Wagering innovations more effective than takeout reduction

[trigger]

"Vercruysse said that the Magna 5 has succeeded where the Ellis pick 4 with a 4% takeout failed because handle increases dramatically on the individual races that comprise the Magna 5."
http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/national-news/2007/September/17/Wagering-innovations-more-successful-than-takeout-reduction.aspx

[DeanT]

Ya, those Magna guys really know how to run a racing business. Everyone should listen :D

[PaceAdvantage]

Didn't handle on Ellis' pick 4 experiment increase substantially?

[jma]

Didn't handle on Ellis' pick 4 experiment increase substantially?

Up 105%, though I guess that wasn't enough for Ellis to overcome the drastic cut in takeout. Of course their overall wagering was down 15% due to "signal issues", so I'd say that type of increase was pretty remarkable.

[kenwoodallpromos]

Wagering up on discounted bets but not overall? Maybe tracks should throw some bones with some meat on them!

[trigger]

http://news.bloodhorse.com/viewstory.asp?id=40837

[rrbauer]

"Vercruysse said that the Magna 5 has succeeded where the Ellis pick 4 with a 4% takeout failed because handle increases dramatically on the individual races that comprise the Magna 5."
http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/national-news/2007/September/17/Wagering-innovations-more-successful-than-takeout-reduction.aspx
The Magna P5 takes advantage of the seasonal offerings of Gulfstream and Santa Anita with some Laurel added in. It's a bet that happens once a week with a guaranteed minimum and it's heavily promoted both on TV and on the Internet. Ellis is a small secondary track with limited exposure and cheap horses. The 4% takeout was a nice gesture but required people like me for example to come up to speed on a new circuit and then make one play a day? Even with the reduced take the pools were small by comparison to first-line tracks and the payoffs were very chalky.

And to extend that idea, the 10-day reduced takeout at Laurel's chicken-shit short meet is going to get players to focus less on Saratoga and Del Mar and the other traditional summer venues just so they can see it (the reduced takeout) go away about the time they're up to speed on that circuit?

Show me some substance and I'll show some support for it.

[jma]

The Magna P5 takes advantage of the seasonal offerings of Gulfstream and Santa Anita with some Laurel added in. It's a bet that happens once a week with a guaranteed minimum and it's heavily promoted both on TV and on the Internet. Ellis is a small secondary track with limited exposure and cheap horses. The 4% takeout was a nice gesture but required people like me for example to come up to speed on a new circuit and then make one play a day? Even with the reduced take the pools were small by comparison to first-line tracks and the payoffs were very chalky.

And to extend that idea, the 10-day reduced takeout at Laurel's chicken-shit short meet is going to get players to focus less on Saratoga and Del Mar and the other traditional summer venues just so they can see it (the reduced takeout) go away about the time they're up to speed on that circuit?

Show me some substance and I'll show some support for it.

I was a big proponent of Ellis and their gesture to cut takeout---it was for the whole meet, and they can't help that they're not a major market. They tried. Still, I can't disagree with any of what you wrote. We need a big player in the field to go for meaningful takeout reduction. So far, it's not happening.

[DeanT]

Ellis's pick 4 on weekends, when a stakes race or competitive ALW race was carded was very well supported. Even if there was a couple 5K MCL diced in.

They did good work considering that many OTB's could not take the bet. All of Canada was shut out of Laurel. It was not on a couple of ADW's I believe as well.

Imo, this business wants to quash all talk of lowering rakes. The less people talk about it, the more they think it will go away and people will blindly enjoy playing into 30% rakes again.

The thing that kills me is the LRL guy. No change at all in wagering he says. What about the fact that people went to your track, cashed a $200 ticket and got back $20 more bucks or whatever, then bet a SAR race? That money back into people's pockets went right back into the pools. They did not stuff the extra 10% in a sock and take it home when they cashed tickets.