A WEEK WITH TWO PROS

[shoelessjoe]

I know I will get blasted for this but I was looking this old Sartin manual A Week At The Races With Two Pros.If anyone has it please let me know I would either buy it or trade something for it.Thanks Shoeless

[PaceAdvantage]

You're not going to get blasted....and I don't know why you think you would...

[shoelessjoe]

It seems to bother some people on here when Im trying to locate something that is hard to find.I really dont know why because I always offer to either pay or trade something for it,Im not looking to get something for free.Shoeless

[PaceAdvantage]

It only bothers folks (and rightly so) when they suspect people of selling copies (pirated) of software or publications. There have been documented cases of folks doing exactly that here on this board.

I'm not saying you are doing this....just explaining to you why you may have noticed certain reactions to certain threads in the past....

[shoelessjoe]

I didnt realize that was happenning that explains things.I am just really into that old Pirco group they really had a lot of great teachers.Also Im using TPR quite a bit and would like to read all I can about it.Shoeless

[njcurveball]

Looks like someone has a copy on Ebay now.

[shoelessjoe]

Good now we will see if it will go for $200 like you think,I seriously doubt it.Shoeless

[njcurveball]

Good now we will see if it will go for $200 like you think,I seriously doubt it.Shoeless

I think you have had a great Saturday night drinking my friend! I never said this book would go for $200.

I think if there is enough interest it may go over $50 and maybe even $100.


It has a lot of good analysis with past performances included using TPR. It also has all the forms necessary and a comprehensive process where they take apart races.

Just the names Dick Schmidt and Tom Hambleton draw a lot of interest.

We will see my friend! First drink is on me if it gets $200 my friend! :ThmbUp:


Since you mentioned it, I will include the link here and we can see if the bidding is worth watching or if it is dud.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=250178495258&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=015

[Dick Schmidt]

Hell, if it goes for $200, I'll find the original paste-ups (lost somewhere deep in the garage of chaos) and reprint the damn thing. I've noticed that a lot more people say they would pay a bomb for some book or program than actually show up, money in hand.


Dick

Show me a man with both feet firmly on the ground, and I'll show you a
man who can't get his pants off.

[dutchboy]

For 15+ years I always assumed TPR referred to total pace rating until I typed it in the search engine and TPR is also used for trackmaster power ratings.



I didnt realize that was happenning that explains things.I am just really into that old Pirco group they really had a lot of great teachers.Also Im using TPR quite a bit and would like to read all I can about it.Shoeless

[First_Place]

"You're not going to get blasted....and I don't know why you think you would..."

Ha! For surely you jest, PA. :D Your forum is NOTORIUS for getting "blasted."

Regards,

FP

[cj]

I thought this was going to be about me getting to hang out with PA and Andicap at the Spa.

[Tom]

I thought it was about two hookers in Vegas. :D

[keilan]

I thought it was about two hookers in Vegas. :D


crack me up :lol: :ThmbUp: :lol:

[Tom Barrister]

I thought it was about two hookers in Vegas. :D

It says "Pros", not "Ho's". :p

[Tom]

In Vegas, they are "Pro Ho's!" :lol:

(Not to be confuses with Ho Ho's, although, enjoyable in thier own right)

[Red Knave]

I thought this was going to be about me getting to hang out with PA and Andicap at the Spa.We were missing the pro from Belgium :(

[Red Knave]

In Vegas, they are "Pro Ho's!" :lol:

(Not to be confused with Ho Ho's, although, enjoyable in their own right)You want a Ding Dong with that?? :eek:

[Tom]

That and a keg of coffee! :D

[njcurveball]

Back on topic.

I learned a lot from this book. It was one of the few Sartin manuals that approached the races with a cohesive contender and pace-line strategy. I also copied and used the model pages for track profiles, running models, and money management,

Having the DRF past performances and charts right there made it very easy to compare what I would have done with what the pros actually did.

I see from the comments above not many others have had a chance to read this book.

Shame, it is much better for learning than the dreaded "yellow manual".

[46zilzal]

Pizzola mentions, twice, that one of the major reasons he left Pirco was that he believed they kept things intentionally difficult to understand to keep people coming back.

[cj]

Pizzola mentions, twice, that one of the major reasons he left Pirco was that he believed they kept things intentionally difficult to understand to keep people coming back.

The stuff is hardly rocket science.

[46zilzal]

The stuff is hardly rocket science.
The subtle compounded and NEW ratings bring a different nuance to understanding them......Get up to date before you comment.

[njcurveball]

The stuff is hardly rocket science.


This is exactly the reason why many preferred TPR even when given the chance to use advanced programs like Kgen and Energy!

It has a pace number, a final fraction number, and a total pace rating. Many in the group were very successful using that simple approach.

[njcurveball]

I guess this must be a very rare book, other than the usual bantering on subjects not relating to the thread, no one else seems to have read it.

Shame, it is probably the best book on practical use of TPR out there.

[bigmack]

Zillyopolis: Pizzola believed they kept things intentionally difficult to understand to keep people coming back.
cj: The stuff is hardly rocket science
Zilzally: The subtle compounded and NEW ratings bring a different nuance to understanding them......Get up to date before you comment.

Branded 46 discourse.

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u70/macktime/avatar_1500.gif

[Tom]

I guess this must be a very rare book, other than the usual bantering on subjects not relating to the thread, no one else seems to have read it.

Shame, it is probably the best book on practical use of TPR out there.

Never saw it advertised, and don't recall ever even hearing about it.

Dick? Second Edition?

[njcurveball]

The only one I have seen is on Ebay now. I would post pictures from mine, but they might get mad.

It really helped the people in our group back then. Having track profiles, money management forms, TPR rating forms, and capping along with Dick Schmidt and Tom Hambleton as you read the book.

The people who bought programs like Kgen and Energy but did not understand them, did much better with the TPR ratings.

The yellow manual, as you probably know, was more dig and ask, dig and ask, dig and ask.

With TPR, you filled out your models, picked your pacelines, punched the numbers in the computer and bet.

I think one of Dick's recent posts said he was still using it and doing quite well, but I would not want to put any details there. Ever seen his avatar? :eek:

I don't know how far you are from South Jersey, Shoeless, if ACRC is within driving distance I would be glad to give you a look at my copy sometime.

That is unless the one on Ebay goes for $200, then mine should be out very soon. :jump:

Jim

[NoDayJob]

Good now we will see if it will go for $200 like you think,I seriously doubt it.Shoeless

Make sure the staples aren't rusted if you bid over $50. :lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

Ha! For surely you jest, PA. :D Your forum is NOTORIUS for getting "blasted."Where? Surely you jest...nobody gets blasted on my watch. Now BillW and CJ are another story....:lol:

[njcurveball]

Good now we will see if it will go for $200 like you think,I seriously doubt it.Shoeless


Well Shoeless, the book is at $86 with 11 hours to go. Is that any different from what we talked about?

[banacek]

Well Shoeless, the book is at $86 with 11 hours to go. Is that any different from what we talked about?

$247.50. Gee, I sold mine a couple of years ago on ebay and maybe got 50 bucks!

[witchdoctor]

Hell, if it goes for $200, I'll find the original paste-ups (lost somewhere deep in the garage of chaos) and reprint the damn thing. I've noticed that a lot more people say they would pay a bomb for some book or program than actually show up, money in hand.


Dick

Show me a man with both feet firmly on the ground, and I'll show you a
man who can't get his pants off.



Dick

Looks like you will need to go digging in the garage.

[Donnie]

Dick--
Re: the "garage of chaos" - I'll pay you $100 if you let me come over and clean it out for you! :jump:

Wonder how many "gems" you got buriied out there....??

[The Judge]

the book did you? Would have been the smart move. I have the book I know where it is but wasn't there a tape with it? If so , I'll have to look for the tape.

[Donnie]

Geez, Judge, I never thought of that! The guy owns the copyright, but doesn't have the book laying around anymore. Re-obtain an original of the book, take it to the printers and then have it "republished" from a print-to-order printer. I know quite a few people who would probably be interested in obtaining an updated version of that book. I think he'd easily get his investment back and much more!

I still wonder what he has packed away in his garage. If he's like me, there is the chance he didn't throw ANYTHING away. At least that is what my wife would tell you!!! :eek:

[Dave Schwartz]

Dick--
Re: the "garage of chaos" - I'll pay you $100 if you let me come over and clean it out for you!


Donnie,

I have seen that garage... Before you go in there you'd better leave a note on your car so that the rescue guys know where to come looking.

Dick's office? His idea of "orderly" is to have all the piles of papers the same size - like 3-4 feet tall.

Seriously...

:lol:


Dave

[Dick Schmidt]

OK, OK, I'll look and see if I can find it. May take a while. After that, I'll talk it over with Tom, as he holds the copyright with me. Maybe we can do it. I don't remember a tape with it, but the book should be as valuable as ever.

Dick
Brilliance borrows, genius steals!

[dartman51]

Wow!! $247.50. Not bad. Let's all have a drink.

Dartman51

[andicap]

I thought this was going to be about me getting to hang out with PA and Andicap at the Spa.

You talking about my handicapping or my golf game?

[Donnie]

HEY DICK!!!
WHILE YOU"RE OUT THERE.......!! (yelling cause I believe we last saw him heading for his garage!)

You still got the paste-ups for this one?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Handicapping-1989-A-Day-At-The-Races-Dick-Schmidt_W0QQitemZ250185289264QQihZ015QQcategoryZ31 668QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

And, no, it is not me selling it this time!! :)

[Dick Schmidt]

Yeah, I still have originals for everything I ever did. In the case of the manual you are referring to, I would need to get permission from all of the authors and then no doubt pay each some part of the profits. Only fair, but it ain't gonna happen. Way too much work. If I didn't write it by myself, or with one other person I am still in contact with (Tom Hambleton or Bert Mayne, for instance) then its going to stay on the shelf (or in the box at the bottom of the pile).

Haven't made it out to the garage yet, but I'm sure I will. Any day now. Real soon. Yup.

Dick

Waiting for brilliance to hit me.....stay tuned. May be awhile.

[banacek]

Yeah, I still have originals for everything I ever did. In the case of the manual you are referring to, I would need to get permission from all of the authors and then no doubt pay each some part of the profits.

Doesn't stop you from writing a new book. Put me down for an autographed copy!

[shoelessjoe]

Good now we will see if it will go for $200 like you think,I seriously doubt it.Shoeless


I want to apologize to Njcurveball for not accurately quoting him saying the book would go for $200.00.I dont want to be lumped in with some of the people who are assholes on board here.Shoeless

[shoelessjoe]

I would like to add that I just recieved a nice e mail from Njcurveball,he's a nice guy and I wish there were more here like him.Shoeless

[andicap]

I've got an original red match-up manual, mainly bradshaws stuff (and some Pizzolla). Not in the greatest of shape -- some pages missing but still mainly intact.
Wonder how much THAT would go for?
Someone gave it to me for free about 10 years ago.

I also had an energy manual but that seems to have be missing.

[Donnie]

Andi--
Depends.
Is someone interested in it because they are a collector? Then the finer the shape it is in, comes into play in a major way.
Are they interested in the content? To say "some pages missing" is a huge bummer. Cause what's on those pages may really affect the value. When these two conditions cross over, watch out. If the item is something that has never been seen on Ebay before, and it is in GREAT shape, and for hands-on application, all is present and accounted for, this creates the primo auction environment. Considering that many programs dovetailed off the Sartin group, any original material has become almost "the lost archives". I didn't realize it until a week ago, but I have an original manuscript from Walt Owens, hand typed out and put in a 3 ring binder. Walt is considered a fine system seller. I got this manuscript with a bunch of other books I bought as a lot. Just threw the whole lot up on my bookshelf and never took the time to look thru it. Moved all my stuff to a new bookshelf and thumbed thru stuff I never knew I even had! Did you know that Gordon Jones wrote a book on money management? Neither did I ....but I have it.

I take GREAT care in handling anything I have purchased in the past. I do not underline or highlight anything in my books. If it is of interest to me, I will write it down. This could be the difference between a book fetching $15 and the same book ending at $85. I have a number of Sartin FollowUps that you would swear are fresh off the press....but they have been stored and sealed in plastic acid-free bags....I have had some nice sales on Ebay, but have also sold to a private collector for VERY generous amounts of money.

I will admit, this "Week with 2 Pros" took me by surprise.....but I figured $100- $150 would be a reasonable range. Kinda like hitting an exacta you thought was gonna pay $30 and it ends up paying $50+!

[banacek]

Hey Dick, Another one just sold on ebay. Sold for $199 (buy it now) in less than a day.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=250193176594&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=015

Time to search the garage.:)

[Pace Cap'n]

My wife saw a really, really, old bible at a garage sale last week for $50. She said she would have bought it but some guy named Gutenberg had written his name all over it.