NYRA pick six snafu

[Ron]

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/more_sports/story/445213p-374921c.html

[PaceAdvantage]

So it's a state rule, eh? How can that be, if as the article states, you could have gotten the wager cancelled at a ticket window? I take it state law says wagers made with a NYRA ONE account are subject to different cancellation restrictions than a wager made at a teller window? That doesn't sound right....but then again, when it comes to the NYSRWB, you never know....

It sounds to me like this guy tried to cancel the wager from a betting machine, where this $50 rule is in place. I wonder what would have happened if he had called a NYRA ONE operator on the telephone....perhaps they could have cancelled his wager that way?

[pjbc77]

That's a good question. I wonder how many people who have NYRA ONE accounts know that there are different rules about cancellations than if they bet with a teller...

[samyn on the green]

He could have had the SAM ticket canceled by going to a mutual clerk. They can cancel tickets over $50 that a SAM machine can not and they have done this before for me. Daily News is not doing the public any favors by not reporting this. This newspaper always caters to the disgruntled loser, the type that blames everyone but himself. The negative horseplayer sterotype that is so common amoung us.

There is a block on tickets being canceled at SAM machines over $50 due to possible chicanery. An example is betting a longshot FTS heavy to manipulate its price early to attract other action away from a real steam horse. Then cancel all tickets at the last minute and bet all the bankroll in the last minutes on the real steam horse while all the little me too money goes to the longshot FTS that took the early phantom action.

[PaceAdvantage]

Maybe now we're getting somewhere. However, the person in question used his NYRA ONE account to wager....not the same as wagering with a voucher....similar, but not exactly the same.

I have a sneaking suspicion that a phone call to a NYRA ONE operator could have easily solved his problem. Not sure if he could have gone to a teller and had them access his account....maybe....but I'm not sure. Perhaps he couldn't get to a telephone quickly enough.....

[samyn on the green]

The SAM ticket I am talking about was a bet on NYRAONE card. The clerks canceled a $175 win bet for me on a NYRAONE card that the machine would not cancel at Aquueduct over the winter. To cancel a bet over $50 the teller is required to get supervisor approval but it was canceled before post time.

[PaceAdvantage]

Well then, there you go....thanks for the clarification. I figured something like this would be very possible, but I guess Bossert's pal did not. There should be a notice on the SAM machine reading "SEE TELLER" when something like this happens.That would make the most sense....

[pjbc77]

Agreed. It would also make sense for Bossert to do a little research before firing off an irresponsible column.

[the little guy]

Nothing like not doing your homework. I especially liked his quotes from NYRA officials backing up the incorrect information he was giving.

Calling NYRA-One and speaking to a supervisor was all that was necessary.

[cj]

I liked the bottom part of the article better, about the late scratches. Why does NYRA suddenly have the worst gate crew in the country, bar none?

[pjbc77]

I heard at the track (which of course means that this could be completely untrue) that the long time starter left before last season, but stayed on in an advisory capacity for last year's meet. I think this is the current starters second year, they did have some problems last year as well. Can be very frustrating to watch.

[Ron]

"The stewards immediately put up the inquiry sign and after several reviews declared Sunshine Johanne a nonstarter because she actually broke through the gate, stumbling to her knees, before the actual start. Sydsational wasn't ordered scratched after the head-on replay showed she appeared to rear on her own at the start."


Sydsational reared on her own, or reared because the horse next to her broke through the gate, stumbling to her knees, before the actual start?

Both horses should have been scratched.

[TravisVOX]

Would someone please email when the NY Daily News writes a positive article about horse racing in NY? I feel like my inbox will be empty for a while.

[aaron]

Travis-
Why don't you think there are any positive articles about NY racing ? Could it be the way the tracks are run in NY ?
For example after a positive start at Saratoga, have the race cards reverted to being slightly better than a winter card at Aqueduct ? For an example check the August 18th card.It may have been the worse card ever run at Saratoga.Also check some of the weekend cards which are top heavy with Maiden Races.
It seems NYRA is saving all its races for Travers Day.One other thing to check out is the betting machines,which are not nearly as good as the ones they replaced.I heard the machines currently in use at NYRA were rejected by New Jersey racing.

[rrbauer]

The racing associations usually blame the tote companies for failure to provide the bettors with sufficient options in dealing with late scratches. Yet, I can't ever recall a racing association refusing to continue a contract with a tote company because it wouldn't make software changes that would enhance bettors' options. Now that Magna owns a tote company maybe that will change at their tracks (LOL)!

Both the state and the racing associations do everything in their power to keep bettors' money in the pools once it has been committed. The idea that scratches should result in refunds flies in the face of this agenda.

Yes, one option to the bettor in "Pick" bets should be an alternate runner for a scratched horse. And, another option to the bettor in "Pick" bets should be a refund for combinations involving a scratched horse; either a refund of the entire bet involving the scratched horse, if it is the first leg of the "Pick" series; or, a refund of the portion of the bet involving the scratched horse that is still alive, if it is a downstream leg of the "Pick" series.

As an aside, one of the things that I like about playing "Pick" bets with Pinnacle is that they will refund ALL combinations involving the scratched horse, regardless of which leg the scratch occurred in and regardless of whether, or not, the combination is still alive when the scratch occurs. That works for me!

However, Pinnacle does not take Pick-6 bets, so it's a moot point vis-a-vis the current controversy.

[the little guy]

I wonder who is the press agent for Empire Racing and what his previous job was.

[TravisVOX]

Travis-
Why don't you think there are any positive articles about NY racing ? Could it be the way the tracks are run in NY ?
For example after a positive start at Saratoga, have the race cards reverted to being slightly better than a winter card at Aqueduct ? For an example check the August 18th card.It may have been the worse card ever run at Saratoga.Also check some of the weekend cards which are top heavy with Maiden Races.
It seems NYRA is saving all its races for Travers Day.One other thing to check out is the betting machines,which are not nearly as good as the ones they replaced.I heard the machines currently in use at NYRA were rejected by New Jersey racing.

I actually like the machines, they're up-to-date and quality.

As for the racing, it's funny, because if they carded more high-class allowances we would all be screaming about 5 or 6 horse fields. So, rather than do that, they give us big fields, and now we're all screaming about poor quality. Horseplayers are never happy.

[pjbc77]

I would have to agree. I follow Saratoga every year, and I think this meet so far is a good combination of quality races along with races that will fill. The third race on Sunday was $100,000 claimer with some terrific horses, but only five showed up to run. If the statebred races and the maiden claimers fill up, then I don't have a problem with the secretary carding them. Even in those, it's not like we're talking about $5,000 horses. No one wants to watch (or more importantly, bet on) four and five horse fields all day.

[aaron]

Travis-
I can go either way on the race cards.The thing I don't like is that NYRA is constantly telling us what a great job they are doing.They are doing an okay job.They should be ashamed of themselves for the shambles they have left at Aqueduct.Only NYRA could have a gift shop open during the Saratoga simulcasts.I bet they probably have not done $100.00 in business in the gift shop in 4 weeks,but they close concession stands because there is no business during the week at the Belmont meet.
As for the machines you are one of the few who likes them.
All things considered I guess we'll have to live with them.
The executives at NYRA are probably doing the best they can under the circumstances,but I would respect them more if they identified the problems and said this is what I will do to correct them if the franchise is renewed.

[cj]

If you don't like the cards at Saratoga, try Hollywood South...errrrr...Delmar.

The machines stink. At any given time in a row of 10, 2 or 3 are out of order. If you happen to be the lucky soul to be the one the machine malfunctions for, you have to wait 10 minutes for an attendant to show up and get your voucher out.

[aaron]

CJ-
Many bettors have spoken to the powers that be about the machines and have never received an adequate answer.I know the machines were never tested by any bettors before installation.With the advent of the new machines they have made it virtually impossiable to bet w/p parlays or p/s parlays.I know most players don't make this bet,so I understand their indifference,but that doesn't make it right.

[Ron]

The machines stink. At any given time in a row of 10, 2 or 3 are out of order. If you happen to be the lucky soul to be the one the machine malfunctions for, you have to wait 10 minutes for an attendant to show up and get your voucher out.

This weekend there were quite a few of them that wouldn't take the card, and of course you wouldn't know it until it was your turn.

[Suff]

I wonder who is the press agent for Empire Racing and what his previous job was.

Glen Mathes, NYRA director of communications.