Kramer loses it

[Valuist]

http://www.usatoday.com/life/people/2006-11-20-michael-richards_x.htm?csp=27

[twindouble]

With out Kramer in my opinion that show would have flopped. Seinfeld was just handed the jokes and he sucked as an actor. Kramer cracked me up just walking through the door, he's a true comedian.

Just about every race or nationality had words that demeaned them. Many joke books were best sellers using the them.

Why he would go off the wall under that circumstance is beyond me.

[GaryG]

However, were the races reversed the black comic could call caucasians every filthy name in his vocabulary and he would just be "expressing his blackness" or "releasing his pent up rage". Think about it. This happens all the time.

[bigmack]

I can think of fewer racist comedians than Chris Rock

[twindouble]

However, were the races reversed the black comic could call caucasians every filthy name in his vocabulary and he would just be "expressing his blackness" or "releasing his pent up rage". Think about it. This happens all the time.

I agree Gary, excellent point.

[banacek]

Seinfeld is coincidently on Letterman tonight and I heard Richards will be on during Seinfeld's interview to give a videotaped apology about the incident.

[Stevie Belmont]

Huge Richards fan, but he clearly lost it. As a stand up, he should know how to deal with hecklers, as thats part of the job. He could have easliy made that situation funny if he had opted to. Unfortunate, but will pass as everything else does.

[banacek]

Huge Richards fan, but he clearly lost it. As a stand up, he should know how to deal with hecklers, as thats part of the job.

My favourite line dealing with hecklers was from Steve Martin:

"yeah, I remember when I had my first beer":)

[Lefty]

I'm shocked that Paul Rodriguez was shocked. He's one of the biggest racists i've ever heard try to be funny.

[spilparc]

With out Kramer in my opinion that show would have flopped. Seinfeld was just handed the jokes and he sucked as an actor. Kramer cracked me up just walking through the door, he's a true comedian.



Seinfeld was a true ensemble comedy. Kramer was great, no doubt, but Seinfeld was the glue that held that show together. And he grew as an actor.

George and Elaine were necessary parts of the equation. They were both funny and good actors. If you watch some of the early episodes Kramer wasn't so hot. They all grew into their parts to become a finely honed team. They all played off one another perfectly.

You also had great bit part actors like Newman, and George's father who was hilarious. And don't forget Larry David behind the scenes.

George, Elaine, Kramer, and Jerry together and you have what is probably the greatest situation comedy of all time about four of the most self-absorbed people on the planet. They all coalesced as actor-comedians into one great show.

Somehow I never get tired of watching it.

[Tom]

With out Kramer in my opinion that show would have flopped. Seinfeld was just handed the jokes and he sucked as an actor. Kramer cracked me up just walking through the door, he's a true comedian.

Just about every race or nationality had words that demeaned them. Many joke books were best sellers using the them.

Why he would go off the wall under that circumstance is beyond me.

Not that there's anything wrong with that!:D

[twindouble]

Seinfeld was a true ensemble comedy. Kramer was great, no doubt, but Seinfeld was the glue that held that show together. And he grew as an actor.

George and Elaine were necessary parts of the equation. They were both funny and good actors. If you watch some of the early episodes Kramer wasn't so hot. They all grew into their parts to become a finely honed team. They all played off one another perfectly.

You also had great bit part actors like Newman, and George's father who was hilarious. And don't forget Larry David behind the scenes.

George, Elaine, Kramer, and Jerry together and you have what is probably the greatest situation comedy of all time about four of the most self-absorbed people on the planet. They all coalesced as actor-comedians into one great show.

Somehow I never get tired of watching it.

I looked at it this way. Take Don Knotts :lol: ( Deputy Barney fife) out of the Andy Griffith show or The barber Floyd you've got nothing but a boring show that wouldn't have lasted with out him. That's the way I look at Kramer, sure they all jelled but without such good suporting actors Seinfeld would have gone nowhere. Not only that he would have come and gone as a stand up without the big wigs catering to him. Just my opinion.

T.D.

[Lefty]

Seinfeld was the funniest show that ever hit tv and the writing was superb.
It almost didn't see the light of day as the focus group didn't like it. Finally they gave it only 4 episodes to hit or miss.

[twindouble]

[QUOTE=Lefty]Seinfeld was the funniest show that ever hit tv and the writing was superb.

That I agree with.

[JustRalph]

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=1809&stc=1

Senator Byrd's favorite comedian, when he is awake, that is...........

[PaceAdvantage]

What a very strange situation this has turned out to be. Seeing Richards on Letterman via satellite trying to fix what he broke was very uncomfortable, but I give props to Jerry Seinfeld for trying to help his friend and fellow comedian at a time when most everyone else has run away.

[boomman]

First of all let me state unequivocably that I am not condoning Michael Richards' behavior in any way, and to be honest, I just don't like referrals to or ethnic or racial jokes of any kind. The problem is, you are bound to offend SOMEONE, and I don't care to laugh at the expense of others. (Self-deprecating humor is fine and I often use it myself)...But let's be TOTALLY honest here-As Gary said in an earlier thread, if this had been a black person making fun of a white person or ridiculing the caucasian race,this would have never made national news, in fact nothing would have been said-That is the reality of the world we live in!!!

[chickenhead]

I only saw a quick clip of it, so I'm not going to throw anyone under the bus, but it did not look good.

I'm actually a big fan of racial humor, I think it can be really healthy when done right. But it HAS to be funny, i.e. it has to be saying something. MR appeared to more or less just be saying nasty things to these guys. That's not quite the same thing. If you're insult the comic dog that's one thing, but to blast someone with racial epithets doesn't really require any imagination, and could probably only be funny if that is your schtick.

I would guess even while he was doing it, he was trying to find a place to land, some way to have it make sense, and just couldn't do it. Unfortunately I think his biggest crime is not being much of a standup...he shouldn't have tried to tread that kind of deep water.

[GameTheory]

He wasn't "doing comedy" anymore when he was yelling at these guys -- he snapped, seemed to lose his mind, and was just yelling. This kind of thing happens to young stand-ups just starting out all the time -- not yelling racial slurs -- but just sort of snapping on-stage. Being up there puts you in an incredibly vulnerable state-of-mind, and if you don't have the experience of dealing with hecklers it must feel like being shot at. Some people just lose it.

[Valuist]

Carlos Mencia is good w/the racial humor. He picks on EVERY group equally.

[JPinMaryland]

Borat still seems to be doing well at the gate. I guess it means it depends on how the racial stuff is interpreted. CLearly it wasnt funny and clearly he seemed to be just angry but still....

Did anyone see the apology? I saw an edited version of the rant but not the apology. People were saying it was like he slipped into the Kramer character. Maybe he just talks like that in real life? ...

I think Andy Griffith would have got along fine w/o Floyd the Barber.

[twindouble]

Borat still seems to be doing well at the gate. I guess it means it depends on how the racial stuff is interpreted. CLearly it wasnt funny and clearly he seemed to be just angry but still....

Did anyone see the apology? I saw an edited version of the rant but not the apology. People were saying it was like he slipped into the Kramer character. Maybe he just talks like that in real life? ...

I think Andy Griffith would have got along fine w/o Floyd the Barber.

I just liked Floyd, takes a good actor to get into a character like Floyd. Now I can't remember who played the part. :bang:

[delayjf]

Seinfeld was the funniest show that ever hit tv and the writing was superb

I'd say its a tie between Seinfeld and Married with Children.

[GaryG]

[/b]

I just liked Floyd, takes a good actor to get into a character like Floyd. Now I can't remember who played the part. :bang:It was Howard McNear.

http://www.mayberry.com/tagsrwc/wbmutbb/anewsome/private/floydbio.htm

[Lefty]

I'd say its a tie between Seinfeld and Married with Children.
Loved both shows but two different types of comedy. "Married" was the more cartoonish and Seinfeld for all the talk about being about "nothing" had several shows with some rather complex plotting where all the subplots impinged upon the main plot. Both shows were outstanding and consistently funny.

[banacek]

[/b]

I just liked Floyd, takes a good actor to get into a character like Floyd. Now I can't remember who played the part. :bang:

Eugene Levy did a great Floyd the Barber on SCTV. ;)

[twindouble]

Eugene Levy did a great Floyd the Barber on SCTV. ;)

I could have looked it up but it bugs me when I draw a blank like that. I know his first name was Floyd :bang: Oh well.

[Suff]

But let's be TOTALLY honest here-As Gary said in an earlier thread, if this had been a black person making fun of a white person or ridiculing the caucasian race,this would have never made national news, in fact nothing would have been said-That is the reality of the world we live in!!!

Yea. Its great to be Black huh. OK ,,,,Line up over here...all you white guys that want to be black.

Come on!!! Its great... You can say things about white people, but they can't say anything about you!! Think about how great that is. Oh boy.!!

Ok,,,, Line up Gary...Line up Boomman,,, the rest of you line up... Your dream is about to come true... You too are about to get the the great life of being Black in America...

-----------------------------------------------------------------

Of course we know none of you bitches will get in line... ,

[Stevie Belmont]

If any black comedian flipped and did the samething, they would have gotten nailed for it as well, that was over the top. I agree blacks can and do get away with a lot that white people might not be able to, but no one would have gotten away with what Richards did. He went bizerk.

[TurfRuler]

First of all let me state unequivocably that I am not condoning Michael Richards' behavior in any way, and to be honest, I just don't like referrals to or ethnic or racial jokes of any kind. The problem is, you are bound to offend SOMEONE, and I don't care to laugh at the expense of others. (Self-deprecating humor is fine and I often use it myself)...But let's be TOTALLY honest here-As Gary said in an earlier thread, if this had been a black person making fun of a white person or ridiculing the caucasian race,this would have never made national news, in fact nothing would have been said-That is the reality of the world we live in!!!


It's all over the news what Richards said, the so-called "n" word. I don't use it myself, I had friends call me that, but I don't use it on anyone I know. But I would like to ask.

What is a caucasian racist joke that have been told that offends that races conciousness? Did you here the one about Christopher Columbus.

[bigmack]

I could have looked it up but it bugs me when I draw a blank like that. I know his first name was Floyd :bang: Oh well.
Howard McNear td. Lest we not forget Howard Morris who was the head writer on the show and played Ernest T. Bass (How-do-you-do-Mrs. Wiley)

In their prime there were no funnier shows than AGriffith - Seinfeld - The Odd Couple.

http://tsbolton.com/heroes/etb.jpghttp://www.seinfeld-fan.net/pictures/kramer/kramer027.jpg
http://artfiles.art.com/images/-/Odd-Couple-Photograph-C10102413.jpeg

[JustRalph]

Carlos Mencia is good w/the racial humor. He picks on EVERY group equally.

and if he had done this, it would not have even made the news. Let alone a national I'm sorry fest on Letterman.

It was Kramer. That is why it is news.

[kenwoodallpromos]

He's got a brand new TV show.

[kenwoodallpromos]

I was going to make up a comedy routinr sabout the incident but I could not think of anyhting "routine" about it!LOL!! :lol:

[Valuist]

I didn't see the apology. Did he do it in character?

"I'm sorry.....I guess I FLIPPED OUT!! (goes thru convulsive gyrations).

Best racing commercial? None of the NTRA crap but Kramer rooting a horse home at the OTB.....only to have his cigar ignite his Racing Form on fire.

[banacek]

I didn't see the apology. Did he do it in character?

"I'm sorry.....I guess I FLIPPED OUT!! (goes thru convulsive gyrations).

Best racing commercial? None of the NTRA crap but Kramer rooting a horse home at the OTB.....only to have his cigar ignite his Racing Form on fire.

His mudder was a mudder, his father was a mudder

[bigmack]

I didn't see the apology. Did he do it in character?
.
You can see it here V. Well it's nice to know Sinbad has weighed in on the situation.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/SHOWBIZ/Movies/11/20/richards.epithets.ap/index.html

[Stevie Belmont]

and if he had done this, it would not have even made the news. Let alone a national I'm sorry fest on Letterman.

It was Kramer. That is why it is news.

I never saw Mencia go into a rage filled rant

If any public figure does anything like that it's news..

[boomman]

Suff: You got some nerve taking a factual comment and twisting it the way you did-I again REPEAT I was not and am not condoning Richards' actions, and no one said that being black in America was a picnic-but that has nothing to do with this double standard and never has-and as far as who's a coward? Call me that in a forum behind a pen name? Duh!!! LOL BOOM

[Suff]

Suff: You got some nerve taking a factual comment and twisting it the way you did-I again REPEAT I was not and am not condoning Richards' actions, and no one said that being black in America was a picnic-but that has nothing to do with this double standard and never has-and as far as who's a coward? Call me that in a forum behind a pen name? Duh!!! LOL BOOM

Yea... Nothing irks me more than white guys complaining about black guys.

Its a strange thing the world. I say Israel's foreign policy is junk and everyone starts bringing up Germany and Hitler. As if something that happened in another country by another government is our responsibility.

But then in the same breath when you talk about the impact of slavery,people start in on the "it was a long time ago". or "things are even"..and so forth...and so on...

I frequently say.....You know how I know racism is alive and well in America?"

Because I hang around with white people when no black people are around...


That's all fine and good... Blacks don't exactly help themselves to much either. But its definitely more acceptable to say "Blacks are this".. than "Jews are that".... People have no love for Black people. (in general)..But empathy for Jews is very correct.

I could get into my background... and it counts. Because I grew up during busing and even talking to a Black guy could be the end of you in Neighborhoods I ran around in. The things with blacks is that if they ask you directions you send them the wrong way..., all that shit I know well....

Maybe you never heard what I'm saying....but bitching about blacks is not what a white guy does...its not acceptable. Its like bitching about broads.... waste of time and doesnt change anything.

Michael Richards ran his mouth. he said what millions of white people think everyday...and many say when no blacks are around!! :lol:

yet what people took out of it was "Blacks do the same thing and they don't get into trouble"

I ask you again....If they had a line you could get in to change you to be black......would you? HELL NO!!!

So why bitch that they can tell cracker jokes with impunity?: Its all they got!

[chickenhead]

I ask you again....If they had a line you could get in to change you to be black......would you? HELL NO!!!

So why bitch that they can tell cracker jokes with impunity?: Its all they got!

I don't think the line for "IRISH" would be a long one either, Suff. I know what you're saying, but I think it's a goofy point. Black, Latin, Asian....flip a coin, I'll stay Ital. But it wouldn't really matter anyway. I work with black/latin/asian people, they've got everything I've got.

But I've heard about you guys in Beantown...not so friendly with the black man.

[kenwoodallpromos]

COuld've been worse- he coulda been driving!LOL!!

[bigmack]

Of course we know none of you bitches will get in line... ,

:lol:

A santimonious gaunlet thrown down by a white guy to other supposed white guys about what it's like to be Black in America, all the while referring to them as bitches.

Your delusional need to "school" others about what they think or don't think is numbing.

[Tom]

Don't you have and Jews out there to beat up? ( Suff)

[Tom]

I saw the whole apology - it was wierd. He looked like he was goin ginto Krammer character, but not rally - the audience was laguhing, and Jerry told them to stop - that this was not an act.
Then, it seemed like he was losing it again - he started to get beligerent, to ramble on about things. You know, like Suff does here a lot ;):D

I think the guy has some problems.
I heard the whole orignal rant is on Youtube - haven't found it yet.

http://ivillage.feedroom.com/ifr_main.jsp?nsid=b552c2fa1:10f0d098acb:-763&fr_story=FEEDROOM167962&st=1164156300500&mp=FLV&cpf=false&fvn=8&fr=112106_074503_552c2fa1x10f0d098acbxw762&rdm=613270.6613418494

[Tom]

I found the whole live tirade on Youtube, but I won't post a link because it is way past PAs TOS. Look it up yourself if interested.

It happened, get over it. I didn't see it as a big deal - especially in a comedy club in LA.
BTW, speaking of LA, maybe I missed it - there WAS an apology for the riots and looting and burnig after Rodney King wans't there? I mean, THAT was uncalled for. THAT was offensive.

Put crap in persepctive.

[skate]

when i heard this news on the radio, i did not know that Richards was not Seinfeld(?). i've got no side here.


but i gotta think, if he thinks he can "take on" the guy from the audience, go to it. what about the guy doing the heckling?
you have to here what he's saying , in order to judge, no?

[bigmack]

I heard the whole orignal rant is on Youtube - haven't found it yet.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-T7uKvpzVXI

[banacek]

- the audience was laguhing, and Jerry told them to stop - that this was not an act.


I thought that a few in the audience laughed because he called them Afro-Americans, but I could be wrong.

[DJofSD]

The media will drop the Kramer story and move on to Paris (again). First reported on MSNBC. (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15516586)

[rrpic6]

What a very strange situation this has turned out to be. Seeing Richards on Letterman via satellite trying to fix what he broke was very uncomfortable, but I give props to Jerry Seinfeld for trying to help his friend and fellow comedian at a time when most everyone else has run away.

Its called damage control. Seinfeld:Season 7, comes out on DVD this weekend. that tirade will cost Jerry a bundle.

[Lefty]

Its called damage control. Seinfeld:Season 7, comes out on DVD this weekend. that tirade will cost Jerry a bundle.
That's true but I think it entirely possible that Seinfeld also trying to help a friend. If the DVD wasn't coming out, I still think Seinfeld would try to help.

[JPinMaryland]

Did you notice even the heckler couldnt figure out if he was supposed to stay in heckler mode or go into full blown indignation mode?

After Kramer went nuts the heckler started to get up to leave and said "this is inexcusable" or something like that. Then about half way through his exit, he told Richards that he was nothing except for Seinfeld "you're a one hit wonder" he's nothing now.

Richards: "Eww. That hurt."

So even the heckler needs to work on his act. Either stay with the indignation trip or stay in full blown heckler mode it makes it better and more believable.

[JPinMaryland]

Yea... Nothing irks me more than white guys complaining about black guys. ...Michael Richards ran his mouth. he said what millions of white people think everyday...and many say when no ******s are around!! :lol:

yet what people took out of it was "******s do the same thing and they don't get into trouble"

I ask you again....If they had a line you could get in to change you to be black......would you? HELL NO!!!

So why bitch that they can tell cracker jokes with impunity?: Its all they got!


I dont think its a black white issue, Suff but more like a hypocrisy argument. At least the more intelligent comments Ive seen have pointed out that there is more then enuf hypocrisy involved in this.

Forget black comedians. What about Triumph the Insult Dog? What about Borat? How about Don Rickles? I never saw Lenny Bruce but he did some routines that played on racism too.

Did you ever see the Adoph Hanckler skit when John Stewart was on the Larry Sanders show? Oh my god that was at once both gut splitting and highly offensive if you did not know it was comedy. That's what made it genius.

Hanckler: "What caused the sinking of the Titantic?"
Contestant: "AN iceberg?"
[Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzz]
Hanckler: "No, I'm sorry that would be The Jews."

And the chick from the Third Rock from the SUn is telling STewart: "WE could never get away with something like this on Third Rock...."

Can you imagine a little old lady who survived the holocaust and not knowing what the Larry Sanders show was and happening to tune in?

So the pt. is maybe there is a really fine line between what is comedy and what is offensive? Maybe if John Stewart wasnt Jewish he doesnt get away with that?

ANd maybe that line is so fine that obviously some people can be offended while at the same time others might not be. I mean Borat or Lenny Bruce or Hanckler would probably be examples of that.

Am I saying Richards is right on the line? No obviously he just went nuts and it wasnt funny, more like watching a train wreck.

But I am saying that it's just a comedy routine that failed badly. Lots of comics appeal to racism in a way that works as comedy. When it fails it sucks, but it's nothing more than that. The words themselves are no more offensive than anything you'd hear from Chris Rock or Eddie Murphy or anybody..Its not that big a deal.

To hear Sinbad or Paul Rodriguez or whomever say its so terrible is just a little bit overboard.

[JPinMaryland]

Eugene Levy did a great Floyd the Barber on SCTV. ;)

Yes, yes that was classic. The guy who played Floyd was actually terribly sick with one of those wasting diseases is my understanding that is why in the later shows he basically never moved at all. He was so sick. I think he died not long afterward but I could be wrong.

It's actually nice they did that to let him stay on the show. Some of those other shows would just get rid of the characters and pretend he never existed. Or like getting the substitute Darren Stevens to play Samantha's husband. Or when they switched Lionels on the Jeffersons. Was it Bea Benderette that died on Petticoat Junction and they just went on like she never existed?

ANyhow I thought alot about what character was absolutely necessary for ANdy Griffith show and I think it comes down to Opie. WIth a real good child actor in that role the show would not be a classic. Its like compariing Different Strokes to that show with Emanuel Lewis. Gary Coleman classic, Emanuel Lewis, ehh.

So Opie is a must. What about AUnt Bea? You know she played it well but that's not to say another character actor could have played it differently and the show would not suffer. Theres plenty of those characters available: Anne B Davis on Brady Bunch or the lady who Courtship of Eddie's father. Not a crucial role.

What about Don Knotts? That's a tough one. No one else could play it the way Don Knotts did. Definitely one of a kind. The show would probably be somewhat different without him. Its hard to imagine someone else in that role with the same sort of result.

[JustRalph]

What about Don Knotts? That's a tough one. No one else could play it the way Don Knotts did. Definitely one of a kind. The show would probably be somewhat different without him. Its hard to imagine someone else in that role with the same sort of result.

It waaaaasss different. To Andy Griffith watchers the show went completely off the chart bad after Don left. Don came back for guest appearances and in his first I believe he won an Emmy. But the minute Don left and coincidentally the episodes started being filmed in color, the show was never the same. Although it stayed high in the ratings.

From Wikipedia:
The later years
In the fall of 1965, Don Knotts left to pursue a career in feature films. Griffith had said early on that he only planned to do the show for five years. As that time approached, Knotts signed a movie contract. Griffith reconsidered his earlier decision and Knotts, who wanted to continue as Barney, tried to get out of or rework his film contract. However, the film studio wouldn't consider either option, so Knotts was forced to leave the show (although he made 5 guest appearances over the following 3 seasons).

Beginning with the 1965-66 season, the series was broadcast in color. The opening and closing credits were reshot, but retained the familiar theme "The Fishin' Hole". Jack Burns joined the cast as Warren Ferguson, the new deputy, but the character was dropped mid-season without explanation. Griffith later said that it just hadn't worked out.

Perhaps the most significant changes to the show in the 1965/66 season, however, were immediately apparent only to viewers who closely watched the credits: show producer and story consultant Aaron Ruben left the Andy Griffith Show after 5 seasons, as did frequent episode writers Everett Greenbaum and Jim Fritzell. Subesquently, prolific writer Harvey Bullock left after season 6, and by season 8, an entirely new crop of writers was working for the show. While it would be unfair and untrue to characterize the new writers as anything less than professional, the color episodes were often accused of lacking Ruben's customary affection for the small-town lifestyle and attention to production detail. Additionally, due in part to the departure of Knotts as a comic foil, Griffith's character often comes across as irritable and distant. At the time of their original broadcasts, however, the color episodes of The Andy Griffth Show were quite popular, with the show consistently finishing in the top 10.


[edit] Unpopularity of color episodes in syndication
At the same time The Andy Griffith Show switched to color, a new writing/producing team was hired, the popular Knotts departed, and new (not always popular) supporting characters were added. This made for a unique situation when the show went into sydication.

Over the years, several classic sitcoms of the 1960s began as black and white shows, but went color after a year or two (e.g., Gilligan's Island, My Three Sons, Bewitched, I Dream Of Jeannie, The Beverly Hillbillies). When these series were shown in syndication, TV stations tended to run the color episodes more often than the black and white ones. In some instances, TV stations would even skip the black and white episodes altogether. In some cases, the black and white episodes would be colorized, to make them saleable on the syndication market. With Andy Griffith, however, the opposite would happen. In syndication, the black and white "Barney Fife" episodes from 1960 to 1965 were much more popular and aired much more than the 1965 to 1968 color episodes.

In the 1990s, WHNT-TV in Huntsville, Alabama started airing the color episodes in black and white, the thinking being these episodes would be more likely to be watched if viewers thought they were watching an episode from the popular black and white years. Within the past few years, however, the station has started showing the color episodes in color once again.

[dav4463]

There were still quite a few great Andy Griffith episodes after Knotts left, but not as many. The one where Howard Sprague caught "Old Sam" was a classic. I also love the one where Howard's mother ends up on a date with Andy,Helen,Howard, and Howard's girl. Also the one where Opie tried to impress the rich kid and Andy taught him to just be himself. I loved the one where Goober went to the auto show with Andy, Aunt Bea, and Opie and tried to impress his supposedly more successful former classmate. Goober and Howard had their moments, but it was definitely better with Barney and in b/w....

[PaceAdvantage]

You know, in the early days of this board, I kicked a long established poster off for using the word that got Kramer into a lot of trouble.

With that said, a post has been deleted and one has been edited.

Thanks for your cooperation in keeping the terms of this board in force:You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this forum to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise in violation of any law.Of course, the above is open to interpretation....guess who's?

[The Judge]

I never watched one episode of Steinfeld when it was first on. I only watched the re-runs it was one of the funniest shows I had ever seen. Very clever and of course Kramer was unreal very funny and in a new way. I do remember that Kramer had a Black Lawyer named Johnny Giles (Morrison who was the son of the tecno guy on Mission Impossibe ,Greg Morrison I think). Giles and Kramer were always involve in some sort of crazy half legal scheme to get money but Kramer would always settle out of court without Giles permission for some crazy think like free coffee for life or a huge billboard with him as a cowboy smoking.

A white guy with a Black Lawyer on T.V was cutting edge. I would be interested in what Morrison thinks about this whole mess. The guy really messed up he when crazy. I don't think he had any idea where he was or what he was doing, he when crazy.

I do know that I tried to watch a re-run last night an couldn't watch it Kramer wasn't funny he was not longer the nut-case next door now he was a real live human-being and I got enough of those in my life already.

[Suff]

:lol:

A santimonious gaunlet thrown down by a white guy to other supposed white guys about what it's like to be Black in America, all the while referring to them as bitches.

Your delusional need to "school" others about what they think or don't think is numbing.

its a joke, yea dope. Well not truly...You being a dope I mean. Cuz I aint regular.

I use lexicon that african americans use to show how stupid or rudimentary it sounds comig from a crackass. Hence my position. Don't worry about what Blacks get or say... They have thier own problems.

But good review... three stars *** and a :ThmbDown: ,....and one...:D

[Suff]

You know, in the early days of this board, I kicked a long established poster off for using the word that got Kramer into a lot of trouble.

With that said, a post has been deleted and one has been edited.

Thanks for your cooperation in keeping the terms of this board in force:Of course, the above is open to interpretation....guess who's?

Yes, because I believe I have used the the "N" word before?: no?

But yes....as I was sitting at the house last night I said to myself

"self, you mighta crossed the line of decency with Bommerang and the Pace advantage board with your silly shit"...

Then quickly I rethought "so what"


:lol: Just kidding.

I'll back up and out of the more volatile discussions. I've proven myself incapable of common courtesy.

[The Judge]

I hear you loud and clear. What you have to say makes sense to me.

[kid4rilla]

The guy went nuts, plain and simple. If your a public figure you can't alienate people as a matter of good business.

The two "gentlemen" heckling him during his show we're attention-seeking troublemakers and he exploded on them unprofessionally. He owes those men an apology. THOSE MEN. He doesn't own Sinbad an apology, Sinbad wasn't there.

It could be said that those men owe him, and the audience, an apology for interrupting the show that they and all the others paid to see. They did instigate the situation.

Richards was enraged. When those men interuptted him, he was angry and trying to strike back at them in anyway he could. They know him, but he doesn't know anything about them. Only seeing that they were black, he went in anger to something he expected would hurt them back.

If he had looked down and it would have been a fat guy or asian guy, he would have attacked fat people or asians. Would he then owe Dom Delouise or Jackie Chan apologies? Or only the people present?

I would bet that Richards treats everyone regardless of race, color, or creed with decency in his everyday life. He was not afforded this himself. I would also bet that he isn't supremicist, just going to the ammo that he knew would hurt.

Everyone in the world has prejudices. Everyone in every race. Good and bad. I certainly have prejudices, but none of the supremicist fashion (which would be a problem for me). I always hate it when people are afraid to admit they exist. They're natural and not all that bad, because they can be unlearned.

Just my 2 cents.

[delayjf]

Don Knotts was to Andy Griffin what Jethro and Granny were to the Beverly Hillbillies. Classic. I never laughed so hard when Granny was watching pro wrestling on TV and got fighten mad when the Boston Strong Girl beat up poor little Rebecca of Sunnybrook farms. Jethro drove her down to the auditorium where she opened a can of whip ass - ended up throwing her into about the 3-4 row from the ring. Funnier than hell:lol: :lol:

Come to think of it, the Boston Stong Girl looked a lot like Suff ;) :D

[bigmack]

Richard Pryor & Chevy Chase SNL

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S0u7mZeCGko

[Tom]

Let's put this whole thing in context.
A has-been bad mouths a couple of loud-mouthed cretins in a comedy club.
Duh........who the heck cares????

Probably the best set of the evening.:rolleyes:

[JustRalph]

those two idiots have hired a lawyer, that feminist chick who defended scott peterson's girlfriend, to sue Kramer. they are talking "settlement" on Hannity and Colmes.........If I was Kramer I would tell them to eat shit........or did he already do that? :lol:

[spilparc]

those two idiots have hired a lawyer, that feminist chick who defended scott peterson's girlfriend, to sue Kramer. they are talking "settlement" on Hannity and Colmes.........If I was Kramer I would tell them to eat shit........or did he already do that? :lol:

Look for a deep pocket. Sue. It costs more to defend, in time money and reputation, than settle. What a country, America.

[NY BRED]

for once, Sharpton has issued a sensible statement on this pathetic
situation, that being any apology should have been made on a black
television show.

[Tom]

Sharpton is looking for attention. When does LA apologize for the riots?
Havent' seen that one yet. Did Reginald Denny get an apology for getting his head smashed in on live TV?

[GaryG]

One currently popular term that I expected to hear in all this (and maybe still will) is "hurtful". That is so sad, somebody said something hurtful. Have to pay for it now though. :eek:

[DJofSD]

Whatever happened to 'sticks and stones will break my bones but words will never hurt me'?

[Tom]

They were used on Reginald Denny.

[Lefty]

I saw this interview with the 2 black guys on Hannity and Colmes. They said they were in a group of 20 and then later said they were afraid. Let's see group 2o against Michael Richards and they were afraid. Uh, huh...
Later they said Richards during his rant said he'd still be rich in the morning and they'd still be n's.
"Rich" Enter Gloria Allred.

[The Judge]

What about the police under the" banner of law' attacking black marcher.The good citizens of Alabama blowing up school childern who were in church praying to the same God as those who blew them up. Meger Evers, Martin Luther King, the guy that was drug to death behind a truck in Texas. Reginal Denny is alive.

There is enough to go around ,what gets me is a guy goes nuts( Kramer in public) and some people that are roiting x number of years ago are brought in as if it were a perfect fit.

Do you think these people found Gloria Allred or do you think she found them she has no shame. I'll stop here or she might sue me.

[Tom]

Those who attacked Denny did not speak for anyone but themselves, as Kramnmer spoke for no one but himself. To look for compensation, or an apology to black America on a black network is just as ridiculous. Like you say, or was it someone else, "If it does not fit, I don't give a .....hoot."

[spilparc]

Those who attacked Denny did not speak for anyone but themselves,

RE Reginald Denny, and those who assualted him.

Didn't they get off?!!!

Right on camera beating this guy to death and they go free.

I answered my own question.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reginald_Oliver_Denny

Interesting article. Here is a short excerpt.

"After a few jury changes, the jury arrived at a verdict of not guilty for all charges except a felony count of mayhem for Williams, and one misdemeanor assault charge for both Williams and Watson on October 18 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/October_18). Watson was then given credit for time served and was released."

[The Judge]

Wikipedia explains what happen better then I can but the main actor Wms. was given 10 Years max. The people that came to Dennys aid and protected him from further harm where the black citizens of that neighborhood not the police.

This has gone far afield so unless its about the "Kramer" I won't be replying and "Kramer" may have run its course for me as well.

[GaryG]

"After a few jury changes, the jury arrived at a verdict of not guilty for all charges except a felony count of mayhem for Williams, and one misdemeanor assault charge for both Williams and Watson on October 18 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/October_18). Watson was then given credit for time served and was released."Affirmative Action in action.....ain't it grand?

[JPinMaryland]

In the Reg. Denny case, the defendant's atty. cleverly pointed out that if the def. had wanted to kill the guy, he could have very easily done so by continuing the assault. Hence on the count of "assault with intent to kill" he was found not guilty.

Clever tactic, have seen the same thing tried in MD courts with a similar result. So it was basically good lawyering. I'll withhold further comment on that as it was a jury verdict and I guess we have to live with it....

***

Getting back to the Michael Richards thing, Suff it was MY POST that was deleted in this thread. Not sure you understood that as your comment seemed to suggest you thought one of yours was deleted.

I was going to re-post it with the racial slurs deleted but this Lenny Bruce routine is so well known and easy enuf to find on the internet that there is not much need to.

It's Lenny Bruce's routine where he goes; "I have 3 N-----s, do I hear four, I have 5 [insert racial slur here) etc."

That routine is probably known to most stand up comedians. It was also revisited in the film version of Bruce's life: Lenny (so so movie but good performance by Hoffman) and it is quite possible that Richards was trying to channel that routine in some way, with horrendously bad results.

I thought about that old routine as soon as I saw the video; and another guy somewhere in cyberworld pointed out the same idea. So maybe.

Anyhow the point is this: It's the same material, well basically the same material filled with racial epithetics. The only difference is not the material but hte presentation, one is by a briliant comedian and one is by a not so good comedian.

The line between brilliant comedy and bad racial epithets is very narrow. So I wouldnt read too much into Richard's disaster. I dont think it makes him a racist (could be but doesnt prove it), he shouldnt be banned for life, he doesnt need to apologize to black folks etc.

He maybe should meet with the people who were there at the club. Maybe.

[dav4463]

I just don't like the way the two hecklers go on Fox News and are treated like they are some kind of heroes. They are the ones that started it in the first place.

[delayjf]

So now they got a high profile attorney. I didn't know one could sue somebody for having their feelings hurt. I guess they have a "right not to be insulted. Only in California.

[Lefty]

In the interview, Gloria Allred said Richards was using hate speech and not free speech. Even the liberal, Colmes piped up and said it also was free speech.

[DJofSD]

Jesse Jackson was suppose to have requested that all rap artists drop the use of the "N" word in their lyrics.

Ya, right, as if they'll listen to him let alone do was he asks.

[PaceAdvantage]

Even the liberal, Colmes piped up and said it also was free speech.

I should freakin' hope so!

[kenwoodallpromos]

Maybe I'll buy the DVD just to see Kramer wearing and Afro again!

[JPinMaryland]

Now they are going to ban the "N" word (I that freakin euphemism) from the COmedy club. At least that is what I thought I heard as I was flipping channels.

That is great, hey can we also ban the middle figure gesture made by Michael Vick? What about throat slashes?

Maybe Michael VIck can personally apologize to every fan who attended his football game?

Hell this is like when those people want to get all nations to ban land mines. Why aim so small? Why not just go for a ban on bullets? Or a ban on all weapons? THat would be more effective. What no land mines, but use all the machine guns you want?

[Tom]

How about banning people from whinning about things all the time.
People are going to offend you. Live with it, or stay the hell in your house.

Where's the outrge over "honkey?" It dosen't bother me a bit! Honk honk! :D

[banacek]

Take a couple of minutes to enjoy National Lampoon's take on this::)


http://tinyurl.com/yde7w5 (http://tinyurl.com/yde7w5)

[JustRalph]

banacek..........thanks for the link. that was great............... :lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

Now that was comedy....thanks for the link!

[highnote]

Donald Trump and probably others have said, "Bad publicity is better than no publicity."

Before this incident, I didn't know Kramer's real name. He is probably better known now than before his tirade.