Belmont Friday

[Tom]

What is going on herre?
22 scratches, and yet another 4 horse stakes?
Track not off, weather looks good on TV.

I thought New Jersey was shut down, not New York?

[delayjf]

Hollywood Park doesn't look so bad now!

[The Hawk]

I though that Belmont was the best racing in the country? Maybe not, huh? Makes Finger Lakes look good by comparison.

You had it right. New Jersey IS shut down. New York SHOULD BE shut down... :D

[Dave]

tom -- how many of those were ae's and mto's........?

4 horse races DO suck, though.

[the little guy]

11 were AEs and MTOs and two were parts of entries with the same rider named so one had to scratch. So on average one actual entry came out a race. Probably still too many but not quite as bad as it looks without examination.

[point given]

tom -- how many of those were ae's and mto's........?

4 horse races DO suck, though.

Agreed. But to be fair, the race in question was written for Sun King as a prep. 2 horses scratched and Sun King came in 2nd at 1/5 ! At least they kept the race out of the P6. Which btw, paid $312K for the carryover.

.

[the little guy]

I don't think that race was actually written for Sun King as it was an overnight stake. Regardless....I agree that four horse races suck.

[Tom]

Gee, guys, that was the only race I bet and won!
Have to admit, after drawing 22 lines through horses, I was on to other tracks and did not give Belmont 5 minutes.
After seeing the other race results, that was too much time!

[PaceAdvantage]

I though that Belmont was the best racing in the country? Maybe not, huh? Makes Finger Lakes look good by comparison.

You had it right. New Jersey IS shut down. New York SHOULD BE shut down... :D


Aside from being shut down, how's the racing been at Monmouth this year?

[PaceAdvantage]

Ok, show of hands....out of those who have participated in this thread, who's currently high on crack?

9 races.....two with 7 betting interests, one with 8 betting interests, two with 9 betting interests, one with 10 betting interests, and one with 11 betting interests....7 of 9 with 7 betting interests or more....3 maiden races....

Prices?

$10.80
$81.00
$22.40
$18.80

What's the problem?

[Dave]

beats the hell out of me -- I'm usually pretty happy when mto's are scratched, but to each their own, I guess.

[the little guy]

Unfortunately my dealer got busted so I'm a little shy on crack tonight....



I thought today's card was tough but interesting and the same could be said for tomorrow's. Both the kind of cards where one good opinion makes a decent day and two make a great one. My kind of opportunities.

Sunday's card on the other hand.....I better hope my dealer makes parole.

[Tom]

Uh.....

[ELA]

Great points here. Funny thing is that there's quite a few races at Belmont that are not filling -- for the girls, starters, etc. Anyway, not specifically today, but I've been able to find a lot of value at Belmont. Now, I don't play every race and I only play when I find value, an angle, something I like, etc. I think it's like ice cream -- chocolate, vanilla, strawberry, etc. Everyone has their own likes and dislikes.

Also, about the overnight stake and Sun King. This race was in the book and in the proof for quite some time now. I can check if they changed a condition or eligibility or something like that, but I didn't see this race as being written for him. I'd like to check that out.

As far as Monmouth -- the quality of horses down there has been HORRIBLE!!! I wish I had a barn full of J-bred 5 to 10 claimers, some open 10's, 12.5's, and 16's, and J-bred allowance horses. The J-bred 5's are going for $20K!!! The open $12.5's are going for $20k!!! And will all this -- it has been very, very hard to claim horses. I've already got outshook on a 4-way shake and a 5-way shake. I lost one and there were 4 in for him.

Eric

[bigmack]

I though that Belmont was the best racing in the country?
NY racing in general is getting laughable.

[Zaf]

Give me those 14 horse sprints at EVD ! What a great meet, hope it never ends !

Z

[PaceAdvantage]

Speaking of 5 star racing, what do all the pundits on this thread (especially Mr. Hawk) think of the stellar fields they have lined up at Hollywood Park for this big weekend....

Let's see....5 horse field for the Grade 1 Hollywood Gold Cup....and a mega 4 horse field for the Swaps.....

Yup, NYRA is just the worst.

BTW, the Grade 1 Prioress looks like a kick ass race compared to the "marquee" events out west on Saturday....

[bigmack]

Speaking of 5 star racing, what do all the pundits on this thread (especially Mr. Hawk) think of the stellar fields they have lined up at Hollywood Park for this big weekend....
I'm not Mr. H but I trust you won't mind - then again you might.

Comparing the card from E/W is silly for you to even flop on the table.
With the exception of DLady that girlie run of the Prioress has the indications of a real yawn
all the while having to endure the wrath of four maiden runs, a couple of "so-whaties" and one race of interest.

I hope the nacho cheese is fresh from the machine for the brave who go to the track wondering why they didn't stay home and watch a good Elvis movie on the tube.

[the little guy]

With the exception of DLady that girlie run of the Prioress has the indications of a real yawn



This is one of the most laughably bad opinions I have read recently on the internet.

Not only is the Prioress obviously one of the most interesting and competitive Stakes races of the year, an evenly matched field of solid horses from all over the country, but you have managed to single out the one member of the nine horse field that has absolutely NO chance.

Impressive.

[linrom1]

I'm not Mr. H but I trust you won't mind - then again you might.

Comparing the card from E/W is silly for you to even flop on the table.
With the exception of DLady that girlie run of the Prioress has the indications of a real yawn
all the while having to endure the wrath of four maiden runs, a couple of "so-whaties" and one race of interest.

I hope the nacho cheese is fresh from the machine for the brave who go to the track wondering why they didn't stay home and watch a good Elvis movie on the tube.

At leat you can give the racing secretary in NY credit, after the first race you can call it a day.

[cj]

Where you going to bet after the 1st? How about Calder? What a stellar 13 race card they have today, on a Saturday! Here is the state with the second biggest breeding industry in the country, virtually no competition from neighboring tracks, and this is what we get:

1. 5k claimers, 6 betting interests
2. 6.5k claimers, 7 betting interests
3. MAIDEN, 8 betting interests
4. MAIDEN, 6 betting interests
5. 75k turf stake, 8 betting interests
6. MAIDEN, 8 betting interests
7. 16k turf claimers, NW3LT, 8 bettting interests
8. MAIDEN, 9 betting interests
9. MAIDEN, 9 betting interests
10. 10k claimers, NW2LT, 10 betting interests
11. MAIDEN, 9 betting interests
12. 10k claimers, NW2LT, 7 betting interests
13. MAIDEN, 8 betting interests

So, 13 races, 7 maiden races, 3 more for horses that have won no more than twice in bad claimers. Two are very cheap claimers, and one so so stake where the horses have very little turf experience.

Most of the maiden races horses have little or no running lines, or are going to a new surface.

Yeah, New York racing is terrible, I'll try Crc today. :rolleyes:

[bigmack]

Not only is the Prioress obviously one of the most interesting and competitive Stakes races of the year, an evenly matched field of solid horses from all over the country
Fillies going 6 with one G1 participant - hold me back.

[cj]

Fillies going 6 with one G1 participant - hold me back.

Since it is a G1 race, aren't they all G1 participants?

[DrugSalvastore]

Let's just hope it's better than last years running---when that monster Acey Deucey won under the great Diane Nelson.


I don't agree with TLG on Diplomat Lady being impossible. I actually thought she flashed some useful talent in some of her Cal races--and would appreciate a cut-back. I bet her when she won at KEE...and she won clear, but it was a very unimpressive win considering the speed friendly nature of the KEE dirt track. I really thought she could bury that field over that track.

I'm inclined to toss the Ky Oaks flop---the pace was fast, the race totally collapsed, and that was a track where the outside paths were better. Funky kind of race

Diplomat Lady has won her last two sprint races, and both times the 2nd place finsher went onto score a clear Graded Stakes victory in their next start. At or above her 6/1 morning line price, I think she looks ok. I happen to think she's better than her last two races suggest anyway.

[Tom]

Well, if your playing the 1st at Belmont, you are going deeper in to the card than I am. :sleeping:

Finger Lakes has a great card today.

[Zaf]

And at EVD tonight, 7 of the 10 races have 11 or MORE horses. I know they are cheapies, but the money spends the same ;)

Z

[bigmack]

And at EVD tonight, 7 of the 10 races have 11 or MORE horses.
So right Zaf - and the first 4 are 7F which appear to be confounding to the locals.

[PaceAdvantage]

Wow, talk about egg on my face. They have to change the scratch rules when it comes to stakes races in NY. Basically, trainers can scratch their horse for any reason up to about an hour before post time (I'm not exact on the time...someone can correct me).

This afternoon at Belmont, they ran the Missy's Mirage overnight stakes as the 3rd race. This race had NINE horses entered (one coupling, so EIGHT betting interests), and IT SCRATCHES DOWN TO FREAKIN' TWO HORSES.....A DAMN MATCH RACE!!!!!

Are you kidding me? The weather in NY is fine. The track is fast. And they scratch down to TWO. And the race goes off as a non wagering event....

My apologies to Hollywood Park, as what happened in NY today is just plain embarrassing.

One has to think that there may be more to this than meets the eye....but I wouldn't know what it is....

I'll say it once more:

ARE YOU KIDDING ME?

[Tom]

I heard BRIS is only to charge $0.80 for Belmont files.:liar:

Yeah, something is up - it sucs and Belmont is off my download list until they start acting like a racetrack again.

Like Zaf says, and I agree - those so called cheap tracks often have far better racing than the so called major tracks.

Meanwhile, at HOL, the two big 3yos from the derby trail both get beat in a 4 horse race. Good thing it wasn't a full field - they might not have hit the board!

[shanta]

And at EVD tonight, 7 of the 10 races have 11 or MORE horses. I know they are cheapies, but the money spends the same ;)

Z

Man's got a good point.
Go head "Zaf" :)

:jump: :jump:

Rich

[PaceAdvantage]

Meanwhile, at HOL, the two big 3yos from the derby trail both get beat in a 4 horse race. Good thing it wasn't a full field - they might not have hit the board!

Damn, I didn't even bother looking at the race, even though I absolutely detest A.P. Warrior, and by default Point Determined, since he barely got by A.P. Warrior last time out. I was hoping that either of these two would go elsewhere as betting favorites, to a race with a fuller field, thereby giving me more value to bet against.

I guess even I underestimated their combined "degree of suckiness", although the winner of the race only paid $6.80, so I really didn't miss much today.

But the cat is out of the bag now about how truly mediocre these two horses are, especially A.P. Warrior, who I've slammed since before the Derby....

[bigmack]

This afternoon at Belmont, they ran the Missy's Mirage overnight stakes as the 3rd race. This race had NINE horses entered (one coupling, so EIGHT betting interests), and IT SCRATCHES DOWN TO FREAKIN' TWO HORSES.....A DAMN MATCH RACE!!!!!
What was the deal? It was like mutiny en masse with the scratches.
Or like some kids on the playground "if he not racing then i'm not..."

[Tom]

I guess even I underestimated their combined "degree of suckiness"...

:lol: I gotta remeber that one! It says it all! :lol:

[cj]

Why no betting on the match race?

[Tom]

I was going to ask that - YouBet has odds on the board for the two of them but no payouts?????

So you get an ALL for the P4, then a dead heat in the 4th to boot!

It's like hockey - everyone goes to the playoffs:lol:

[Suff]

and the favorite lost by 6 or so lenghths to. Mike Smith was beating the crapola out his mount at the 16th pole...and I thought..wtf is he doing? Sure enough , horse comes back and wins going away. was 12-1 on the ML before the scratch-fest.


Embarrasing situation..... 8 scratch to 3....and 3 scratch to 2 at the gate no less...!! jiminey....

races 65 grand added......I don't understand the issue. You pay to get in...a tiny price...but still. why enter if you don't want to run. Everybody back there nose who will go in these 65K'rs. :confused:

[Zman179]

Wow, talk about egg on my face. They have to change the scratch rules when it comes to stakes races in NY. Basically, trainers can scratch their horse for any reason up to about an hour before post time (I'm not exact on the time...someone can correct me).

This afternoon at Belmont, they ran the Missy's Mirage overnight stakes as the 3rd race. This race had NINE horses entered (one coupling, so EIGHT betting interests), and IT SCRATCHES DOWN TO FREAKIN' TWO HORSES.....A DAMN MATCH RACE!!!!!

Are you kidding me? The weather in NY is fine. The track is fast. And they scratch down to TWO. And the race goes off as a non wagering event....

My apologies to Hollywood Park, as what happened in NY today is just plain embarrassing.

One has to think that there may be more to this than meets the eye....but I wouldn't know what it is....

I'll say it once more:

ARE YOU KIDDING ME?

This is why I prefer betting the trotters. Every stake race draws a full field, you get very few scratches if the track comes up sloppy, you never have to worry about a race coming off the turf, and a five horse field is an oddity. I've really started loathing playing the flats.

[The Hawk]

I know a lot has happened since I last posted in this thread, but...

Aside from being shut down, how's the racing been at Monmouth this year?

No question, PA, Monmouth has been awful. High degree of suckiness. But the way the quality has decreased there over the years I don't know if anybody expects much from that place anymore. On the other hand, this thread was started by someone who still thinks Belmont offers a superior betting product.

The racing quality has been dreadful at most major circuits. Even Kentucky, which usually offers the best product around, has been sub-par. Which is why these guys are right about tracks like EVD: Full fields mean better value. The quality isn't as good as some of the better tracks, of course, but would you rather bet a 10-horse claimer or a 2-horse stakes race? Wait, you can't bet a 2-horse stakes race...

[Tom]

Although the United Nations today was a good race, and I'll take 2-1 on a horse like that.
And Hollywood has been a dream today.
There is life south and west of Elmont.

[Dave]

I really liked that 3rd at belmont today, so I was pretty pissed when they scratched the entire field until that gate scratch, which just made it funny.
something's up w/that --- I find it hard to believe a whole field just decides to coincidentally scratch.
never seen anything like that.

[Dave]

I was going to ask that - YouBet has odds on the board for the two of them but no payouts?????

So you get an ALL for the P4, then a dead heat in the 4th to boot!

It's like hockey - everyone goes to the playoffs:lol:


no betting on 2 horse races in ny.
I was really rooting for one more gate scratch.

[bigmack]

This is why I prefer betting the trotters..
And you can easily see how your selection is doing cause they have numbers on the top of their heads.
My, they must feel silly with those on.