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View Full Version : 3 easy queations ... for you, but not for me

Robert Vaughan
03-17-2007, 03:37 AM
Hopefully these are 3 easy questions for you ... they aren't for me ...

(1) I have some DRF PP data where the distance unit = Yards and the Breed is either QuarterHorse or Mixed. For distances 300, 350, 400, 450, 550 and 8.70, some of the PPs show both first fractions and final times ... primarily at the 300, 350, and 870 distances. What are the distances to be associated with the first fraction values?

Two questions regarding class. I'm sure there are many perspectives, but ...

(2) What Purse and/or Claim Price ranges should be used to create reasonable class groups?

(3) Obviously, there is considerable overlap of purse ranges accross the Claiming, Allowance, and stake categories ... how do you compare or rate competing horses with past performances from races having similar purses but different class categories? (3a) Is there much difference in class definitions accross tracks?


Thanks!

Robert
ranchwest
03-17-2007, 09:27 AM
Robert, are all of your questions related to QH's? For questions 2 and 3, I think there's a difference in the answer based on the breed.
Tom
03-17-2007, 09:58 AM
http://racing.aqha.com/racing/handicapping/index.aspx


If you are into QH's, there is a lot of good sutff here.
Robert Vaughan
03-17-2007, 10:42 AM
"Robert, are all of your questions related to QH's? For questions 2 and 3, I think there's a difference in the answer based on the breed".


The first question obviously relates to QH's but the others are intended to be relative to T'Breds. I'm analyzing the QH data so as to learn more about acceleration during the first 2 furlongs of a race.

For that reason, I would like to know how to compare classes accross the 2 Breeds. However, the class questions were intended to cover T'Breds.
Big Bill
03-17-2007, 04:43 PM
Robert,

You asked:

"(3) Obviously, there is considerable overlap of purse ranges accross the Claiming, Allowance, and stake categories ... how do you compare or rate competing horses with past performances from races having similar purses but different class categories? (3a) Is there much difference in class definitions accross tracks?"

You might try and find a copy of Quinn's Recreational Handicapping. He has two class charts, one for major tracks and one for minor tracks, that address your question in general terms. I use them in my handicapping.

Big Bill
Tom
03-17-2007, 05:38 PM
http://www.turfpedia.com/techniques/
Big Bill
03-18-2007, 02:21 PM
Tom,

The two charts on the turfpedia link you posted are not the two that I was telling Robert about, if that is what you thought. The two class charts are only in Quinn's Recreational Handicapping book. I'm fairly certain they are not on Quinn's web site.

Sorry you aren't feeling well....hope you are better today.

Big Bill
Tom
03-18-2007, 04:37 PM
Thanks, Bill - food staying down now - that is good!

I thought those were the ones you refered to. Sorry about that.
ranchwest
03-18-2007, 07:06 PM
"Robert, are all of your questions related to QH's? For questions 2 and 3, I think there's a difference in the answer based on the breed".


The first question obviously relates to QH's but the others are intended to be relative to T'Breds. I'm analyzing the QH data so as to learn more about acceleration during the first 2 furlongs of a race.

For that reason, I would like to know how to compare classes accross the 2 Breeds. However, the class questions were intended to cover T'Breds.

I haven't handicapped QH's in a long time, but when I was I found that QH's would jump class levels a lot more than TB's, due in part to the relatively low purse levels.

Some QH's would only run at one track, so they'd go out to pasture for six months during the off season and then come back fresh with maybe a month of training, sometimes coming back at a different level. Tough to handicap to say the least.

If you're truly trying to compare across the breeds, say for a mixed breed race, I'd say that is even more complicated.

IMHO, QH's are a lot more pure in speed than TB's, so that speed is not only a good measure of ability, but also of class. There's not much rating in QH racing, it's pretty much flat out running, at least at the shorter distances.

You might want to try reading "Handicapping Speed: The Thoroughbred and Quarter Horse Sprinters (A critical look at the science of speed handicapping)" by Charles Carroll.