Mountaineer Jumped the Shark?

[michiken]

While watching Mountaineer last night, I could not help but notice the small chalky fields.

Mountaineer used to have full 10 horse fields where you could get a price.....

Is it destined to be the winter version of Aqueduct/Hollywood park where they will only have tiny fields?

Will Mark and Nancy have to keep talking about 'flashbacks from 20 years ago' to fill air time?

Anybody smarter than me know what is going on? Has Mountaineer jumped the shark?

[Buddha]

People just arent coming as much. It started around May with some fields becoming shorter, and after the purse cuts in July, it was more pronounced. Starting in December, they are going back to 9 races and races the purses 10%, which to me really doesnt equate to a purse rasise, will just stay about the same daily level, just individual races going up. It will help over the winter, but next year in the spring when they go back to 10 races, we will see what kind of effect that it has.

[JustRalph]

have you priced a room for a weekend at the Mountain? Try a weekend package. I live a couple hours away, and I can fly to Vegas for the weekend for just a few bucks more.

[BillW]

have you priced a room for a weekend at the Mountain? Try a weekend package. I live a couple hours away, and I can fly to Vegas for the weekend for just a few bucks more.

Horse tracks are in trouble not because they don't have casinos. It's because they don't have casino management!

[rrpic6]

Maybe Dale Baird has ridden out the storm. He might be able to return to the top of the heap soon. This could be good news for some of the poor broken down horses that he buys...then often sends off to Alpo land when the purses were going up. As they go down, he can just "tape" them up and run them once a week.

[midnight]

From what I'm told, Dale Baird actually treats his horses relatively well, compared to a lot of the trainers on "The Mountain". Whether or not it's out of compassion or the business fact that an injured horse isn't going to make him any money is moot.

It's unfortunate, but in the racing business, a cheap horse can only earn its way by getting purse money. There aren't enough interested people or places for all of them, once they aren't able to race anymore.

[shanta]

Horse tracks are in trouble not because they don't have casinos. It's because they don't have casino management!

Tracks are in trouble because there are too darn many of them running. Add to that total lack of coordination among racing sec's as far as scheduling dates to race etc etc.

my opinion anyway

Richie

[GaryG]

We are breeding too many cheap horses and have too many small tracks. In France and Britain they have many fewer tracks and they have short meets. But look at the class of the races. Many a Group 3 winner has won big races over here and their Group 1 runners outclass ours by a mile. Although slots have been a boon for many tracks the overall effect has been to dilute the product with more dates at more venues. The honeymoon may be over at Mnr and others to come.

[46zilzal]

We are breeding too many cheap horses and have too many small tracks. In France and Britain they have many fewer tracks and they have short meets. But look at the class of the races. Many a Group 3 winner has won big races over here and their Group 1 runners outclass ours by a mile.
little venues are where the MONEY is and all those nags you mention are turfers, very limited comparison

[RXB]

While watching Mountaineer last night, I could not help but notice the small chalky fields.

Mountaineer used to have full 10 horse fields where you could get a price.....

Is it destined to be the winter version of Aqueduct/Hollywood park where they will only have tiny fields?

Will Mark and Nancy have to keep talking about 'flashbacks from 20 years ago' to fill air time?

Anybody smarter than me know what is going on? Has Mountaineer jumped the shark?

Finger Lakes got slots. The Pennsylvania tracks are getting ready for slots. The exodus is underway.

Live by the sword, die by the sword.

[highnote]

Finger Lakes got slots. The Pennsylvania tracks are getting ready for slots. The exodus is underway.

Live by the sword, die by the sword.


Mountaineer is building a resort in Pennsylvania aren't they? Prescott Downs or something like that? I think it will be a racino. Anyone know about this?

Buddha,
I'd like to go to Mountaineer sometime between Christmas and New Years. Are they running then?

[BillW]

Mountaineer is building a resort in Pennsylvania aren't they? Prescott Downs or something like that? I think it will be a racino. Anyone know about this?

Buddha,
I'd like to go to Mountaineer sometime between Christmas and New Years. Are they running then?

I think they are (were?) looking at the old Erie site (about 125 miles north and a bit east) - Presque Isle Downs may be a name. Prescott is in Arizona now called Yavapai.

[Buddha]

Mountaineer is building a resort in Pennsylvania aren't they? Prescott Downs or something like that? I think it will be a racino. Anyone know about this?

Buddha,
I'd like to go to Mountaineer sometime between Christmas and New Years. Are they running then?

they are building a track and broke ground a few weeks ago in erie, and bill is right, presque isle. i guess building done by late 2006, racing in 2007 i think.

mountaineer will be running the 2 days after christmas, the 26th and 27th, and then will be down until the 14th of january

[nomadpat]

Will Presque Isle a harness or thoroughbred facility?

[BillW]

Will Presque Isle a harness or thoroughbred facility?

1 mile thoroughbred was the last I heard.

[midnight]

I'd like to go to Mountaineer sometime between Christmas and New Years. Are they running then?

Mountaineer runs until December 20th, then on December 26th and 27th. Then they take their customary two week winter break. They return January 14th 2006.

[Buddha]

Will Presque Isle a harness or thoroughbred facility?

i am not really sure. i have heard both, so not really sure

[cj]

i am not really sure. i have heard both, so not really sure

Listen here, we don't pay you the salary we do as our Mnr consultant to give "I'm not sure answers" even if it isn't about Mnr!

[Buddha]

I know. With my salary from here, I should have all the answers :)

Something that I found kind of funny.
http://www.vindy.com/content/business_tech/294952314765559.php
The track will launch a new marketing campaign this month to try to lure those gamblers back from the five- and 10-machine clubs, but in the meantime, Arneault said MTR has imposed a hiring freeze that will last through the first quarter of 2006.

"If we are not able to get table games by the end of the first quarter, when the legislative session ends, the freeze could turn into a more aggressive form of layoff," he told investors and analysts during a conference call.

Almost every department is shorthanded as it is, and now they are having a hiring freeze until April-ish 2006. Our department is short by 2 people, and we only have 10 in our department, well 8 now, but should have 10. If they start having to lay people off, you can almost kiss MNR goodbye.

And from what I am seeing, BillW was right, a 1 mile thoroughbred track.

[Speed Figure]

3,062 on track and the handle was $25,566. Looks like they love horseracing there. :faint:

[highabove]

Next two days look full

[Buddha]

3,062 on track and the handle was $25,566. Looks like they love horseracing there. :faint:

I dont and would never believe an attendance figure from Mountaineer, and probably most racinos. For those interested in how MNR comes up with the attendance, they add the cars that come in the 2 main roads to the grounds, multipy it by 1.4 i think or maybe 1.8 or something like that, and then add the number of people that are in the OTB trackside to come up with the attendance. Now since they counted cars, why they add teh people that are in the OTB is beyond me, but either way, how many slots players did they count as attendance/ I would be willing to guess that there were probably no more than 350-400 actually horseplayers at the track Monday night.

[highnote]

The last few times I was at MNR they didn't charge for parking or admission. There was no one there taking attendance. Plus a lot of the people in attendance were horse owners, track personnel or stable workers.

[rrpic6]

Funny to see an article from the Youngstown Vindicator. I used to contact them and bitch about never covering the West Virginia Derby. Its possibly the worst paper in the country. If MNR could develop a better advertising plan thru that rag and many of the small community papers it could help bring up the attendance. Letting people win on the slots every so often would help too.

[Zaf]

Only 9 races carded for MNR Friday Night. :eek: EVD T-bred meet starts Thur. Night :)

Z

[Buddha]

Only 9 races carded for MNR Friday Night. :eek: EVD T-bred meet starts Thur. Night :)

Z

Yea, MNR is going to 9 races for Dec, Jan, Feb, and maybe even march. It was a planned cutback. They usually do it every winter. I thoght that EVD was supposed to have QH meet this month for the moved FG dates to LAD, and LAD having to move QH racing to EVD, or were they moving to DED?

[Zaf]

I thoght that EVD was supposed to have QH meet this month for the moved FG dates to LAD, and LAD having to move QH racing to EVD, or were they moving to DED?

Who said what to who ??? :confused: :lol:

Z

[BillW]

Yea, MNR is going to 9 races for Dec, Jan, Feb, and maybe even march. It was a planned cutback. They usually do it every winter. I thoght that EVD was supposed to have QH meet this month for the moved FG dates to LAD, and LAD having to move QH racing to EVD, or were they moving to DED?

It's Fair Grounds and Delta Downs that was damaged. FG is running at LAD and DED Thoroughbred is running at EVD. The EVD QH meet is just wrapping up at EVD. LAD doesn't have an explicit QH meet, just a few mixed days, and Oak Tree (OSA) still runs at Santa Anita. :D

Bill

[Buddha]

guess I just got messed up then. Maybe I misread stories. I don't know. I have been known to be wrong before. :)

[Zman179]

Mountaineer is still a very popular signal. They target their races to be run when other thoroughbred tracks are dark (like on Sunday, Monday & Tuesday nights.) They usually offer very competitive races with many 10 horse fields, but they're having a tough time filling races now, they should be doing ok in a couple of weeks when Finger Lakes closes.

As long as they continue their normal business model, Mountaineer will continue to do very well. I also wouldn't consider a $1.6 million handle on Sunday night with some short fields in the mix as doing badly. However, I would say that the term "jumped the shark" has definitely jumped the shark. :lol: