Will Pays

[buster]

Hey guys. I've been lurking for awhile and really enjoy the site. I'm new to handicapping and need as much help as I can get.

Anyway, does anyone know if there is a place to find past will pays? I'm looking for exacta will pays if that matters.

Thanks for any help.

[Ray]

Tvg.com has that info on there site you dont even have to be a member but of course its only for the tracks they cover . let me know how you like it.

[highnote]

Tvg.com has that info on there site you dont even have to be a member but of course its only for the tracks they cover . let me know how you like it.

I see current will pays on your site, but not past will pays.

Am I missing something? Or do the past will pays not exist on your site?

Thanks.

John

[Ray]

OH I didn tknow you meant passed will pays as far as that goes I have no cluw where one could find that ill do som research but I can timagine anyone houseing thatinfo where the public could get to it. ill let you know.

[highnote]

I can timagine anyone houseing thatinfo where the public could get to it. ill let you know.

Too bad. Seems like there'd be a market for it.

[The Judge]

Are talking about the results. What did the 3 and 8 horse pay in the 9th at Saratoga type thing? If so you can get it free by looking up the track itself on line. They have the rasults and the payouts. There are other places some charge a small fee depending on what you want, others are free. Is this what you are looking for?

[highnote]

No. We want to know the probable payoff of every exacta combination before the race outcome was known. And we'd like the historical probable payoffs going back several years.

Not the results of the winning combination, but the probable payoffs for every combination before the outcome is known.

Some people call it the "exacta matrix".

If there are 10 horses in the race then we want to know how much each combination was paying.

1 with 2, 1 with 3 .... 1 with 10.

2 with 1, 2 with 3... 2 with 10. etc. etc. etc.

[point given]

I donot know of a historical site that saves the exacta matrix. HOWEVER ; I have noticed that Youbet does have the matrix for previous races on the day of the race. So, lets say you logon at the 7th race , and go back to the other races run that day, you can look at the will pays for those races even afterwards. Its an interesting concept and I had contemplated it some years ago when i was in a teletheater which had designated monitors with just the exacta matrix on it , and guys were scribbling away on legal pads, charting the changes in the payouts.. It seemed so cavemanish to do all this work scribbling will pays, when it would be possible to sit at a computer and do printouts every 5 minutes instead. BTW- does anyone do this now ? Follow the $$ in this manner ?

[Good4Now]

You could try to approximate PAST pays for combinations of horses using the Nevada style formula of WIN price times one-half the PLACE price.

Since it seems you are focusing on a few horses do it once with A winning and B second, then reverse with B winning and A second. It may get you where you want to go, but I can't tell if you are trying to get to Cinncinatti or San Jose.

[trigger]

I donot know of a historical site that saves the exacta matrix. HOWEVER ; I have noticed that Youbet does have the matrix for previous races on the day of the race. So, lets say you logon at the 7th race , and go back to the other races run that day, you can look at the will pays for those races even afterwards. Its an interesting concept and I had contemplated it some years ago when i was in a teletheater which had designated monitors with just the exacta matrix on it , and guys were scribbling away on legal pads, charting the changes in the payouts.. It seemed so cavemanish to do all this work scribbling will pays, when it would be possible to sit at a computer and do printouts every 5 minutes instead. BTW- does anyone do this now ? Follow the $$ in this manner ?

I'd be careful using the info shown on the Youbet exacta matrix to plot exacta payoff changes prior to a specific race. If you watch the race on TVG (real time) and at the same time keep an eye on the gross exacta total for the same race on the Youbet matrix screen (Youbet race video is delayed about 30 seconds), the gross exacta total (and specific exacta payoffs) on Youbet often gets updated for huge amounts (e.g., like 50+% of the pool) as the TVG horses enter the home stretch and sometimes after the race is over.
I don't think this is a Youbet thing. I think the tote companies use most their resources to update win odds before the race goes off (not very successfully!) and then update the other exotic pools while the race is being run since changes in these payoffs are much less noticeable to the betting public.

[betovernetcapper]

I don't think this data is available commercially but you can create your own with ATR by having it save the exacta screen at X min' to post. This is something I've always thought might be interesting but have never gotten around to doing.
http://homebased2.com/atr/atr6.htm

[point given]

I'd be careful using the info shown on the Youbet exacta matrix to plot exacta payoff changes prior to a specific race. If you watch the race on TVG (real time) and at the same time keep an eye on the gross exacta total for the same race on the Youbet matrix screen (Youbet race video is delayed about 30 seconds), the gross exacta total (and specific exacta payoffs) on Youbet often gets updated for huge amounts (e.g., like 50+% of the pool) as the TVG horses enter the home stretch and sometimes after the race is over.
I don't think this is a Youbet thing. I think the tote companies use most their resources to update win odds before the race goes off (not very successfully!) and then update the other exotic pools while the race is being run since changes in these payoffs are much less noticeable to the betting public.

Thanks for pointing it out. i only use DD, p3/4 willpays. What about otbs that have the exacta matrix tvs, they are real time, no ?

[buster]

Thanks for the input guys. I guess I might just have to keep track of a few tracks myself.

[trigger]

Thanks for pointing it out. i only use DD, p3/4 willpays. What about otbs that have the exacta matrix tvs, they are real time, no ?

I would tend to doubt that the otb exacta TV screens reflect real time payoffs as I think the tote companies control the transmission of the betting info and, as far as I can tell, exacta info is delayed as the totes try to process win bet info first.
But, you could check by watching the exacta otb screens while a race is being televised and see if the gross exacta pool and/or the specific payoffs change dramatically very late into the actual running of the race (or after the race is over!).
I'd be interested in what you find if you decide to do this (exacta matrix screens not available in my neck of the woods).