"Unsafe Track Conditions"

[takeout]

What's with these tracks that keep closing at the drop of a raindrop? It definitely looks like a bad time to own a mudder.:rolleyes: What's a rough rule of thumb as to how often track bases should have a complete rebuild?

[sq764]

I think it varies from track to track as to their quickness to close.. I know that Penn National constantly closes, looks like te riders have the entire say witt that up there.

Charlestown on the other hand has awful weather all the time and they always seem to race..

[crackers@NOLA]

Today Woodbine, Charles Town and Delaware Park all canceled. I can speak on the Del. situation first hand since I have 3 stabled there. This track has been in the worst shape EVER this year, even when it was dry it was not a good surface to race over. What really erks me about today was that they didn't cancel till almost 11:45 and most of the horses were already treated with LASIX. They canceled yesterday after the 3rd race and we were sure they wouldn't race today. It's just another example of track management giving the horsemen a kick in the ass. If we didn't treat with LASIX and they ran the races we all would have been fined for not running our horses. I can guarantee you one thing I don't think the slots at CT or Del missed a beat today.

[Tom]

Not too many wet slots, eh? <G>
Seriously, I think when the jocks say no, that is the end of discussion. At FL, a few years ago, they actually fired (banned) about ten jocks at at the end of the season because they were instrmental in the cancelling of several days that year. They included the top five jocks! Cooler heads eventually prevailed and they let them come back.
Safety of horse an rider is number one, two, three, four and five.
There is no six.
No fat-ass track offical sitting on his duff inside should EVER have any say at all when they don't race.

[takeout]

Actually I was thinking of Charles Town as one of the worst offenders in the last couple of years. True, years ago it seemed like the jocks would always ride in bad weather but back then I guess it was either ride or starve. I guess it's proper that the jocks have the final say but it can be very frustrating to players and I can only imagine what the horsemen who van in go through for nothing, not to mention their expenses. Saturday night CT closed after the 7th race of a 10 race card. Now I'm thinking... if you can run 7 races in the rain... well, you get my drift. ;)

Am I correct in assuming that if the track bases were rebuilt when they were supposed to be that the jocks would have no reason to refuse to ride on wet tracks?

[Zaf]

Originally posted by takeout
Actually I was thinking of Charles Town as one of the worst offenders in the last couple of years. True, years ago it seemed like the jocks would always ride in bad weather but back then I guess it was either ride or starve. I guess it's proper that the jocks have the final say but it can be very frustrating to players and I can only imagine what the horsemen who van in go through for nothing, not to mention their expenses. Saturday night CT closed after the 7th race of a 10 race card. Now I'm thinking... if you can run 7 races in the rain... well, you get my drift. ;)

Am I correct in assuming that if the track bases were rebuilt when they were supposed to be that the jocks would have no reason to refuse to ride on wet tracks?

It seems that it would take a natural disaster to cancel a card at Mountaineer. They run on some pretty crappy nights.

ZAFONIC

[PurplePower]

Originally posted by takeout
Am I correct in assuming that if the track bases were rebuilt when they were supposed to be that the jocks would have no reason to refuse to ride on wet tracks?
Sometimes the worst year for a track is the first year after a "rebuild" - especially if base is rebuilt. There is some ground shift and packing and the cushion can feel like it is actually sliding over the base. Then, different parts of country use different soils for their base, sub-base and cushion. Sam Houston Race Park has a unique surface in that the sub base and cushion are both the same Brazos River Sand mix so the top of our track is 10 inches of Brazos River Sand. Our track super mixes a little clay and silt-loam with the stuff that comes directly from the river to maintain a consistent mix around the oval. It is roughly 92% of a course sand, 4% clay and 4% silt-loam. This surface handles a lot of water and has very good footing even when sloppy. In fact, this track actually records faster times right after a good hard packing rain - especially if we have been dry for a couple of weeks. Canterbury had beautiful, fluffy black "top soil" when I raced there. Wonderful for training two-year olds (or growing corn) and kind to older runners with tender feet, etc. When wet, however, that surface was slicker than a linoleum floor with cooking oil spilled on it. (Actually never stepped in owl s**t - so that expression doesn't have the same meaning for me).

Tom said it when he said "safety first". Going 35-40 mph around a 180 degree arc in less than 440 yards is exciting enough without adding the thrill of a slippery surface. And, I agree with Crackers 100 % that track management needs to at least give the impression that they understand what goes on prior to racing and make decisions about cancellation (or moving OFF turf) before lasix time when possible.

After all:Baseball cancels when it rains, golf and tennis too.
They don't have the balls, it seems, for playing in the goo.
NASCAR stops their big machines and puts them in pit row.
Fans want to see them hit the wall, they don't like 'em going slow.
Football keeps on going, because in addition to liking pain,
Most of those behemoths don't have the sense to get out of the rain.
(Ok - it's Monday after Texas Champions night -- I am not a poet, but wax dumb every now and then - Too bad it wasn't raining in my office here so that my computer called off posting for the remainder of the day.)

[takeout]

Originally posted by PurplePower
It is roughly 92% of a course sand, 4% clay and 4% silt-loam. This surface handles a lot of water and has very good footing even when sloppy.

That sounds like a recipe that needs to be sent to Charles Town.

I'm not sure what is going on up there but they ran all ten on a "muddy" track Friday night, then ran all ten on a "muddy" track Saturday night, then cancel after the 3rd race on a "muddy" track Sunday afternoon.

I have the same question as before. If they can run 23 races in the mud, why not 30? Can the mud be that different from day to day? They did have a lot of jockey defections Saturday night.

[Zaf]

Originally posted by takeout
That sounds like a recipe that needs to be sent to Charles Town.

I'm not sure what is going on up there but they ran all ten on a "muddy" track Friday night, then ran all ten on a "muddy" track Saturday night, then cancel after the 3rd race on a "muddy" track Sunday afternoon.

I have the same question as before. If they can run 23 races in the mud, why not 30? Can the mud be that different from day to day? They did have a lot of jockey defections Saturday night.

Surprized they don't cancel more often. They certainly do not need their racetrack handle to be profitable.

ZAFONIC

[Rick]

Why don't they have covered tracks like a lot of sports stadiums so that they never have to worry about the weather? Or would it take the sport out of things to have a consistent surface?

[takeout]

Originally posted by zafonic
Surprized they don't cancel more often. They certainly do not need their racetrack handle to be profitable.

ZAFONIC
That may be part of the problem. Mnr is a slot track, however, and they seem to run a lot more than CT. Mnr has only closed 4 times this year to CT's 12.

It would be interesting if tracks with slots had to turn off the slots when they couldn't produce their live racing card and/or cancelled during their card. If racing is cancelled after the 3rd race, then cut the power to the slots after the 3rd race. No racing at all when it's scheduled, then the slot side doesn't open at all that day. It wouldn't take long for whatever needed fixing to get fixed then. ;)

If the slots are supposed to subsidize these tracks (and pretty soon they'll probably be in the majors as well) then one would think that they would take at least a small part of that revenue to keep the track side running. One thing's for sure, there isn't going to be a penny spent on the horseracing side that isn't mandatory.

[takeout]

Originally posted by Rick
Why don't they have covered tracks like a lot of sports stadiums so that they never have to worry about the weather?
Sounds like a good idea to me. Now, if we can just get them to earmark some of that slot dough... :)

[Zaf]

Originally posted by takeout
That may be part of the problem. Mnr is a slot track, however, and they seem to run a lot more than CT. Mnr has only closed 4 times this year to CT's 12.

It would be interesting if tracks with slots had to turn off the slots when they couldn't produce their live racing card and/or cancelled during their card. If racing is cancelled after the 3rd race, then cut the power to the slots after the 3rd race. No racing at all when it's scheduled, then the slot side doesn't open at all that day. It wouldn't take long for whatever needed fixing to get fixed then. ;)

If the slots are supposed to subsidize these tracks (and pretty soon they'll probably be in the majors as well) then one would think that they would take at least a small part of that revenue to keep the track side running. One thing's for sure, there isn't going to be a penny spent on the horseracing side that isn't mandatory.

The slot take is reflected in the inflated purses at places like CT, MNR, WO , PRM etc. The money is filtering back to the horsemen and the game in that way.

Lets face the slot end drives the business, They are going to keep those one arm bandits running 365, 24/7.

ZAFONIC