Forcing a Democracy to become Communist

[Secretariat]

GW hypocrisy is in full force today. All we've been hearing is about the freedom and democracy of the Iraqi people. Americans have put down their lives for this process correct? Well, Chiang Kai Chek - roll over in your grave. It appears in a democracy since WW II, Taiwan, Washington is abandoning our promise for people to live in freedom, and want Taiwan to unify with commie China. I don't know how the guy sleeps at night anymore.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060227/ts_afp/taiwanchinapolitics

TAIPEI (AFP) - Taiwan's President Chen Shui-bian scrapped an advisory council on unifying the island with China, a move that Beijing has warned would set off a serious crisis in the region.

The decision to shut down the National Unification Council (NUC) and to scrap symbolic guidelines on possible reunification with mainland China came despite pressure against the move from Taiwan's close ally Washington."The National Unification Council will cease functioning and the budget no longer be appropriated," said the pro-independence Chen, an outspoken critic of Beijing's claim of sovereignty over the island.

"The National Unification Guidelines will also cease to apply," Chen told reporters after a meeting of Taiwan's top security agency, the National Security Council.

Chen said the decision had been prompted by "China's persistent military threat and its attempts to use non-peaceful means to unilaterally change the status quo in the Taiwan Strait."

China has stockpiled at least 700 ballistic missiles targeting Taiwan and repeatedly threatens to invade the island if it should move towards declaring formal independence.

The decision to abolish the council and the guidelines will take effect on Tuesday.

The US, which does not support Taiwanese independence and opposes unilateral changes to the status quo by either Taiwan or Beijing, had also pressed Chen not to get scrap the council, fearing the prospect of a military showdown.

Chen defended the controversial decision, saying "what we are doing today is to safeguard freedom, democracy, human rights and peace of the status quo, to protect the right of free choice of the 23 million Taiwan people."

[PaceAdvantage]

And you know this isn't just window dressing by Washington because........?????

What is said in public isn't necessarily what is so....been that way for at least a number of decades.....

[GaryG]

This is strictly for Commie consumption. Every few years they rattle the sabres at Taiwan, which they still claim in the same way Saddam claimed Kuwait. Not important at all. :sleeping:

[kenwoodallpromos]

Stop lying, Sec:
From NYU-
:


Clinton's Turnaround on Taipei Policy
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

By Richard Halloran
Global Beat Issue Brief No. 40, July 14, 1998
Copyright 1998*, Center for War, Peace and the News Media

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

President Bill Clinton's nine-day visit to the People's Republic of China earlier this month was a success in public relations, resulted in a few substantive agreements, but distinctly altered American diplomatic posture in Asia to favor China.

Fundamentally, Mr. Clinton was the first U.S. president to accept Beijing's concept on the issue of sovereignty over Taiwan, the island nation of 21 million people who consider themselves independent but that Beijing claims is a province of China. Beijing has called on Taiwan to "face realities," a demand quickly rejected by Taipei."

[Light]

Is this guy confused or what?

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/74252/george_w_bush/

[Secretariat]

Stop lying, Sec:
From NYU-
:


Clinton's Turnaround on Taipei Policy
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

By Richard Halloran
Global Beat Issue Brief No. 40, July 14, 1998
Copyright 1998*, Center for War, Peace and the News Media

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

President Bill Clinton's nine-day visit to the People's Republic of China earlier this month was a success in public relations, resulted in a few substantive agreements, but distinctly altered American diplomatic posture in Asia to favor China.

Fundamentally, Mr. Clinton was the first U.S. president to accept Beijing's concept on the issue of sovereignty over Taiwan, the island nation of 21 million people who consider themselves independent but that Beijing claims is a province of China. Beijing has called on Taiwan to "face realities," a demand quickly rejected by Taipei."

I could give a rats ass what Clinton said. In fact Republicans in Congress denounced that statment soundly.

http://www.taiwandc.org/nws-9927.htm

"Mr. President, although the issues between Taiwan and China are complex, the simple truth is that Taiwan is a democracy and a friend of the United States, while the People's Republic of China is neither. Our policy must be based on this vital distinction.

We look forward to receiving your timely response. Sincerely,

Jesse Helms, Trent Lott, Paul Coverdell, Connie Mack "

So Repubs soundly criticized Clinton for that remark, and GW did as well. in fact he openly sold arms to Taiwan in 2001 to defend themsevles from a Chinese invasion, and said:

"The Chinese must understand that we have got common interests.
"But there is going to be some areas where we disagree and, evidently, one area where we disagree is whether or not the United States ought to provide defensive arms for Taiwan, which I have done," Bush said.

The 1979 Taiwan Relations Act, states that the US would do what was necessary to preserve freedom in Taiwan.

Once upon a time, Bush understood the morality of that course. Shortly after coming to office, in April 2001, the president said in a television interview that America had an obligation to do “whatever it took” to help Taiwan defend itself. "Whatever it takes" We've heard that before from him.

Kendall, it is pure hypocrisy when the President renenges on his promise from 2001 to preserve freedom and democracy in Taiwan. Clinton has nothing to do with GW's promise. My post was not on Clinton, it was on GW's hypocrisy.

Go back and read it. You can't speak out agaisnt tyranny in iraq claiming democracy and freedom is the answer, while compelling a current democracy to become communist. It IS hypocrisy.

[GaryG]

You can't speak out agaisnt tyranny in iraq claiming democracy and freedom is the answer, while compelling a current democracy to become communist. It IS hypocrisy.The only reason China didn't take Taiwan back long ago was because they knew that we wouldn't let them. The Taiwanese are not losing any sleep over this and nobody else should either. You need to find something else to do with your time...really.

[kenwoodallpromos]

"The US, which does not support Taiwanese independence and opposes unilateral changes to the status quo by either Taiwan or Beijing, had also pressed Chen not to get scrap the council, fearing the prospect of a military showdown."
You are the one who said Taiwan has been a Democracy all this time- and this article says the official US policy (which the President makes through the State Department, not Congress) under Bush is to "oppose unilataeral changes to the status quo".
Either you or I do not understand what "status quo" means- or only read into thing what we want. I understand what I read!

[Secretariat]

"The US, which does not support Taiwanese independence and opposes unilateral changes to the status quo by either Taiwan or Beijing, had also pressed Chen not to get scrap the council, fearing the prospect of a military showdown."
You are the one who said Taiwan has been a Democracy all this time- and this article says the official US policy (which the President makes through the State Department, not Congress) under Bush is to "oppose unilataeral changes to the status quo".
Either you or I do not understand what "status quo" means- or only read into thing what we want. I understand what I read!

And you failed to read this:

Chen said the decision had been prompted by "China's persistent military threat and its attempts to use non-peaceful means to unilaterally change the status quo in the Taiwan Strait."

Kendall, GW's hypocrisy of fostering democracy and freedom in Iraq while hindering that progress in Taiwan is the height of hypocrisy. And that my friend, is no lie.

[JustRalph]

:sleeping: :sleeping: :sleeping:

[Tom]

But the question remains - is China were to do something, what would we do?
China would be nuts to do anyhting, though - they way Bush allows them to walk all over us now, making billions from tier illegal activities with virtually no change WE will ever grow balls enough to say squat about it.
Why go to war with someone you have already conquered???

[kenwoodallpromos]

Sorry, Sec- 700 missles aimed at Taiwan and 1 billion people and 50 years of real "attempts" and China cannot get the job done if they really wanted to?LOL!! We are buying peace 99 cents at a time!LOL!!

[Secretariat]

Sorry, Sec- 700 missles aimed at Taiwan and 1 billion people and 50 years of real "attempts" and China cannot get the job done if they really wanted to?LOL!! We are buying peace 99 cents at a time!LOL!!

Sorry, kendall. It is only the deterrence of the US that keeps those missles aimed at Taiwan from China in check. When GW abandons that deterrence and abandons Taiwans pursuit of freedom which the 1999 Republican Congress affirmed in their letter to Clinton, and which GW also affirmed when he sold weapons to Taiwan promising them stability, it is hypocrisy.

You do realize the population of Taiwan is 22,894,384 people. The population of Iraq is 26,074,906. Not that much difference. The difference is the people of Taiwan alread have a democracy in place which they've had for years. When GW can abandon Taiwan to commie China while advocating the need for a democracy in an Islamic cleric state it is the height of hypocrisy.

Besides you need to read the Taiwan Security Enhancement Act, which Jesse Helms was even a co-sponsor of. Is GW going to ignore this as well?

http://usinfo.org/sino/taiwan_enhance.htm

[GaryG]

Sorry, kendall. It is only the deterrence of the US that keeps those missles aimed at Taiwan from China in check. When GW abandons that deterrence and abandons Taiwans pursuit of freedom which the 1999 Republican Congress affirmed in their letter to Clinton, and which GW also affirmed when he sold weapons to Taiwan promising them stability, it is hypocrisy. Sorry sec, as much as you would love for this to happen it will not. We are not about to abandon Taiwan who has been a valuable trading partner for a long time. You are more naive than I thought....well maybe not.

[Secretariat]

Sorry sec, as much as you would love for this to happen it will not. We are not about to abandon Taiwan who has been a valuable trading partner for a long time. You are more naive than I thought....well maybe not.

Where do you get the idea I would love this to happen? I'm adamantly opposed to it happening. Go back and read the orginal article at the beginning of the thread. You're off track.

[Tom]

If China decided to "swallow up" Taiwin, it appears we are committed to not allow it to happen.

My question is, what would we/could we do about it? this is a scenario not likely to happen until China has finished feeding off our economy, but at some point, we have to have the answer to this. Unlike us, China has a definate long term plan for THIER homeland security - and it includes destryoing us. Think not?