Big Red - Big Move

[bigmack]

Where do you feel he made his most formidable move of the four?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huOmZH3G-Dc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huOmZH3G-Dc)
Marlboro

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyqllleV6WA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyqllleV6WA)
KY Derb

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNHJkz5K6uk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNHJkz5K6uk)
Man O War

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZN5kBpvNeE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZN5kBpvNeE)
Preakness

[Benevolus]

Thanks for the videos. What is funny is that Riva Ridge may have been the second best horse of all-time.

[JPinMaryland]

Or Sham.

[Valuist]

Even better than the mighty Discreet Cat :D

[PaceAdvantage]

I sense you mocking Discreet Cat in your post Valuist, but I don't think that's very fair. DC has done some pretty amazing things in his relatively short career to date.

He destroyed the BC Classic winner back in MARCH when he was barely a 3yo. Yeah, you can say Invasor has gotten better since, but so has Discreet Cat!

He equaled a long standing track record....Grade 1 winners breaking or equaling long established track records are hard to come by these days....

I think it's way too early to diminish DC's quality compared to the greats of the past, considering his consistent ability to impress as the competition gets tougher.

[bigmack]

Or Sham.
Sham's time of 1:59 4/5 would have won any other running of the Kentucky Derby, before or since.

[Valuist]

I sense you mocking Discreet Cat in your post Valuist, but I don't think that's very fair. DC has done some pretty amazing things in his relatively short career to date.

He destroyed the BC Classic winner back in MARCH when he was barely a 3yo. Yeah, you can say Invasor has gotten better since, but so has Discreet Cat!

He equaled a long standing track record....Grade 1 winners breaking or equaling long established track records are hard to come by these days....

I think it's way too early to diminish DC's quality compared to the greats of the past, considering his consistent ability to impress as the competition gets tougher.

He's good but to be considered among the best, he has to face the best. Discreet Talent may have as much pure talent as Bernardini or Invasor but until he faces those types, it doesn't matter.

Reminds me of a couple years ago when one well known figure maker made the comment that "Mineshaft ran the best figure of all time." He ran his big figs against garbage cans so no real hardcore racing fan could buy into that assertion.

[Snow Chief]

Sham's time of 1:59 4/5 would have won any other running of the Kentucky Derby, before or since.


He would have deadheated with the mighty Monarchos. Third best of all time?

[PaceAdvantage]

Reminds me of a couple years ago when one well known figure maker made the comment that "Mineshaft ran the best figure of all time." He ran his big figs against garbage cans so no real hardcore racing fan could buy into that assertion.

I fail to understand what that has to do with Discreet Cat. I don't recall mentioning the words SPEED FIGURE.....

[Valuist]

Would Discreet Cat be able to duplicate his Cigar Mile fig against the likes of Bernardini, Invasor and Premium Tap? Maybe. We'll never know. I do think Mineshaft wouldn't have run the "biggest fig ever" if he wasn't running against 3 or 4 stiffs.

[PaceAdvantage]

Would Discreet Cat be able to duplicate his Cigar Mile fig against the likes of Bernardini, Invasor and Premium Tap? Maybe. We'll never know. I do think Mineshaft wouldn't have run the "biggest fig ever" if he wasn't running against 3 or 4 stiffs.

I haven't been keeping up....Isn't it a distinct possibility that DC will face Invasor in Dubai?

Then again, you're probably right. They'll probably race DC on the World Cup undercard, ducking Invasor because they're both owned by the same family.

Like I said in another thread, the universe has dealt us a crappy hand with DC and his owners.

[Overlay]

The Preakness gets my vote. Everyone remembers Chick Anderson saying, "He's moving like a tremendous machine!" from the Belmont, but I like to hear the rising inflection and excitement in his voice when Secretariat made his move at Pimlico: "He's going for the lead and it's RIGHT NOW he's looking for it!"

[Tom]

Do we really need yet another Discreet Cat thread?:bang:

[bigmack]

Do we really need yet another Discreet Cat thread?:bang:
As the generator of this thread Iam OUTRAGED by the hijacking that have been foisted upon it by Value & PA. Particularly with a thread that was going nowhere. I hope you two sleep well tonight knowing what you've done.

[46zilzal]

The Preakness gets my vote. Everyone remembers Chick Anderson saying, "He's moving like a tremendous machine!" from the Belmont, but I like to hear the rising inflection and excitement in his voice when Secretariat made his move at Pimlico: "He's going for the lead and it's RIGHT NOW he's looking for it!"
in over 45 years of racing I have NEVER seen another route of that distance won on the CLUBHOUSE turn. NOTHING CLOSE.

[PaceAdvantage]

As the generator of this thread Iam OUTRAGED by the hijacking that have been foisted upon it by Value & PA. Particularly with a thread that was going nowhere. I hope you two sleep well tonight knowing what you've done.

I'm sorry. :(

[Cratos]

Bigmack.

In my opinion, the Preakness would be first and the Marlboro Cup would be second, but overall the Ky Derby was his best performance even though his Belmont was more spectacular.

[bigmack]

in over 45 years of racing I have NEVER seen another route of that distance won on the CLUBHOUSE turn. NOTHING CLOSE.
My feelings exactly! With the exception of the 45 year part

[bigmack]

in over 45 years of racing I have NEVER seen another route of that distance won on the CLUBHOUSE turn. NOTHING CLOSE.
You think it was self driven by Sec or did RTurc ask for it?

[Overlay]

Undoubtedly, Secretariat was ready and more than willing to make that move, but according to the chart for the race, Turcotte let him know when it was time to turn loose:

"Secretariat broke well and was eased back and relaxed nicely as the field passed the stands for the first time. He was guided outside two rivals entering the clubhouse turn and responding when Turcotte moved his hands on the reins, made a spectacular run to take command entering the backstretch."

Paradoxically, I think I've also read quotes from Turcotte where he said that he was just along for the ride on that move, and that it was all Secretariat's doing. Maybe they were functioning so much as a unit, or Turcotte's actions were so instinctive or reflexive to him, that he was not even aware of his having asked Secretariat for that run. (Or maybe the chart caller misinterpreted what he saw.)