Nice Touch, Rich

[bigmack]

NYT RICH: 'WE HAVE LOST IN IRAQ'
Sat Dec 09 2006 17:55:43 ET

"We're not winning - We've lost"

So declares Bush critic Frank Rich in Sunday runs of the NEW YORK TIMES.

Taking it all the way, this time, Rich writes: "The actual reality is that we have lost in Iraq"

"The Iraq-Vietnam parallels at this juncture are striking" Rich explains, in an op-ed he has titled: "THE SUNSHINE BOYS CAN'T SAVE IRAQ"

Rich declares: "As bad as things may seem now, they can yet become worse, and not just in Iraq"

"The longer we pretend that we have not lost there, the more we risk losing other wars we still may salvage, starting with Afghanistan"

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/tsc.html?URI=http://select.nytimes.com/2006/12/10/opinion/10rich.html&OQ=_rQ3D1Q26nQ3DTopQ252fOpinionQ252fEditorialsQ252 0andQ2520OpQ252dEdQ252fOpQ252dEdQ252fColumnistsQ25 2fFrankQ2520Rich&OP=662483d3Q2FQ25jQ5DvQ25gkL77gQ25YmmPQ25Q3EYQ25Q3 EmQ257cxQ7Ex7Q7EQ25Q3EmLxQ3FzQ2Bzg5q
If you lack login with NYT:
Username poopoohead3
Password poopoohead

[PaceAdvantage]

I don't get it. Lost? Iraq-Vietnam parallels are striking? In what way? Have these people ever taken a history class in their lives?

Having been a student of the Vietnam War in the past, I can say this author is thoroughly full of shit, if he is going to sit there and proclaim the Iraq-Vietnam parallels are striking.

There is only one instance in where the parallels may be striking, and that is the way the American media turned into the most incredible PR machine our enemy has ever had....

[46zilzal]

BIGGEST PARALLEL: BOTH conflicts were based upon overt lies.


Flawed Intelligence and the Decision for War in Vietnam

Signals Intercepts, Cited at Time, Prove Only August 2nd Battle, Not August 4 and purported Second Attack Prompted Congressional Blank Check for War

Johnson-McNamara Tapes Show Readiness to Escalate, Even on Suspect Intel.

One example of many

[bigmack]

BIGGEST PARALLEL: BOTH conflicts were based upon overt lies.
State it for all to see 46. Rather than your typical fare just come out with the Taoist nature that you adhere to and declare that while our cherished breathren's are in harms way that op-ed pieces as Franks are uncalled for under current conditions. We've lost?????

Rather than "fighting the power" that to you lies or misleads the public, have some thought about a guy or gal in harms way doing the best they can for a cause that may someday turnout to be a good thing.

[PaceAdvantage]

BIGGEST PARALLEL: BOTH conflicts were based upon overt lies.


Flawed Intelligence and the Decision for War in Vietnam

Signals Intercepts, Cited at Time, Prove Only August 2nd Battle, Not August 4 and purported Second Attack Prompted Congressional Blank Check for War

Johnson-McNamara Tapes Show Readiness to Escalate, Even on Suspect Intel.

One example of many

The author explicitly states parallels AT THIS JUNCTURE, meaning NOW -- not BEFORE the war, where you claim that we were "OVERTLY LIED TO"

Once again, you get points for diversion and spin, but zero points for sticking with the point.

[JustRalph]

Remember, This is the same author that said

"The Valerie Plame Case will be bigger than Watergate! "

:lol: :lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

Remember, This is the same author that said

"The Valerie Plame Case will be bigger than Watergate! "

:lol: :lol:

Yup, there's been a lot of erroneous stuff that the BIG, BAD, DOMINATING RIGHT of OFF-TOPIC has just let slide on by....so much for the BULLY label.....:lol:

[betchatoo]

Biggest parallels with Vietnam to Iraq. We went to war without an exit strategy. We have continued to battle without giving a full commitment to doing whatever is necessary to emerge victorious. We blame those who oppose the war for our tactical mistakes.

[46zilzal]

Biggest parallels with Vietnam to Iraq. We went to war without an exit strategy. We have continued to battle without giving a full commitment to doing whatever is necessary to emerge victorious. We blame those who oppose the war for our tactical mistakes.
cogent albeit incomplete assessment

[PaceAdvantage]

Biggest parallels with Vietnam to Iraq. We went to war without an exit strategy. We have continued to battle without giving a full commitment to doing whatever is necessary to emerge victorious. We blame those who oppose the war for our tactical mistakes.

I will grant you that we have continued to battle (and I don't even know if this is true....I can't recall the last time a major engagement with the enemy was reported) without giving a full committment to doing whatever is necessary to emerge victorious. Ultimate blame rests with those in charge, but of course nothing is black and white, and reasons DO exist for why this is happening.

[PaceAdvantage]

cogent albeit incomplete assessment

So why not offer up a more complete assessment instead of another one-lined useless response?

[46zilzal]

what the heck were we doing in either place? No reason to be there either time.

[PaceAdvantage]

what the heck were we doing in either place? No reason to be there either time.

We were fighting the spread of Communism in Vietnam, under the belief that if Vietnam fell, the rest of S.E. Asia would follow....you know, the domino theory. Didn't you take any history courses along your way to a medical degree? This is high school level stuff.....

[JustRalph]

We were fighting the spread of Communism in Vietnam, under the belief that if Vietnam fell, the rest of S.E. Asia would follow....you know, the domino theory. Didn't you take any history courses along your way to a medical degree? This is high school level stuff.....

and BTW, look around.........the only place Communism survives is in Asia.......unless you want to count that tiny piece of shit island off the coast of Florida..........

[46zilzal]

We were fighting the spread of Communism in Vietnam, under the belief that if Vietnam fell, the rest of S.E. Asia would follow....you know, the domino theory. Didn't you take any history courses along your way to a medical degree? This is high school level stuff.....
that was BULL SHIT THEN and it is bull shit now. It didn't change a thing and it never would.

[46zilzal]

parallels then and now:
http://www.independent.org/newsroom/article.asp?id=1694

[PlanB]

46, you present a complex problem for me. I can't bear it when I read another USA guy got killed. Every morning I leave my apt with that news & I'm very very (annoyed, hostile, belligerent, sad) at that information. It's guys my age.
Probably leaving their wives, who are crazy in love, without enough money. It's beyond sad to me. The quandary is, is no war useful? Bush43 is & was over his head, and finally most americans know so, but ..... is there NO OTHER REALITY?
43 will leave & resume an even more cushioned world, but what about our young guys who lost legs/arms? Where's their cushion? I dunno anything when I think this way. I would agree with you 100% but that's NOT gonna happen, so how do we protect, as best we can, our remaining men? TELL ME THAT.

[46zilzal]

There are a lot more "wounded" than you think. I lost several friends YEARS after Vietnam to the ravages of alcohol, PTSD and another to a simple car accident (he had been in a helicopter crash and sustained a small meningeal bleed that had gone undetected with the instruments of that time and a small bumper cruncher opened it again and he was dead at 37). Seven in my high school class died including a close friend Rodger. It changed my brother in law to a aperson I simply did not recognize and he was headed to a divorce before he died (an industrial accident that had nothing to do with Vietnam). A good freind of my father's (a prominant dentist) offered to put braces on my teeth for cost so that I would not have to go since he lost his 19 year old son to that foolish and totally unnecessary conflict on the other side of the world. I worked with a guy who had been wounded in the leg and the injury nicked his common peroneal nerve leaving him with a withered lateral muscular compartment and the need of a leg brace. He was bitter and tried to talk ANYONE out of the foolishness of war (much like the great John Voight speech in Coming Home). Another friend threw all of his medals away (they had been in a case on the mantel of his home) while I was visiting, much to his parents chagrin. He had been in special forces in the Army (Ranger?) and had nightmares regarding all the villages that he burned for, what he stated over and over was "no good reason." He was another that dove into the bottle but was able to conquer his demons after a few years.

It would be one thing if there was a reason, but that war, like the current "war" is complete and utter bull shit. You are aksed to put your life on the line for some nebulous untried "idea" that the rutabaga and his cabal could change the world and human nature while he was at it.

There are going to be more of these poor guys coming back unable to get over what they have experienced, but the powers that be are more worried about their legacy than the lives of all these guys JUST LIKE VIETNAM. It is disgusting.

[PlanB]

I commiserate with you totally, but YOU didn't answer my question to my Needs. It's NOW, you want to go way back, like me, to erase the war totally. But you & me cannot. SO NOW WHAT? can you even think outside the math function you've programmed yourself into? oK, let's say you cannot do that. BUT, is there no suggestion that deals with the pain?

[Tom]

Biggest parallels with Vietnam to Iraq. We went to war without an exit strategy. We have continued to battle without giving a full commitment to doing whatever is necessary to emerge victorious. We blame those who oppose the war for our tactical mistakes.

Exit strategy - Like we had one when we went into WWII? We had a stategy to fight it, but exits it? We STILL haven't totally exited WWII.

No committment - correctaundo.

Blame others - not really. Oppostiiton to the war is one thing, understandable, acceptable, expected. But much has been done to undermine our efforts, to tie our hands. Right in this very board, we have perfect examples of mindless drones who focus on diddley-assed stuff, like Abu Grad, wher enobody dies, and totally ignore the beheadings of innocent non combatants. They whine about the so-called rights of battlefield participants taken off for intense questioning - nothing fatal, or permanent, yet vital in getting info, the, even when we get good intel (the LA air attacks that were thwarted) they still whine about it. Some here would rather see the author of 9-11 not have been roughed up than have saved lives in LA.
One can be opposed to the war with out aiding the enemy, and that is EXACTLY what many have done, the NY Times in particular. Frankly, the editor of the times should be facing treason charges, IMHYOCO.

[46zilzal]

they need to leave as soon as possible.

[bigmack]

IMHYOCO.
Solid post T. On a side note if you goog IMHYOCO it has two entries. Both from you from a long time ago on this kooky board.

In
My
Humble
Yet
Obviously
Correct Opinion!

Is a trademark pending?

[PlanB]

TOM, in my opinion, a great post.

[Tom]

Solid post T. On a side note if you goog IMHYOCO it has two entries. Both from you from a long time ago on this kooky board.

In
My
Humble
Yet
Obviously
Correct Opinion!

Is a trademark pending?

Nope, straight to public domain.....Fröhliches Weihnachten!

[bigmack]

.Fröhliches Weihnachten!
Gleich zu Ihnen

[JustRalph]

Exit Strategy? The only way to fight a war the right way and have an exit strategy is to believe that you exit when there is no one left to shoot. End of story. Whether they surrender or you kill them off. That is an exit strategy.

[PaceAdvantage]

You are aksed to put your life on the line for some nebulous untried "idea" that the rutabaga and his cabal could change the world and human nature while he was at it.

Wait....I thought they were putting their lives on the line for oil....wasn't that what you said earlier? I'm so confused....

Are you changing your tune yet again?

[betchatoo]

Exit strategy - Like we had one when we went into WWII? We had a stategy to fight it, but exits it? We STILL haven't totally exited WWII.

No committment - correctaundo.

Blame others - not really. Oppostiiton to the war is one thing, understandable, acceptable, expected. But much has been done to undermine our efforts, to tie our hands. Right in this very board, we have perfect examples of mindless drones who focus on diddley-assed stuff, like Abu Grad, wher enobody dies, and totally ignore the beheadings of innocent non combatants. They whine about the so-called rights of battlefield participants taken off for intense questioning - nothing fatal, or permanent, yet vital in getting info, the, even when we get good intel (the LA air attacks that were thwarted) they still whine about it. Some here would rather see the author of 9-11 not have been roughed up than have saved lives in LA.
One can be opposed to the war with out aiding the enemy, and that is EXACTLY what many have done, the NY Times in particular. Frankly, the editor of the times should be facing treason charges, IMHYOCO.

Tom:

The question was about parallels to VietNam, not WWII. In Iraq and Nam we got into the war of our own volition not because we were attacked (and please don't cite 9-11, it had nothing to do with Iraq). In entering such a war, it would have behooved us to know what constituted victory and when it was time to disengage.

Also, in World War II we were fighting for our very survival and we threw everything we had into the effort. Although I would still disagree with the reasons for engagement, I would see far more point to this fight in Iraq if we had the same commitment.

The matter of the prisons and torture is a tricky one for me. I would have no problem with torturing someone if I thought it would spare the lives of people I cared about. But we seem to have imprisoned so many people that had little or nothing to do with the terrorists (and thus had little to offer in information) that we have, in some cases, become the bad guy.

Finally, there is your talk that the editor NY Times should be arrested for treason. I really would like to see what you have to offer in the way of evidence that he actually abetted the enemy. Otherwise, you want to imprison for using freedoms we have fought so hard to preserve, freedom of the press and freedom of speech

[betchatoo]

Exit Strategy? The only way to fight a war the right way and have an exit strategy is to believe that you exit when there is no one left to shoot. End of story. Whether they surrender or you kill them off. That is an exit strategy.
Then obviously we haven't fought this war the right way.

[JustRalph]

Then obviously we haven't fought this war the right way.


Exactly!

[Tom]

Bet, that was my point - WWII didn't have an exit strategy, and Viet Nam evolved from it, WWII never really ended - it morphed into the cold war, and Communism replaced the nazis.


And, Lincoln locked up people who ba mothed his war, and even sent dowm oout of the o****ry. In times of war, you do what has to be done. The NY Times has gove far past free speech - they have provided aid to the enemy.

[46zilzal]

The NY Times has gove far past free speech - they have provided aid to the enemy.
Why for providing a rational optional point of view to the pablum everyone had been spoon fed by this administration?

That logic is full of holes

[bigmack]

Why for providing a rational optional point of view to the pablum everyone had been spoon fed by this administration?
There is no breaking your myopic view of the world. In your want to believe that you hold truths that others find unrealized and not found in traditional media outlets you position yourself with a righteous viewpoint that only you and a few possess.

46, you know I like you in your histrionic view of horse racing but your didiactic ramblings lack serious thought.

Slam away and keep slamming away at "the man" and "the power" and "the sheep" that buy the stories fed by the "power"./

Come on - Anyone worth their salt reads everything.

[46zilzal]

"Make no mistake about it, I understand how tough it is, sir. I talk to families who die."
-- Washington, D.C., Dec. 7, 2006

the whole family died??? How did the entire family get over there?

OR, almost like one who studders:"We stand together because we understand the only way to secure a lasting peace for our children and grandchildren is to defeat the extremist ideologies and help the ideology of hope, democracy, prevail. ...Sixty-five years ago this day, America was jolted out of our isolationism and plunged into a global war that Britain had been fighting for two years. In that war, our nation stood firm. And there were difficult moments during that war, yet the leaders of our two nations never lost faith in the capacity to prevail. We will stand firm again in this first war of the 21st century. We will defeat the extremists and the radicals. We will help a young democracy prevail in Iraq. ...I believe we'll prevail. Not only do I know how important it is to prevail, I believe we will prevail. I understand how hard it is to prevail. ...And I want to tell you, I see the threat and I believe it is up to our governments to help lead the forces of moderation to prevail. It's in our interests. ...As you can tell, I feel strongly about making sure you understand that I understand it's tough. But I want you to know, sir, that I believe we'll prevail. I know we have to adjust to prevail, but I wouldn't have our troops in harm's way if I didn't believe that, one, it was important, and, two, we'll succeed. ...I like to remind people it's akin to the Cold War in many ways. There's an ideological clash going on. And the question is, will we have the resolve and the confidence in liberty to prevail? ...I do believe there is a -- I know there's a change of attitude. And now the fundamental question is, can we help the moderates prevail?"

[JustRalph]

Why for providing a rational optional point of view to the pablum everyone had been spoon fed by this administration?

That logic is full of holes

how about releasing classified documents? Publishing information that the Admin begged them not to. It is roundly agreed by many experts that what the Times has done will cost American Lives in the future. And nobody seems to give a damn! It is absolutely amazing........... :bang:

[bigmack]

"Make no mistake about it, I understand how tough it is, sir. I talk to families who die."
-- Washington, D.C., Dec. 7, 2006

the whole family died??? How did the entire family get over there?
Knock that shit off. People in whatever position of power need to make decisions - some right, some wrong. I suspect few of them made a decision to send those in harms way without convening with their God, with their conscience. Your standing in judgement of "the man" & "the power" is tired. Read the scripts of soldiers that were in battle and the testimonials of those that gladly serve, all the while completely aware of your like, of your view, of your finger pointing at the folks that put them there, and they categorically dismiss your view and stand tall in their directive.

You, with all due respect, are undeserving to ask how they got there or why they enlisted in a service that means more to them than the hangnail of your big toe. Knock it off 46, your act is really f-ing tired....

[JustRalph]

Knock that shit off. People in whatever position of power need to make decisions - some right, some wrong. I suspect few of them made a decision to send those in harms way without convening with their God, with their conscience. Your standing in judgement of "the man" & "the power" is tired. Read the scripts of soldiers that were in battle and the testimonials of those that gladly serve, all the while completely aware of your like, of your view, of your finger pointing at the folks that put them there, and they categorically dismiss your view and stand tall in their directive.

You, with all due respect, are undeserving to ask how they got there or why they enlisted in a service that means more to them than the hangnail of your big toe. Knock it off 46, your act is really f-ing tired....

Great Post! :jump: :ThmbUp:

[Secretariat]

We were fighting the spread of Communism in Vietnam, under the belief that if Vietnam fell, the rest of S.E. Asia would follow....you know, the domino theory. Didn't you take any history courses along your way to a medical degree? This is high school level stuff.....

Isn't it a parallel to say as well: "We were fighting the spread of terrorism in Iraq, under the belief that if Iraq fell, the rest of the Mid-East would follow....you know, the domino theory."

[Lefty]

46, Iraq completely different from Vietnam. We were attacked on 9-11. And before you rush in to say Iraq didn't do it, it has been demonstrated time after time that Saddam was giving money to the terrorists and that Zarquari(now dead) was in Iraq. Saddam also had enriched uranium. But you and others like you, keep turning a blind eye to the facts because they don't jibe with your Bush hating agenda.

[PaceAdvantage]

Isn't it a parallel to say as well: "We were fighting the spread of terrorism in Iraq, under the belief that if Iraq fell, the rest of the Mid-East would follow....you know, the domino theory."

In my opinion, no.

[46zilzal]

how about this wonderful one from fearless leader?

"You know, the plans of Mr. Zarqawi was to foment sectarian violence. ...The bombings that took place recently was a part of a pattern that has been going on for about nine months.
-- Tallinn, Estonia, Nov. 28, 2006

[46zilzal]

46, Iraq completely different from Vietnam. We were attacked on 9-11. And before you rush in to say Iraq didn't do it, it has been demonstrated time after time that Saddam was giving money to the terrorists and that Zarquari(now dead) was in Iraq. Saddam also had enriched uranium. But you and others like you, keep turning a blind eye to the facts because they don't jibe with your Bush hating agenda.
Iraq had nothing to do with it: shown OVER AND OVER

[PaceAdvantage]

Lots of us out here don't care whether or not Iraq had anything to do with 9/11. It's a moot point. It doesn't matter at this juncture. How many ways can I say it?

I know how many times I can say it....as many times as you keep bringing up this old pointless point.

[JPinMaryland]

how about releasing classified documents? Publishing information that the Admin begged them not to. It is roundly agreed by many experts that what the Times has done will cost American Lives in the future. ...:

Which experts?

[JustRalph]

Isn't it a parallel to say as well: "We were fighting the spread of terrorism in Iraq, under the belief that if Iraq fell, the rest of the Mid-East would follow....you know, the domino theory."

Different Theory. In Iraq we were hoping to plant the seeds of Democracy. Remove a dangerous idiot and start a different kind of dialogue in the Middel East. Once you do that........history shows that it grows on its own. The Iraqi's were not about to be over-run by a communist country who was going to force them into communism or the like. Vietnam was. And eventually was when we walked away.

[Secretariat]

Different Theory. In Iraq we were hoping to plant the seeds of Democracy. Remove a dangerous idiot and start a different kind of dialogue in the Middel East. Once you do that........history shows that it grows on its own. The Iraqi's were not about to be over-run by a communist country who was going to force them into communism or the like. Vietnam was. And eventually was when we walked away.

In Vietnam we were hoping to plant the seed of democracy over communism and remove a tyrant Ho Chi Minh.

btw... when you say Vietnam went communistic after we walked away. Yes, it did, and now has just been promoted to favored trading status by the lame duck Congress and GW. So maybe if we walk away from Iraq in a decade they'll be our favored trading partner.

I think the parallels between the Nam and Iraq Civil Wars are quite pertinent. I beleive the "domino" theory of communism has been transmuted directily into a "domino" theory of terrorsim with many of the same type of slogans. if we don't fight them over there we'll be fighting them on the shores of California. I jsut have never seen any Iraqi insurgent groups attacking abroad Americans or Americian embassies/ There's simply no precedent for it. Al Queda maybe, but certainly not Iraqis. They weren't on the 911 planes.

[Light]

I beleive the "domino" theory of communism has been transmuted directily into a "domino" theory of terrorsim with many of the same type of slogans.

Totally agree.The many (false) faces of the boogieman is a main ingredient of American foreign policy.

[Lefty]

"Make no mistake about it, I understand how tough it is, sir. I talk to families who die."
-- Washington, D.C., Dec. 7, 2006

the whole family died??? How did the entire family get over there?

OR, almost like one who studders:"We stand together because we understand the only way to secure a lasting peace for our children and grandchildren is to defeat the extremist ideologies and help the ideology of hope, democracy, prevail. ...Sixty-five years ago this day, America was jolted out of our isolationism and plunged into a global war that Britain had been fighting for two years. In that war, our nation stood firm. And there were difficult moments during that war, yet the leaders of our two nations never lost faith in the capacity to prevail. We will stand firm again in this first war of the 21st century. We will defeat the extremists and the radicals. We will help a young democracy prevail in Iraq. ...I believe we'll prevail. Not only do I know how important it is to prevail, I believe we will prevail. I understand how hard it is to prevail. ...And I want to tell you, I see the threat and I believe it is up to our governments to help lead the forces of moderation to prevail. It's in our interests. ...As you can tell, I feel strongly about making sure you understand that I understand it's tough. But I want you to know, sir, that I believe we'll prevail. I know we have to adjust to prevail, but I wouldn't have our troops in harm's way if I didn't believe that, one, it was important, and, two, we'll succeed. ...I like to remind people it's akin to the Cold War in many ways. There's an ideological clash going on. And the question is, will we have the resolve and the confidence in liberty to prevail? ...I do believe there is a -- I know there's a change of attitude. And now the fundamental question is, can we help the moderates prevail?"
46, sadly, you worry more about style than substance,.
I'll take the writings of Erskine Caldwell over those of WM Faulkner anyday.
And laughably, in your haste to condemn Bush for the way he uses or misuses words, you wrote studders instead of stutters.
Substance, zilly, not style, that's where it's at, my man.

[JustRalph]

Totally agree.The many (false) faces of the boogieman is a main ingredient of American foreign policy.

it wasn't a boogeyman who brought down those buildings. It was 19 criminal minds with real live intent on killing americans. they weren't monsters under the bed and their brethren are still out there. No matter how hard you try to discount it...........

I figure the terrorists are waiting. they realize that they must attack us slowly so as not to infuriate enough americans so that we start tossing nukes or actually decide to fight a war. They have waited long enough already. I predict next summer..........brings us more terror............and it won't be the boogeyman..........it will be a ground based attack too.

[Light]

it wasn't a boogeyman who brought down those buildings.

And it wasn't Boogeyman Saddam either. Yet he was the scapegoat.

There has not been a whisper of attacking Saudi Arabia or sanctions against them. After all those "911 terrorists" were all Saudi's.Does that make sense? The Saudi ambassador's wife directly funded the hijackers. Saudi officials have transfered millions of dollars to terrorist organizations.Why would Bush turn a blind eye to the obvious?

He not only turned a blind eye but he covered up these reports censoring 28 pages of a Congressional study about 911 which detailed these Saudi incidents a year after 911. The U.S. is dependent on Saudi Arabia and the Bush administration knows it. The Boogeyman comes in quite handy when protecting the very regimes they preach against.

[Secretariat]

it wasn't a boogeyman who brought down those buildings. It was 19 criminal minds with real live intent on killing americans. they weren't monsters under the bed and their brethren are still out there. No matter how hard you try to discount it...........


And NONE of them were Iraqis.

[JustRalph]

:bang: apparently you guys will never get it.

why the hell did I wade in here again................

[Tom]

It's like telling a child candy is bad for him. They do not possess the mental facilities to comprehend ating more complex than "Bush bad."
Not even a verb, just Bush bad. Evolution stalled out.

[PaceAdvantage]

And it wasn't Boogeyman Saddam either. Yet he was the scapegoat.

There has not been a whisper of attacking Saudi Arabia or sanctions against them. After all those "911 terrorists" were all Saudi's.Does that make sense?

Does it make sense to bomb American Airlines and United Airlines headquarters? Hell, it was their planes that were crashed into the WTC and Pentagon.....right?

It would be just as silly to attack Saudi Arabia as it would be to attack the corporate headquarters of the airliners used in the attack.

There were many good reasons to go into Iraq after 9/11. You just don't agree with any of them, and that's fine. We all have our opinions.

[Light]

PA

Your analogy doesnt make sense. Of course it wouldnt make sense to bomb American Airlines and United Airlines headquarters. They were also victims of the hijacking.

But as I said all of the hijackers were Saudi's and even the Saudi ambassador's wife directly funded the hijackers. And Saudis fund terrorist organizations including the funding for the hijacking. Yet they are our friends. Saudi's are the pink elephant in the middle of the room that not only is being ignored but covered up by the Bush administartion.

This covering up,proves to me that the word terrorism is not defined by actions but rather cronyism.

[bigmack]

Pretty Good Read:

Iraq and Vietnam - Differences, Similarities, and Insights
http://www.strategicstudiesinstitute.army.mil/pdffiles/00367.pdf



Light, you're a sharp guy but this takes the cake
This covering up,proves to me that the word terrorism is not defined by actions but rather cronyism.

[JPinMaryland]

I predict next summer..........brings us more terror............and it won't be the boogeyman..........it will be a ground based attack too.

Yes, Im sure you will enjoy it when thousands more americans become victims. This how self centered you are; more death and destruction in the future will only glorify your predictions.


This kind of thinking makes me want to puke.

[JustRalph]

Yes, Im sure you will enjoy it when thousands more americans become victims. This how self centered you are; more death and destruction in the future will only glorify your predictions.


This kind of thinking makes me want to puke.

Well I got what I wanted.

Funny how when I do it.........you jump right in and go after me. When Americans get killed for three years straight and the Left treats it the same way, you guys don't give a damn. It was good for you. What was bad for America was good for you and you guys screamed it from the rooftops........ I turn it around on you and here you come.

You went after that like a Hungry Perch!

[PaceAdvantage]

Yes, Im sure you will enjoy it when thousands more americans become victims. This how self centered you are; more death and destruction in the future will only glorify your predictions.


This kind of thinking makes me want to puke.


Are you kidding? I've been saying this all along, only in response to LJB, Hcap, Light and one or two others. But you're only jumping in to respond to JR? What a laugher. Where were you the last couple of years?

[JustRalph]

Duplicity, the hallmark of the Left

[betchatoo]

Duplicity, the hallmark of the Left

JR:
After a few years of reading this forum I find it comes equally from both sides

[Indulto]

Originally Posted by JPinMaryland
Yes, Im sure you will enjoy it when thousands more americans become victims. This how self centered you are; more death and destruction in the future will only glorify your predictions.

This kind of thinking makes me want to puke.JPIM,
I assume you were spoofing lsbets’ goading hcap, but just in case I’m wrong I want to reiterate my concern that we need to avoid being lulled into in a false sense of security by the fact that we haven’t been subject to another wake-up call YET from some very dangerous people who it seems logical to conclude are already HERE.

For any of us to accuse or even suggest that his/her non-simian political adversaries took or would take satisfaction in the loss of innocent lives -- either our own or those of other countries -- is inappropriate at best. ;)