Daily Racing form price increase?

[andicap]

does anyone know when the DRF's 50 cent price increase ($5.50 at least off-track) kicks in?

[maxwell]

ASAP :D

You know what they say about death and ... :mad:

[GaryG]

But it used to cost 35 cents....

[rokitman]

$5.50?! Those people have no shame.

[andicap]

I don't know -- its a pretty good deal still. Funny how people who will bet $100 or more a day will complain over 50 cents. Besides I figure their strategy is to steer more people online where they don't have paper costs.

Do you people know how expensive paper is? And they have to circulate 40,000 papers NATIONALLY. The Wall Street Journal is national, sure but with 2 million readers has the economics of scale the DRF lacks.

I suspect people on this site don't know a lot about the newspaper publishing business. Well, it's my business so I know what they're up against.

Also, unlike most papers the DRF relies on circulation instead of advertising for most of its revenues. The Internet is becoming a bigger part but they still need to grow. And the DRF no longer accepts ads from off-shore books -- The Sporting News got whacked with a $7.2 million settlement recently for doing so.

Whatever you think of the paper, the Formulator 4 is a good product and couldn't be developed if revenues hadn't been growing. I think the DRF gets a bad rap, partly because horseplayers just like to grumble, partly because of its history, and partly because of its (justly) well-criticized customer service operation.
And its lack of pace figures.

(Wait we don't want everyone to have access to pace figures.)

[PaceAdvantage]

They're still accepting offshore ads on their website (Sportsbook.com)

[Valuist]

And the DRF has gotten smaller in the past two years. There's very little room to write notes in there. Maybe the NTRA should help subsidize them if it would mean keeping the price reasonable ($2 or $2.50 IMO). A new player goes to the track, pays admission, parking, $5.50 for a Form. He's out $15-20 before he starts to bet. $5.50 is out of line (as is $5) IMO.

As for printing it up online, that's fine if one can do it from work. But at home, it really sucks up the ink.

[twindouble]

I don't know -- its a pretty good deal still. Funny how people who will bet $100 or more a day will complain over 50 cents. Besides I figure their strategy is to steer more people online where they don't have paper costs.

Do you people know how expensive paper is? And they have to circulate 40,000 papers NATIONALLY. The Wall Street Journal is national, sure but with 2 million readers has the economics of scale the DRF lacks.

I suspect people on this site don't know a lot about the newspaper publishing business. Well, it's my business so I know what they're up against.

Also, unlike most papers the DRF relies on circulation instead of advertising for most of its revenues. The Internet is becoming a bigger part but they still need to grow. And the DRF no longer accepts ads from off-shore books -- The Sporting News got whacked with a $7.2 million settlement recently for doing so.

Whatever you think of the paper, the Formulator 4 is a good product and couldn't be developed if revenues hadn't been growing. I think the DRF gets a bad rap, partly because horseplayers just like to grumble, partly because of its history, and partly because of its (justly) well-criticized customer service operation.
And its lack of pace figures.

(Wait we don't want everyone to have access to pace figures.)

I agree, it's still the best buy out there but I haven't figured out what the PP's cost me after ink and paper because I'd would buy them anyway.

T.D.

[First_Place]

My "racing form" of choice is the Daily Racing Program. At $3.00 a copy and covering ALL tracks running that particular day, it's the best bang for the buck (x 3).

Regards,

FP

[Doc]

As a former DRF employee, I know that the paper USED TO make a huge profit every year. That's when it was still owned by Triangle Publications. It's been sold several times since, and, while I'm not sure if it's still as profitable, I do know that they pay their writers very fat salaries. The whole newspaper industry is struggling right now, and in most cases an ailing paper will offer employees buyouts or reduce their staff to cut costs. Instead of hitting horseplayers with a price increase, I say why not lop off some of the staff writers...many of them only re-write press releases, anyway. This is especially true for the guys that cover the Mid-Atlantic tracks - Delaware, Philly, Penn, etc. Sometimes there isn't even a quote in the stories. The guys in New York and California are much better, but they, too, rely upon the daily Barn Notes for their writing fodder. Here's an even better idea - get rid of the writers altogether and just publish past performances. You can get all the racing news you need from BloodHorse.com and Thoroughbred Times.

[takeout]

Here's an even better idea - get rid of the writers altogether and just publish past performances.
:ThmbUp:

[Milleruszk]

As for printing it up online, that's fine if one can do it from work. But at home, it really sucks up the ink.[/QUOTE]

For $100. you can get yourself a B/W laser printer and print 2000-5000 pages for about $75. It used to cost me much much more to keep my inkjet in ink.
Get yourself a laser and swipe the paper from work. ;)

[BIG RED]

That's not a bad idea. I found myself over the years, more and more, just going to the pps and not even reading any of the articles.

[twindouble]

That's not a bad idea. I found myself over the years, more and more, just going to the pps and not even reading any of the articles.

Same here, can't remember the last time I read anything of any importance to me.

[Indulto]

Doc,
I take it you were not a writer during your tenure at DRF. Frankly, the columns by Bergstein, Beyer, Crist, Hovdey, and Jerardi and the reporting by Andersen, Grening, Hegarty, and Privman are worth the price alone. In general, more news of interest to horseplayers appears there than in the Blood Horse or Thoroughbred Times, though often the latter will go into more depth than DRF. The Letters to the DRF Editor is still the most widely accessed forum for horseplayer opinions. The expert selections have always been a valuable reality check and source of great amusement.

Andicap,
As a traditionalist raised on the Morning Telegraph who still abhors the West Coast format (but appreciated that it consumed fewer trees), I can’t imagine going to the track without it. As my vision declines, the print edition sure beats my Laserjet printouts.

Rockitman and Valuist,
The real shame is what $5.50 buys at track concessions. Free DRFs are among the most successful on-track promotions.



As they provide flexibility and considerable value on-line, I don't understand all the complaining.

P.S. I don’t own any DRF stock, but I sure wish I did.

[boxcar]

Doc,

Andicap,
[size=3]As a traditionalist raised on the Morning Telegraph who still abhors the West Coast format (but appreciated that it consumed fewer trees), I can’t imagine going to the track without it. As my vision declines, the print edition sure beats my Laserjet printouts.

Yikes! Morning Telegraph!? Never guessed you were of the Jurassic Park set. :D

Boxcar (Feelin' more youthful by the moment...)

[Indulto]

Yikes! Morning Telegraph!? Never guessed you were of the Jurassic Park set. :D
Box,
They didn't call it the "Bible" for nothing. Some people quoted Charles Hatten as if his columns were "scripture." ;)

[JackS]

I've tried to estamate the cost of the on-line edition. For anyone playing only one track, this is the most cost effective solution. For those playing and printing out two or more tracks ,the hard edition of DRF may be the best bargain.
I use the refill inkjet kits and not necessarily the kit designed for my printer but the ones that come with the most ink. The next time I buy paper, I'm going to consider the bulk boxes available at Wal-mart as this should also save on downloads. My estimation per download is about $2.50 which is about $1.25 in ink and paper.
As suggested above, I'm going to research the Laser printer idea and will also look forward to other ideas.

[JackS]

I forgot to ask- Anyone know how and where to purchase bulk ink? I wouldn't care if it were 8oz or a gallon this is the bulk of the cost of doing your own downloads.

[JustRalph]

Laser printer Now! If you are paying that much for Ink Jet printing , you are nuts.........get a laser. You can buy a color laser for under 400 bucks now.

[Vegas711]

Racetracks should follow Canterbury parks lead, if you buy 1 form( am edition ) at cby at the regular price you get a second( Pm edition ) for $ 1.00 this covers 12 tracks.


You can get a black and white Laser printer brother hl 1440 for less than 200 dollars at office max , I am able to print 5000 plus pages per ink cartrige it costs about a tenth of a cent per page.

[JackS]

Thanks guys, I'm going to get a laser printer.

[Valuist]

Jack-

http://www.cdw.com

[cj]

...And the DRF no longer accepts ads from off-shore books

I'm not sure about the legalities of it if TSN had to pay, but they sure haven't stopped. You can barely find the articles between the pictures of Brooke Burke.

[Doc]

[QUOTE=Indulto]Doc,
I take it you were not a writer during your tenure at DRF. Frankly, the columns by Bergstein, Beyer, Crist, Hovdey, and Jerardi and the reporting by Andersen, Grening, Hegarty, and Privman are worth the price alone.

Indulto,
Yes, I was a writer with DRF. But what I'm saying is one of the ways the paper can cut costs is to stop paying some of the obscene salaries...instead of passing on price increases to their customers.

Doc

[JackS]

I just ordered the 1440 from CDW. Only regret- I didn't have this info sooner.
Thanks again

[Indulto]

Doc,

Prior to the PC revolution, I used to feel that getting paid to write computer programs was like getting paid to solve crossword puzzles (any ALC/BAL practitioners will appreciate that). Since the advent of racing message boards like PA, I now know the real racket is getting paid to write about horse racing, especially when one’s opinion is involved.

I did get your point about cost savings, but what should be considered obscene? Do columnists get paid by the word? Is Beyer affordable because he is syndicated? What do you think they pay for his ratings?

It sure looks to me as if a lot of extra paper is used for advertisements that don’t appear on-line, and they don’t make it easy to physically separate PPs for individual tracks from one another.

If you’d be willing to share at least portions of something published of yours that you’re particularly pleased with, I’m sure that a lot of us here would appreciate it, but of course there’s no telling what Tom’s or toetoe’s reaction might be. :D

[toetoe]

I know *I* couldn't imagine. :) :ThmbUp: <<<<< That's a big toe. :D

[alysheba88]

I defended the Form for years but no more.

Never buy the paper form anymore and probably never will again. Nothing of value to add.

The Bris PP's are better. I can find better discussing of racing issues and betting strategies on various race forums, including this one. Where real horse players talk about real issues.

Not sure I follow all the stuff about printing pp's for those who bet download them online. Why print them? If I am going to the track or betting from somewhere other than my house I will print them, but if betting from home, which is something I do more and more now, I can just view on screen.

[Overlay]

But it used to cost 35 cents....

You've got me beat. I can only remember back to when the Form cost 50 cents.

[Buckeye]

I don't have $5.50 to my name. uh oh.

[rrpic6]

$5.50?! Those people have no shame.

Most likely its going to be reasoned as a "gasoline surcharge", as many companies are now doing, UPS, FedEX, and many others that use trucks to deliver their product.

[Milleruszk]

[QUOTE=JackS]I just ordered the 1440 from CDW. Only regret- I didn't have this info sooner.
Thanks again[/QUOTE

Good Luck with the laser. I got my Brother 1435 laser over a year ago. I used to use an HP inkjet. HP is got a real racket going. They have the cartridges rigged somehow so you can't use generic cartridges. They just don't work. HP sells inkjets for $50 but the replacement cartridges cost $50. It's probably cheaper to throw the printer out when it runs out of ink and buy a new one. :confused:

[Valuist]

Alysheba-

What about handicapping the day before or 2 days before? I can't imagine just winging it while the races are going on, not even printing them out.

[PaceAdvantage]

I'm not sure about the legalities of it if TSN had to pay, but they sure haven't stopped. You can barely find the articles between the pictures of Brooke Burke.

They've stopped putting them in the print edition....however, I hear this is because the tracks were pissed at DRF for promoting off shore wagering.

But it makes more sense, especially with the timing involved, that the Sporting News settlement of $7.2M has a lot more to do with DRF ditching the print offshore ads than a bunch of angry racetracks.

Of course, I could be wrong.

[alysheba88]

Alysheba-

What about handicapping the day before or 2 days before? I can't imagine just winging it while the races are going on, not even printing them out.

Well actually I cant imagine handicapping two days before myself. But thats another story. Not sure what one has to do with the other to be honest. Ie; what not printing it out has to do with winging it. I will generally look at the pp's the night before and start narrowing down the field. I have a one page betting sheet where I note my initial thoughts. On the opposite side of the sheet I track my actual bets (broken down my bet type, amount, class of race, distance, etc. I wait until scratches before updating anything on race day. Maybe look at some replays and recent track condition. And then wait for the odds on the horses I like before betting. The pp's being on my computer screen or being printed out on paper doesnt really effect any of this. I dont need to print out 20-30 pages of PP's when I can scroll down. Also Brisnet has a pp generator which lets you look at the pp's in a customized way of your choice. For example you could have the horses pp's shown in order of their running style, with speed horses listed first. And you can filter out horses that are throw outs and so on. I should also mention I create a play list basically summarizing the horses I am going to look to play for the day based on my proven strenghts and weaknesses.

When I made the transition from the Form to online pp's I too felt I had to print them out all the time. I realized it was more habit than anything. There was nothing I gained from printing them out, other than just doing it because I was used to that. That I could do my handicapping and betting just as easily, if not more easily with everything online. Toggling back and worth between the betting screen and my pp's.

Again, when I go to the track its another story. I am not going to log on my computer and bring it there. But even then I dont find it necessary to print every single page of the past performances if I have made my own odds line and made my general observations. One last thing I should mention, for better or worse I do zero percent handicapping after the first race starts. Well at least 95% of the time. My handicapping is done before the race day begins. All that remains is betting and looking at the odds. When I go to the track I will read a book more than I will be the pp's between races. I will look at the post parade and stuff but thats about it. Just dont feel the need to handicap between races.

[boxcar]

I've tried to estamate the cost of the on-line edition. For anyone playing only one track, this is the most cost effective solution. For those playing and printing out two or more tracks ,the hard edition of DRF may be the best bargain.
I use the refill inkjet kits and not necessarily the kit designed for my printer but the ones that come with the most ink. The next time I buy paper, I'm going to consider the bulk boxes available at Wal-mart as this should also save on downloads. My estimation per download is about $2.50 which is about $1.25 in ink and paper.
As suggested above, I'm going to research the Laser printer idea and will also look forward to other ideas.

Laser printers are the way to go for these kind of print jobs. I have an NEC printer, and I just recently bought their high volume toner cartridge (6,000 pages) for slightly over $120. This works out to 2 cents a page. (Unfotunately, the photoconducter on the unit is shot, so now I'll have to lay out about a $105. for it. But that's supposed to last for about 20,000 pages.)

And if you buy your paper in a master case (which I think is 10 reams) at an office supply house when it's on sale, that probably would work out to a little more than a penny a page. All in all, you can get really nice pp print jobs for probably under 5 cents a page. And if you have a parsimonious streak in you like I do, all you have to do is cherry-pick the races you want to print by prescreeing them on your monitor -- assuming you're a spot player. If not, ignore this money-saving strategy.

Boxcar

[dav4463]

I for one do not mind a picture of Brooke Burke !

[cj]

I for one do not mind a picture of Brooke Burke !

One is fine, but 6,248 per day is a bit much.

[Valuist]

Brooke is definitely MILF territory. But even too much of her gets overbearing.

Alysheba-

I do a lot of my handicapping on my train rides to work and at lunch, so I really have no choice but to print them out. To each his own, I guess.

[Doc]

Alysheba, I handicap much the same way you do. At first I felt compelled to print out the pps, but I stopped quickly due to the cost of the ink. So I download from Brisnet.com, save the pps to my computer, and toggle back and forth between the pps and a blank document where I'll type my picks and notes. I print out only the sheet with my notes. I don't do much handicapping at the track, just watch the opening odds, post parades, etc. Rarely if ever do I buy the Form anymore - usually just on Derby Day.

[Valuist]

My eyes would fry out if I did that. I don't like looking at the computer screen for more than 10 minutes at a time.

[GaryG]

And if you have a parsimonious streak in you like I do, all you have to do is cherry-pick the races you want to print by prescreeing them on your monitor -- assuming you're a spot player.I use the bris ultimates and also save some paper by not printing the summary after each race. It is a liile bit of a hassle to make so many print jobs but at the end of the year you save a lot of paper.

[alysheba88]

My eyes would fry out if I did that. I don't like looking at the computer screen for more than 10 minutes at a time.

I look at one all day long in my job so I am used to it, lol. But I know what you mean

[boxcar]

I use the bris ultimates and also save some paper by not printing the summary after each race. It is a liile bit of a hassle to make so many print jobs but at the end of the year you save a lot of paper.

I don't know how you guys do it with these hoidy toidy, very busy looking data files. After looking at that race that How Cliche linked us to on the Long Shot thread, my eyes were popping out of my head. :) Way too much data on one page...for me. Just give me the raw pp data in its traditional format without all the window dressing, frills, and bells and whistles.

It's no wonder some here are concerned about printing costs. I would be too.
:D

Boxcar

[Doc]

I agree that some past performance formats - like the Bris Ultimate pps, for instance - contain way too much info. All of those jockey & trainer percentages, etc. makes my head swim. Remember back in the 60's and 70's when the pps in the Form were so simple? Horses that liked an off-track only had an "X" after their names...

I guess more info is better, but what bettors forget is that horses feel pain and get sick and can't communicate very well with their trainers and jockeys...and all the data in the world won't make you a winner if the horse doesn't follow through.

Doc

[Vegas711]

My eyes would fry out if I did that. I don't like looking at the computer screen for more than 10 minutes at a time.


Me too, the computer screen is hard on your eyes. I remember when I was 10 years old my mom would constantly tell me not to sit so close to the television, that doing so would hurt my eye sight,that was then when i would sit 3 feet away from the TV now my computer screen is less than 1 foot from my face.

[andicap]

Emailed the DRF and it turns out at least the Northeast will remain at $5. It was worded to say in my zip code the price would remain the same. They didn't say about anywhere else.

Has the price gone up anywhere? I swear I read about some price increase somewhere but maybe I imagined it.

[Alan Wight]

Has the price gone up anywhere? I swear I read about some price increase somewhere but maybe I imagined it.

The California edition increased 50 cents late last year. The off-track cover price ($4.50) is still lower than the East Coast edition, but the newstand where I pick it up adds on anther 50 cents to make it an even 5 bucks.

[JohnGalt1]

When I started actually handicapping races in 1989, (the first two years were with friends using the newspaper handicappers) the Form was $1.50 but that was before simulcasting in Minnesota. So at $5.00+ we get 4 or more tracks.

I switched to downloading the Form from Bris because I got tired of waiting at convenience stores at 3 AM or hanging around for hours for the delivery truck because I need to handicap ahead of time, sometimes cards are available 3 days ahead of time.

To save money I get the Premium pps for $1.00 per card. I usually play 3 when I go.

I use their pp generator which allows me to print the form the way I want. I don't print the Bris pace figures, (I make my own.) and I don't print the comapny line.

I also print with the draft setting giving me 3 times as many copies as regular. I handicap at my desk with a good light so reading the lighter print isn't a problem.

At work I collect old sheets of survey paper, (I work for a sales company) that are blank on one side. It saves me a couple bucks per 500 sheets.

It did take awhile to get used to not using the Form, but now I like the 8.5 X 11.5 sheets better on my desk and they fit in my folder I take to the track better.

[alysheba88]

Dont understand the idea of "too much info" in regard to Bris (or anyone). Just disregard what YOU think is too much

[JackS]

I might be old fashioned but I still like to see the TR/VAR in the DRF. Also I like to compare these ratings with the Beyer number. I can either accept these ratings or disregard them but I still like to see them.
I do use the Bris Form from time to time but old habits are hard to break.
There is quite a bit more info with Bris and maybe in time I will be able to wean myself away from the DRF. Time will tell.

[PaceAdvantage]

BTW, I stand corrected about the DRF and the removal of offshore ads from their print edition. Apparently, this happened a while ago....well before the Sporting News settlement....

[GeTydOn]

Buyouts and layoffs are common in the newspaper industry. Costs of newspapers have gone up through the years. But it seems like the Racing Form has gone up ten-fold in comparison to other daily papers. Too bad if horseplayers are going to grumble about the increase in cost. It shouldn't matter whether they are putting $1 or $1,000 down on a race. Sitting quietly by as prices continue to escalate is like saying "thank you sir may I have another". Let these companies go back to the drawing board and figure creative ways to avoid increasing the burden on the customer.

[twindouble]

Buyouts and layoffs are common in the newspaper industry. Costs of newspapers have gone up through the years. But it seems like the Racing Form has gone up ten-fold in comparison to other daily papers. Too bad if horseplayers are going to grumble about the increase in cost. It shouldn't matter whether they are putting $1 or $1,000 down on a race. Sitting quietly by as prices continue to escalate is like saying "thank you sir may I have another". Let these companies go back to the drawing board and figure creative ways to avoid increasing the burden on the customer.

I never have a problem paying more for a good product, ESP one I can make money with. To me it's cheap by todays standards.

Another example is, Hellmann's Mayo and Hinz Ketchup if they screw those two up I'll be fit to be tied. Wouldn't care if they charged more.

B@M baked beans turned into water along with Motts Apple water sauce, don't buy them anymore. :mad:

[Zman179]

I'm the same as twindouble, I do not mind at all paying extra for a premium product; however, what the DRF is asking borders on being larcenous. $5.50 for a newspaper filled with information that generally comes from a third party (equibase) and that is available elsewhere (internet, most track programs) for a whole lot less? While the DRF is better than any publication in the world (when comparing worldwide racing journals,) it is still extremely overpriced.

If the DRF was still producing their own past performances like they had in the past, then I could see paying that kind of money for it. But they no longer do that, they've sold that part of the company off (a few years ago,) and they never passed along any of the savings to their customers. In other words, you're no longer paying for the information, you're paying for the brand-name.

[rokitman]

And if you are a regular player, you've already bought most of the information that you're getting for your $5.50. Over and over and over and over...

At the OTB's near me there is commonly 5 tracks for $5. But 1 or 2 of the tracks are often not available to play, although there is now 10 + tracks that are available to play.

Just went and looked at the "Daily Plan" for online DRF. $3.50 for 3 tracks. $1 per additional track. So, $5.50 for 5 tracks. No paper, no ink, no delivery, no middleman...but still the same price, and even a little higher, as I would pay for the print version at OTB. What a focking joke.

Best of luck to whoever can rationalize being robbed by that obsolete parasitic rag.

[JulieKrone]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valuist
My eyes would fry out if I did that. I don't like looking at the computer screen for more than 10 minutes at a time.

Vegas711 (http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/member.php?u=1684);
Me too, the computer screen is hard on your eyes. I remember when I was 10 years old my mom would constantly tell me not to sit so close to the television, that doing so would hurt my eye sight,that was then when i would sit 3 feet away from the TV now my computer screen is less than 1 foot from my face.
__________________

Never been proven-- that and a slew of such:
Excess you-know-what causes blindness, you-know-what before a sporting event decreases performance, excess salt is bad, spice bad for stomach, rain/bathing/cold liquids cause or are bad for colds, wash hair every day it falls out, sun causes cancer, replacement hormones in women cause cancer. I could go on forever, it got so bad I had to run away from my house at 14 I couldn't take it anymore.

[Indulto]

Originally posted by JackS:
I might be old fashioned but I still like to see the TR/VAR in the DRF. Also I like to compare these ratings with the Beyer number. I can either accept these ratings or disregard them but I still like to see them. I do use the Bris Form from time to time but old habits are hard to break. There is quite a bit more info with Bris and maybe in time I will be able to wean myself away from the DRF. Time will tell.JS,

You are not alone in your time capsule. I too am glad that DRF retained the old speed ratings I grew up with despite adding the Beyer figures. Whenever I encounter another “mature” horseplayer with a form open (and I can be unobtrusive about it) I glance at the way it is marked up, and guess what? More often than not, the highest ratings in both columns are circled!

I only play the higher purse races on weekends/holidays, and it is not unusual for me to catch a non-favorite winner with one or more 90+ TRs higher than their corresponding Beyers. This is especially true of sprints. The variant helps me identify “ouchy” horses to avoid on fast California tracks.


My younger cronies refer to the "Form" as DOF (Data for Old Farts).

[GaryG]

The variant helps me identify “ouchy” horses to avoid on fast California tracks.


My younger cronies refer to the "Form" as DOF (Data for Old Farts).I make my own variants and have never looked closely at those in the DRF but one overlooked use of varants is this: Many horses run their best (or worst) races on certain kinds of tracks and only accurate variants will give you this info. Especially in CA when the tracks are often like a paved highway. To the casual player the races are all on a "fast" track, but we know better.

[Tom]

Good point, GaryG. Not so much anymore, but in years past, there were major differences in the track itself at FL during April/May, Oct/Nov as compared to July August.

The deeper track favored certain horses, the hard track favored a different group.

My variants and speed figs could equate the performances but not the horses. I used to have a list of "deep track" horses and "hard track" horses.

Nowadays, track maintainance has pretty much smoothed out the real extremes of the good ole days. You never see a sloppy trak like we used to have. *sigh*