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Stevie Belmont
11-28-2006, 11:02 PM
This is bound to set off some solid debate, so be it. That’s what horse racing is all about. Debate, but if I had a vote for the Eclipse award for top sprinter in the land, it would go to Discreet Cat. I know the knocks against him as he probably did not race enough to garner the award. Only one Grade I win and Grade II victory over a less than impressive field, but in this case I say quality over quantity is more deserving. He has delivered impressive efforts each and every time he has stepped on to the race track. He is undefeated in 6 starts. He has never been defeated as a race horse in his career. In my opinion he is the nation’s top sprinter of 2006.

Every race Discreet Cat has run this year has been awe inspiring. He started out his campaign in Dubai where he won both his starts. He won his first start of the year in the Areej Trophy at a mile. And a brilliant win in the UAE Derby. He was visually impressive in that victory at a mile and one eighth. His displayed a powerful long stride in delivering a dominating win. At that point he was considered a legitimate Kentucky Derby prospect. Both those wins came across the Atlantic. This is what makes this horse even more remarkable. He was still able to transfer his super form back the United States where his dominance continue to reign supreme.

His first start of the year was in an optional claiming race at Saratoga. The conditions of the race and quality of the field did not inspire anything great as far as competition goes. He hardly broke a sweat at Saratoga that day. He stopped the clock in 1:21.2 without really doing anything more than a leisurely gallop. His powerful stride was on display in an effort that showed he was in fact was getting better. That win also earned him a big speed figure. He was for real. He was a budding superstar.

His next start was another easy victory in the 7 furlong Jerome Breeder's Cup at Belmont Park on October 1st. It was his first graded stakes win in the United States. The public sent him away as a huge1-9 favorite. He showed why. Once again he delivered another superb effort. The quality of that field could easily be questioned as nothing more than ordinary. The fact of the matter was he beat them with such ease; the performance had to considered a brilliant win in the way he did it. The DRF comment said “Ran away when asked”. He earned another huge figure in the process. He had at this point already stamped himself a superstar with brilliant speed.

Alas Discreet Cat saved his best effort to date in the Cigar Mile on November 25th where he faced the 2005 Breeder’s Cup Sprint Champion and Met Mile Champion Silver Train, and the fast classy Badge of Silver, who was coming off a game try in the Breeder's Cup mile. For the first time in Discreet Cats young career he was posed a stiff challenge from champion horses in the United States. Many wondered how he would handle his first class test. How was he going to handle legitimate speed horses? Some doubted this lightly raced, over hyped horse was legitimate. No cake walks today at he Big A.

Discreet Cat answered those questions and several others with a blockbuster win. He put together arguably the best performance of the year by any horse anywhere. In fact the effort was so brilliant; it might have been one of the best performances in years by any horse anywhere. In winning the Cigar Mile, he equaled a track record of 1:32.2 held by the great Easy Goer. The win was as magnificent as the time indicated. Not only did he deliver a dominant performance in winning, he is a three old who beat older horses while giving away weight to the rest of the field! He was simply awesome in winning.

He sat behind the speedball Sharp Humor who set the opening fraction of 22.4 Than he had to deal with the best speed horse he has faced in Silver Train through extremely fast fractions of 44.4 and 1:07.4. He rolled up under a hand ride at the top of the stretch to engage Silver Train who was in an all out drive. Silver Train spurted out to a 2 length lead, but Discreet Cat looked as strong as he ever did as he mounted his winning bid. He over took Silver Train at will. Not an easy task on a track that favored front runners most of the day. The question was to be, can he now hold the late challenge of Badge of Silver after the battling through wicked fractions? Some wondered if he would be able to. I’ll be honest, I wondered myself after seeing the mind bending fractions.

He did. He had plenty left for the final furlong. He even opened up a 3 length lead as he stopped the clock in a track equaling time. It was a brilliant win. There is little doubt that the track had a speed bias that day. However the track was as fair to every horse as it was to Discreet Cat. They all ran on it and Discreet Cat put together a huge effort in beating top quality race horses.

I feel his brilliance on the track is worthy of the top sprinter in the land. Some even question if a mile is considered a true sprint anyway. I do. Any race a mile or less to me is a sprint. He won every race in more impressive fashion than the race before it. For a horse that was as dominant as he was, it should not go unrewarded.

The leading candidate for top sprinter is Thors’s Echo. I also feel he will probably win the award, and I don’t want to take anything away from him. He has had a great 2006 campaign. His BC Sprint win and Defrancis Dash win are both Grade I’s and he got the job done. He also ran a strong 2nd is the Golden Shaheen in March to Proud Tower Too. Incidentally that was same day Discreet Cat won the UAE Derby. However he has only won 2 of the 6 races he was in this year. Henny Hughes is another candidate. He was an impressive winner in all his starts this year, but a dull last place finish in the BC Sprint, all but ended any hopes of that title. Bordonaro also had stellar 2006. He displayed his true speed on California strips as well as a win at Gulfstream to start the year. All three of these horses had rock solid 2006 campaigns, but none of them were as dominant and displayed the utter brilliance in each start as Discreet Cat has. He was perfect and impressive this year.

He had the type of the 2006 that in any other year might have gotten him some type of an Eclipse award. He was a super three old in a crop that is one of the best groups that has been assembled in years. They include Barbaro, Bernardini, Henny Hughes, Showing Up, Strong Contender and Bluegrass Cat, a strong group for sure. Three of them are no longer in training. It’s almost as if Discreet Cat’s accomplishments have gone unnoticed to some extent as he has been under the radar it seems. Overshadowed by stable mate Bernardini. He was as dominant on the track as any of the horses mentioned above, if quality of wins counts for anything to voters, he should garner attention in that respect over the quantity of races that the other candidates up for the top sprinter in the nation will get.

Discreet Cat did not dance every dance. He was not in the Breeder’s Cup either, but his wins were as dominant as any sprinter this year period. They were breathtakingly easy. If beating last years Breeder’s Cup Sprint Champ and this years Met Mile champ counts for anything, and equaling a 17 year old track record Discreet Cat is the top sprinter in the land, and he is also the fastest horse in training. The year is not over yet, and there still might be some other sprinters that will chalk up some wins, but they will be hard pressed to top Discreet Cats performances.

The odds are he will not get any Eclipse Awards, but there is no doubt he is threat to take some awards next year. A older, more seasoned Discreet Cat is a scary prospect for sure. Sprints will be a thing of the past next year, as he will attempt to conquer the classic distances. I have little doubt he will succeed in that endeavor as well.

Stevie Belmont
11-28-2006, 11:21 PM
I know the Jerome is a mile.

kept thinking of that AOC race at Saratoga.

cj
11-29-2006, 01:43 AM
Mike Watchmaker wrote the same stuff on DRF. While it is great you like the horse, there is no way this horse is the sprinter of the year. Thor's Echo locked it up on Saturday.

PaceAdvantage
11-29-2006, 02:58 AM
I read the Watchmaker column, but still I have to agree with CJ here.
There are two horses out there that everyone seems to be dying to give an Eclipse award to -- Barbaro and Discreet Cat. However, when examined with an objective mind, neither of them did enough to earn an Eclipse in any of the designated categories.

Barbaro has been passed by Bernardini with his Preakness, Travers and very good 2nd in the Breeders' Cup Classic against top older horses.

Discreet Cat never faced top sprinters going the classic American sprint distance of six furlongs, so how in the world can you give him the award? It doesn't matter to me that he ran a one turn mile and a couple of 7f races against junk. They race 9f around one turn at Belmont too....should I go check those charts and see if any speedball blazed the first 6f in one of those 1 1/8 mile races?

Would Discreet Cat beat Thor's Echo and any other top sprinter right now if they went 6f? My opinion is that he would....and rather easily I might add. But until he actually does (and obviously, he won't), I can't see how you can give him the title of Champion Sprinter - 2006.

Indulto
11-29-2006, 06:20 AM
... He was a super three old in a crop that is one of the best groups that has been assembled in years. They include Barbaro, Bernardini, Henny Hughes, Showing Up, Strong Contender and Bluegrass Cat, a strong group for sure.

...Overshadowed by stable mate Bernardini. He was as dominant on the track as any of the horses mentioned above, if quality of wins counts for anything to voters, he should garner attention in that respect over the quantity of races that the other candidates up for the top sprinter in the nation will get.

... Discreet Cat did not dance every dance. He was not in the Breeder’s Cup either, but his wins were as dominant as any sprinter this year period. They were breathtakingly easy. If beating last years Breeder’s Cup Sprint Champ and this years Met Mile champ counts for anything, and equaling a 17 year old track record Discreet Cat is the top sprinter in the land, and he is also the fastest horse in training.SB,
Obviously you are as big a fan of DC as I am of Barbaro and Lava Man, both of whose prospects were once as bright as DC’s still is. I hope you won’t mind if I disagree with a few of your points.

First, the quality of this crop of three year olds can’t be compared with top crops. e.g., those of Dr. Fager and Damascus, Affirmed and Alydar, or Sunday Silence and Easy Goer.

Second, some very capable horsemen in a position to know apparently believed Bernardini was the better horse, and certainly his victories were no less impressive than DC’s, but with better Beyers.

Third, DC may well be the best miler/middle distance horse on dirt in the country, but neither of his two sprint victories were in graded stakes. Siren Lure’s graded wins at 7 f were also visually impressive, but so were Thor’s Echo’s consistently super performances in three successive six furlong Grade I sprints in six weeks suggesting HE may be the “fastest horse in training.”

I don’t believe that speed ratings should crown champions, but they can confirm greatness as I believe was the case for Ghostzapper. Is there even a single DC Beyer in the 120s? It always comes down to who you beat, how far you went, and how much you won. I wouldn’t mind seeing DC beat both Bernardini and Invasor at 10 f in a G1 race, but I will be happy to bet against it if his supporters drive his odds down below those of both opponents.

Stevie Belmont
11-29-2006, 12:18 PM
Hey I know it's Thor's Echo, but for arguments sake, I ask why not?

Stevie Belmont
11-29-2006, 12:20 PM
Solid crop. Did not say the crop was better than you mentioned.



SB,
Obviously you are as big a fan of DC as I am of Barbaro and Lava Man, both of whose prospects were once as bright as DC’s still is. I hope you won’t mind if I disagree with a few of your points.

First, the quality of this crop of three year olds can’t be compared with top crops. e.g., those of Dr. Fager and Damascus, Affirmed and Alydar, or Sunday Silence and Easy Goer.

Second, some very capable horsemen in a position to know apparently believed Bernardini was the better horse, and certainly his victories were no less impressive than DC’s, but with better Beyers.

Third, DC may well be the best miler/middle distance horse on dirt in the country, but neither of his two sprint victories were in graded stakes. Siren Lure’s graded wins at 7 f were also visually impressive, but so were Thor’s Echo’s consistently super performances in three successive six furlong Grade I sprints in six weeks suggesting HE may be the “fastest horse in training.”

I don’t believe that speed ratings should crown champions, but they can confirm greatness as I believe was the case for Ghostzapper. Is there even a single DC Beyer in the 120s? It always comes down to who you beat, how far you went, and how much you won. I wouldn’t mind seeing DC beat both Bernardini and Invasor at 10 f in a G1 race, but I will be happy to bet against it if his supporters drive his odds down below those of both opponents.

Valuist
11-29-2006, 12:26 PM
Its based on what you accomplish NOT who's the most talented. If they wanted to win sprinter of the year, they could've entered the BC Sprint. They chose not to.

Benevolus
11-30-2006, 05:56 AM
He needs to win more than one grade 1 in a 5 horse field to win an eclipse. Remember his dubai race did not count, and even if it did it was not a sprint. Probably the best horse in the world, but no eclipse.

toetoe
12-01-2006, 02:16 PM
How about top three-year-old? I've been thinking about the owner. Why NOT run them both in the BC Classic? :confused: He thrashed Invasor, still as a three-year-old, from off the pace in Dubai, quite an achievement. He's not flattered by the stateside runners he's faced, a predicament he shares with Bernardini, at least up until the Classic.

chrisg
12-01-2006, 02:27 PM
Remember his dubai race did not count

What do you mean?

Stevie Belmont
12-02-2006, 12:07 AM
Those races have no impact on eclipse voting.

samyn on the green
12-02-2006, 12:17 AM
Discreet Cat is the greatest horse to hit the track since Spectacular Bid. Take a look at this horses efficient stride, his 107 6F speed in a gallop, his paddock manners, he is everything a racehorse should be and more. Discreet Cat is a work of art and nearly unbeatable from 6-10 furlongs.

You have all these handicappers knocking him, saying he has not beaten anybody, listen he has beaten everybody from sprinters to breeders cup champions, to the horse of the year on the track. Those that line-up against the cat that are not champions themselves get left in the dust like a Ferrari racing a go-kart. Discreet Cat has beaten everyhorse that has lined up against him and left those that know breathless. Galloping in hand on a 107 pace and then drawing off in the stretch, wow that is what we have been waiting for. These handicappers knocking the Cat are nothing, they have no eye and no balls not able to take a stand or realize what they are looking at. If you need it to happen before you know it why are you playing this game? The trick here is to know the results before the race goes off. As a handicapper you are supposed to take stands before races. Here is my stand; Discreet Cat is a monster and the greatest American Dirt horse since 1979. He is cut in the mold of the immortal Dr. Fager.

Discreet Cat is the goods and the undefeated 2007 champion you heard it here first.

PaceAdvantage
12-02-2006, 12:40 AM
samyn, I don't think there are many left who knock Discreet Cat. Not after his last race....what's there to knock? He's already beaten a BC Classic winner and a BC Sprint winner for goodness sakes!! :lol:

Anyway, I just fear he is going to be handled in such a way that we will NEVER fully appreciate him for what he might be.....it seems the universe has to ALIGN in an exact way for us to realize we have witnessed a truly great one....

Think of all the little things that can happen to snatch a potential Secretariat or Affirmed or Seattle Slew from the clutches of racing immortality!

With DC's connections, I feel the universe may have missed its mark once again. I fear the Dubai World Cup might be his last hurrah, and no matter who he beats, it won't be as 100% satisfying as seeing him campaign all year in the states.....

Valuist
12-02-2006, 12:54 AM
You can backfit a scenario that flatters him considerably. He did beat Invasor last spring. Invasor has clearly improved a lot since then. Its also possible Invasor didn't ship well from South America to Dubai. DC was in Dubai all winter.

Silver Train? Cmon. He was a Belmont specialist.....in 2005. Taste of Paradise should've won the 2005 Sprint and clearly was the best horse. Aside from the Met Mile, which seemingly came out of nowhere, Silver Train has looked like classified allowance quality in his other 2006 races.

I could backfit a scenario for Fourth of Gold and say he beat Bernardini in a race this year. Right now, Fourth of Gold can't get a win against M50000 runners.

PaceAdvantage
12-02-2006, 01:11 AM
You can backfit a scenario that flatters him considerably. He did beat Invasor last spring. Invasor has clearly improved a lot since then. Its also possible Invasor didn't ship well from South America to Dubai. DC was in Dubai all winter.

Silver Train? Cmon. He was a Belmont specialist.....in 2005. Taste of Paradise should've won the 2005 Sprint and clearly was the best horse. Aside from the Met Mile, which seemingly came out of nowhere, Silver Train has looked like classified allowance quality in his other 2006 races.

I could backfit a scenario for Fourth of Gold and say he beat Bernardini in a race this year. Right now, Fourth of Gold can't get a win against M50000 runners.


OK. According to you, unless we can get Cigar, Holy Bull, Sunday Silence, Secretariat, Affirmed, Bernardini, Ruffian, Barbaro, Forego, Seattle Slew, Seabiscuit and Man o'War together for a race (ALL AT THEIR PRIME) with Discreet Cat, you'll never be satisfied....is that right? :lol:

Tom
12-02-2006, 10:55 AM
That race wouldnever take place at Belmont - too many horses for a stakes race. Cut it down to 4. :lol:

>>>>>>

Why doesn't the Dubai race count? There are no rules for voting on HOY. IF a voter considers it, it counts for his vote. No one has to explain how they voted.

But Bernie is 3YO HOY hands down. No other 3yo came close to equaling his impact. And only one older horse.

classhandicapper
12-02-2006, 11:33 AM
Discreet Cat beat a small but decent quality field in the Cigar by a little over 3 lengths. His pace and speed figures for the race were impressive, especially for a relatively lightly raced 3YO (even though it's already the fall).

However, there have been plenty of horses that have beaten much better groups than that Cigar field by more and earned similar or better figures doing it.

What we are looking at is an immensely talented horse that has the potential to be "one of the ones", but nothing he has done on the track yet puts him on the same level as some of the great horses we have seen. He will have to develop further (and may). Other great ones consistently put up big figures against very high quality and very deep fields often with the worst of the trip.

In a 10F race I'd take both Invasor and Bernardini over him "at this stage" heads up. With a few races under his belt, maybe the pecking order would switch.

It's funny how things work. I spent much of the summer saying people were ahead of themselves on Bernardini, now I think people are underrating him relative to DC. That Classic field was pretty darn tough. It was far from the best we've seen, but Bernardini ran a great race. He just wasn't the "second coming" the way people hoped.

chrisg
12-02-2006, 12:33 PM
Those races have no impact on eclipse voting.

So you're saying that when these foreign horses win one race here and get the Eclipse , there races abroad have no impact on the decision?

I find that hard to believe.

CJ, PA, Suff, Tom...is this true?

Stevie Belmont
12-05-2006, 04:32 PM
Watchmaker's take. Quite similar to mine. Actually makes me feel pretty good. Pointed to several of the same factors. For arguments sake it's a good piece.


http://www.drf.com/drfNewsArticle.do?NID=80840&subs=0&arc=1

Suff
12-05-2006, 04:36 PM
So you're saying that when these foreign horses win one race here and get the Eclipse , there races abroad have no impact on the decision?

I find that hard to believe.

CJ, PA, Suff, Tom...is this true?

I don't know much about stuff like this.

Horses are big, have four legs, they run around in a circle. prior to starting they let you throw a couple of dollars down on the order you think they'll finish.

Thats the true extent of my horse racing knowledge.