Do offshore books co-mingle Pk4 wagers

[Light]

Was playing Penn Nationals late Pk4 tonight. Bunch of bombs. But I was alive in the last leg with 2 horses. It was paying almost 2k for $1 to one of my horses. The other one(#7) was a price and it was only paying $327 for a buck. Should be paying at least 5k. But this low payout was because it was paying on 3 out of 4.

The point is I was alive to the #7 and Penn's pool was not recognizing that someone (me) could get 4 out of 4 with that horse. I used an offshore account. I never realized that you could get royally screwed if the offshore service doesnt co-mingle their customers bets with the host track. Luckily my #7 finished 2nd. But this is an enormous reason to watch who you bet with.

[dav4463]

Shouldn't the offshore pay the same amount that the track pays no matter how many people hit it through the offshore account? Or would that destroy the offshore book if a big one hits and the offshore has to pay it out more than once? I guess I don't really understand how the offshore books work.

[Dave Schwartz]

I believe that one of our members here told me once that on a no-hit at the track, Pinnacle keeps 20% and gives him the rest of the pool (up to the posted max, of course). (Perhaps he had negotiated a deal.)


Regards,
Dave Schwartz

[Light]

Having the offshore book pay what the track pays is not the point

My point is that If I had 4 out of 4 in the pk4 ,I was only going to get a 3 of 4 payout instead of the whole pk4 pool because my bet is not co-mingled with the host track.

[Light]

Another way to look at this is say an offshore account lets you bet on the BC pk6 races,like Pinnacle does. Say there are 3 lucky players with Pinnacle's Pk6 pool who pick all 6. And say no one from the host track pool picks 6.

If Pinnacle did not comingle their customers pk6 bets with the host track,those bets did not exist as far as the host track is concerned.. Now these 3 players are shorted several million dollars because the offshore book will only pay them the host track payout of 5 of 6. Same goes for Pk4's. That is a steep price to pay for an offshore account.

[AngelEyes]

Was playing Penn Nationals late Pk4 tonight. Bunch of bombs. But I was alive in the last leg with 2 horses. It was paying almost 2k for $1 to one of my horses. The other one(#7) was a price and it was only paying $327 for a buck. Should be paying at least 5k. But this low payout was because it was paying on 3 out of 4.

The point is I was alive to the #7 and Penn's pool was not recognizing that someone (me) could get 4 out of 4 with that horse. I used an offshore account. I never realized that you could get royally screwed if the offshore service doesnt co-mingle their customers bets with the host track. Luckily my #7 finished 2nd. But this is an enormous reason to watch who you bet with.

What happened here is exactly what one would want .... ie. that offshore service does not piggyback your bet. At pinnacle (see rule below) you would have received 80% of total pk4 pool if the 7 would have won.

Rule 6:
If the track payout on a race pays to ALL on Supers/Trifectas, pays out 2 of 3 on a Pick 3, or 3 of 4 on a Pick 4, and the Pinnacle Sports client's wager has the exact ticket, the customer will be paid out the whole pool minus the takeout percentage. If pool information is not available, the payout will be 3x's the consolation payout. If takeout information is not available, it will default to 20%. If paid out the whole pool, consolation payouts on the same race will not apply. All normal track limits are still applicable.

[Dave Schwartz]

Light,

If they give you the entire pool, you have the equivilent of getting it yourself at the track.


Dave

[Buddha]

Light,

If they give you the entire pool, you have the equivilent of getting it yourself at the track.


Dave

Along with not having to file with the IRS if you don't want to.

[RaceIsClosed]

Light,

If they give you the entire pool, you have the equivilent of getting it yourself at the track.


Dave

The ideal situation is to have a winning ticket offshore with only one winner on track. Then you are literally doubling your payout.

I know Pinnacle doesn't take pick-3s at Philadelphia Park, likely because it's too easy to nail them this way (the pools for this wager are usually about $2-5k).

[Sailwolf]

Along with not having to file with the IRS if you don't want to.



Take it from a tax CPA, if you do not file with the IRS, it's fraud (criminal if the IRS finds out)

[Light]

Thanks for the info. I did not realize Pinnacle was that generous. Allthough I have an account with Pinnacle,I used another offshore account that I allways have problems with. This Pk4 paid on 3 out of 4,which I had,and they so far have not paid me .They say I need 4 out of 4. I said no one on the planet had 4 of 4 so it paid on 3. No comprende.

On another note, I have become too paranoid of disputes with online account holders(domestic and offshore) and can no longer trust them with potential large payouts. So Whenever I play SA Pk6 carryovers,I go to the track. I once hit a super with an an online outfit and 15 minutes after it became official,all traces of that bet dissapeared off the screen.There was suddenly no record of me having bet it. It took 2 weeks to resolve.

[Buddha]

Take it from a tax CPA, if you do not file with the IRS, it's fraud (criminal if the IRS finds out)

I wasnt saying that it was legal or ethical to do, but possible.

[Bala]

From time to time there is a lot of talk on this board of Pinnacle. As if they
are a monopoly. I find their software clumsy at times. For the recreational
player I find http://www.betcris.com/ to have excellent customer services and
fast payouts. As for rebates, you have to ask. Not everyone advertises.

For the large player, http://www.jazzsports.com/ is highly professional.
Jazz will take 10dime plays on the NHL. To the best of my knowledge, no
one else takes that much on hockey. However, Jazz does commingle on the
ponies.


I have no affiliation with the above - only real world experience.

_________________________________________
Outsource congress to India.

[Valuist]

CRIS has been one of the biggest offshores for years but I've never heard of Jazzsports before. I wonder if they were under a different name in the past. I didn't see anything about horse racing on their site.

[garyoz]

For the large player, http://www.jazzsports.com/ is highly professional.
Jazz will take 10dime plays on the NHL. To the best of my knowledge, no
one else takes that much on hockey.


Even post-Gretsky they take huge NHL action? Jazzsports has been around for several years. I never used them, but have heard good things about them. I think they are based in Costa Rica.

[GMB@BP]

CRIS has been one of the biggest offshores for years but I've never heard of Jazzsports before. I wonder if they were under a different name in the past. I didn't see anything about horse racing on their site.


interesting, with Pinnacle going to 4% on NYRA, as a mostly exotics player this is appealing, 8% is pretty solid.

[Bala]

CRIS has been one of the biggest offshores for years but I've never heard of Jazzsports before. I wonder if they were under a different name in the past. I didn't see anything about horse racing on their site.
__________________________________________________ _____

No Jazz has always been Jazz. In fact before there was Sasan Bala there was
Jazz. http://tinyurl.com/awagj

Jazz has been catering to large players since the beginning of the offshore
craze. Unlike nine.com, some choose a low profile and remain under the radar.
For those in the NYC tristate area, Jazz has runners that will pay you in person.
Also, the runners can set up an account for you without wiring $$$ offshore thus
insuring privacy.

__________________________________________________ _
Outsource congress to India.