My NFL top ten

[Valuist]

1. Indianapolis- a full FG better than the rest. Lone negative is they've faced a weak schedule and it will get tougher. If they can't beat NE this year, they may never get the monkey off their back.

2. Denver- has done very little wrong since a poor week 1 performance against Miami. Since then, their only loss was by 1 point on the road.

3. Pittsburgh- they could be about tied for Denver. They did have to work hard to beat an injury riddled Raven team last night and that's why I can't put them ahead of Denver.

4. Atlanta- the best of the NFC...which isn't saying much but they are the best.

5. San Diego- I know the talking heads and print media would never have San Diego in their top 10, let alone top 5 but they don't do their homework. A brutal schedule and 4 tough losses. They could be 8-0 w/a break here and there.

6. New England- Like SD, they've had a rough schedule and they've also battled injuries. Getting Bruschi back helps but still no Rodney Harrison and the 2 coordinators from last year are still missed. This is a decent team but not nearly as strong as the past 2 SB winning teams.

7. Philadelphia- I don't like what I've seen recently. Denver just ran wild on them. Even when they stopped LT, they were outplayed by San Diego and should've lost that game.

8. Jacksonville- The upcoming schedule makes them a contender. They don't tend to win by a lot and they managed to lose a game last week despite putting up impressive numbers but all around they are solid.

9. Seattle- I don't know if I can really buy into this team. Offensively they can put up some numbers. We'll see if the D can hold up.

10. Carolina- The difference between them and #6 really isn't big. After 5, I see a noticable dropoff. They have some playmakers on both sides of the ball.

Pretenders: Tampa Bay- took advantage of some scheduling early. With no Griese, forget the playoffs. Chrissy Simms is terrible. Cincinnati- they've preyed on the turnover prone QBs of the NFC North. I was shocked that they intercepted Favre 5 times at home and still were in danger of letting the Packers tie the game late. Any team who is plus 4 or more in the turnover battle doesn't win big, they've got some issues to resolve.

[cj]

Don't see how Philly can make that list over NYG.

[WINMANWIN]

When its all said and done Philly WILL PLAY INDY in the SUPER BOWL.
Classic example of a team having a couple of bad games, and many jump off the bad wagon. Philly is the best team in the N.F.C

[Valuist]

CJ-

I don't think there's much difference between Philly and the NYG. Passing game? I'll still give it to Philly. Running game? Give it to Tiki and the NYG. Defensively, pretty similar. Both give up 4.2 ypc; the Eagles give up more yards but more attempts against. Pass D: the Giants give up more yards but actually have been more efficient: NYG D: 78.8 QB rating against and 9 TD 10 INT; Philly D: 86.6 QB rating against and 13-8 TD/Int ratio.

I think Winman is right, however because Denver really ran it up and piled some meaningless garbage stats into those totals.

One more thing: Eli still hasn't won a road game. Like they say in Missouri, show me he can do that. We know McNabb can.

[cj]

...Philly is the best team in the N.F.C

The best team? They are in last in the division!

Valuist, if they are so close, then why one #7, and no NYG? I see this for NY...Points For 209, Points Against, 137. For Philly...Points For 163, Against, 167. Philly has been humiliated twice...absolutely blown away.

[Valuist]

Those pts for/pts against may be a little deceptive, taking into account last week's results. The Giants win by 36 and the Eagles lose by 28. And before we put too much stock in pts for/pts against, look at Green Bay. GB is not a good football team at 1-6 but 158 pts scored and 139 given up. And next week won't prove much as the Giants get the West Coast punching bag (SF).

If the two teams were to play, I'd probably make the home team a 3 pt favorite. If it was at NY and the Giants were a 4 or 4 1/2 pt favorite, one would get overwhelmed w/Philly money.

[WINMANWIN]

[QUOTE=Valuist] And next week won't prove much as the Giants get the West Coast punching bag (SF).

Who they have lost to twice in the past years I believe :ThmbDown:
Letdown factor, after the BIG MARA VICTORY, is the story with them this week. But seriously, The EAGLES should be O.K. down the stretch, with Owens being a GOOD Boy, I know the Falcons BEAT THEM in Atlanta, but the Eagles destroyed them in last years Championship game. The N.F.L is alot like horse racing, you have to smell a letdown, or a medicore performance. I wouldnt be surprised to see the REDSKINS coming off a demoralizing shut-out to the GIANTS, beat the Eagles this weekend. If teams played the way, we assumed they would every week, We would not have to GAMBLE on T-Bred racing. :D

[Valuist]

I agree its a lot like horse racing. Teams go in and out of form. Some teams may let down off strong efforts but I find the NFL 1000 times more formful than college football. I don't like betting money on 19 and 20 year old kids.

The letdown is a possibility for the Giants, but this Niner team is horrible. They took advantage of a terrible QB (Simms) and a less than 100% Cadillac Williams. I also think Tampa has been a bit of a fraud, beating up on teams like Minny, Green Bay and Detroit.

[BetHorses!]

1. Indianapolis- a full FG better than the rest. Lone negative is they've faced a weak schedule and it will get tougher. If they can't beat NE this year, they may never get the monkey off their back.

2. Denver- has done very little wrong since a poor week 1 performance against Miami. Since then, their only loss was by 1 point on the road.

3. Pittsburgh- they could be about tied for Denver. They did have to work hard to beat an injury riddled Raven team last night and that's why I can't put them ahead of Denver.

4. Atlanta- the best of the NFC...which isn't saying much but they are the best.

5. San Diego- I know the talking heads and print media would never have San Diego in their top 10, let alone top 5 but they don't do their homework. A brutal schedule and 4 tough losses. They could be 8-0 w/a break here and there.

6. New England- Like SD, they've had a rough schedule and they've also battled injuries. Getting Bruschi back helps but still no Rodney Harrison and the 2 coordinators from last year are still missed. This is a decent team but not nearly as strong as the past 2 SB winning teams.

7. Philadelphia- I don't like what I've seen recently. Denver just ran wild on them. Even when they stopped LT, they were outplayed by San Diego and should've lost that game.

8. Jacksonville- The upcoming schedule makes them a contender. They don't tend to win by a lot and they managed to lose a game last week despite putting up impressive numbers but all around they are solid.

9. Seattle- I don't know if I can really buy into this team. Offensively they can put up some numbers. We'll see if the D can hold up.

10. Carolina- The difference between them and #6 really isn't big. After 5, I see a noticable dropoff. They have some playmakers on both sides of the ball.

Pretenders: Tampa Bay- took advantage of some scheduling early. With no Griese, forget the playoffs. Chrissy Simms is terrible. Cincinnati- they've preyed on the turnover prone QBs of the NFC North. I was shocked that they intercepted Favre 5 times at home and still were in danger of letting the Packers tie the game late. Any team who is plus 4 or more in the turnover battle doesn't win big, they've got some issues to resolve.


Quick review and I respectfully disagree with a couple in your top 10. I would remove Pats and Eagles at the moment.

I would add Chiefs and Giants plus I would knock the Steelers down several notches.

Also might remove Carolina and replace with Redskins. Tough environment for them last game maybe we can "throw it out"

Totally agree about the Bengals and Bucs

[xfile]

1. Indianapolis- a full FG better than the rest. Lone negative is they've faced a weak schedule and it will get tougher. If they can't beat NE this year, they may never get the monkey off their back.

2. Denver- has done very little wrong since a poor week 1 performance against Miami. Since then, their only loss was by 1 point on the road.

3. Pittsburgh- they could be about tied for Denver. They did have to work hard to beat an injury riddled Raven team last night and that's why I can't put them ahead of Denver.

4. Atlanta- the best of the NFC...which isn't saying much but they are the best.

5. San Diego- I know the talking heads and print media would never have San Diego in their top 10, let alone top 5 but they don't do their homework. A brutal schedule and 4 tough losses. They could be 8-0 w/a break here and there.

6. New England- Like SD, they've had a rough schedule and they've also battled injuries. Getting Bruschi back helps but still no Rodney Harrison and the 2 coordinators from last year are still missed. This is a decent team but not nearly as strong as the past 2 SB winning teams.

7. Philadelphia- I don't like what I've seen recently. Denver just ran wild on them. Even when they stopped LT, they were outplayed by San Diego and should've lost that game.

8. Jacksonville- The upcoming schedule makes them a contender. They don't tend to win by a lot and they managed to lose a game last week despite putting up impressive numbers but all around they are solid.

9. Seattle- I don't know if I can really buy into this team. Offensively they can put up some numbers. We'll see if the D can hold up.

10. Carolina- The difference between them and #6 really isn't big. After 5, I see a noticable dropoff. They have some playmakers on both sides of the ball.

Pretenders: Tampa Bay- took advantage of some scheduling early. With no Griese, forget the playoffs. Chrissy Simms is terrible. Cincinnati- they've preyed on the turnover prone QBs of the NFC North. I was shocked that they intercepted Favre 5 times at home and still were in danger of letting the Packers tie the game late. Any team who is plus 4 or more in the turnover battle doesn't win big, they've got some issues to resolve.


Ummmm...did you not see the NY Giants beat the Broncos??? And the Giants WIPED OUT the Redskins 36-0...This Manning might be as good or better than Peyton. Where's the Giants on your list? And Tampa Bay has the league's best defense. Do you care to put your money where your ratings are???...lol...I'm game on this :cool:
http://images.nfl.com/images/teamtitles/2004/NYG.gifhttp://images.nfl.com/images/logos/80x60/NYG.gif

[BetHorses!]

[QUOTE=Valuist] And next week won't prove much as the Giants get the West Coast punching bag (SF). Who they have lost to twice in the past years I believe :ThmbDown:
Letdown factor, after the BIG MARA VICTORY, is the story with them this week. :D


Not so sure about a letdown. The man was loved by all and this might be a team on a mission now. Excellent coach also helps prevent letdowns.

[Valuist]

Xfile-

Eli had almost nothing to do with the win over Washington. It was Tiki Barber and the defense. Eli numbers: 12 of 31 (38.7%) for 146 yards. Thats less than 5 yards per attempt. 1 TD and 1 pick. Eli still hasn't won a road game in his NFL career and you're comparing him to Peyton? :lol:

The Giants are a decent team and around those teams in the 7-10 area.

Tampa Bay is a fraud. Wins over Minnesota, Green Bay, Detroit, Buffalo and Miami. Losses to the NYJ and Niners. The Forty Niners, who are so bad, Las Vegas bookmakers started putting their games in a circle. They hadn't done that since the 1976 Bucs.

[schweitz]

CJ-

I don't think there's much difference between Philly and the NYG.

I agree---Cowboys beat both of them. ;)

[SAL]

The Forty Niners, who are so bad, Las Vegas bookmakers started putting their games in a circle. They hadn't done that since the 1976 Bucs.


Hey Valuist, what does this mean? What is the consequence for a team that is put in a circle?

Being a die hard 49er fan, the current version is almost unbearable to watch. Right now I would be happy with them surpassing their win total from last year. :)

[BetHorses!]

Hey Valuist, what does this mean? What is the consequence for a team that is put in a circle?

:)


Circle means the wagering is limited on the game usually due to key injuries or bad weather.

[Valuist]

That usually is the case, but in this case it was due to incompetence. Its rarely done, and supposedly hadn't been done in almost 30 years.

[Valuist]

OK, Giants fans are upset. Here's some evidence that shows they don't deserve to be in the top 10:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/statistics?stat=team&sort=ypg&pos=def&league=nfl&year=2005&season=2

3rd worst in yardage against.

[cj]

3rd worst in yardage against.

Yards don't equate to points.

[Valuist]

Not in EVERY case, but the majority of the time they do. Of the 8 worst teams in yardage against, the Giants are the only one who hasn't allowed at least 22.9 pts a game. What does this say? Either they've been good in the red zone, or they've been very lucky. Maybe a combination. The so-called bend but don't break defenses will eventually break. I think the key for the Giants has been the plus 12 in turnovers. Turnovers are part skill, part coaching, and part dumb luck. Coaches like Dungy and Lovie Smith drill awareness into their players heads to always be looking for deflected passes, and to try to strip ballcarriers of the ball. But fumble recoveries are more a matter of just being in the right place at the right time. Often teams who recover a lot of fumbles one year see their fortunes reverse as things even out the following year, or as Phil Steele calls it "turnovers=turnaround".

With all the talk of the Giants and Eagles, the more I look at it, the best team in that division I believe is Dallas.

[BetHorses!]

Val,

I hear what you are saying and you do make a good argument. For the record I am no Giants Fan but I think outside of top 10 is a stretch. After this weekend your #6 New England could be 4-4 and the Giants could very well be 6-2.

It is interesting that the Giants and Bengals are both #1 and #2 in takeaway's and both near the bottom in overall D (ypg) -- Bengals 19th Giants 30th

And the freaking Rams are 4-4 after all the BS lol


Good Thread!

[Valuist]

I think the difference between 6th and 12th or 13th isn't very big. That's where the parity is in the league now. But its different from 3,4 or 5 years ago, when the parity was from maybe 4-20. The Giants should win today but I don't think we'll learn anything more from them. If Philly does overcome not having Owens, they will have to be given credit.