

Closers do much better when the pace horses have to over-extend.

Finally something we can agree on, 46. Closers usually need the speed to tire in front of them from a fast pace. Speed horses do better with a slow pace so they have something left to hold of the closers.

Bob

[JustRalph]

there are conditions wherein there is "no pace" and S types do well. If an entire field is baren when it comes to front end pace.........the true S types will come running anyway............and usually hit the board with the best 1st and 2nd fraction horses and win their fair share. I get a very nice reading on these type of races via my software. And when I see "no pace" from anybody, you can bet the best 3rd fraction horses............

[cmoore]

I often look to see how many E and/or Ep style runners are in race. How many of those runners have 5 or more speed points. If half the field are E and/or Ep style runners with 5 speed points or more. Then you could easily get a S Style runner to win it. Already mentioned earlier in this thread. But a paceless race could also mean a crowded front end. A crowded front end also could get you a S Style winner. If you know your breeding real well. Many maiden races are loaded with early speed. First time starter early speed are ones the public doesn't notice as much. These can also get you a closer type winner. Those are far and few between though. Traffic problems and wide trips will hinder the closers. So if you think a closer has a real good chance. If the odds are juicy enough, always bet win and place or back up in the exotics some how. One more point. The lower purse claimers that duel usually give out much easier also.

[pandy]

Please express your opinions on the following:

1. (S) Sustained Pace or Final Fraction horses win their fair percentage of races.

2. These types of horses generally pay much better odds because they are often overlooked by the handicapping public.

3. These types perform better on synthetic surfaces.

Agree on all 3.