Del Mar: inside vs. outside/speed vs. closers

[Turfday]

I spoke with a prominent So. California trainer today who is settled in nicely at Del Mar.

In the mornings, the track is firmer (weather is cooler). When it's hot (like in the afternoon), the track figures to be spongier.

Two other prominent So. California trainers complained that the Polytrack was too spongy (although most had differing opinions). Apparently their voice was heard, as the next day, tractors had been on the track pushing the material down (making it firmer).

The Del Mar oval has a shorter stretch than Hollywood Park and Santa Anita, a well known fact. So my question to all of you physics majors (of which I'm not one), what would your take be on the following:

If a racetrack is banked more steeply, what type of runners have an edge? If a racetrack is banked moderately, what type of runners have an edge? If a racetrack has NO BANK on its turns whatsoever, what type of runners have an edge?

This trainer told me today that when the surface was installed, there is NO BANK on the turns at Del Mar.

If, indeed this is the case, and I have no reason to doubt him, my unscientific, naive opinion based on NO BANK... turning into the stretch, the horses inside or rallying inside should have the edge...e.g. ("golden rail").

And if it's a HOT day, you'd better have a fit horse. I think it will be tougher for a first-time starter to win.

I'm merely speculating. Any opinions from the physics majors?

[GMB@BP]

I spoke with a prominent So. California trainer today who is settled in nicely at Del Mar.

In the mornings, the track is firmer (weather is cooler). When it's hot (like in the afternoon), the track figures to be spongier.

Two other prominent So. California trainers complained that the Polytrack was too spongy (although most had differing opinions). Apparently their voice was heard, as the next day, tractors had been on the track pushing the material down (making it firmer).

The Del Mar oval has a shorter stretch than Hollywood Park and Santa Anita, a well known fact. So my question to all of you physics majors (of which I'm not one), what would your take be on the following:

If a racetrack is banked more steeply, what type of runners have an edge? If a racetrack is banked moderately, what type of runners have an edge? If a racetrack has NO BANK on its turns whatsoever, what type of runners have an edge?

This trainer told me today that when the surface was installed, there is NO BANK on the turns at Del Mar.

If, indeed this is the case, and I have no reason to doubt him, my unscientific, naive opinion based on NO BANK... turning into the stretch, the horses inside or rallying inside should have the edge...e.g. ("golden rail").

And if it's a HOT day, you'd better have a fit horse. I think it will be tougher for a first-time starter to win.

I'm merely speculating. Any opinions from the physics majors?

If you are considering energy distribution, that late runners will have more energy, front running horses having to slow down into the turn would provide more of an advantage to the closers.

I mean drive a car at 35 an hour into a pretty decent curve with no bank and you are talking about some serious force which is why the less the bank the larger the radius needed to negotiate the curve, and of course the speed plays a part. I mean a 2% bank is fine, its just not as fine for a front runner as 6% which is what they had last year.

I always thought del mar provided front runners a sling shot affect into the stretch compared to HP and SA due to the banking. I really think this along with the surface is going to make it look more like a turf race where the field bunches up.

Well see tomorrow, I am only playing turf races the first few days to get a feel for what is going on.

[ELA]

Good info -- thanks. The physics aspect is far beyond me, LOL. About the track surface itself though, I spoke with several jockeys who have been working horses daily over the new surface. One thing that concerned me, initially, is the volatility of the surface -- for example, between Sunday and Monday, and then to today. I've thought, since the very begining that any synthetic track surface would be a "work in progress" type of situation, and that the work, as well as the surface, would develop over time and have a "life cycle" so to speak.

It's one thing to have a surface in use at a training center, where there might be several hundred horses using the track on daily basis -- as opposed to having a surface where 1000 plus horses are not only using the surace in the mornings, but are racing over the surface in the afternoon as well. The practical application would understandibly create a different dynamic.

I think anyone who feels they "know" how the track is going to play, right from the get-go, is either fooling themselves, or is trying to take a confident stand. Not that I am an expert, but I think cautious due diligence is called for. There will be nuances, idiosyncrasies, etc. in the track -- daily, as time goes on, etc. At least that is the expectation. Or, perhaps it will be a very biased, very predictable track -- who knows, LOL.

Eric

[kenwoodallpromos]

Not as much banking is supposed to be needed for artificial track, but some are using (steep) 6 degree instead of 3 or 4 degrees anyway. DM website says theirs was "adjusted", meaning lowered.

I know most do not go by workouts, but most days has been 50 to 50 2/5 average for 4f works; a couple of days it was up to "normal" 49.4.
If the track workouts Wed, am is anything close to 37 for 3f or 49 flat for 4f, I will expect early speed to dominate. Slower and I expect class to rule the opening day sprints.

[Turfday]

There is a 3% bank on the turns at Del Mar, not no bank as I previously posted above.

[Pell Mell]

I really don't know how it would play out with horses but having driven race cars for many years I can tell you how banks work with cars. If there is banking on the track or in the turns the fastest way around is to stay very high or wide entering the turn and then drop down to hit your apex and then to drift toward the outside coming off the turn.

I think this is what Bobby Ussery used to do in NY many years ago.

[Zoocapper]

Do you think it will be the best jockeys who are able to figure the bias if a bias exists?

[kenwoodallpromos]

I predict the early speed jockeys will do fine in the rubber sprints today.