If the Red Sox get Santana, should they even play the season?

[harnesslover]

I mean is there a point?

To have arguably the 2 best pitchers in all of baseball 1-2 in your rotation is almost unfair.

[RaceBookJoe]

That would make them odds on to win again. Tigers made a nice trade , Yankees are always trying but Boston would have to be considered the favorites. Cleveland also has a nice rotation.

[harnesslover]

That would make them odds on to win again. Tigers made a nice trade , Yankees are always trying but Boston would have to be considered the favorites. Cleveland also has a nice rotation.
Tigers are going to have a sick lineup and a nice rotation..

Yankees are a mess, but for fear of having the whiny new jersey babies start ruining the thread, I will leave it at that

[njcurveball]

I am sure there is a Santana love fest going on here.

For those who play Fantasy Baseball, we know the guy lost a whole lot in the last 2 months of the season.

I think the stats go something like after his 17 strikeout game where he PI$$ED the fans off, he promptly went 2-4 with a 5.11 ERA the rest pf the way.

As for the Post Season, he is 1-4 lifetime with a 3.97 ERA.

I can't wait for the Sox to get him! :ThmbUp:

NO WAY I would give up Phil Hughes OR Ian Kennedy for him, let alone BOTH of them!

Sox are totally insane to give up Jacoby Ellsbury! If he goes to Minnesota he may just be the starting Center Fielder in the All Star Game in 2 years.

[ghostyapper]

I remember hearing the same thing about the 2004 lakers. How'd that work out?

[ghostyapper]

NO WAY I would give up Phil Hughes OR Ian Kennedy for him, let alone BOTH of them!

Are you insane?

[harnesslover]

Are you insane?

Not insane, just out of touch with reality.

To not trade for arguably the 2nd best pitcher in baseball is comical.

I mean come on, ALCS, game 7 against Beckett, who would you want on the mound? Santana? Hell no.. Ian Kennedy!!

[Robert Goren]

Pitchers can go from great to rotten in no time flat.

[harnesslover]

Pitchers can go from great to rotten in no time flat.

I am not disagreeing, but who has gone from GREAT to rotten like that of late that hasn't been injured or has gotten old?

[njcurveball]

Are you insane?

Santana has never been a big game pitcher. It is comical someone who criticizes Alex Rodriguez so much would put so much faith in him becoming one for the Sox.

How has he done in the World Series? Hmmm, he has NEVER pitched in the world series.

If I were putting a guy on the mound for one game today, obviously Santana towers over the two at this point.

However, they have to guarantee him over 100 million for what could easily be a few average seasons.

Pitching in the Bronx takes a certain attitude and Hughes and Kennedy have shown plenty of promise.

Ian Kennedy is 23, stepped in this year and won on the biggest stage in sports.

He also has a very modest contract for the next 4 years.

Phil Hughes? He is all of 21 and has taken a no-hitter into the 7th inning already at the Big League level.

Another modest contract for the next 4 years.

Free Agent pitchers, especially ones that tank in the last 2 months are terrible bets to pay off with big salaries.

How did Barry Zito do in September of 2006? A huge 5.40 ERA for Oakland. He comes to the pitching friendly NL and puts up an 11-13 season with a 4.53 ERA! Think the Giants would want that $126 million back?

I am sure the Yankee critics are loving this! Since if they trade for Santana then they all will point to the Yanks trying to "buy" the championship. And if the Yanks do the right thing and pass on his big contract, they can cry about that too.

Funny how Santana who has never won anything big is worth the money and Arod is criticized for his money and having never won anything big. :bang:

[RaceBookJoe]

It is always "damned if you do, damned if you dont" with the Yankees. iF they get Santana we will all hear " there they go again, trying to buy a ring" , if they try to build from youth we will hear " how could they pass up a top pitcher" . As a Yankee fan, yes I want them conpetitive but I would like to see them get back to a youth movement. If I was the owner, i would keep hughes,kennedy,cabrera, and joba...give them a year experience and shoot for the 2009 WS. In a perfect world of course haha. Boston...without Santana will still be a really good team, with him they have a possible dynasty.

[harnesslover]

Boston...without Santana will still be a really good team, with him they have a possible dynasty.
That's the scary part - they don't even need Santana..

[njcurveball]

ANd lest we not forget another great free agent pitcher named Jason Schmidt!

48 million for 3 years! Another guy coming off a terrible 2nd half with an ERA close to 5!

That didn't stop the Dodgers from paying him big money for his 1-4 season and 6+ ERA last year!

Sure, spend big money for a pitcher these days! Who knows? Maybe he will be great or maybe he will be playing poker with Carl Pavano and Jason Schmidt! :lol:

[harnesslover]

It is always "damned if you do, damned if you dont" with the Yankees. iF they get Santana we will all hear " there they go again, trying to buy a ring" , if they try to build from youth we will hear " how could they pass up a top pitcher" . As a Yankee fan, yes I want them conpetitive but I would like to see them get back to a youth movement. If I was the owner, i would keep hughes,kennedy,cabrera, and joba...give them a year experience and shoot for the 2009 WS. In a perfect world of course haha. Boston...without Santana will still be a really good team, with him they have a possible dynasty.

Maybe they're reeling from paying Clemens $20 million for trash.. Or Pavano or Wright or... well I can stop there..
Still blows my mind that a Yankee fan could use the excuse that paying a 2 time cy young winner who is 28 that much is ludacrous and a risk, but paying a 43 year old $26 million prorated for a half season is worth the risk.

But what do I know

[njcurveball]

without Santana will still be a really good team, with him they have a possible dynasty.

Whether it be the Sox, Yanks, Phils, or KC Royals. If I had a choice between Jacoby Ellsbury for 4 years in Center field at a modest salary or 100 million for a guy who has never pitched in the World Series, put me down for Ellsbury! :ThmbUp:

There was something wrong with Santana the last 2 months. Pay 100 million to find out? I am the glad the Yanks are not doing that! :ThmbUp:

[RaceBookJoe]

Maybe they're reeling from paying Clemens $20 million for trash.. Or Pavano or Wright or... well I can stop there..
Still blows my mind that a Yankee fan could use the excuse that paying a 2 time cy young winner who is 28 that much is ludacrous and a risk, but paying a 43 year old $26 million prorated for a half season is worth the risk.

But what do I know

I wasnt saying that it was ludacrous or a risk, i was just saying what it is. Pavano/wright I believe both got injured..so you can say it was a bad move or bad luck...kind of like the redskins drafting Sean Taylor then having him murdered, they went with who they thought could do good and bad luck bit them. The Clemons move was utter stupidity. Today's world is too much " i want/need it now". Sometimes you need to take a step or 2 backwards to get momentum to break through. Just my thoughts.

[harnesslover]

I wasnt saying that it was ludacrous or a risk, i was just saying what it is. Pavano/wright I believe both got injured..so you can say it was a bad move or bad luck...kind of like the redskins drafting Sean Taylor then having him murdered, they went with who they thought could do good and bad luck bit them. The Clemons move was utter stupidity. Today's world is too much " i want/need it now". Sometimes you need to take a step or 2 backwards to get momentum to break through. Just my thoughts.

The injuries do happen, but the point was Wright and Pavano each had exactly ONE decent year in their careers prior to the Yankees offering them those contracts. It just made no sense to offer those contracts to guys who hadn't really proven anything.

I don't disagree with them keeping Kennedy and Hughes as they could be decent pitchers.. I think they need to get younger, so you have to keep some youth. Is it worth passing up on a potential perennial cy young winner? Not sure.

And if Hughes and Kennedy turn out to be duds, then what do you have left?

[RaceBookJoe]

The injuries do happen, but the point was Wright and Pavano each had exactly ONE decent year in their careers prior to the Yankees offering them those contracts. It just made no sense to offer those contracts to guys who hadn't really proven anything.

I don't disagree with them keeping Kennedy and Hughes as they could be decent pitchers.. I think they need to get younger, so you have to keep some youth. Is it worth passing up on a potential perennial cy young winner? Not sure.

And if Hughes and Kennedy turn out to be duds, then what do you have left?

The same thing I have had the past few years...early exit from the playoffs haha.

[fouroneone]

even if the sox get santana, how do they plan on pitching to the tigers lineup :D :D :D

[harnesslover]

even if the sox get santana, how do they plan on pitching to the tigers lineup :D :D :D

Fortunately they only play them 8 times, so it really doesn't matter.

They have a nice lineup no doubt.

[RaceBookJoe]

They might have to inject the baseballs with steroids making them heavier. Should be an interesting season.

[njcurveball]

They might have to inject the baseballs with steroids making them heavier. Should be an interesting season.

Finally a job they can call on Jose Canseco to do right! :lol:

[Wiley]

Fortunately they only play them 8 times, so it really doesn't matter.

They have a nice lineup no doubt.
If the Tigers can stay healthy, a big if as they could not last year - Sheffield and Zumaya's shoulders are big question marks, it could matter with Santana in Boston and be to the Tiger's advantage if they both meet in the playoffs as Ordonez owns Santana.

[harnesslover]

If the Tigers can stay healthy, a big if as they could not last year - Sheffield and Zumaya's shoulders are big question marks, it could matter with Santana in Boston and be to the Tiger's advantage if they both meet in the playoffs as Ordonez owns Santana.

Well, I think Santana is going to stay with the Twins. And even so, one player vs one batter does not an edge make :-)

I hope the Tigers do stay healthy, it will be fun to see the mix of Sox, Angels, Indians, Tigers..

On paper, Angels look tough again.. But paper hasn't been good to them

[OTM Al]

For me these people saying it is over because the Red Sox would have the best team on paper are nuts. Consider the Red Sox Starting Rotation

1. Beckett: Great 2007. Great 2003. The three years in between though were good, but hardly at the level of the bookends. Which one shows up next year is not guaranteed.

2. Schilling: Still pitching well, but another year older. He shows up fat again it will be even harder to get back in shape.

3. Matzusaka: The super-dragon-happy-family gyro ball was a myth, but he's a good starter none the less. I think he has room to improve a little, so we are to see if he can adjust or if he gets bombed in his 2nd year.

4. Buckholz/Lester: Red Sox version of Phil Hughes, either one that remains.

The we have Santana himself. He is the best pitcher that is going to be available for some time no doubt, but the one question I ask you is how do you feel about a left handed flyball pitcher throwing half his games at Fenway where his lifetime ERA is 6+? I think the Sox are in this one to jerk the Yankee's chain, not to seriously pursue him.